D12 Discussion: Dwightmare over! (1139)

Re: D12 Thread - WoJo: ORL ready to trade

Postby Texas Lakers Fan on Mon Jul 02, 2012 8:04 pm

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Re: D12 Thread - WoJo: ORL ready to trade

Postby Lakerman JSJ on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:00 pm

Lakers' outlook on Dwight Howard should change
By Mark Medina
July 2, 2012, 8:41 p.m.


Within a seven-hour span, my opinion on whether the Lakers should pursue Dwight Howard completely changed.

Call me fickle and uninformed. But the same could apply to Howard, too. After constantly going back and forth on whether he wants to stay with the Orlando Magic or leave for presumably greener pastures, Howard finally put his proverbial foot down. He told Yahoo Sports on Sunday night that he wants to play for one specific team, which sources close to him indicated was the New Jersey Nets. But that wish blew up in his face when the Nets, for whatever reason, reached a deal to acquire Atlanta forward Joe Johnson, guaranteeing they wouldn't have enough cap space or assets to secure Howard.

My opinion has changed on Howard simply because of the circumstances. The main uncertainty in the Lakers swapping Andrew Bynum for Howard involved his long-term future with the purple & gold. He made it clear through back channels he had no desire in following in Shaquille O'Neal's footsteps. Howard also offered unenthusiastic responses toward playing second fiddle behind Kobe Bryant. That backdrop put the Lakers at huge risk by giving up a huge asset only to see Howard leave after one season.

That framework changes, however, with the Nets getting Johnson. The Lakers have stronger negotiating power in convincing Howard he likes sunny Los Angeles. After that a mix of winning, excellent weather, fewer options and the Hollywood spotlight could convince Howard to stay. After all, who could see Howard having trouble saying no to that backdrop when he's already agonized so much over possibly leaving Orlando?

Of course, some concerns still persist. When will Howard recover from his back surgery? Some teams, such as the Dallas Mavericks and Atlanta Hawks, will also throw sweeteners at the Magic center. How long will it take for Howard and Bryant to iron out any issues regarding their role? But those issues are far less agonizing than wondering when Bynum will improve his poor on-court behavior and inconsistent effort.

It's way too early to know whether the Lakers can hit a "home run," as General Manager Mitch Kupchak put it. But one thing's clear. New Jersey inadvertadently delivered a fastball right down the plate. Now the Lakers need to swing with full contact.


http://www.latimes.com/sports/lakersnow/la-sp-ln-la-could-lakers-outlook-on-dwight-howard-change-20120702,0,2119351.story?track=rss&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter&dlvrit=53297
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Re: D12 Thread - WoJo: ORL ready to trade

Postby FabFourLakers on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:03 pm

I don't want Dwight on our team...esp if we're giving up Bynum for him.

Now if we were trading Pau, that's a different story.
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Re: D12 Thread - WoJo: ORL ready to trade

Postby Texas Lakers Fan on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:04 pm

No it shouldn't. If Dwight doesn't wanna sign extension with the Lakers then we shouldn't trade for him.
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Re: D12 Thread - WoJo: ORL ready to trade

Postby Rooscooter on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:08 pm

FabFourLakers wrote:I don't want Dwight on our team...esp if we're giving up Bynum for him.

Now if we were trading Pau, that's a different story.


I don't know..... Howard is starting to sound Bat guano crazy these last few weeks.... first he want's out.... they he opts in..... then he accuses the team of "blackmail".... they he tries to get the Union to sue the NBA/Magic... they he demands a trade to only one team....

I wouldn't want him on our team regardless of who we traded.....
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Re: D12 Thread - WoJo: ORL ready to trade

Postby Doc Brown on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:11 pm

I don't want him on the team, but the FO seems to want him on the team. And the sad part is they don't care if other deals pass them by as long as they attempt to get there man.
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Re: D12 Thread - WoJo: ORL ready to trade

Postby therealdeal on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:12 pm

In general I like Medina and I think he's sort of right with this one, but getting Howard fixes nothing...

I think the Lakers would still need to trade Gasol. They still need to make a trade to fix their bench up nicely, get younger, and get more athletic.

