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nameant
Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 16032
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 Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:18 pm Post subject: |
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man we better get a 1st round pick too. at least a 2nd.  |
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SWOL
Separated at Birth: Ron Artest
Joined: 18 Jun 2003
Posts: 12936
Location: Buena Park CA
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:19 pm Post subject: |
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I SECOND THAT
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Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:19 pm Post subject: |
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| Ill take Jamison for caron. |
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Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:20 pm Post subject: |
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| maddprophet wrote: |
now into particulars.....their contracts don't match up, so it can't be straight up. there has to be some other players involved. not that those additional players would make much difference, i mean it's only CARON FREAKING BUTLER FOLKS!
but more than anything, i think it absolutely ridiculous to claim a player's career is a bust or he's trash by the time he's 22. HE'S 22!!! 
there is a huge upside to this kid. tons of potential. to say his head is screwed up, or he has no heart, and never can improve is nuts. he's more or less a rookie at this point in his mentality. he's still maturing and growing as a person as well as a player.
let's not condemn him already, give him a chance before you throw him to the wolves, just to jump on his bandwagon later, and oh yes, you will be a jumpin.
this apparently just makes too much sense for some of you to comprehend |
Thank you, maddP! And MP, they probably don't get it because...IT'S CARON FREAKIN' BUTLER!
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DMK
Clublakers Analyst
Joined: 15 Feb 2005
Posts: 15765
Location: Baltimore, MD
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:21 pm Post subject: |
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MJ called Kwame a "Flamin F@%%it" and literally made him cry....
Just find that funny.
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:23 pm Post subject: |
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| wingnut wrote: |
| VerbalMilk wrote: |
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| No offense but did you read your last statement. Please dont go into he won with this dude etc. That argument is tired and bottomless. caron comes off the bench b/c PJ says he has to. the same with atkins. We have fine bench players with our current roster. WE NEED BENCH PLAYERS. Does Caron want to come off the bench? Does Kwame? |
Oh, don't worry, dawg, I have thick skin. But what I said about him winning was mainly due to MJ/Pip/Rodman and Shaq/Kobe than it was with BJ and Fish.
Now, why would PJ sit Butler? In favor of who? |
LO, Kobe. We need a 1 regardless if we can cover that with a trade great. Caron can spell both 2-3. think how great that would be. LO sits caron in. Kobe sits etc. LO and Kobe sit you put Jones and Caron in. |
Ok, I'm still a little thrown here because who starts at PF then if Odom starts at the 3? |
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Andrew Evenstar
Joined: 21 Jul 2003
Posts: 4526
Location: Ventura, California
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:24 pm Post subject: |
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i love caron :( i think he is a good player that will improve so much. i also want kwame. i just wish we could give up other players besides caron/odom. i'm mixed on this, but i like caron more than kwame. i realize we need kwami more, but still :(
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Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:26 pm Post subject: |
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| wingnut wrote: |
| Ill take Jamison for caron. |
"Somtimes I dream...that he is meeeeee" |
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Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Andrewevenstar wrote: |
| i love caron :( i think he is a good player that will improve so much. i also want kwame. i just wish we could give up other players besides caron/odom. i'm mixed on this, but i like caron more than kwame. i realize we need kwami more, but still :( |
Oh damn. Are you gonna need a tissue, bro?  |
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Muggle
Joined: 04 Apr 2005
Posts: 980
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:28 pm Post subject: |
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Well, I was just listening to ESPN radio an hour ago here in So Cal, and Mason and Ireland were acting like it was a done deal, taking caller's opinions and everything. John Ireland was even saying that it was shown on the ESPN ticker...
Then they cut some poor guy off on the phone because they had Ric Bucher on the other line, and Ric Bucher said he just had word from his "Wizards Source" that this is anything but a done deal, in fact, it's more likely than not that this won't go through. Ric said that when he asked his source if this was some sort of a back up or fall through plan, the source said that was a great way of putting it.
Moreover, Ric Bucher said that he feels that as the NBA gets closer to the July 22nd date to begin trades, Kwame Brown's stock is going to go way up and Caron Butler will not be enough to bring in Brown.
Personally, I don't have a problem with shipping out Butler (because I understand that Butler is our most valuable trade piece), and while Brown isn't the player we all hoped for in return, the Lakers aren't getting any help from any other team in the NBA, so Brown may be the best we can get our hands on.
What's bugging me more than anything about those up in arms with the Caron trade, are the fans who are claiming we must keep Butler because he gets along so well with Kobe. I'm sorry, but the time for appeasing to Kobe Bryant is long over, and we need to get players on the court as soon as possible that are going to help him get a championship, not be best buddies with him.
