ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby Texas Lakers Fan on Sun Sep 02, 2012 2:57 pm

last stand wrote:
Rooscooter wrote:We haven't stepped foot on the court yet..... We could gel quickly and stay healthy and flat out dominate.... or we could have trouble adjusting to not having shooters and a very thin bench and have an injury or two and limp a long into the playoffs... I think it will be somewhere between but we are the ones that have to prove ourselves...... OKC is the defending West Champ.... so they are the team to beat until we beat them....


thin bench? meeks, jaimison, hill, blake

thats pretty good. it's not OKC, Miami, or denver deep but its pretty damn deep

I'd argue our bench is as good if not better than OKC or Miami. Think about it who does Miami or OKC have on their bench that can hurt you consistently? Miami has Ray Allen, Udonis Haslem, and Norris Cole. OKC has James Harden and Nick Collison. We have Jamison who can match Allen and Harden production wise and we also have guys like Meeks who is a very solid shooter and Hill who's a solid defender, rebounder, and hustle player. Not to mention we have the best starting unit in the league by a mile therefore we don't really need great bench production.
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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby v1n5anity on Sun Sep 02, 2012 4:26 pm

:man10: :man10: :man10: :man10: @ Jamison matching Harden production wise. Just wow. Jamison will average no more than 12 ppg, and I think more likely he'll score around 10, and even that might be generous. . Even if Jamison took more shots, he still can't match Harden's production. Harden does a lot more than just score.
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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby Finwë on Sun Sep 02, 2012 5:01 pm

V1n5anity wrote::man10: :man10: :man10: :man10: @ Jamison matching Harden production wise. Just wow. Jamison will average no more than 12 ppg, and I think more likely he'll score around 10, and even that might be generous. . Even if Jamison took more shots, he still can't match Harden's production. Harden does a lot more than just score.

Minute-wise (and that's what matters in the playoffs, Harden was out there against our starters most of the time, he just didn't start the game) Harden is actually a starter, Sefolosha playing the role of a bench player / rotation guy at that position.. Taking that into account, OKC's bench is Maynor (missed all season), Sefolosha, Cook, Collison, Mohammed, PJ3 (has health issues) right?
Ours: Blake (and Duhon), Meeks, Ebanks, Jamison, Hill.. We still may add a rookie (DJO) or sign another vet (Barnes, Martin rumored).
Their bench isn't better than ours.
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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby Texas Lakers Fan on Sun Sep 02, 2012 7:00 pm

V1n5anity wrote::man10: :man10: :man10: :man10: @ Jamison matching Harden production wise. Just wow. Jamison will average no more than 12 ppg, and I think more likely he'll score around 10, and even that might be generous. . Even if Jamison took more shots, he still can't match Harden's production. Harden does a lot more than just score.

Jamison averaged 17 & 6 last season. He's been a near 20 ppg scorer. Therefore he clearly can match Harden as far as points scored. To laugh at that just shows your lack of knowledge and level of immaturity. I never said Jamison is as efficient as Harden, but if we're talking about scoring Jamison can definitely match Harden. Jamison as I said has been basically a 20 ppg scorer his entire career and you think it's generous that he'll score 10 ppg? Wow just wow dude a clue.
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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby last stand on Sun Sep 02, 2012 7:21 pm

Texas Lakers Fan wrote:
last stand wrote:
Rooscooter wrote:We haven't stepped foot on the court yet..... We could gel quickly and stay healthy and flat out dominate.... or we could have trouble adjusting to not having shooters and a very thin bench and have an injury or two and limp a long into the playoffs... I think it will be somewhere between but we are the ones that have to prove ourselves...... OKC is the defending West Champ.... so they are the team to beat until we beat them....


thin bench? meeks, jaimison, hill, blake

thats pretty good. it's not OKC, Miami, or denver deep but its pretty damn deep

I'd argue our bench is as good if not better than OKC or Miami. Think about it who does Miami or OKC have on their bench that can hurt you consistently? Miami has Ray Allen, Udonis Haslem, and Norris Cole. OKC has James Harden and Nick Collison. We have Jamison who can match Allen and Harden production wise and we also have guys like Meeks who is a very solid shooter and Hill who's a solid defender, rebounder, and hustle player. Not to mention we have the best starting unit in the league by a mile therefore we don't really need great bench production.


eric maynor, james harden, nick collison and a promising rookie in Perry Jones III. maynor is an elite backup PG. harden is the best bench player.

we aren't better than them on the bench

miami

haslem, battier, allen, cole. thats better than us easily.
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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby last stand on Sun Sep 02, 2012 7:25 pm

Texas Lakers Fan wrote:
V1n5anity wrote::man10: :man10: :man10: :man10: @ Jamison matching Harden production wise. Just wow. Jamison will average no more than 12 ppg, and I think more likely he'll score around 10, and even that might be generous. . Even if Jamison took more shots, he still can't match Harden's production. Harden does a lot more than just score.

