Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby VincentTH on Tue Feb 21, 2012 12:12 pm



Thanks lotus for a very informative analysis of the current state of the Lakers FO. For this Lakers fan of 30 years, it is indeed sad!!!! Even compared to the lows of the 90's after the Magic's HIV scandal, I have never lost hope. I do now.
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby JSM on Wed Feb 22, 2012 1:54 pm

Mike Bresnahan of the LA Times wrote:
Magic Johnson: Jim Buss is running the Lakers, not Mitch Kupchak

These are uncomfortable days for the Lakers, who can't avoid the glare of the drama spotlight yet again.

Magic Johnson said in a conference call Wednesday that Lakers executive Jim Buss, not General Manager Mitch Kupchak, was making the important decisions for the franchise.

"It's not Mitch's situation anymore. Mitch isn't running the team. Jim Buss is running the team," Johnson said. "Mitch has to follow the direction of Jim Buss and what he wants. I wouldn't say Mitch is the problem. He's going to do his job."

Mitch Kupchak has been in the Lakers' front office for 25 years but Buss had been gradually handed more power over the years by his father, team owner Jerry Buss.

Jim Buss should meet personally with Kobe Bryant because the 14-time All-Star "just wants to be informed as a leader and future Hall of Famer and guy who has brought five championships to the Lakers," Johnson said.

"He wants more communication probably like he did when [former Coach] Phil Jackson was there and he worked well with Mitch. I don't think Kobe feels he has that type of relationship or the communication has been there with Jim. What probably has to happen is they need to sit Kobe down and sit Jim down. Dr. [Jerry] Buss was the master at taking you to lunch or taking you to dinner and going over what he was thinking and what he wanted to do with the team. Jerry West was good at that as well. Kobe, Mitch and Jim just have to get on the same page and things will be OK."

When asked if he would meet with Jim Buss, Kobe responded Wednesday, "Um, perhaps."
Johnson praised Bryant for airing his frustrations about the front office's unclear future plans with four-time All-Star Pau Gasol.
"I'm proud of Kobe for being a good teammate and being a good leader and voicing his opinion," said Johnson, who sold his 4.5% ownership stake in the Lakers two years ago but remains on the team payroll as a vice president.

On Wednesday, Bryant clarified why he challenged the front office.

"Nobody else is going to say it, man," Bryant said after the Lakers' shoot-around in Dallas. "I'm the only onw with [courage] big enough to say it, so I said it."

Bryant also discussed the brief, informal discussion among Lakers players after their victory Monday against Portland.

"I wouldn't have called it a team meeting," he said. "After the game, guys talked, D-Fish got up and talked, said a couple of words, and that was about it.

"It was just us understanding that we reached the midway point of the year and we really have to lock in on what we have to do and stay focused on ourselves and not let any outside distractions, be it trade talk, be it criticsism or whatever the case may be, interfere with what we have to do as a group, as a cohesive unit."

Derek Fisher, Bryant said, was "the one that calls the meetings and does most of the emotional speaking."

Bryant also weighed in on the Lakers' first trip back to Dallas since getting swept here in four games in the Western Conference semifinals last May. The teams play each other Wednesday at American Airlines Center.

One reporter asked if Dallas dinged up the Lakers' mystique last season.

"It's tough to put a dent in mystique with all of them [championship] banners," Bryant said. "They had a great year last year. They kicked our butts, that's for darn sure. But we're going to be back at it. We're middle of the pack right now but we have aspirations of being there again in June and seeing this team in the playoffs."

Can the Lakers do it with their current roster?

"Yeah, we can but we've got to be damn near perfect," Bryant said.

Johnson thought otherwise, saying the team needed to make "one or two trades" before the March 15 deadline.

If the Lakers don't pull off a trade and Buss doesn't communicate with the organization, Johnson remains pessimistic about the Lakers' championship hopes.

"They can compete for the Western Conference championship," said Johnson, who predicted the Miami Heat would win the NBA title. "But if they don't [make a trade], I don't think they'll compete. I think Oklahoma City is better. San Antonio is also playing better than the Lakers right now."

