Dwight Discussion: Griffin for Dwight?... Naaaa (1011)

Rooscooter wrote:

phoenixrisingla wrote:Surprised to see so many people in here still slamming Dwight.

I for one think he's played great the last couple games and his attitude seems to have improved too.

Does your definition of Great include free throw shooting below his already horrific average?....

He played a decent game but to say it was "Great" would seem to indicate he would at least go above his averages in some category wouldn't you think?

He was active on defense until he got his 4th foul and then committed a pretty silly 5th one.... when he went to the bench after that we separated a little because the lane was wide open and Nash and Clark had some very easy chances off Kobe action to the weak side. This is a fact.... not a slam on Howard.

I'm sure he's limited by his shoulder injury and he gave us some good defense early to establish the tone of the game on that end but I'm not sure how anyone can get to "great" from there.

What's important is that we won.... we looked like a team for once and we played some defense off of Howard for a change. The next couple games will be the key to seeing if we can salvage anything from this season.

phoenixrisingla wrote:

Rooscooter wrote:

phoenixrisingla wrote:Surprised to see so many people in here still slamming Dwight.

I for one think he's played great the last couple games and his attitude seems to have improved too.

Does your definition of Great include free throw shooting below his already horrific average?....

He played a decent game but to say it was "Great" would seem to indicate he would at least go above his averages in some category wouldn't you think?

He was active on defense until he got his 4th foul and then committed a pretty silly 5th one.... when he went to the bench after that we separated a little because the lane was wide open and Nash and Clark had some very easy chances off Kobe action to the weak side. This is a fact.... not a slam on Howard.

I'm sure he's limited by his shoulder injury and he gave us some good defense early to establish the tone of the game on that end but I'm not sure how anyone can get to "great" from there.

What's important is that we won.... we looked like a team for once and we played some defense off of Howard for a change. The next couple games will be the key to seeing if we can salvage anything from this season.

Look, you can still try to be negative about him if you really want. And if you keep using his averages from before the injury as a water mark, you'l be likely to continue being negative.

I guess great for me means "great relative to the 50% effort" we've seen from him before. His points werent mind blowing, neither was his rebounding truth be told. But when he's that active and energetic I'll take it.

Great by comparison to what I've seen earlier this season I guess. Time to readjust our expectations for our players and this team. Baby steps boys.

Rooscooter wrote:

phoenixrisingla wrote:

Rooscooter wrote:

phoenixrisingla wrote:Surprised to see so many people in here still slamming Dwight.

I for one think he's played great the last couple games and his attitude seems to have improved too.

Does your definition of Great include free throw shooting below his already horrific average?....

He played a decent game but to say it was "Great" would seem to indicate he would at least go above his averages in some category wouldn't you think?

He was active on defense until he got his 4th foul and then committed a pretty silly 5th one.... when he went to the bench after that we separated a little because the lane was wide open and Nash and Clark had some very easy chances off Kobe action to the weak side. This is a fact.... not a slam on Howard.

I'm sure he's limited by his shoulder injury and he gave us some good defense early to establish the tone of the game on that end but I'm not sure how anyone can get to "great" from there.

What's important is that we won.... we looked like a team for once and we played some defense off of Howard for a change. The next couple games will be the key to seeing if we can salvage anything from this season.

Look, you can still try to be negative about him if you really want. And if you keep using his averages from before the injury as a water mark, you'l be likely to continue being negative.

I guess great for me means "great relative to the 50% effort" we've seen from him before. His points werent mind blowing, neither was his rebounding truth be told. But when he's that active and energetic I'll take it.

Great by comparison to what I've seen earlier this season I guess. Time to readjust our expectations for our players and this team. Baby steps boys.

So reality is "negative"....

Great players should play great. He's injured but Kobe has been injured in the past as well and still played great.

The offensive flow was away from him for the most part and when he was involved he was fouled. He didn't shoot free throws well by any known measure of "greatness" that I'm aware of either.

As I said, he helped set the tone on the defensive end that led to the win against a tough opponent. He was largely non-existent on the offensive end but it wasn't for a lack of opportunities as much as it was him being in foul trouble and missing free throws.

I guess I reserve the word great for something that is way above average. If I started using for average performances it would lose it's meaning.....

khmrP wrote:^^^its possible, $4mill above the cap is the threshold, so a few house cleaning are in order for that to happen, mainly dumping Pau for nothing or amensty.

therealdeal wrote:

khmrP wrote:^^^its possible, $4mill above the cap is the threshold, so a few house cleaning are in order for that to happen, mainly dumping Pau for nothing or amensty.

We wouldn't waste our amnesty on a guy who's expiring. We're not the Warriors

I suppose if we traded Pau for literally nothing then it could work, but I don't see the Lakers going that route.

therealdeal wrote:Because we're still aiming for the blank canvas idea if Howard walks. We're still trying to rebuild from the ground up and if we start getting pieces back, we're still getting smashed by punitive taxes levied against teams who are "repeaters".