Jamison averaged 17 & 6 last season. He's been a near 20 ppg scorer. Therefore he clearly can match Harden as far as points scored. To laugh at that just shows your lack of knowledge and level of immaturity. I never said Jamison is as efficient as Harden, but if we're talking about scoring Jamison can definitely match Harden. Jamison as I said has been basically a 20 ppg scorer his entire career and you think it's generous that he'll score 10 ppg? Wow just wow dude a clue.


harden is not just a scorer, he's a creator, he gets to the paint, he gets opposing teams in foul trouble. he's also what 23, so he's only getting better

not to mention he shot 49% and 39% from 3

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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby v1n5anity on Sun Sep 02, 2012 9:27 pm

Texas Lakers Fan wrote:
V1n5anity wrote::man10: :man10: :man10: :man10: @ Jamison matching Harden production wise. Just wow. Jamison will average no more than 12 ppg, and I think more likely he'll score around 10, and even that might be generous. . Even if Jamison took more shots, he still can't match Harden's production. Harden does a lot more than just score.

Jamison averaged 17 & 6 last season.


He averaged 17 ppg on 40% shooting taking 16 shots a game. He's not going to get anywhere near the same amount of shots on this team. His %'s may go up, but he still won't be able to score close to 17 ppg. To think otherwise is being blindly optimistic.

He's been a near 20 ppg scorer. Therefore he clearly can match Harden as far as points scored.


Your logic here is flawed. Jamison won't get enough shots to average even 15 ppg. I'm not sure how he can possibly match Harden's production considering A) he won't play that many minutes compared to Harden and B) won't get the same amount of touches/shots. At this point of his career, Jamison doesn't do much outside of scoring. Harden does a lot more. So not only will Harden surpass Jamison's one strength in scoring, but he will contribute in other areas that Jamison is simply incapable of contributing in. Seriously, take of your Lakers goggles. If you're expecting Jamison to average 15+ ppg, you will be sadly disappointed.

To laugh at that just shows your lack of knowledge and level of immaturity.


You are one of the most immature people on this site. I hope you're kidding here. Also, you flip flop more than anyone I have ever seen. It's unreal. And laughing at your opinion is warranted considering how much you do it to others. You really don't have a clue about basketball. Stop acting like you do.

I never said Jamison is as efficient as Harden, but if we're talking about scoring Jamison can definitely match Harden.


Thing is, we're not talking about just scoring. You said Jamison can match Harden production wise. That's everything included. But even if we were only talking about scoring, you're still dead wrong. Jamison will not match Harden's scoring. He won't. He's not good enough to, he won't get enough minutes, and he won't get enough shots. It's as simple as that, really. As I said, Jamison's one strength is scoring. Harden not only scores better than him, but he will do other things that Jamison can't (create for others, draw fouls, defend, etc.).

Jamison as I said has been basically a 20 ppg scorer his entire career and you think it's generous that he'll score 10 ppg? Wow just wow dude a clue.


Yes. Ask the more intelligent posters here. 10-12 ppg would be GREAT from Jamison. Expecting anything more is unrealistic. Jamison being a 20 ppg scorer means absolutely nothing on this team. Ron Artest used to be a 17+ ppg scorer for a number of years. But that means absolutely nothing when your not getting enough shots or minutes. Dwight will play about 37 minutes per game and Gasol will play about 33 minutes. That's 70 minutes between the two, leaving just 26 minutes to be played at the PF and C position. Jamison will not play those 26 minutes. He will likely split those minutes with Hill. Jamison may play some at the 3, but really, he won't play too many minutes if everyone is healthy. Harden plays over 30 mpg. I'm really not sure how you can't see this. You're way to biased.
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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby v1n5anity on Sun Sep 02, 2012 9:31 pm

Finwë wrote:
V1n5anity wrote::man10: :man10: :man10: :man10: @ Jamison matching Harden production wise. Just wow. Jamison will average no more than 12 ppg, and I think more likely he'll score around 10, and even that might be generous. . Even if Jamison took more shots, he still can't match Harden's production. Harden does a lot more than just score.