I think Dwight coming here for a "rented" season would be good. I believe he would probably stay because he would get paid here; especially if Deron signs with New Jersey which would leave Dwight's options much more limited. He would have Dallas if Dallas can find a way out from under Marion and Haywood (just trade them to New Jersey, they love awful contracts). He would have Atlanta which is the current home of his best friend Josh Smith. Outside of that, he's not going to have any options. Considering the money he could get here, I don't see why he wouldn't end up loving it here.

However, a big 3 of Howard/Gasol/Bryant doesn't make us a championship team in my opinion simply because we'd have a remaining roster of:
Blake/Morris
Goudelock/Odom
Eyenga
McRoberts
Sacre

Excluding of course the free agents we have yet to bring back and including our draft picks. That bench is not good enough to do a damn thing. It has no scorer, no real great defensive presence, and not a whole lot of rebounding for that matter.

We need to let go of Gasol even if it is for a package like the Minnisota one: Johnson, Barea, Williams. That would shed some salary and make us a more complete team. Try to re-sign Sessions and Hill. Throw Blake to anyone (maybe Portland) and then re-evaluate the roster.

Sessions/Morris
Bryant/Barea/Goudelock/Odom
Artest/Johnson/Eyenga
Williams/McRoberts
Howard/Hill

That team is much better. We're still missing a real backup PG, but I think we could pick one up somewhere. Delonte West would be nice.
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Re: D12 Thread - WoJo: ORL ready to trade

Postby Rooscooter on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:13 pm

Doc Brown wrote:I don't want him on the team, but the FO seems to want him on the team. And the sad part is they don't care if other deals pass them by as long as they attempt to get there man.


If they are holding our for him then it's for "Star Power" only IMO.... he's not going to put us over the top... not with the supporting cast we have. Waiting this out until the final minute.... which could be the trade deadline next season by the way.... will hamstring any move between now and when the F'ing Howard situation is finalized.....
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Re: D12 Thread - WoJo: ORL ready to trade

Postby Texas Lakers Fan on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:14 pm

^ Beasley would need to come in a package for Gasol.
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Re: D12 Thread - WoJo: ORL ready to trade

Postby jjin28 on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:14 pm

I was pining for d12. But eff this chump. Him saying he wouldnt want to come to the lakers is an insult. And this guy obviously doesnt have the reasoning skills to see why the lakers organization can make him a freaking legend. Aint no way he becomes a legend in brooklyn, dallas, houston, orlando, etc.... He is short sighted n if he cant see that, then hes not ready to play for the lake show.

We should lock this thread n only open it if d12 humbles himself...eff this dude dissin lake show. Its embarrasing to keep this thread alive
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Re: Medina

Postby JUST-MING on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:15 pm

Mark Medina wrote:My opinion has changed on Howard simply because of the circumstances. The main uncertainty in the Lakers swapping Andrew Bynum for Howard involved his long-term future with the purple & gold. He made it clear through back channels he had no desire in following in Shaquille O'Neal's footsteps. Howard also offered unenthusiastic responses toward playing second fiddle behind Kobe Bryant. That backdrop put the Lakers at huge risk by giving up a huge asset only to see Howard leave after one season.

Who is to say Andrew Bynum has a long-term future with the Lakers?

He can also bolt for “greener pastures”. I don’t mind at all that Howard doesn’t want to follow in Shaq’s footsteps. He already has 3 defensive player of the year awards and 3 rebound crowns (Shaq only had 1). Howard has played the pivot the way that it is supposed to be played; ie. rebounding and blocking shots. That’s how Bill Russell won 11 titles with the Celtics.
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Re: Medina

Postby Rooscooter on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:19 pm

JUST-MING wrote:
Mark Medina wrote:My opinion has changed on Howard simply because of the circumstances. The main uncertainty in the Lakers swapping Andrew Bynum for Howard involved his long-term future with the purple & gold. He made it clear through back channels he had no desire in following in Shaquille O'Neal's footsteps. Howard also offered unenthusiastic responses toward playing second fiddle behind Kobe Bryant. That backdrop put the Lakers at huge risk by giving up a huge asset only to see Howard leave after one season.