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maddprophet
Joined: 07 Jun 2005
Posts: 154
Location: Hotlanta, GA.
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:28 pm Post subject: |
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have we gotten any more confirmation on this deal yet? anyone? 
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Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:29 pm Post subject: |
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| VerbalMilk wrote: |
| wingnut wrote: |
| VerbalMilk wrote: |
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| No offense but did you read your last statement. Please dont go into he won with this dude etc. That argument is tired and bottomless. caron comes off the bench b/c PJ says he has to. the same with atkins. We have fine bench players with our current roster. WE NEED BENCH PLAYERS. Does Caron want to come off the bench? Does Kwame? |
Oh, don't worry, dawg, I have thick skin. But what I said about him winning was mainly due to MJ/Pip/Rodman and Shaq/Kobe than it was with BJ and Fish.
Now, why would PJ sit Butler? In favor of who? |
LO, Kobe. We need a 1 regardless if we can cover that with a trade great. Caron can spell both 2-3. think how great that would be. LO sits caron in. Kobe sits etc. LO and Kobe sit you put Jones and Caron in. |
Ok, I'm still a little thrown here because who starts at PF then if Odom starts at the 3? |
So kwame fills that hole? I mean seriously. he will get rolled up. AT least Turiaf brings .....something. I wouldput money on it that 4years of college and SPL and an entire training camp will put turiaf on equal ground, maybe astep just below brown at the start. the difference is turiaf has heart and is fine being just another role guy |
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Muggle
Joined: 04 Apr 2005
Posts: 980
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:31 pm Post subject: |
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maddprophet, see my above post...No confirmation at all.
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GuRu
Better Than You
Joined: 01 Jun 2004
Posts: 29592
Location: Michigan
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:34 pm Post subject: |
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| maddprophet wrote: |
I don't know what deals are out there for Caron. All I know is we have to trade him. I hate to say it, because he is one of my favorites, but we have to trade him.
If Kwame Brown is the best young big we can get then so be it. |
Thats basically how i feel. Im very skeptical on Kwame, and how he'll fit, or how he'll progress, but what do Laker fans serioulsy expect to attract dangling Caron butler out there? He's average SF in a league overplenished with such players.
Im surprised he could command any big. If i was the Wizards GM, i wouldnt accept Caron for Kwame, and if I was Mitch, I probably wouldnt deal caron for Kwame until I was sure Id revisited all other options
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maddprophet
Joined: 07 Jun 2005
Posts: 154
Location: Hotlanta, GA.
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:35 pm Post subject: |
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Muggle313 Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:28 pm Post subject:
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Well, I was just listening to ESPN radio an hour ago here in So Cal, and Mason and Ireland were acting like it was a done deal, taking caller's opinions and everything. John Ireland was even saying that it was shown on the ESPN ticker...
Then they cut some poor guy off on the phone because they had Ric Bucher on the other line, and Ric Bucher said he just had word from his "Wizards Source" that this is anything but a done deal, in fact, it's more likely than not that this won't go through. Ric said that when he asked his source if this was some sort of a back up or fall through plan, the source said that was a great way of putting it.
Moreover, Ric Bucher said that he feels that as the NBA gets closer to the July 22nd date to begin trades, Kwame Brown's stock is going to go way up and Caron Butler will not be enough to bring in Brown.
Personally, I don't have a problem with shipping out Butler (because I understand that Butler is our most valuable trade piece), and while Brown isn't the player we all hoped for in return, the Lakers aren't getting any help from any other team in the NBA, so Brown may be the best we can get our hands on.
What's bugging me more than anything about those up in arms with the Caron trade, are the fans who are claiming we must keep Butler because he gets along so well with Kobe. I'm sorry, but the time for appeasing to Kobe Bryant is long over, and we need to get players on the court as soon as possible that are going to help him get a championship, not be best buddies with him.
dohhhh!! that's true, kwame's stock will rise the closer to the deadline we get, we should get commitments on this deal asap! if it falls through, and we get nada as far as pf/c help, alot of you will be missing this trade proposal. i sure as hell will.
i don't see how we can get magloire if we can't get kwame from the wizz. then after that we're looking at trying to get ratliff or marshall. hardly the possibilities of kwame. 