Minute-wise (and that's what matters in the playoffs, Harden was out there against our starters most of the time, he just didn't start the game) Harden is actually a starter, Sefolosha playing the role of a bench player / rotation guy at that position.. Taking that into account, OKC's bench is Maynor (missed all season), Sefolosha, Cook, Collison, Mohammed, PJ3 (has health issues) right?
Ours: Blake (and Duhon), Meeks, Ebanks, Jamison, Hill.. We still may add a rookie (DJO) or sign another vet (Barnes, Martin rumored).
Their bench isn't better than ours.


I never said anything about the teams' respective benches. I was addressing the Harden vs. Jamison point.
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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby Finwë on Sun Sep 02, 2012 9:37 pm

V1n5anity wrote:
Finwë wrote:
V1n5anity wrote::man10: :man10: :man10: :man10: @ Jamison matching Harden production wise. Just wow. Jamison will average no more than 12 ppg, and I think more likely he'll score around 10, and even that might be generous. . Even if Jamison took more shots, he still can't match Harden's production. Harden does a lot more than just score.

Minute-wise (and that's what matters in the playoffs, Harden was out there against our starters most of the time, he just didn't start the game) Harden is actually a starter, Sefolosha playing the role of a bench player / rotation guy at that position.. Taking that into account, OKC's bench is Maynor (missed all season), Sefolosha, Cook, Collison, Mohammed, PJ3 (has health issues) right?
Ours: Blake (and Duhon), Meeks, Ebanks, Jamison, Hill.. We still may add a rookie (DJO) or sign another vet (Barnes, Martin rumored).
Their bench isn't better than ours.


I never said anything about the teams' respective benches. I was addressing the Harden vs. Jamison point.

OK, I was just giving my take on OKC's bench, not really responding directly to your post. Maybe it was an indirect response because you were arguing Jamison vs Harden and I felt that maybe that argument shouldn't be taking place as Harden is actually a "starter" that comes of the bench.
I understand where you were coming from though, and I agree with you about Jamison's production, especially on this team where he won't be featured nearly as much. I'd expect his percentages to go up though because of all the attention our other guys attract.
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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby v1n5anity on Sun Sep 02, 2012 9:43 pm

Finwë wrote:
V1n5anity wrote:
Finwë wrote:
V1n5anity wrote::man10: :man10: :man10: :man10: @ Jamison matching Harden production wise. Just wow. Jamison will average no more than 12 ppg, and I think more likely he'll score around 10, and even that might be generous. . Even if Jamison took more shots, he still can't match Harden's production. Harden does a lot more than just score.

Minute-wise (and that's what matters in the playoffs, Harden was out there against our starters most of the time, he just didn't start the game) Harden is actually a starter, Sefolosha playing the role of a bench player / rotation guy at that position.. Taking that into account, OKC's bench is Maynor (missed all season), Sefolosha, Cook, Collison, Mohammed, PJ3 (has health issues) right?
Ours: Blake (and Duhon), Meeks, Ebanks, Jamison, Hill.. We still may add a rookie (DJO) or sign another vet (Barnes, Martin rumored).
Their bench isn't better than ours.


I never said anything about the teams' respective benches. I was addressing the Harden vs. Jamison point.

OK, I was just giving my take on OKC's bench, not really responding directly to your post. Maybe it was an indirect response because you were arguing Jamison vs Harden and I felt that maybe that argument shouldn't be taking place as Harden is actually a "starter" that comes of the bench.
I understand where you were coming from though, and I agree with you about Jamison's production, especially on this team where he won't be featured nearly as much. I'd expect his percentages to go up though because of all the attention our other guys attract.


Haha my fault, I thought you were responding to me. But you're right about what you said. Jamison's %s will go up, but his numbers will go down (and minutes too).

