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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby Center Court on Thu Jan 30, 2014 1:09 pm

Uncle Drew wrote:Surprise surprise :man12:

Kyrie Irving Privately Telling People He Wants Out Of Cleveland


The Cleveland Cavaliers were hoping to be a playoff contender this season around Kyrie Irving, but have been terribly disappointing. The Cavaliers have missed on several draft picks and Chris Grant's job as general manager is in danger.

"Kyrie Irving has been telling people privately he wants out," wrote Chad Ford.

Irving becomes eligible for a contract extension this offseason and will presumably receive a max offer from the Cavaliers. Irving could become a restricted free agent in the 2015 offseason meaning he could not leave outright until 2016.

"The Cavs are working to try to create a winning situation and culture to make him happy," wrote Ford. "Didn't report it to say he's gone. Just trying to show why the Cavs are trying hard to right the ship right now."

Via Chad Ford/ESPN


No surprise here. Kyrie is going to be the first player to turn down his first max deal offer. He's going to be ours in 2016.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby revgen on Thu Jan 30, 2014 1:16 pm

Uncle Drew wrote:Surprise surprise :man12:

Kyrie Irving Privately Telling People He Wants Out Of Cleveland


The Cleveland Cavaliers were hoping to be a playoff contender this season around Kyrie Irving, but have been terribly disappointing. The Cavaliers have missed on several draft picks and Chris Grant's job as general manager is in danger.

"Kyrie Irving has been telling people privately he wants out," wrote Chad Ford.

Irving becomes eligible for a contract extension this offseason and will presumably receive a max offer from the Cavaliers. Irving could become a restricted free agent in the 2015 offseason meaning he could not leave outright until 2016.

"The Cavs are working to try to create a winning situation and culture to make him happy," wrote Ford. "Didn't report it to say he's gone. Just trying to show why the Cavs are trying hard to right the ship right now."

Via Chad Ford/ESPN


He's just mad that Bynum beat him to it.

That organization has been a mess ever since Lebron left.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby revgen on Thu Jan 30, 2014 1:27 pm

@MarkG_Medina 7m

Steve Nash, Steve Blake are also on the practice court

@MarkG_Medina 5m

Steve Blake, Jordan Farmar are also on the practice court


Looks like we'll be getting roster improvement from within. I look forward to not seeing Jodie Meeks run the offense anymore.

UPDATE

@LakersReporter 9m

2/2: Blake and Farmar are definitely out Friday, but are a possibility for (at) Minnesota on Tuesday. Nash not ruled out for tomorrow.

@LakersReporter 7m

Steve Nash just offered an update on the last tweet: "I don't think tomorrow is a possibility:" So he's out vs. the Bobcats.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby revgen on Thu Jan 30, 2014 1:46 pm

Uncle Drew wrote:Lakers Might Pursue Eric Bledsoe In Restricted Free Agency

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The Los Angeles Lakers might pursue Eric Bledsoe in restricted free agency this offseason.

The Lakers would presumably have to overpay Bledsoe in order for the Phoenix Suns not to match.

Bledsoe was traded by the Los Angeles Clippers to the Suns in the offseason.

Via Chris Broussard/ESPN


this is good and not so good news, good news is that we are already looking out there what is available, but bad news is that we will have to overpay Bledsoe, that's only chance we can get him, because Suns will match any offer.
Bledsoe would be huge for us, dude is beast.


Bledsoe is injury prone. Do not want.

And if we're going to sign Love in 2015, we shouldn't be overpaying guys like him.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby Doc Brown on Thu Jan 30, 2014 1:48 pm

I'm excited about Farmar coming back. Blake and Nash, nope. Marshall has earned the starting PG spot, the other 3 can compete for the backup spot.

If MDA is stupid enough to kick Marshall out, I hope to baby Jesus someone in the FO tells him that ain't gonna fly.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby Slurpee22 on Thu Jan 30, 2014 1:49 pm

We might win some games with Farmar and Blake back, but I doubt it's gonna be enough to hider us from a Top-6 draft pick.... it's good that they are back soon... we can potentially showcase them in a trade.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby D.B. Cooper on Thu Jan 30, 2014 4:02 pm

I want Farmar and X back,only.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby Battle Tested20 on Thu Jan 30, 2014 5:42 pm

It great to have SOME of these guys back but offense has never really been the overwhelming issue this year. Its our no defense philosophy.