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Spark the ism, my expertism, is lyricism, my flow will take you over, like I was hypnotism..so where's the lighter.... |
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GuRu
Better Than You
Joined: 01 Jun 2004
Posts: 29592
Location: Michigan
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Muggle313 wrote: |
| Moreover, Ric Bucher said that he feels that as the NBA gets closer to the July 22nd date to begin trades, Kwame Brown's stock is going to go way up and Caron Butler will not be enough to bring in Brown. |
Thats interesting....
ric bucher ususally does a decent job regarding his feelers for the NBA and what it'll take to get a deal done. If Bucher doesnt think Caron is enough to land Kwame, than my fears may have been realized. The league has finally started to see how commonplace a slasher SF is in the NBA
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maddprophet
Joined: 07 Jun 2005
Posts: 154
Location: Hotlanta, GA.
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:37 pm Post subject: |
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muggle- saw that after i posted.
on a different note, can someone tell me how you copy and paste someone's earlier post and have it come out in that white box. i'm not very computer savy, and am just cutting and pasting old school style, and don't get the same results. sorry, i'm an idiot, and need help 
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Spark the ism, my expertism, is lyricism, my flow will take you over, like I was hypnotism..so where's the lighter.... |
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LakersCourt
Joined: 23 Oct 2003
Posts: 949
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:40 pm Post subject: |
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All indications are that the Wizards WILL TRADE Kwame Brown for Caron Butler. A gamble? You bet it is. However, I want somethign else included.
As I have said:
Lakers Trade:
F- Caron Butler
G- Sasha Vujacic
F- Brian Cook
F- Stanislav Medvedenko
Washington Trades:
F- Kwame Brown
G/F- Jarvis Hayes
A tandem of Kobe- Lamar-Kwame -Bynum has to look pretty damn scary in a couple of years |
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Muggle
Joined: 04 Apr 2005
Posts: 980
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:41 pm Post subject: |
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| maddprophet wrote: |
muggle- saw that after i posted.
on a different note, can someone tell me how you copy and paste someone's earlier post and have it come out in that white box. i'm not very computer savy, and am just cutting and pasting old school style, and don't get the same results. sorry, i'm an idiot, and need help |
If you want an immediate quote you can click the "quote" link on the top right corner of that person's post.
Or, you could do it the old fashioned way by using typing it out yourself.
For example, to quote me, type this: [quote=muggle313] and when you end the quote, finish with this: [/quote]
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| Quote: |
It is our choices, Harry, that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities.
--Albus Dumbledore, Harry Potter & The Chamber of Secrets |
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Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:41 pm Post subject: |
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| GuRu wrote: |
| Muggle313 wrote: |
| Moreover, Ric Bucher said that he feels that as the NBA gets closer to the July 22nd date to begin trades, Kwame Brown's stock is going to go way up and Caron Butler will not be enough to bring in Brown. |
Thats interesting....
ric bucher ususally does a decent job regarding his feelers for the NBA and what it'll take to get a deal done. If Bucher doesnt think Caron is enough to land Kwame, than my fears may have been realized. The league has finally started to see how commonplace a slasher SF is in the NBA |
If your fears have been realized why not have him come off our bench? Will someone throw the sink at him in free agency next year. If so he should be valuable now. Like Kwame, Caron stock will rise up to the 22. Not as much but we dont need Bron to be legit |
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maddprophet
Joined: 07 Jun 2005
Posts: 154
Location: Hotlanta, GA.
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Muggle313 wrote: |
| maddprophet wrote: |
muggle- saw that after i posted.
on a different note, can someone tell me how you copy and paste someone's earlier post and have it come out in that white box. i'm not very computer savy, and am just cutting and pasting old school style, and don't get the same results. sorry, i'm an idiot, and need help |
If you want an immediate quote you can click the "quote" link on the top right corner of that person's post.
Or, you could do it the old fashioned way by using typing it out yourself.
For example, to quote me, type this: [quote=muggle313] and when you end the quote, finish with this: |
[/quote]
_________________
Spark the ism, my expertism, is lyricism, my flow will take you over, like I was hypnotism..so where's the lighter.... |
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GuRu
Better Than You
Joined: 01 Jun 2004
Posts: 29592
Location: Michigan
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:43 pm Post subject: |
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| maddprophet wrote: |
| on a different note, can someone tell me how you copy and paste someone's earlier post and have it come out in that white box. i'm not very computer savy, and am just cutting and pasting old school style, and don't get the same results. sorry, i'm an idiot, and need help |
Check you PM's
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I Offered My Honor
She Honored My Offer
And All Night Long
It Was Honor and Offer |
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maddprophet
Joined: 07 Jun 2005
Posts: 154
Location: Hotlanta, GA.