Part of the appeal of the total rebuild process is that we're likely going to be under the luxury tax threshold for a year so we can avoid those taxes. You start signing more guys and signing and trading guys, we're not likely to be a contender and we're going to pay out the nose for it.

khmrP wrote:

therealdeal wrote:Because we're still aiming for the blank canvas idea if Howard walks. We're still trying to rebuild from the ground up and if we start getting pieces back, we're still getting smashed by punitive taxes levied against teams who are "repeaters".

Part of the appeal of the total rebuild process is that we're likely going to be under the luxury tax threshold for a year so we can avoid those taxes. You start signing more guys and signing and trading guys, we're not likely to be a contender and we're going to pay out the nose for it.

dont matter to me since I'm not a Kobe fan but that to me would just be wasting another yr of his career or probably his last yr altogether if we're gona be inflexible with that plan. If you can sign the player to contend w/o Howard with the cap space in addition to adding solid pieces such as talented youth and picks it would make it a better transition IMO. I dont want to be like the Mavericks.

therealdeal wrote:

khmrP wrote:

therealdeal wrote:Because we're still aiming for the blank canvas idea if Howard walks. We're still trying to rebuild from the ground up and if we start getting pieces back, we're still getting smashed by punitive taxes levied against teams who are "repeaters".

Part of the appeal of the total rebuild process is that we're likely going to be under the luxury tax threshold for a year so we can avoid those taxes. You start signing more guys and signing and trading guys, we're not likely to be a contender and we're going to pay out the nose for it.

dont matter to me since I'm not a Kobe fan but that to me would just be wasting another yr of his career or probably his last yr altogether if we're gona be inflexible with that plan. If you can sign the player to contend w/o Howard with the cap space in addition to adding solid pieces such as talented youth and picks it would make it a better transition IMO. I dont want to be like the Mavericks.

Well we won't because we're based in LA, the West Coast Capital of entertainment. Dallas can't hold a candle to the appeal we have on people. I mean hell, Dwight didn't want to come here until he felt the LA lifestyle during his recovery.

I know what you're saying, but I think that's honestly the FOs take on this season: we're going all out for 2 years and then we're done with that crap for a year or two after Kobe retires. Obviously no one was expecting this epic failure of a season, but I strongly doubt it changes the future plans because we're talking about the Busses paying 100 million in just taxes for the next two seasons. If Dwight walks, we'll probably just try to fill the gap with some cheaper guys. Kobe and Gasol and probably Nash will finish their careers together (at least in LA).

Just my thoughts on how this'll go.

phoenixrisingla wrote:Umm, yes the reality is negative. Have you been watching at all this year? Not a lot to be positive about until recently.

As I said, you make it sounds as if setting the defensive tone is a small thing for this team. Based on how he affected the game last night, in comparison to ho he has played this season, he had a great game. Besides, you're conveniently ignoring his 17pt 13reb game against the Jazz. or is 17 and 13 "average" too?

You can turn this into a semantics debate regarding the proper syntax of using "great" and its meanings, or you can write off every game where Dwight doesnt get 20 and 20 as an average game.

Doesnt affect me either way, friend.

khmrP wrote:when I ref Dall I wasn't ref them for signing star player, I ref them because they're wasting Dirks last couple of years trying to wait and pursure certain star players. I dont want to see that happen here while Kobe is still playing at an elite lvl.

Rooscooter wrote:

phoenixrisingla wrote:Umm, yes the reality is negative. Have you been watching at all this year? Not a lot to be positive about until recently.

As I said, you make it sounds as if setting the defensive tone is a small thing for this team. Based on how he affected the game last night, in comparison to ho he has played this season, he had a great game. Besides, you're conveniently ignoring his 17pt 13reb game against the Jazz. or is 17 and 13 "average" too?

You can turn this into a semantics debate regarding the proper syntax of using "great" and its meanings, or you can write off every game where Dwight doesnt get 20 and 20 as an average game.

Doesnt affect me either way, friend.

Not at all.... setting the defensive tone is a positive.... but that's the one thing he's done consistently this year.... He's gotten frustrated when the others stand and watch him and then has bailed a couple of times.....

The last couple games the others have actually began to play off of him and rotate to protect him when he rotates.... that's not a Dwight thing... he's been doing that.... it's a Pau, Kobe, MWP and Nash thing. They were the reason the D is better... Dwight was about the same until he was limited by fouls.

It seems we won't see eye to eye on this. When Dwight has a "great" game I'll be back to congratulate him on it.....

therealdeal wrote:No we can't. Sign and trades aren't allowed under the new CBA for teams over the cap (or maybe the tax threshold, but for us it doesn't matter).