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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby FabFourLakers on Sun Sep 02, 2012 11:57 pm

How can we have a weak bench after adding Jamison and Meeks, two guys that can definitely shoot the 3 ball and will probably be wide open all day playing with Nash, Dwight, Kobe, Pau? Blake is still a SOLID back up PG, we all hated him at the back up 2 but that's because Mike Brown is an idiot, at least he will have no choice but to play Blake exclusively at the back up 1 spot now that Meeks is in the fold. Ebanks is going to improve, there's no way he REGRESSES and playing next to Nash, he will probably play more free and hit those open mid range jumpers for us. I think our bench may be among the best in the league if everything falls into place....Jordan Hill, Antawn Jamison, Devin Ebanks, Jodie Meeks and Steve Blake. I'll take my chances with THAT bench along with arguably THE best starting 5 in the league. Even if people go down with injuries, our team is STILL deep enough to cover for it. I'm not worried at all. I like our team and I like our chances to win it all. Despite all of our flaws last year, we were literally a "Kobe not having a meltdown for 2 games" away from eliminating the eventual WCF champion OKC Thunder in the 2nd round. Teams WILL NOT be able to pack the paint against the Lakers simply cuz they have THE best shooting POINT GUARD in the league now who is literally AUTOMATIC from downtown. You want spacing? Bring in Antawn Jamison, keep Dwight in the game or keep Gasol in the game....u could even bring in Meeks and slide kobe to the 3....spacing is the last thing I'm worried about. The only thing I'm worried about with this team? HEALTH. If we're healthy, we SHOULD win it all. If not, we're out in the 2nd round.
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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby Doc Brown on Mon Sep 03, 2012 6:10 am

Jamison won't be scoring 17ppg for one reason and one reason only........minutes.

He won't get enough minutes to do that. 10-12 ppg is the range he will be in IMO.
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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby Rooscooter on Mon Sep 03, 2012 9:47 am

last stand wrote:
Rooscooter wrote:We haven't stepped foot on the court yet..... We could gel quickly and stay healthy and flat out dominate.... or we could have trouble adjusting to not having shooters and a very thin bench and have an injury or two and limp a long into the playoffs... I think it will be somewhere between but we are the ones that have to prove ourselves...... OKC is the defending West Champ.... so they are the team to beat until we beat them....


thin bench? meeks, jaimison, hill, blake

thats pretty good. it's not OKC, Miami, or denver deep but its pretty damn deep


I'd say it's pretty thin..... If we have an injury at SF or in the front court we're playing some real scrubs or running the starters into the ground....

Meeks and Hill have a lot to prove before they can be counted on IMO.....

Jamison won't be putting up 15+ for us...... His minutes will probably be close to his career low unless we suffer an injury....

Our bench is better...... But not a lot better.
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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby The Rock on Mon Sep 03, 2012 10:15 am

Man, after watching the Dodgers roll out a star studded lineup and laying an egg for the past month or so, reminded me nothing is a given. These dudes need to come out and play every game focused and with a lot of intensity with an eye on playoff basketball. And it doesn't help that Mike Brown = Don Mattingly. I hope Pau and Nash dont inexplicably underperform.
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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby therealdeal on Mon Sep 03, 2012 10:27 am

Doc Brown wrote:Jamison won't be scoring 17ppg for one reason and one reason only........minutes.

He won't get enough minutes to do that. 10-12 ppg is the range he will be in IMO.

This. Jamison is still more than capable, but because he won't play as many minutes, he won't score as much. His FG% should rise considerably and his scoring total should drop about 5-6 points.

And I would argue that our bench will be just as effective as Miami's.

Their starters are: Chalmers, Wade, Battier, James, Bosh. Battier isn't a part of their bench.
Their bench is:
Cole -okay, but inconsistent and undersized
Allen -still effective, but older and becoming an injury risk
Miller -should have retired, he won't withstand the rigors of another season
Lewis -coming off of an awful couple of seasons, also an injury risk
Jones -one-dimensional shooter
Haslem -good
Pittman -garbage
Anthony -garbage

Our bench is:
Blake- Not good.
Duhon- A little worse than Blake.
Meeks- Capable of starting, young, excellent shooter, developing defender.
Ebanks- Young athlete, capable defender, still a little raw.
Jamison- Still very capable of starting, a very good scorer, possible 6th man candidate, maybe some injury concerns.
Earl Clark- garbage.
Hill- Rebounding machine and capable defender.

Our bench AT LEAST measures up against theirs. Especially considering our advantage down low far exceeds their advantage outside.
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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby v1n5anity on Mon Sep 03, 2012 12:32 pm

Where's KeepBynum at :man10: :man10:
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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby FabFourLakers on Mon Sep 03, 2012 11:53 pm

therealdeal wrote:
Doc Brown wrote:Jamison won't be scoring 17ppg for one reason and one reason only........minutes.

He won't get enough minutes to do that. 10-12 ppg is the range he will be in IMO.

This. Jamison is still more than capable, but because he won't play as many minutes, he won't score as much. His FG% should rise considerably and his scoring total should drop about 5-6 points.