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:43 pm Post subject: |
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aha! good lookin out
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Spark the ism, my expertism, is lyricism, my flow will take you over, like I was hypnotism..so where's the lighter.... |
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GuRu
Better Than You
Joined: 01 Jun 2004
Posts: 29592
Location: Michigan
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:45 pm Post subject: |
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| LakersCourt wrote: |
| All indications are that the Wizards WILL TRADE Kwame Brown for Caron Butler. |
All indicators? i dont think anything is finalized yet....
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Muggle
Joined: 04 Apr 2005
Posts: 980
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:46 pm Post subject: |
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| LakersCourt wrote: |
| All indications are that the Wizards WILL TRADE Kwame Brown for Caron Butler. |
Link, please? And something other than what Peter Vescey and David Aldridge have already written, because that's still speculation and unconfirmed rumors. I want to see something that directly quotes people from both organizations before I buy into it.
And GuRu, I agree with you about Bucher...he's usually pretty accurate on his speculation, so if he thinks this is a long shot then I tend to believe him over Peter Vescey.
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It is our choices, Harry, that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities.
--Albus Dumbledore, Harry Potter & The Chamber of Secrets |
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lalfan
Joined: 12 Nov 2004
Posts: 576
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:46 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="Muggle313"]
What's bugging me more than anything about those up in arms with the Caron trade, are the fans who are claiming we must keep Butler because he gets along so well with Kobe. I'm sorry, but the time for appeasing to Kobe Bryant is long over, and we need to get players on the court as soon as possible that are going to help him get a championship, not be best buddies with him.[/quote]
true, last year was kobe's year to show he can carry this team without having management bring in significant help but he failed(injured or not), so this year it's not about kobe, it's about how to improve the team, management is more knowlegeable when it comes what's best for the team. |
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GuRu
Better Than You
Joined: 01 Jun 2004
Posts: 29592
Location: Michigan
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:47 pm Post subject: |
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| wingnut wrote: |
| GuRu wrote: |
| Muggle313 wrote: |
| Moreover, Ric Bucher said that he feels that as the NBA gets closer to the July 22nd date to begin trades, Kwame Brown's stock is going to go way up and Caron Butler will not be enough to bring in Brown. |
Thats interesting....
ric bucher ususally does a decent job regarding his feelers for the NBA and what it'll take to get a deal done. If Bucher doesnt think Caron is enough to land Kwame, than my fears may have been realized. The league has finally started to see how commonplace a slasher SF is in the NBA |
If your fears have been realized why not have him come off our bench? Will someone throw the sink at him in free agency next year. If so he should be valuable now. Like Kwame, Caron stock will rise up to the 22. Not as much but we dont need Bron to be legit |
Id be fine with Caron coming off the bench. In fact, ive been calling for it all year, but we didnt have the personnel to do it. if we can find someway to acquire a decent starting PF, and allow Caron to come off the bench them im all for it.
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I Offered My Honor
She Honored My Offer
And All Night Long
It Was Honor and Offer |
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:48 pm Post subject: |
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| lalfan wrote: |
| Muggle313 wrote: |
What's bugging me more than anything about those up in arms with the Caron trade, are the fans who are claiming we must keep Butler because he gets along so well with Kobe. I'm sorry, but the time for appeasing to Kobe Bryant is long over, and we need to get players on the court as soon as possible that are going to help him get a championship, not be best buddies with him. |
true, last year was kobe's year to show he can carry this team without having management bring in significant help but he failed(injured or not), so this year it's not about kobe, it's about how to improve the team, management is more knowlegeable when it comes what's best for the team. |
you will lose this argument 100 out of a 100 times if your answer is kwame. |
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GuRu
Better Than You
Joined: 01 Jun 2004
Posts: 29592
Location: Michigan
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Muggle313 wrote: |
| LakersCourt wrote: |
| All indications are that the Wizards WILL TRADE Kwame Brown for Caron Butler. |
Link, please? And something other than what Peter Vescey and David Aldridge have already written, because that's still speculation and unconfirmed rumors. I want to see something that directly quotes people from both organizations before I buy into it. |
Youd think some people would have learned after every single "insider" rumor over the last year has been proven false.
Ill believe it when I see it
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maddprophet
Joined: 07 Jun 2005
Posts: 154
Location: Hotlanta, GA.
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| Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 2:49 pm Post subject: |
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i don't think caron brings much more off the bench than what we already get from jj
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