These guys won't made that big of a difference in that area I don't think at least.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby Weezy on Thu Jan 30, 2014 5:51 pm

Great to hear Blake and Farmar are almost back, not great to hear Nash is.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby LakersN4 on Thu Jan 30, 2014 7:14 pm

Bulls fans are hopeful that they amnesty Boozer & deal Gibson & Dunleavy for Pau to let him expire & make an offer to Melo.. If only the fans actually ran that team. I'll take Gibson & Bledsoe, Monroe, or Deng over Melo anyday.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby Slurpee22 on Thu Jan 30, 2014 7:20 pm

I doubt, the Bulls give up Gibson, he is a player you need in the playoffs...
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby Savory Griddles on Thu Jan 30, 2014 9:01 pm

revgen wrote:
Uncle Drew wrote:Lakers Might Pursue Eric Bledsoe In Restricted Free Agency

Image
The Los Angeles Lakers might pursue Eric Bledsoe in restricted free agency this offseason.

The Lakers would presumably have to overpay Bledsoe in order for the Phoenix Suns not to match.

Bledsoe was traded by the Los Angeles Clippers to the Suns in the offseason.

Via Chris Broussard/ESPN


this is good and not so good news, good news is that we are already looking out there what is available, but bad news is that we will have to overpay Bledsoe, that's only chance we can get him, because Suns will match any offer.
Bledsoe would be huge for us, dude is beast.


Bledsoe is injury prone. Do not want.

And if we're going to sign Love in 2015, we shouldn't be overpaying guys like him.


Not sure if his weird little injury this season and the knick-knacks throughout his career are enough to say he's "prone." Slightly overpaying Bledsoe makes some sense. If we can pair Bledsoe with Love and whoever we pick in the draft (in the event we signed Bledsoe it would likely be a wing) I think those three are a fantastic start to a rebuild (actually, if that wing is Wiggins, we're talking a 2nd year Wiggins, Bledsoe and Love...that be rebuilt) and there would still be enough left over to make a run at Durant the next season when Kobe is off the books.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby revgen on Thu Jan 30, 2014 9:31 pm

Savory Griddles wrote:
revgen wrote:
Uncle Drew wrote:Lakers Might Pursue Eric Bledsoe In Restricted Free Agency

Image
The Los Angeles Lakers might pursue Eric Bledsoe in restricted free agency this offseason.

The Lakers would presumably have to overpay Bledsoe in order for the Phoenix Suns not to match.

Bledsoe was traded by the Los Angeles Clippers to the Suns in the offseason.

Via Chris Broussard/ESPN


this is good and not so good news, good news is that we are already looking out there what is available, but bad news is that we will have to overpay Bledsoe, that's only chance we can get him, because Suns will match any offer.
Bledsoe would be huge for us, dude is beast.


Bledsoe is injury prone. Do not want.

And if we're going to sign Love in 2015, we shouldn't be overpaying guys like him.


Not sure if his weird little injury this season and the knick-knacks throughout his career are enough to say he's "prone." Slightly overpaying Bledsoe makes some sense. If we can pair Bledsoe with Love and whoever we pick in the draft (in the event we signed Bledsoe it would likely be a wing) I think those three are a fantastic start to a rebuild (actually, if that wing is Wiggins, we're talking a 2nd year Wiggins, Bledsoe and Love...that be rebuilt) and there would still be enough left over to make a run at Durant the next season when Kobe is off the books.


Knick knack? He missed 42 games with the Clippers 2 seasons ago with the exact same injury to the exact same knee. That's injury prone.

If we're going to overpay to bring somebody onboard, Lance Stephenson is the guy we should be targeting.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby Savory Griddles on Thu Jan 30, 2014 10:29 pm

revgen wrote:
Savory Griddles wrote:
revgen wrote:
Uncle Drew wrote:Lakers Might Pursue Eric Bledsoe In Restricted Free Agency

Image
The Los Angeles Lakers might pursue Eric Bledsoe in restricted free agency this offseason.

The Lakers would presumably have to overpay Bledsoe in order for the Phoenix Suns not to match.

Bledsoe was traded by the Los Angeles Clippers to the Suns in the offseason.

Via Chris Broussard/ESPN


this is good and not so good news, good news is that we are already looking out there what is available, but bad news is that we will have to overpay Bledsoe, that's only chance we can get him, because Suns will match any offer.
Bledsoe would be huge for us, dude is beast.


Bledsoe is injury prone. Do not want.

And if we're going to sign Love in 2015, we shouldn't be overpaying guys like him.