Bryant talked further about Lakers Coach Mike Brown, who has been questioned by some players about his substitution patterns and lack of rest between games.

"It's a constant learning process for him, coming to a group that we know how to play so well together and so forth," Bryant said. "We have certain things that are habitual for us, whether it's pre-game routines and other stuff. They seem shocking to him: 'How the hell did you win championships doing this stuff?' But it works for us. It's just a matter of him kind of getting used to it. He's doing it."

Bryant declined to elaborate.

Brown said he was pleased that the Lakers talked after Monday's game.

"I think it's great," he said. "If they have them in the future, to me I think that's a big positive, but I also do not need to know what they talked about in there."
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby lotus on Wed Feb 22, 2012 2:58 pm

The evidence mounts.
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby The Rock on Wed Feb 22, 2012 3:29 pm

So Mitch is basically a yes man. Like old times
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby Weezy on Wed Feb 22, 2012 4:14 pm

The thing that kinda worries me or bothers me, and maybe I'm just seeing what isn't there, is that Jim Buss seems to have little loyalty or respect for Kobe. And yes the name on the front is bigger than the name on the back, but Kobe is one of the greatest Lakers of all time, he's carried the franchise for years, you can STILL win with him, but all the stuff I read or hear makes me feel like Jim just sees him as another player and this is HIS team not Kobe's.

I had all this in mind already, but then Stephen A Smith just came on SportsCenter and said that Kobe called Jim over the summer asking to be involved in the coaching search at least if Shaw wasn't going to be hired, and Jim never even got back in touch with him, and STILL hasn't to this day. I don't know how much of that is true, but if it is true in some part that is just bad, how can you as the guy taking over and running things not even be in touch with your star player, the guy still carrying your franchise? That type of behavior just gives me no confidence for the future.
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby last stand on Wed Feb 22, 2012 4:19 pm

Not defending Jim buss on that because he should make an effort to contact Kobe. However my guess is that Jim and probably Jerry still haven't forgiven Kobe for his tirade in 2007. When Kobe called dr. Buss an idiot among other things. You haven't seen much contact between Kobe and Jerry, and since Jim is basically all about his father I'm guessing that's related to this
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby lakers_09tv on Wed Feb 22, 2012 4:20 pm

Stephen A. Smith on Sportscenter said that Kobe contacted Jim Buss during the summer, because he wanted to help with the coaching search and Jim didn't even respond to any of his calls and up to this day Jim hasn't made any efforts to contact Kobe.
He said this whole mess with the Lakers organization starts and ends with him.
Last edited by lakers_09tv on Wed Feb 22, 2012 4:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby lakers_09tv on Wed Feb 22, 2012 4:22 pm

last stand wrote:Not defending Jim buss on that because he should make an effort to contact Kobe. However my guess is that Jim and probably Jerry still haven't forgiven Kobe for his tirade in 2007. When Kobe called dr. Buss an idiot among other things. You haven't seen much contact between Kobe and Jerry, and since Jim is basically all about his father I'm guessing that's related to this

You have an excuse for everything. Hilarious.
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby lakers_09tv on Wed Feb 22, 2012 4:26 pm

Maybe thats why Kobe didn't say anything when Mike Brown was hired, because of the disrespect that Jim Buss showed him.
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby last stand on Wed Feb 22, 2012 4:29 pm

lakers_09tv wrote:
last stand wrote:Not defending Jim buss on that because he should make an effort to contact Kobe. However my guess is that Jim and probably Jerry still haven't forgiven Kobe for his tirade in 2007. When Kobe called dr. Buss an idiot among other things. You haven't seen much contact between Kobe and Jerry, and since Jim is basically all about his father I'm guessing that's related to this

You have an excuse for everything. Hilarious.


How is that even an excuse. It's called reasoning. Kobe called jims father an idiot and attacked him through the media. This is a fact. Jim buss is extremely close to his father which is documented.

