BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby kray28 on Fri Nov 09, 2012 7:48 pm

Phil allowed for a ton of Kobe ball, why couldn't he allow the same with Nash?

We did not run 100% Triangle with Phil.
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby Battle Tested20 on Fri Nov 09, 2012 8:06 pm

kray28 wrote:Phil allowed for a ton of Kobe ball, why couldn't he allow the same with Nash?

We did not run 100% Triangle with Phil.
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby Finwë on Fri Nov 09, 2012 8:21 pm

^^

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Tex always insisted that the triangle was simply a basic format, that you could go to any look out of it. The Lakers ran pick n roll from i
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby Murdock on Fri Nov 09, 2012 9:43 pm

Nash can ... should he? not so much ... it would have to be amended to maximize his potential IMO ... don't know how feasible is that though
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby S.R.05 on Fri Nov 09, 2012 11:01 pm

if thats the biggest issue then we have nothing to worry about
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby MC on Sat Nov 10, 2012 2:09 am

Even though most would say Nash does not ideally fit the triangle I'm pretty sure he would still be productive in it......

besides, it's not like you run your system 100% of your touches....... generally you run your offense about 60% of the time while running sight adjustments and mixing in some ISO and Pick & Role action along with it.

It's not all about Nash either...... what about the 18-20 minutes Nash is on the bench........ it's also about what do you have in place to get less talented players shots coming off the bench while maintaining balance on the floor to cover transition opportunities?

Nash is a smart guy who is also a deadly spot up shooter............ if they decide to go with the Zen Master Nash will be the last guy you have to worry about out of all the new guys on the roster.
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby Ariza3 on Sat Nov 10, 2012 2:19 am

if phils back you dont have to worry about the starters. i think overall no matter what offense were running the players still are going to have to get to know eachother and thats the reason for a lot of our turnovers.

So i dont think the players will have trouble learning the offense. Nash has a super high basketball IQ, Kobe knows it, Pau knows it, MWP knows it, Dwight i think will have the most trouble learning it also that hes not 100% wont help.

Mike just wasnt the guy to get guys to respect him and buy into what hes teaching....also i just dont think hes a good enough coach to implement the princeton offense. If anyone can get the team to run the triangle its phil who will also tweak it to benefit nash's abilities aswell as dwights athleticism. no doubt.
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby Lets Go Lakers on Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:11 am

I think what this team needs more than x's and o's is a leader who can command the respect of the team. PJ is that guy obviously. The x's and o's will take care of itself. Pj will maximize the talent of this team.
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby Congo Cash on Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:38 am

Steve Nash is not stubborn unlike GP, and he is easily the better shooter...
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby yossarian33 on Sat Nov 10, 2012 4:19 am

I am more excited at the prospect of seeing Steve Nash have Phil Jackson as a head coach and watching that dynamic (which to me seems like it could be nothing but good), than i would be concerned about how he would fit into the triangle offense. I have confidence they could figure something out that will work.

Out of any coach that has been mentioned, i think hiring Phil has to be the best bet for getting Dwight & Nash that first ring, and I hope that's just what happens. I wouldn't mind Jeff Van Gundy or Macmillan either. D'antoni's coaching doesn't seem solid enough in certain ways and at key times, though as a former Suns fan back in the golden days of Stodamire and Nash I admit it certainly was fun to watch at times.
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby solenstyle on Sat Nov 10, 2012 5:09 am

Ariza3 wrote:if phils back you dont have to worry about the starters. i think overall no matter what offense were running the players still are going to have to get to know eachother and thats the reason for a lot of our turnovers.

So i dont think the players will have trouble learning the offense. Nash has a super high basketball IQ, Kobe knows it, Pau knows it, MWP knows it, Dwight i think will have the most trouble learning it also that hes not 100% wont help.

Mike just wasnt the guy to get guys to respect him and buy into what hes teaching....also i just dont think hes a good enough coach to implement the princeton offense. If anyone can get the team to run the triangle its phil who will also tweak it to benefit nash's abilities aswell as dwights athleticism. no doubt.



The center has the easiest job in the Triangle. It's part of the reason why Pau was able to do well in 2008.
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby Punk-101 on Sat Nov 10, 2012 10:31 am

I liked what I saw from the team last night in regards to them "not having to think too much". I hope the triangle wouldn't reinstate this detriment. I'm confident that phil would implement the tri slow enough with enough non-tri-, non-thinking offense to make for an appropriate learning curve.
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby last stand on Sat Nov 10, 2012 10:52 am

Punk-101 wrote:I liked what I saw from the team last night in regards to them "not having to think too much". I hope the triangle wouldn't reinstate this detriment. I'm confident that phil would implement the tri slow enough with enough non-tri-, non-thinking offense to make for an appropriate learning curve.


he did that in 2006 because lamar and co were just flat out incapable
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby borri on Sat Nov 10, 2012 11:18 am

Nash PnR is pretty gosh darn productive. Nash shooting open J's is also pretty gosh darn productive.

The TRI uses PnR. The TRI produces open J's for perimeter players. The TRI works best when you have players who can hit an open J.

You do the math on whether the TRI and Nash is a concern.
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby LTLakerFan on Sat Nov 10, 2012 1:47 pm

yossarian33 wrote:I am more excited at the prospect of seeing Steve Nash have Phil Jackson as a head coach and watching that dynamic (which to me seems like it could be nothing but good), than i would be concerned about how he would fit into the triangle offense. I have confidence they could figure something out that will work.