Not sure if his weird little injury this season and the knick-knacks throughout his career are enough to say he's "prone." Slightly overpaying Bledsoe makes some sense. If we can pair Bledsoe with Love and whoever we pick in the draft (in the event we signed Bledsoe it would likely be a wing) I think those three are a fantastic start to a rebuild (actually, if that wing is Wiggins, we're talking a 2nd year Wiggins, Bledsoe and Love...that be rebuilt) and there would still be enough left over to make a run at Durant the next season when Kobe is off the books.


Knick knack? He missed 42 games with the Clippers 2 seasons ago with the exact same injury to the exact same knee. That's injury prone.

If we're going to overpay to bring somebody onboard, Lance Stephenson is the guy we should be targeting.


Well, maybe not Bledsoe, but I cannot get behind Stevenson. I don't know why but that guy screams "Contract Year Break-Out" to me. I just don't trust him at all. I'd rather do Monroe than Stevenson.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby revgen on Thu Jan 30, 2014 10:51 pm

Savory Griddles wrote:
revgen wrote:
Savory Griddles wrote:
revgen wrote:
Bledsoe is injury prone. Do not want.

And if we're going to sign Love in 2015, we shouldn't be overpaying guys like him.


Not sure if his weird little injury this season and the knick-knacks throughout his career are enough to say he's "prone." Slightly overpaying Bledsoe makes some sense. If we can pair Bledsoe with Love and whoever we pick in the draft (in the event we signed Bledsoe it would likely be a wing) I think those three are a fantastic start to a rebuild (actually, if that wing is Wiggins, we're talking a 2nd year Wiggins, Bledsoe and Love...that be rebuilt) and there would still be enough left over to make a run at Durant the next season when Kobe is off the books.


Knick knack? He missed 42 games with the Clippers 2 seasons ago with the exact same injury to the exact same knee. That's injury prone.

If we're going to overpay to bring somebody onboard, Lance Stephenson is the guy we should be targeting.


Well, maybe not Bledsoe, but I cannot get behind Stevenson. I don't know why but that guy screams "Contract Year Break-Out" to me. I just don't trust him at all. I'd rather do Monroe than Stevenson.


1) I can understand "contract year" when it comes to his offensive production. But his defense is legit and has been for awhile now. On top of that, he's 23 years old. I'm not surprised that he's making drastic improvements to his game given his age.

2) I like Monroe if we had a legit defensive anchor to pair with him. If Mitch can swing a deal to bring a shotblocker onboard, then Monroe looks like a good target. If we can't find a shotblocker to protect the rim, then we need to target a guard who can protect the perimeter like Stephenson.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby Lakerjones on Thu Jan 30, 2014 11:33 pm

^^ I'm a fan of Stephenson as well. Won't Indy lock him down though? He's an important player for them.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby wcsoldier81 on Fri Jan 31, 2014 1:47 am

^^^^ Pacers may not able/willing to pay the tax ... I think Lance is their priority but if they want to keep him AND avoid the tax = depth is likely totally gone

We need to think 2 way players ... Lance and Bledsoe ( injuries are a concern) yes , Irving and Love meh ...
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby Doc Brown on Fri Jan 31, 2014 4:38 am

Stephenson! Stephenson! Stephenson!

You guys hear that? It's the Stephenson train gaining momentum.

Awww yissssssss

Seriously, we need to test the Pacers by throwing a contract at Lance that he can't refuse, make the Pacers look at the luxury tax dead in the face. Do it Mitch.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby therealdeal on Fri Jan 31, 2014 10:09 am

I'm definitely getting aboard the train too. But not at the cost of other assets.

I think Stephenson is more of a 3rd option type of player. We need the first two options or at least the flexibility to get those two options. If we sign him, we need to preserve the money needed to get Love. Kobe, Love, and Stephenson with some of our bench players back and a rookie... That's a pretty good team. Probably a 6th seed or something.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby lukewaltonsdad on Fri Jan 31, 2014 12:00 pm

Indiana Pacers fans would be wise to cherish Lance Stephenson's ongoing evolution now, because he may not be around much longer.

Stephenson will hit unrestricted free agency this summer, where he will be met by an influx of hungry, deep-pocketed suitors bearing checks and promising additional fame. Among his admirers will be the Pacers, the team that facilitated Stephenson's rise from a brazen second-round draft pick to legitimate cornerstone with a pleasant edge.

The same team Stephenson doesn't want to leave.

"This is a great team—I’d love to stay," he told the The New York Times' Harvey Araton.

Remaining with the Pacers isn't that simple. Indiana is hamstrung by the same financial limitations all small markets face, detriments that won't disappear between now and free agency.

Constraints that could prevent Indy from retaining one of the most invaluable assets it currently has.

