just add bynum and title? NOT! dynamic PG needed...

just add bynum and title? NOT! dynamic PG needed...

Postby hollywood swinger on Tue Jun 17, 2008 9:29 pm

i know alot of people hear think and i have heard in the media 'once bynum comes back next year' ect....
i totally disagree with this. boston will get better. they will add more ring chasing free agent vets and gel even more as a team.

we have to many non smart players such as odom,vlade & dare i say luke. also lets all just take it easy myself included that sasha is some absolute ingrediant we need to win a title. this guy really lost alot of shine the series outside of game 3.

i think we all know the moves we need to make. we need more toughness inside alla a danny fortson or dale davis. our 3 postion is absolutely horrible right now.

mitch kupchak still has alot of tweaking to do with this roster. odom, vlade & walton will not be championship pieces playing large roles. those guys need to be moved if the right deals come along.

most importantly we need to have a renewed commitment to DEFENSE. i would love to see a guy like rick fox or pippen be brought on board to coach a tough defensive mindset if they are interested.
hate to rain on our future championship parades but there is no guarantee we will win anything unless we realize and mitch more importantly that he is not done building this team.
don't even get me started on gasol and the other euro's on this squad. yes we were an early arrival to the finals but when you get there you might as well win it because you never are promised a return visit.
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Postby JSM on Tue Jun 17, 2008 9:47 pm

No Boston will get older.

We saw Miami. They will be adding more old, washed up has beens.

They're window is closing quick.

They have a 0% of beating a healthy Lakers next year.
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Postby Angela1986 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 9:49 pm

I do think changes are in order. Bynum will help with a lot of our defensive woes but that won't solve all of them.
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Postby A_V_R on Tue Jun 17, 2008 9:50 pm

Bynum and Artest.
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Postby kray28 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 9:53 pm

The team as a whole has to develop a more aggressive and assertive mindset.

Big, wholesale changes in personnel are not needed though. As I said in another post, we play a clean brand of finesse ball that is good enough to beat 99% of the league.

They aren't as far away most might think....but this was a good example of how the other guys were too scared to step to the plate.

Lose the fear...find the aggression and you win. Sounds simple, it isn't though. You have to believe in yourself...most the Lakers are too young at this point though.

This experience should help accelerate the growth rapidly though.
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Postby hollywood swinger on Tue Jun 17, 2008 9:54 pm

JSM wrote:No Boston will get older.

We saw Miami. They will be adding more old, washed up has beens.

They're window is closing quick.

They have a 0% of beating a healthy Lakers next year.


jsm you really believe we can just add bynum and beat boston? i think our other weaknesses are just to glaring. the sf,defense in general will not beat a boston team next year. they are not dogs. they won't age 7 years in 1 year.
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Postby JSM on Tue Jun 17, 2008 10:04 pm

hollywood swinger wrote:
JSM wrote:No Boston will get older.

We saw Miami. They will be adding more old, washed up has beens.

They're window is closing quick.

They have a 0% of beating a healthy Lakers next year.


jsm you really believe we can just add bynum and beat boston? i think our other weaknesses are just to glaring. the sf,defense in general will not beat a boston team next year. they are not dogs. they won't age 7 years in 1 year.

No, but I think with Drew in the middle and 1 additional perimeter defender (Ron or Battier if we can't get Ron) and we are raring to go roster wise. I want to add a little depth a C and PG, but it's not absolutely a necessity.

Roster wise, that's all the tinkering we need. Coaching staff, we need a defensive assistant.

But as far as Boston, they're done. Yes, when you are in your mid 30s, one year seems like 7 years. Cassell and PJ Brown, they're going to need to borrow Pierce's wheelchair next season.

Posey, Brown, Cassell, House, and T. Allen (R) are FAs.
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Postby Amongst:Kings on Tue Jun 17, 2008 10:04 pm

Byum will be a major factor

Artest would be lovely, but not too realistic

We also need to add some tough, physical to round out the bench.
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Postby Arcarsenal on Tue Jun 17, 2008 10:08 pm

All this foolish optimism must stop.


28 other teams will be battling for the championship.

What are the chances of Lakers meeting Celtics again let alone Lakers even getting this far?

You say "oh there is always next year" but when you add the fluffing...
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Postby hollywood swinger on Tue Jun 17, 2008 10:12 pm

JSM wrote:
hollywood swinger wrote:
JSM wrote:No Boston will get older.

We saw Miami. They will be adding more old, washed up has beens.

They're window is closing quick.

They have a 0% of beating a healthy Lakers next year.


jsm you really believe we can just add bynum and beat boston? i think our other weaknesses are just to glaring. the sf,defense in general will not beat a boston team next year. they are not dogs. they won't age 7 years in 1 year.