Who is to say Andrew Bynum has a long-term future with the Lakers? He could bolt for “greener pastures” as well. Also, I don’t mind at all that Howard doesn’t want to follow in Shaq’s footsteps. Howard already has 3 defensive player of the year awards and 3 rebound titles (Shaq only had 1). He has played the pivot the way that it’s supposed to be played ie. rebounding and blocking shots. That’s how Bill Russell played when he won 11 titles with the Celtics. He didn’t need Kobe Bryant and Dwayne Wade to win titles.


Did you just imply that Howard would mean more to this team than Shaq meant to the 2000 team?..... And did you just compare him to Russell?....

Wow.... do you overrate this guy.....
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Re: Comparison

Postby JUST-MING on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:22 pm

JUST-MING wrote:I’d put Dwight in the same group with Bill Russell, Moses Malone, and Hakeem Olajuwon. Same size 6’10”. Same explosive second jump. Elite offensive rebounders. Can switch on and defend guards. The main flaw in Dwight’s offensive game is that he does everything to his right. Let’s be honest here, Bynum only has 1 post move, a drop step. Let’s not pretend he’s Kevin McHale on the block. He isn’t.

That Shaq comment was about developing a skillset, namely a bank shot at the age of 28.
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Re: Medina

Postby Rooscooter on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:24 pm

JUST-MING wrote:
Rooscooter wrote:And did you just compare him to Russell?....

Yeah, about 30 pages ago.


I hope it wasn't favorably......
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Re: D12 Thread - WoJo: ORL ready to trade

Postby lakersin4 on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:27 pm

With the Nets all but out of the picture to sign him next season, we need to take the chance..
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Re: Medina

Postby revgen on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:29 pm

JUST-MING wrote:
Mark Medina wrote:My opinion has changed on Howard simply because of the circumstances. The main uncertainty in the Lakers swapping Andrew Bynum for Howard involved his long-term future with the purple & gold. He made it clear through back channels he had no desire in following in Shaquille O'Neal's footsteps. Howard also offered unenthusiastic responses toward playing second fiddle behind Kobe Bryant. That backdrop put the Lakers at huge risk by giving up a huge asset only to see Howard leave after one season.

Who is to say Andrew Bynum has a long-term future with the Lakers? He could bolt for “greener pastures” as well. Also, I don’t mind at all that Howard doesn’t want to follow in Shaq’s footsteps. Howard already has 3 defensive player of the year awards and 3 rebound titles (Shaq only had 1). He has played the pivot the way that it’s supposed to be played ie. rebounding and blocking shots. That’s how Bill Russell played when he won 11 titles with the Celtics. He didn’t need Kobe Bryant and Dwayne Wade to win titles.


Bynum's agent has already indicated that he's willing to talk to the Lakers right now about an extension.

If Bynum "bolts", it won't be because he and agent didn't try to come up with a deal.
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Re: David Lee

Postby JUST-MING on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:38 pm

revgen wrote:Bynum's agent has already indicated that he's willing to talk

After the Trevor Ariza incident, I don’t have any faith at all in his agent.
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Re: David Lee

Postby revgen on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:47 pm

JUST-MING wrote:
revgen wrote:Bynum's agent has already indicated that he's willing to talk

After the Trevor Ariza incident, I don’t have any faith at all in his agent.


The Ariza "incident" happened 3 years ago.

And Ariza and Bynum are different players with different priorities. If Bynum's agent is willing to talk about an extension, that means Bynum told him to do it. Technically, Bynum could get a longer more lucrative contract from the Lakers by becoming a FA in 2013. Extensions aren't as lucrative under the new CBA.
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Re: Comparison

Postby vic5150 on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:49 pm

JUST-MING wrote:
JUST-MING wrote:I’d put Dwight in the same group with Bill Russell, Moses Malone, and Hakeem Olajuwon. Same size 6’10”. Same explosive second jump. Elite offensive rebounders. Can switch on and defend guards. The main flaw in Dwight’s offensive game is that he does everything to his right. Let’s be honest here, Bynum only has 1 post move, a drop step. Let’s not pretend he’s Kevin McHale on the block. He isn’t.