Out of any coach that has been mentioned, i think hiring Phil has to be the best bet for getting Dwight & Nash that first ring, and I hope that's just what happens. I wouldn't mind Jeff Van Gundy or Macmillan either. D'antoni's coaching doesn't seem solid enough in certain ways and at key times, though as a former Suns fan back in the golden days of Stodamire and Nash I admit it certainly was fun to watch at times.


To OP.....Does a bear bleep in the woods? Nothing to see here folks.....keep moving. Phil freaking Jackson, Steve freaking Nash and Kobe freaking Bryant will figure this all out. Guran freaking teed. :jam2: :bow:
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby charvin on Sat Nov 10, 2012 2:16 pm

Phil's going to poke fun at Nash 'carrying the ball' and calling Popovich the best coach from his quotes a few years back. :man10:
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby LTLakerFan on Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:19 pm

This is so beautiful, so perfect right now, just what is needed whether we win it all or not. PJ is our best shot. But to maximize this team and have a real shot at it, and to keep Dwight here and exponentionally getting better and smarter about the game, and to deal with the egos and the press (thank god for PJ back with the press) he is PERFECT. In the world of NBA basketball he is every bit as larger than life as any of them are. And whip smart to lead them. I still can't believe what has transpired since yesterday morning. :man4: :man4: :man4: :bow: :bow:
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby Alleyhoops on Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:51 pm

Elements of the triangle create scoring opportunities from perimeter spots much the way it did with Fisher. I can think of worse scenarios than creating spot-up opportunities for a player who Kobe called the best shooter in the NBA. It's one method of capitalizing on Steve's strengths and gives us something we've sorely been lacking for awhile -- good perimeter shooting. And yes, there is freedom to run pick and rolls within those sets.
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby KareemTheGreat33 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 1:05 am

Luke Walton played in the triangle and became productive despite his uhm, "limitations" (he sucks, simply put)... Now you take a Steve Nash, one of the best passer in NBA history, and you think he won't flourish? Granted his assists totals will suffer a bit, I expect a surge in other department and will be very very effective.
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby wcsoldier81 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 2:09 am

The biggest issue with this team by far ,Pjax or not , triangle or not , is defense ...
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby MC on Sun Nov 11, 2012 2:26 am

wcsoldier - ya but the offense had it's hand in that as well........ I think a lot of times when the Princeton was breaking down this team was getting caught unbalanced on the floor to protect vs transition points. Floor balance offensively when the shots are taken within a half court system also plays a big part in your defensive strategies.......... if you take bad shots out of the frame or timing of the offense than the unbalanced floor ends ups putting a big old spotlight on one of our perceived weaknesses which is transition defense. Between this and the flat out TOs giving the opponent extra possessions it puts serious pressure on the other side of the floor. All this has a lot to do with the offense and how efficient this team was running it......

They also have some rotation issues to solve on the defensive end..... no doubt..... but that will come as guys get familiar with each other and Howard actually works himself into his maximized self (he's not there yet)
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby wcsoldier81 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 2:39 am

Sure but our halfcourt D is poor too ..

1) PNR coverage ( before GS game , we were ranking 29th on defending the pnr ball handler efficiency wise)
2) can't stop people off the dribble
3) in general poor communication and lack of speed to rotate ...

Lack of speed/athleticism on perimeter , Pau being a defensive liability at the 4 is a HUGE concern ... worst thing ? D12 is damaged good as of now on D and who knows when he will be able to be the defensive anchor he used to be ( if ever)
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby MC on Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:20 am

^
I know what I would do about Gasol if I were Phil........ I would try and convince him to come off the bench...still get a good portion of his minutes but by having him come off the bench he would be able to play more minutes at his natural position at his age which is now center. Him knowing the triangle, you might be able transition the bench to Phil's philosophy a little quicker while reducing his minutes at the 4 and minutes overall to sustainable levels..... use the big lineup as a mix up rather than the base.

half court Defense is an issue that's for sure and it might be longer than sooner before that gets some fix'n too with the triangle being re-introduced (unless Phil has something else up his sleeve system wise). Hopefully they will start by just having a philosophy at that end of the floor like funneling the ball to the baseline..... this team is giving up the center of the paint way too much which maximizes a ball handler and offensive options schematically. That would be a start..........
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby Lakerjones on Sun Nov 11, 2012 10:11 am

As we are seeing, this is not the BIGGEST issue with Pjax. The biggest issue is does Phil actually want to coach or is he just stepping into this void in pursuit of his larger plans - to secure himself a larger piece of the Lakers' pie? I don't think he has much left to prove on the coaching end, and I don't think it's the major part of his agenda. He is leveraging his position to get more power in the organization.

Can Phil work with Nash and can he fit him in to his actual plans on the court? Sure. I don't think that will be much of an issue at all. Phil has shown flexibility in order to utilize his players strengths. That's coaching 101. He's not going to waste Nash's talent the way it was happening so far this preseason and season.
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Re: BIGGEST issue with PJax: Can Nash play in the triangle??

Postby blinkme28 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 10:34 am

He's a better shooter than Fisher and we still won 2 rings with an old outdated Fisher. Defenses will always double a penetrating Kobe and Nash will get those open shots. In reality our starters really only played 4 or 5 games together including the preseason. I hope we'll be an above .500 team by the middle of december.
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