No, but I think with Drew in the middle and 1 additional perimeter defender (Ron or Battier if we can't get Ron) and we are raring to go roster wise. I want to add a little depth a C and PG, but it's not absolutely a necessity.

Roster wise, that's all the tinkering we need. Coaching staff, we need a defensive assistant.

But as far as Boston, they're done. Yes, when you are in your mid 30s, one year seems like 7 years. Cassell and PJ Brown, they're going to need to borrow Pierce's wheelchair next season.

Posey, Brown, Cassell, House, and T. Allen (R) are FAs.


i know you keep saying boston will get older but do you honestly believe lamar,vlade & luke just to name a few have the mental and internal toughness to win a title?
i think our roster just got bigtime exposed at certain positions. boston just might get artest for all we know. then what? bynum alone wont get it done. we need to shake up the roster about 30%.
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Postby davriver290 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 10:32 pm

The NEEDS TO GET RID OF.

Radman
Luke
Mihm
Farmar

Needs to Get
Artest
Davis

Both players opted out and no doubt are looking for a ring. Davis was at a Lakers game and there are heavy rumors of Artest coming to LA.

Look we can keep Odom, but the guy isn't a big time player, or can't handle pressure. Odom can come off the bench behind Gasol or Artest one of the two.

And Davis looks like he will be coming to LA, I mean how can ya say no?

Davis/Fisher
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Artest/Odom/Kobe
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Bynum/Gasol/Mbenga
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Postby knm131 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 10:34 pm

kray28 wrote:The team as a whole has to develop a more aggressive and assertive mindset.

Big, wholesale changes in personnel are not needed though. As I said in another post, we play a clean brand of finesse ball that is good enough to beat 99% of the league.

They aren't as far away most might think....but this was a good example of how the other guys were too scared to step to the plate.

Lose the fear...find the aggression and you win. Sounds simple, it isn't though. You have to believe in yourself...most the Lakers are too young at this point though.

This experience should help accelerate the growth rapidly though.


Do you honestly believe just saying we need to be more aggressive is going to change everything 300 days from now?

It isn't.

We're going to have the SAME problems in tight game situations, and in the postseason next year.

No one outside of Kobe, who will look to make things happen.
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Postby kray28 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 10:42 pm

Yes, actually I do think a lot of these guys can be taught how to play aggressive team defense. It takes teaching, practice and a certain mindset though. Defense has never been Phil's specialty though...he leaves that up to Cleamons.

But I'm not just talking about aggression on defense but on offense as well.
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Postby revgen on Tue Jun 17, 2008 10:44 pm

Adding Bynum will be very important for our defense. Do we need to show more commitment on defense? Yes, but commitment starts with the right pieces. Boston had the right pieces to be a defensive team, so their commitment started early. Nobody knew how good Bynum would be this year and Pau didn't come until Febuary. We know that with 2 7-footers in the paint, that we can start commiting to playing defense starting in training camp and be confident once the regular season starts.

Keep in mind that Pau has never won a playoff game until this year. And at some points, he looked like it. Winning a World Basketball title is not the same as winning a grueling 7-game series in the NBA playoffs. Pau, despite being veteran, learned a lot from this postseason. I believe he has heart and will work hard to improve himself physically and mentally to compete in the NBA for the postseason this offseason. Ditto with Odom who never has gone past the 2nd round and only went to the 2nd round playing in a weak eastern conference.

Also, one final note. This team was never expected to win a championship early in the season, much less get to the NBA finals. The expectation was to become an "elite" team as Kobe demanded in the offseason. We accomplished that by reaching #1 in the regular season standings in one of the toughest conferences in NBA history, and reaching the WCF's. The confidence that they've gotten by getting here and the bitter taste of losing will motivate them to improve their weaknesses.
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Postby last stand on Tue Jun 17, 2008 10:48 pm

i tell you ron artest is very likely more likely than ever

plus bynum with his work ethic will hopefullyy be healthy and improved with some added hunger and confidence knowing his team needs him to win it all

artest would solve a crap load of the defensive problems

now you trad lamar and vlad to chicago for hinrich and gooden you got yourself a strong bench and unbelievable starting 5

our bench goes from soft to hard with gooden, fisher, ronny, and ariza occupying it

our starters become lockdown and better offensively with bynum, artest is an excellent scorer, and then hinrich can create for others which fisher can't and he can shoot the 3 at a 40+% clip

thats what mitch needs to do
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Postby knm131 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 10:55 pm

kray28 wrote:Yes, actually I do think a lot of these guys can be taught how to play aggressive team defense. It takes teaching, practice and a certain mindset though. Defense has never been Phil's specialty though...he leaves that up to Cleamons.

But I'm not just talking about aggression on defense but on offense as well.


Yeah I agree aggression is what we need. But seriously, which Lakers have ever, whether in a Laker uniform or otherwise, been aggressive? Only Sasha and Farmar really. (Other than Kobe).

