Artest is 4-24 in the last 3 games

I think the Lakers shooting coaches should give him some pointers. He always fades to either left or right when shooting, he rarely shoots straight up and I think that really hurts his chances of making shots. Yesterday he was so off though! and Yes I think that has a big part in our offensive vowes!

Yeah, let's just point out Ron's shooting. Let's ignore that Shannon is 7-25 in the last 3 games as well. Let's ignored that Jordan is 6-17, or that FIsh is 7-22, etc. But let's blame Ron, who we brought in for his defense, not offense.

KobeDunk10 wrote:I think the Lakers shooting coaches should give him some pointers. He always fades to either left or right when shooting, he rarely shoots straight up and I think that really hurts his chances of making shots. Yesterday he was so off though! and Yes I think that has a big part in our offensive vowes!

Yes, and he's making guys miss their open shots too right?

OK EVERYONE SAY IT WITH ME:

DEFENSE WINS CHAMPIONSHIPS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

LakerFanIam wrote:I know he's dealing with bad feet, but I honestly think I could jump higher than Ron right now.... Trust me, that's saying a lot.

He really looks like he's physically struggling out there... His hands are quick & he's a smart position defender, but his body is just not cooperating right now.

How is it that everyone (Lakers, commentaters, analysis, even fans) are saying that Ron is much better physically now, than he was early in the season, and you're saying he's not?

TT24 wrote:

LakerFanIam wrote:I know he's dealing with bad feet, but I honestly think I could jump higher than Ron right now.... Trust me, that's saying a lot.

He really looks like he's physically struggling out there... His hands are quick & he's a smart position defender, but his body is just not cooperating right now.

How is it that everyone (Lakers, commentaters, analysis, even fans) are saying that Ron is much better physically now, than he was early in the season, and you're saying he's not?

I'm not ripping on Ron at all... He brings a ton to the game even when he doesn't put up any stats... BUT, you can't tell me that he looks as mobile or has as much lift as he should... Maybe he's feeling better, it just looks like he's still physically limited out there sometimes.

& also:DEFENSE WINS CHAMPIONSHIPS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ron needs to watch tape of rick fox in the triangle. three point shots, baseline cuts, and the occasional duck-in. the only time he might ever need to freelance is if kobe, bynum, and gasol are all sitting simultaneously.

his work on d is still impressive, though. i have confidence his shot will return.

Lost weight, hurt his thumb, not feeling 100% comfortable in the offense. All excuses, sure, but they are legit. Heck, it took LO how many years to play comfortably in this offense? But I agree - he can, and should, play better offensively.

At the same time, he plays killer D, and if he continues to do so, his offensive problems are not hurting us much, if at all. Play hard, play defense and the offense will come. Why?

Because DEFENSE WINS CHAMPIONSHIPS.

Hurt thumb, and he's drifting on his shot too much, fixable. The one 3 he actually hit he was standing still and not drifting.

LA needs to get more offense out of SF and PG. The 2G, C and PF positions are pretty consistent, but with Ron and when Luke comes back that is two of the most unathletic SFs in the NBA. Farmar stunk last night and Fisher isn't much better. PG on O and D and SF on O has got to get better for LA to win a title.

Yes -- defense wins championships, but having TWO starters shoot less than 20% against good teams can negate all that defense. The Lakers lost by a bucket to Miami and Orlando. Fish or Ron hit even a normally bad % (rather than an atrocious %), and the Lakers likely win both games.

So two starters shooting 1 for 9, or 2 for 11, or 0 for 6, plus Jordan shooting 3 for 15 in the last few games, will lead to losses, regardless of defense.

The point in this thread is that Ron must shoot better than 17%.

That goes without saying.

tigerjeterkobe wrote:Yes -- defense wins championships, but having TWO starters shoot less than 20% against good teams can negate all that defense. The Lakers lost by a bucket to Miami and Orlando. Fish or Ron hit even a normally bad % (rather than an atrocious %), and the Lakers likely win both games.

So two starters shooting 1 for 9, or 2 for 11, or 0 for 6, plus Jordan shooting 3 for 15 in the last few games, will lead to losses, regardless of defense.

The point in this thread is that Ron must shoot better than 17%.

Lets look deeper than the superficial basketball is black and white ideas.

You are being rather selective are we not. Lets see some things in the Orlando game.

Lakers shot 37% (33-88) as a team from the field. Every starter but Bynum had a NEGATIVE +/- except Jordy (+2), Shannon (+3) and Drew (+10). We were also outrebounded by 11 boards. We also shot less free throws 26 (making 23) than Orlando made 28 of 39. I can see many, many, many reasons that we could point at besides Ron’s shooting in this game. Let us go look at Miami…

In Miami Lakers shot 51% (45-88) from the field. Ron shot 4-8 and Fisher 5-8 which are 50% or higher for both players. However the Lakers did shoot 60% from the free throw line at 15-25. The Heat conversely shot 21-25 from the charity stripe. That is a 6 point swing right there. Now the Lakers did shoot horrible from 3-point land @ 26.1% while the Heat shot 47.4% (7 of the 9 makes came from Q Richardson). Lets look at the Lakers misses from the 3, Ron (3), Pau (1), Kobe (5), Fisher (2), LO (1), Shannon (1) and Jordy (4). All these missed 3-pointers Kobe missed 15 possible points to lead the way. Any one of those shots fall we win. Now Ron did have a negative +/- this game at -5, Drew (-10), Shannon (-6), Jordy (-2) and Pau (0). In fact Kobe (+3), LO (+4) and Fisher (+1) had the only Positives in the game.