And I would argue that our bench will be just as effective as Miami's.

Their starters are: Chalmers, Wade, Battier, James, Bosh. Battier isn't a part of their bench.
Their bench is:
Cole -okay, but inconsistent and undersized
Allen -still effective, but older and becoming an injury risk
Miller -should have retired, he won't withstand the rigors of another season
Lewis -coming off of an awful couple of seasons, also an injury risk
Jones -one-dimensional shooter
Haslem -good
Pittman -garbage
Anthony -garbage

Our bench is:
Blake- Not good.
Duhon- A little worse than Blake.
Meeks- Capable of starting, young, excellent shooter, developing defender.
Ebanks- Young athlete, capable defender, still a little raw.
Jamison- Still very capable of starting, a very good scorer, possible 6th man candidate, maybe some injury concerns.
Earl Clark- garbage.
Hill- Rebounding machine and capable defender.

Our bench AT LEAST measures up against theirs. Especially considering our advantage down low far exceeds their advantage outside.


Agreed 100%. I'd say our bench is among the best in the league. Roos, i usually agree with you, but I think you're wrong on this one. I'm trying to find a flaw in our bench that we had last year and we just don't have it. We have our back up 2 in Meeks (who started for Philly last year for majority of the year), we got our back up 4 and 5 in Jamison and Hill not to mention Jamison can still play a little 3 if need be, and we have Steve Blake as a back up PG...while he's not the best out there, he's capable of backing up that position, evidenced by last year's playoffs. The only thing we hated about Steve Blake was when he was inserted at the 2 spot alongside Sessions. THAT was what drove us crazy. If we see him at the 2 this year, then I think we have a right to beat the crap out of Mike Brown when he walks down the street. But i doubt he will see 2 at ALL this season unless BOTH Kobe and Meeks go down with injuries (god forbid). Also, Devin Ebanks is GOING to be better next year. He knows he's the back up 3 and u know he's a hard worker so his game is going to look nice when the season starts ESP if he gets in the game alongside NASH. Everybody's game will elevate thanks to Nash. if he can make the scrubs in PHOENIX look good, imagine what he can do with our "scrubs" in LA. Hill may not be PROVEN but u know he's going to work hard and hustle every second of the game and he's going to get you offensive rebounds and extra possessions. That's all that I care about. I like our bench and I think we match up very well with other elite team's benches. Last year was an epic disaster...this year I'm expecting a much better showing from our bench.
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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby LoyalLakerfan44 on Tue Sep 04, 2012 8:09 am

wcsoldier81 wrote:I hate when people give us credit . We haven't proved anything , OKC is the clear favorite


I agree a lot of things have to go well before we can start dancing. First the chemistry; start without Howard, then with Howard, a lot of new faces, new offense, older players, injuries etc. So many factors that have to go well and then facing a teams (ie. OKC, Heat) that have been together and in the hot seat for years now!
I personally think that if the Lakers win a championship it won't be this year but most likely next year (if you can keep Howard).
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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby therealdeal on Tue Sep 04, 2012 9:07 am

LoyalLakerfan44 wrote:
wcsoldier81 wrote:I hate when people give us credit . We haven't proved anything , OKC is the clear favorite


I agree a lot of things have to go well before we can start dancing. First the chemistry; start without Howard, then with Howard, a lot of new faces, new offense, older players, injuries etc. So many factors that have to go well and then facing a teams (ie. OKC, Heat) that have been together and in the hot seat for years now!
I personally think that if the Lakers win a championship it won't be this year but most likely next year (if you can keep Howard).

wc was being sarcastic.
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Re: ESPN Predicts NBA Champion: Lakers Get 31 Votes

Postby The Laker Link on Tue Sep 04, 2012 11:01 am

lilman2834 wrote:I woulda sworn the Celtics didn't have chemistry when they put they team together n won it all. Yall. Ain't god.yall don't kno what the lakers gon do.lakers might win it all


On that note, the Lakers did pick Pau up mid-season and went to the Finals.

So you had one team that was built together over the off-season playing a team that was built together in the mid-season and the off-season team won.

Now yeah, the Heat won last year which gives them a huge edge, but I will take my chances that Dwight knows how to get involved having played against the Lakers a few years ago in the Final and Nash SURE AS HELL knows how to get involved having played and played and played the Lakers to death over the years.

I think Chemistry SHOULD be ok, and so I say we have a better chance than most people are giving us right now.
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