Pau has been soft to the tune of an 0-12 postseason showing and a disappearing act in 5 of 6 games in the NBA Finals.

Outside of "they can be taught" I see no evidence that they have the capability to do it on a CONSISTENT basis.

This team is and will continue to be next year, a purely Kobe driven team. He needs a partner, someone who can take off some pressure off Kobe, someone who will take 2, 3, 4 possessions a quarter and MAKE plays.

Pau will be fine in the regular season. No doubt the regular 19 and 9 type player with 4.5 assists per game and a couple blocks.

It's next postseason I'm worried about.
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Postby knm131 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 11:00 pm

If it were humanly possible, I would move Pau for Brand in a S/T and try to use Odom's contract for a shooter and a pick.
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Postby hollywood swinger on Tue Jun 17, 2008 11:04 pm

lets face it guys we are still also in search of a true #2 scorer to develop. i think we will quickly see bynum is the 2nd leader on this team behind kobe interms of playing with fire. time to dump the dead weight. vlade,luke, mihm.
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Postby gill on Tue Jun 17, 2008 11:05 pm

hollywood swinger wrote:lets face it guys we are still also in search of a true #2 scorer to develop. i think we will quickly see bynum is the 2nd leader on this team behind kobe interms of playing with fire. time to dump the dead weight. vlade,luke, mihm.


Rip and Tay would fit sooooo well in this team.

Also, Mitch better URGE Phil to also get a defensive coach alongside him.
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Postby last stand on Tue Jun 17, 2008 11:05 pm

hollywood swinger wrote:lets face it guys we are still also in search of a true #2 scorer to develop. i think we will quickly see bynum is the 2nd leader on this team behind kobe interms of playing with fire. time to dump the dead weight. vlade,luke, mihm.


michael redd?

besides bynum is our magic johnson

kobe is our kareem book it
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Postby Mr_Hollywood_Line on Tue Jun 17, 2008 11:07 pm

Point(s) taken re: Vlade, Luke, and Lamar.

Vlade is worthless, Luke is smart, but has a limited skill set, and after this series, I question whether Lamar, with all his talent and versatility, possesses the heart of a champion.
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Postby hollywood swinger on Tue Jun 17, 2008 11:14 pm

last stand wrote:
hollywood swinger wrote:lets face it guys we are still also in search of a true #2 scorer to develop. i think we will quickly see bynum is the 2nd leader on this team behind kobe interms of playing with fire. time to dump the dead weight. vlade,luke, mihm.


michael redd?

besides bynum is our magic johnson

kobe is our kareem book it


redd would be a killer next to kobe. i just want coby,luke,vlade,mihm OFF THIS TEAM ASAP!

somehow we need a true star next to kobe. LO=nope, RU pau =nope, Bynum=?
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Postby Splash on Tue Jun 17, 2008 11:16 pm

Bynum needs to come into next season as the meanest dude on the block.

If he can establish himself as an intimidating bully-like force on the court, I think we'll just be fine.

This Laker squad was just EXCRUCIATING to watch these finals.

They got punked like lil' high school freshmans takin' it up the rear by big ol' senior football players...without even trying to retaliate.

*Shakes Head*

I'm pretty @#^%^ pissed right now.

Thank goodness there's a positive to all this...and it' s pretty big one too: #17.
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Postby last stand on Tue Jun 17, 2008 11:18 pm

hollywood swinger wrote:
last stand wrote:
hollywood swinger wrote:lets face it guys we are still also in search of a true #2 scorer to develop. i think we will quickly see bynum is the 2nd leader on this team behind kobe interms of playing with fire. time to dump the dead weight. vlade,luke, mihm.


michael redd?

besides bynum is our magic johnson

kobe is our kareem book it


redd would be a killer next to kobe. i just want coby,luke,vlade,mihm OFF THIS TEAM ASAP!

somehow we need a true star next to kobe. LO=nope, RU pau =nope, Bynum=?


redd coming here would be to play the role of ray allen and simply be a zone breaker for kobe

bynum has to become the 2nd guy for us to win more than 2 titles

i just want new blood on this team

someone competitive on a different level someone to finally take the pressure off kobe to create shots for himself and everyone else

thats why we lost our offense was have kobe create everything for everyone

spoon feed people for open shots and dunks

they knew that and made sure other guys had to create and none could
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Postby puffyusaf#2 on Tue Jun 17, 2008 11:22 pm

I disagree with your disagreement. The Lakers with all its pieces are the most dangerous team in basketball even that Celtic slurper JVG talked about late in this game. While I agree with thweaking the roster I can't imagine how fast anyone can forget we were 2 games from the championship trophy.

I told my friend who is a Spurs fan that the Lakers board will be full of "Trade everyone" threads. Why am I not shocked?
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