Like I said Defense wins Championships. It isn’t just the starters shooting a low percentage it is the team as a whole. You pointed to 2-games to make your point but if you look at the numbers for the game your opinion isn’t holding water for lack of a better term. Does Ron need to shoot better? Of course. Is his shooting the reason we lose games by 1 point? Not at all. Ron, unlike most, has been critical on our defensive side of the ball. You guys are pointing fingers at little issues when there are huge ones that should be addressed. Just my opinion though.

When Ron isn't having one of his rare good games offensively, it's like having 2 Derek Fishers on the court at the same time.

Yeah, I went there.

Disclaimer: Statement limited to the offensive end only.

dudes legs are tired from running too much

soon to have an injury, and will be out for the playoffs.

then those of you complaining will be happy

puffyusaf#2 wrote:another fan trying to hard to point fingers at the wrong things.

Why are you always trying to crap on peoples threads? Ron artest is stinking it up..A fan made a thread about it. Shut up already with the negativity...Ive read some good threads youve made...but as far as replies go, your always discouraging people from making threads.

Johnnyboy wrote:but as far as replies go, your always discouraging people from making threads.

Really??

Keep it up then, Puffy!

MadMax wrote:

Johnnyboy wrote:but as far as replies go, your always discouraging people from making threads.

Really??

Keep it up then, Puffy!

haha agreed. we have like 5 of these threads

Johnnyboy wrote:

puffyusaf#2 wrote:another fan trying to hard to point fingers at the wrong things.

Why are you always trying to crap on peoples threads? Ron artest is stinking it up..A fan made a thread about it. Shut up already with the negativity...Ive read some good threads youve made...but as far as replies go, your always discouraging people from making threads.

Ron Artest has played better defense than any other SF in the league. If you can honestly say he's been "stinking it up," maybe you should be the one refraining from posting.

therealdeal wrote:

Johnnyboy wrote:

puffyusaf#2 wrote:another fan trying to hard to point fingers at the wrong things.

Why are you always trying to crap on peoples threads? Ron artest is stinking it up..A fan made a thread about it. Shut up already with the negativity...Ive read some good threads youve made...but as far as replies go, your always discouraging people from making threads.

Ron Artest has played better defense than any other SF in the league. If you can honestly say he's been "stinking it up," maybe you should be the one refraining from posting.

Johnny, let the kid have his fun attacking people behind a keyboard

anyways like Bill Walton always says, "It's not how many shots you make, it's how many you take"..

Ron is a great defender but hes horrible on offense! He's very inconsistant with his jumper, had bad mechanics and never shoots it straight up, he's always floating on his jumper which hurts his %. He is also Fisher 2.0 when driving to the basket, he really can't finish at the rim and that surprises me. I never noticed that about him in Indiana, Houston and Chicago. It really got to the point that when he shoots I cringe. So as much as hes helping us on defense and thats where championships are won hes really not helping us on offense and thats where we miss Azira with his ability to slash and athleticism. Ariza was HUGE in the playoffs for us, he hit countless big 3s and he was no slouch on defense where he pretty much turned the Denver series around with 2 clutch steals. Im starting to get the feeling that the loss of Ariza will be to the Lakers what Posey leaving Boston was to the Celtics, hopefully Im wrong but Im starting to see a lot of paralels in the two ...

With Ron, Fish, Bynum and Pau in the starting lineup we are just too slow and unathletic to be efficient in the triangle consistantly. Add the fact we have no real consisant outside threat to spread the defense and it becomes a bit stagnent where Kobe needs to take over much more than he had to last year. Thats why I would be in favor or Phil starting LO and bringing Bynum off the bench, LO would make us more versitile on both ends. LO + Pau in the starting lineup is a proven formula that has worked last year. I would go back to it down the stretch to give us a boost into the playoffs.

if ron hit half of his layups he'd be shooting 45%.

not worried about his offense.

GNC wrote:if ron hit half of his layups he'd be shooting 45%.

not worried about his offense.

He's Fisher 2.0 when going to the hoop, I think he went to Fishers summer camp to learn how to make them.

Johnnyboy wrote:

puffyusaf#2 wrote:another fan trying to hard to point fingers at the wrong things.

Why are you always trying to crap on peoples threads? Ron artest is stinking it up..A fan made a thread about it. Shut up already with the negativity...Ive read some good threads youve made...but as far as replies go, your always discouraging people from making threads.

Crapping on threads? I appreciate your opinion but let me help you out. I disagree with the thread that isn't negativity. Negativity by its very definition means to be negative about something and since this thread is a NEGATIVE on Ron so if I disagree that would be a POSITIVE. I discourage threads of overreactions because they are just that and in fact they are usually full of incorrect information. I wish people would stop making threads without actually thinking of the whole picture. You should try to read my response on the other page and try and discourage that or better yet put a negative spin to counter what I posted.

If you make a thread it shouldn't matter if someone tries to discourage it "IF" you are able to back your point then you can defend it and the naysayers will have to shut up. Since the motto of "Come Strong" no longer applies to creating threads on CL maybe my standards are to high. Maybe we should change our motto to "well post something no matter how wrong you are as long as you are hating on our players its cool". Sound good?