Gauging Stephenson's Value

Determining Stephen's exact value isn't easy.

The lines of potential compensation remain blurred this side of the CBA, more than three years later. Just know that Stephenson, who will earn just over $1 million this season, will net more.

According to Sports Illustrated's Chris Mannix, much more:

'Rival execs predicting Lance Stephenson will be worth between $7 and $9 million per season in a multi year deal this summer.'

That's not an unreasonable range considering how productive Stephenson has been (more on this momentarily). But it's also not a definitive one. Stephenson could see more, or he could wind up accepting less.

If he winds up accepting less, it will be for the Pacers. He won't be giving out discounts like Tootsie Pops on Halloween.

"I'm staying with the Pacers," he told Pacers.com's Mark Montieth in November.

While it's not unrealistic to envision Stephenson accepting a slight pay cut to remain in Indiana, his market may make the decision for him. Small differences are something he can stomach, but there will be a team that complicates things. That presents a drastically different offer.

It always happens like this. Teams force each other to make difficult decisions, and Indiana's is shaping up to be a doozy, maybe even an impossible one.

Stephenson is one of three NBA players averaging at least 13 points, six rebounds and five assists per game. The other two? LeBron James and Nicolas Batum, who are each earning substantially more than $7-9 million annually. Batum is the cheapest of the two, and he's bringing home nearly $11.3 million this season.

For the longest time, I've also compared Stephenson to Andre Iguodala. The two are eerily similar in skill set, able to impact both ends of the floor while also seesawing between off-ball and on-ball scorers and point forwards of sorts.

Exhibit A:

Iggy vs. Stephenson
Player PTS FG% 3P% REBS ASTS STLS Off. Rtg. Def. Rtg. PER 2013-14 Salary
Iggy 10.7 52.6 45.1 4.0 5.0 1.6 114 101 14.8 $12,868,632
Lance 13.3 48.7 35.8 6.6 5.2 0.7 107 98 15.0 $1,005,000
Via Basketball-Reference and ShamSports.

Not to say I speak for everyone, but I bet you didn't see that coming. Bothy Iggy and Stephenson are versatile players capable of having profound impacts. Teams with will pony up for that kind of double-ended talent. The Golden State Warriors sure did.

Because we should all be suckers for additional perspective, let's take a look at all players who are logging at least 30 minutes per game while also posting offensive ratings over 105 and defensive ratings under 100:

Cost of Two-Way Players
Player MPG Off. Rtg. Def. Rtg. Net Rtg. 2013-14 Salary
Kevin Durant 37.8 121 98 +23 $17,832,627
Paul George 36.5 113 94 +19 $3,282,003
DeAndre Jordan 35.3 115 97 +18 $10,986,550
Serge Ibaka 32.2 111 99 +12 $12,350,000
Lance Stephenson 35.2 107 98 +9 $1,005,000
Roy Hibbert 30.3 107 93 +14 $14,283,844
Joakim Noah 32.3 108 97 +11 $11,100,000
George Hill 31.7 111 98 +13 $8,000,000
Via Basketball-Reference and ShamSports.


First thing's first: Holy hell, Indiana. Four of the eight players on this list are Pacers. That's absurd.

Now, notice how much every other player aside from Stephenson is making. Save for Paul George and George Hill, he's the only one not earning eight figures annually. And I'm inclined to exclude George, since he's already the proud owner of a max extension that kicks in next season.

So, technically, Stephenson and Hill are the only ones taking home under eight figures, and at $8 million, Hill's pretty damn close.

This isn't to say Stephenson is worth Kevin Durant money—he's not. The CBA also won't allow anyone to pay him that much. But the average salary on this list is over $9.8 million, so that $7-9 million could be generously priced in the wrong direction.

How Much Can Stephenson Actually Be Paid?

All we need do is look at Larry Coon's CBA FAQ to find the answer.

According to Coon, the maximum starting salary for players who have been in the league for six years or less will be $13.7 million in 2013-14. Some team could offer Stephenson that coin.

Will they? Probably not.

That's more money than Iguodala signed for last summer. The current CBA punishes teams for overspending, preaching shrewd investing instead. But is it implausible to believe Stephenson could net $10 million to start? Not in my book.

Complicating matters will be Stephenson's free-agency status. He won't be a restricted free agent, so Indy won't have the opportunity to match any offer he receives. If the Pacers want to keep him, they'll have to sew him up before someone else does.


How Much Can Indy Afford to Pay Him?


This is a different, more loaded question entirely.

The Pacers won't be willing to dip into the luxury tax. Team president Larry Bird has made that perfectly clear. Leading into next season, that creates some issues.

