Goudelock is trying to expand his versatility

Goudelock is trying to expand his versatility

Postby revgen on Tue Oct 09, 2012 7:46 pm

Whatever gets me on the floor. I'm a combo [guard]," Goudelock said. "I want to be at the point where if i'm asked to play point it's not an issue on whether I'm going to be able to get guys into the sets and direct everybody into where they need to go. Everybody knows I can play at 2 and can score. But I want to be the biggest threat I can be at point guard.


http://www.latimes.com/sports/lakersnow/la-sp-ln-lat-andrew-goudelock-drawing-motivation-from-uncertain-future-20121009,0,4193706.story?track=rss

Therein lies the problem IMO. He's not a PG. Period. He's a scorer. If he was a PG, he would have shown it in the 4 years that he played at Charleston.

Sometimes you need to know who YOU are and not what others want you to be. Ever since Glock has been trying to be a "combo guard" starting in the summer league, he's looked gawd awful.

I'm all for him trying to expand his playmaking skills, but he can't be changing his mentality. He's a scorer first. Passer 2nd.
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Re: Goudelock is trying to expand his versatility

Postby therealdeal on Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:23 pm

He can expand his game overseas. This team is above his contributions. Sorry kid.
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Re: Goudelock is trying to expand his versatility

Postby The Rock on Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:27 pm

He'll do just fine at backup PG. Its not like he's gonna be asked to create. Just dump into Pau or Howard or Jamison down low and be the floor spacer
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Re: Goudelock is trying to expand his versatility

Postby revgen on Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:33 pm

therealdeal wrote:He can expand his game overseas. This team is above his contributions. Sorry kid.


I agree. If they want him to be a PG, then why draft him in the first place? He was the 4th leading scorer in the NCAA his rookie year. When we used him as a Gary Neal type scorer off the bench last season, he shined. He's wasting his time and ours trying to be something he's not.
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Re: Goudelock is trying to expand his versatility

Postby Lakerjones on Tue Oct 09, 2012 10:25 pm

Goodaluck with that Goudelock.
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Re: Goudelock is trying to expand his versatility

Postby therealdeal on Tue Oct 09, 2012 10:41 pm

revgen wrote:
therealdeal wrote:He can expand his game overseas. This team is above his contributions. Sorry kid.


I agree. If they want him to be a PG, then why draft him in the first place? He was the 4th leading scorer in the NCAA his rookie year. When we used him as a Gary Neal type scorer off the bench last season, he shined. He's wasting his time and ours trying to be something he's not.


But even his shine came at the expense of his defense. Neal isn't a good defender by any stretch, but he's definitely not an awful one. I read a stat somewhere that Goudelock gave up more than a point for every point he scored.

Not good.

I think his best chance at playing professionally is outside of the NBA.
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Re: Goudelock is trying to expand his versatility

Postby revgen on Tue Oct 09, 2012 10:52 pm

therealdeal wrote:
revgen wrote:
therealdeal wrote:He can expand his game overseas. This team is above his contributions. Sorry kid.


I agree. If they want him to be a PG, then why draft him in the first place? He was the 4th leading scorer in the NCAA his rookie year. When we used him as a Gary Neal type scorer off the bench last season, he shined. He's wasting his time and ours trying to be something he's not.


But even his shine came at the expense of his defense. Neal isn't a good defender by any stretch, but he's definitely not an awful one. I read a stat somewhere that Goudelock gave up more than a point for every point he scored.

Not good.

I think his best chance at playing professionally is outside of the NBA.


I'm not sure where your stats come from but according to 82 games, Goudelock's PG opponents shot 39 eFG% last season. And he outscored them 23.6ppg/48 to 17.7ppg/48. Goudelock also shot a gaudy 59eFG% against his opponents to get those 23.6ppg too.

http://www.82games.com/1112/11LAL5.HTM

Where his PG opponents outshined him was in the assist category, which is why they tended to have a higher PER than him. But since we're running the Princeton next season, passing and playmaking will be shared by all instead of the PG so I don't see that being an issue anymore if he's the backup PG and they're all following the system. If it worked for Gilbert Arenas in Washington, it can work for Goudelock.

The problem is that the coaching staff seems to be imploring him to be a more active playmaker. He's a not a playmaker and never will be. He's a scorer/shooter. Could he do a better job of reading the defense when they collapse on him and finding teammates? Sure, but he needs to do so being who he is and not what the coaching staff is apparently trying to turn him into.
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Re: Goudelock is trying to expand his versatility

Postby therealdeal on Wed Oct 10, 2012 9:05 am

That stat is a bit disingenuous. He didn't play PG very often last season, which is what I was referring to. I think we're discussing two different things here.