That Shaq comment was about developing a skillset, namely a bank shot at the age of 28.


One move is more than zero, which is how many moves Dwight has. This is a grown man's league. I no longer believe Howard has the sack to lead. Trade Gasol and let's ride. I'm sick of waiting on Dwight to ditch his skirt.
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Re: David Lee

Postby live and die in LA on Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:58 pm

JUST-MING wrote:
revgen wrote:Bynum's agent has already indicated that he's willing to talk

After the Trevor Ariza incident, I don’t have any faith at all in his agent.


Oh man I just had a flashback about Gumbygld, :man10: Completely forgot about that saga.
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Re: David Lee

Postby JUST-MING on Mon Jul 02, 2012 10:06 pm

revgen wrote:The Ariza "incident" happened 3 years ago.

Trevor Ariza is on his 3rd team in 3 years.

revgen wrote:Extensions aren't as lucrative under the new CBA.

Since when does the CBA apply to David Lee “negotiations”? The guy completely fabricated a $9 million offersheet, when teams could only offer the mid-level exception of about $5.6 million. He then fed the press lies regarding the Lakers not wanting to resign his client (“scorched earth” policy); et cetera.
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Re: David Lee

Postby revgen on Mon Jul 02, 2012 10:24 pm

JUST-MING wrote:
revgen wrote:The Ariza "incident" happened 3 years ago.

Trevor Ariza is on his 3rd team in 3 years.

revgen wrote:Extensions aren't as lucrative under the new CBA.

Since when does the CBA apply to David Lee “negotiations”? The guy completely fabricated a $9 million offersheet, when teams could only offer the mid-level exception of about $5.6 million. He then fed the press lies regarding the Lakers not wanting to resign his client (“scorched earth” policy); et cetera.


1) What does that have to do with Bynum?

2) There were teams that could have paid Ariza 9 million. Toronto is particular. Whether they did or not is hard to say. But to say that no team could offer him more than MLE at the time is false.

And once again, I don't see how this has anything to do with Bynum. Teams like Portland are offering max money to players like Roy Hibbert. Houston is offering $8 million to scrubs like Osik. Golden State paid perennial underachiever Kwame Brown $7 million last season.

Bynum will get paid max money. Whether it's here or somewhere else. The fact that he and his agent are willing to discuss an extension shows that Bynum actually wants to be here if the Lakers want him. He's not looking to "bolt" as you call it.
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Re: D12 Thread - WoJo: ORL ready to trade

Postby The Rock on Mon Jul 02, 2012 10:32 pm

Let Dwight rot in the East. What a jackass

He wants more control over decisions on the franchise. GTFO. What the hell have you done to earn such power?
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Re: David Lee

Postby JUST-MING on Mon Jul 02, 2012 10:37 pm

revgen wrote:And once again, I don't see how this has anything to do with Bynum. Teams like Portland are offering max money to players like Roy Hibbert. Houston is offering $8 million to scrubs like Osik. Golden State paid an underachieving Kwame Brown $7 million last season.

It’s far from a slam dunk that Bynum even resigns with the Lakers. He isn’t taking a paycut. He’s already making $17 million at the age of 25. That’s more than what Shaq and Kobe made during their primes. So who is to say that David Lee doesn’t demand a $30 million per extension – or takes the Dallas offersheet.

I wouldn’t put it past the guy with nip rings.
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Re: D12 Thread - WoJo: ORL ready to trade

Postby Texas Lakers Fan on Mon Jul 02, 2012 10:40 pm

:man10: @ Dwight. This guy has become the biggest clown in sports. He wants more power really? He has more given more than enough power in Orlando considering they fired their coach and GM to please him. I've said it many times and I'll say it again even if healthy he's at best a slight upgrade over Bynum. He averages 1.9 more points, 2.7 more boards, and 0.2 more blocks. Not a very big difference at all especially considering Howard is the #1 option while Bynum is #2 and plays next to Kobe Bryant who averages the most field goal attempts in the league. Trading Drew for Dwight definitely doesn't make us a legit title contender. Anyone who thinks it does is delusional.
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