Here's a look at Indy's salary commitments for 2014-15 (asterisk denotes non-guaranteed contract):

Pacers Salary Outlook
Player 2014-15 Salary
Roy Hibbert $14,898,938
David West $12,000,000
George Hill $8,000,000
Luis Scola $4,868,499*
Ian Mahinmi $4,000,000
Paul George $13,701,250
Chris Copeland $3,135,000
C.J. Watson $2,077,000
Solomon Hill $1,302,840
Lance Stephenson N/A
Donald Sloan $948,163*
Orlando Johnson $915,243*
Total salaries $65,846,933
Total w/o options $65,846,933
Via ShamSports.com.


Assuming the Pacers retain Luis Scola, Orlando Johnson and Donald Sloan, they have more more than $65.8 million committed to 11 players next year. As Bleacher Report's D.J. Foster reminds us, the projected luxury-tax line for 2014-15 is $75.7 million. This theoretically allows the Pacers to offer Stephenson just under $10 million to start, right in the $7-9 million range.

But that number is bound to decline.

Foster also notes that George is eligible for a $3 million salary bump if named to this year's All-NBA team, which let's face it, is going to happen. This puts Indy's ledger at roughly $68.8 million, suggesting it can only afford to pay Stephenson under $7 million in 2014-15.

Not only is that below Mannix's $7-9 million forecast, it prevents the Pacers from potentially rising above it.

So, you know, uh-oh.

Understand this dilemma was unavoidable.

The market demanded George and Hibbert be paid handsomely, and while I'm also no advocate of Hill's contract, $8 million annually is hardly sickening. David West' three-year, $36-million contract on the other hand...

But whatever. No one can say the Pacers have been irresponsible with their money. There's that much.

This early in the process, Stephenson is also far from a goner. He could surprise us all, and take less. Make that "much less." At 23, that's unlikely, especially after George and Hibbert didn't do the same. That puts this all on the Pacers.

Dumping Scola's $4.8 million salary creates extra wiggle room, assuming that's possible. Unfortunately, even that may not do the trick.

"He has totally reinvented himself," said Tom Konchalski, a Queens-based basketball scout, of Stephenson, via Araton.

Reinvented himself to the point of a lavish contract outside Indy's means? If the Pacers are, in fact, unwilling to foot luxury-tax bills and Stephenson is averse to accepting well below his market value, then yes, that's exactly what he's done.


http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1907 ... rice-range

I read this article about a week ago...thought it provided a decent breakdown...
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby lakerfan2 on Fri Jan 31, 2014 12:11 pm

I'd go after Stevenson for Around 10M. I think he's worth it. He's like a bigger Westbrook.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby Magic Skywalker on Fri Jan 31, 2014 1:35 pm

While I do agree on going for Stephenson (I think he's a terrific young player with a very high ceiling, and he certainly seems to have matured from when he came into the league), I certainly disagree on him being a bigger Westbrook.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby jhalp on Fri Jan 31, 2014 3:00 pm

Lance is everything we need and at a bargain in my opinion. Offer this guy between 10-13 and lock it up. He is a superstar next year. The guy does it on both ends and is getting the team whatever it needs every game. Very underrated in my opinion. I think he is CLOSELY behind George as the best player on the pacers. To me its a no brainer, he should be top priority over mellow or anyone next year.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby LakersN4 on Fri Jan 31, 2014 3:17 pm

LakersN4 wrote:Bulls fans are hopeful that they amnesty Boozer & deal Gibson & Dunleavy for Pau to let him expire & make an offer to Melo.. If only the fans actually ran that team. I'll take Gibson & Bledsoe, Monroe, or Deng over Melo anyday.

welp..

The Los Angeles Lakers, Washington Wizards and Charlotte Bobcats have each engaged in preliminary trade talks with the Chicago Bulls regarding Taj Gibson, according to a source.

The Bulls reportedly did not like the possible return from any of the teams.

The Bulls could be determined to move salary to create room and pair Derrick Rose with a second superstar.

“The way that works is this, when something gets close or they think there’s something there that makes sense they’ll come to me,’’ Tom Thibodeau said. “Every conversation that they’re having I don’t know about nor do I want to know about. I think it’s important for me to be focused on the guys we do have.

Via Joe Cowley/Chicago Sun-Times
Hope this goes somewhere.
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Re: Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Postby Battle Tested20 on Fri Jan 31, 2014 3:21 pm

Getting Taj Gibson would be great, but if we trade Pau, I want another 1st Round Pick and preferably for this year.
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