My point was that last season when he played, he was a poor defender. He played most of his minutes at the SG position where his opponent's eFG% was 54.5% and they outscored him by 6.5 points/48 minutes while also averaging more assists. Meanwhile he only shot an eFG of 41.5%. Last season as a backup SG, which is what he was mainly asked to do, he was not good. I'm not a big believer in PER, but he had a 2.8. That's low any way you want to shake it.

Now what you're talking about is what they're trying to turn him into which is a combo guard, someone like OJ Mayo. I think they're trying to do that because frankly the only way he can be an effective NBA caliber player is if he is a fairly potent offensive threat, because with his lack of size, athleticism, and strength he's not going to be a good defender.

I still think his best chance at being a professional basketball player is overseas. I don't see him making the final roster.
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Re: Goudelock is trying to expand his versatility

Postby revgen on Wed Oct 10, 2012 9:58 am

I don't think I'm being disingenuous since the chance of him being a SG again is unlikely with Meeks in the mix. He won't be guarding SG's again if he gets a spot on this team, so I don't see his defensive numbers against bigger shooting guards to be relevant. Also, he played 1/3 of his total minutes at PG, especially his stint when Blake was out and he was putting up productive numbers.

I don't mind him being a combo guard if he keeps his score-first mentality. What I have a problem with is his new "pass first" approach that's not working very well.

Mike Brown seems to like Blake more than Glock anyway, and Morris + Duhon are locked up, so I agree that overseas is the most likely option.
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Re: Goudelock is trying to expand his versatility

Postby KB24 on Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:07 am

He can expand his game....on a different team.
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Re: Goudelock is trying to expand his versatility

Postby S.R.05 on Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:25 am

shouldn't be too hard to expand on basically nothing
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Re: Goudelock is trying to expand his versatility

Postby Juronimo on Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:39 am

He doesn't have point guard skills or playmaking instincts. Also his ballhandling is suspect. He might as well try to learn how to play center.

He should just keep working on his jumper and improve his defensive skills instead of trying to fit a square peg into a round hole. He definitely has scoring ability. He should focus on being a specialist if he wants to stick in the NBA. If he does that, a homeless man's Steve Kerr would be his ceiling.
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Re: Goudelock is trying to expand his versatility

Postby therealdeal on Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:51 am

revgen wrote:I don't think I'm being disingenuous since the chance of him being a SG again is unlikely with Meeks in the mix. He won't be guarding SG's again if he gets a spot on this team, so I don't see his defensive numbers against bigger shooting guards to be relevant. Also, he played 1/3 of his total minutes at PG, especially his stint when Blake was out and he was putting up productive numbers.


Again, you're projecting what he might do this season, and I'm talking about what he did last season. Two different subjects. And 1/3 of his minutes at PG is an incredible minority in comparison to the 2/3 (67%) at SG where most of his numbers came from. His playing time was so limited that extracting information from them is already fairly difficult because of the sample size. To take that and further break it down, and to a smaller portion no less, is even more difficult.

Even so, he was outperformed as a PG because while he scored well he could not pass the ball well at all. Your point about the Princeton offense making that less important is true, but if he can't perform as well as Steve Blake as a defender and as a distributor, even within the Princeton Hybrid, then I don't think it matters. Heck, he can't even outplay Darius Morris.

I'm glad we agree he should be gone. The rest is really semantics.
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Re: Goudelock is trying to expand his versatility

Postby Ariza3 on Wed Oct 10, 2012 12:48 pm

mike brown has to stop trying to change players. glock is a scorer...so help him develop as such. if hes being developed as a PG he will be nothing but a 3rd string PG for his entire career...but if hes developed as a SG who can come in and just put up points quick or spot up for the 3 then he'd do well in the league.

we've seen what he can do when hes able to play the SG and score for the lakers. so i say let him do that and help improve his D so he can stay on the floor and score. theres plenty of teams that need that type of player off there bench esp when teams are going small.

I would love to see him get mins bc of what we saw him do last season, but now we have too many guards and he prob wouldnt get in the rotation anyways. before DJO got here maybe behind Meeks but now i doubt it.

He could be a Nate Robinson type player for a team who just comes in undersized but still gets buckets....with the 3 or that floater of his.
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Re: Goudelock is trying to expand his versatility

Postby karacha on Wed Oct 10, 2012 12:53 pm

I agree with revgen. Glock is a SG. An undersized SG, but a 2 nevertheless. Why even draft him and ask him to expand his game? That's totally unnecessary. He should probably go to Europe, learn how to play team ball and shoot those long "bombs". That's it. Or just play him with some starters here and let the kid shoot. If you want to play Meeks instead, that's fine, but do Glock a favor and send him somewhere else.

We have a bunch of young players who don't even know what their role is. Do we really need them? Morris, Glock and those few centers... meh. :man3:
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Re: Goudelock is trying to expand his versatility

Postby dj vitus on Wed Oct 10, 2012 9:49 pm

Who cares about versatility. Just keep throwing that 18-foot floater. It hardly misses. Any time you try anything else, it doesn't work.
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