Put 2 and 2 together before you personally attack me. Use some logic, use your education. If not use your own personal life. Would you be close with someone if they attacked your father in the media for everyone the see and hear
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby lakers_09tv on Wed Feb 22, 2012 4:33 pm

last stand wrote:
lakers_09tv wrote:
last stand wrote:Not defending Jim buss on that because he should make an effort to contact Kobe. However my guess is that Jim and probably Jerry still haven't forgiven Kobe for his tirade in 2007. When Kobe called dr. Buss an idiot among other things. You haven't seen much contact between Kobe and Jerry, and since Jim is basically all about his father I'm guessing that's related to this

You have an excuse for everything. Hilarious.


How is that even an excuse. It's called reasoning. Kobe called jims father an idiot and attacked him through the media. This is a fact. Jim buss is extremely close to his father which is documented.

Put 2 and 2 together before you personally attack me. Use some logic, use your education. If not use your own personal life. Would you be close with someone if they attacked your father in the media for everyone the see and hear

Then Jim Buss shouldn't be the head of an organization if he can't put personal matters aside for the better of the team.

How did I personally attack you? You can't be serious.
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby last stand on Wed Feb 22, 2012 4:43 pm

lakers_09tv wrote:Then Jim Buss shouldn't be the head of an organization if he can't put personal matters aside for the better of the team.

How did I personally attack you? You can't be serious.


How has he not put it aside. Kobe is a laker, making 30 million a year starting next season. How is that not putting it aside. The boss doesn't have to let employees in on company matters. Jim, mitch, and Jeanie are executives. Kobe is an employee. Should he have received a returned phone call? Yes it's the right thing to do. Is it necessary for Jim buss to treat Kobe like he's an executive? No
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby ShowtimeACB on Wed Feb 22, 2012 4:48 pm

last stand wrote:
lakers_09tv wrote:
last stand wrote:Not defending Jim buss on that because he should make an effort to contact Kobe. However my guess is that Jim and probably Jerry still haven't forgiven Kobe for his tirade in 2007. When Kobe called dr. Buss an idiot among other things. You haven't seen much contact between Kobe and Jerry, and since Jim is basically all about his father I'm guessing that's related to this

You have an excuse for everything. Hilarious.


How is that even an excuse. It's called reasoning. Kobe called jims father an idiot and attacked him through the media. This is a fact. Jim buss is extremely close to his father which is documented.

Put 2 and 2 together before you personally attack me. Use some logic, use your education. If not use your own personal life. Would you be close with someone if they attacked your father in the media for everyone the see and hear


Yes, let´s all use our own personal experiences, in my case more exactly when i´m at the office working, i´m not friends with everybody there but i do my job properly and the best i can, it doesn´t matter if one of my colleagues said something about my dad 5 years ago or about my brother 1 week ago, i have to work with them and i do it.

If in such a professional enviroment as the NBA u are telling me after 5 years Jim Buss is holding some personal dislike for Kobe letting that to interfere in the way he has to do his work properly then i tell you he's not a valid person for the job.
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby last stand on Wed Feb 22, 2012 4:51 pm

Yes Jim buss isn't working with Kobe. He's only paying him and Kobe is playing. Since when has Kobe had an input in anything laker related since 2007. Kobes suggestions of Kidd, JO, an Garnett sure went far.

Jim buss is working with kobe. Until he trades him out of spite which won't happen then this is a none issue
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby thkthebest on Wed Feb 22, 2012 5:00 pm

Mike Brown: "How the hell did you win championships doing this stuff?"

I'm curious to know what they're doing. Lol.
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby last stand on Wed Feb 22, 2012 5:04 pm

thkthebest wrote:Mike Brown: "How the hell did you win championships doing this stuff?"

I'm curious to know what they're doing. Lol.


No one will ever know. I will say we won championships based on 3 things IMO

Overwhelming skilled size
Sheer will
Kobes greatness

The reason it doesn't work anymore is outside of Kobe, Bynum, and fisher the will is not there anymore. And fisher has the will but doesn't have the ability to exert that will.
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby The Rock on Wed Feb 22, 2012 5:09 pm

Magic Johnson views Jerry Buss as a father. Magic publicly bashing Jim Buss really shows how deep Lakers' problems are.

Magic: "I've been with the Lakers orginization almost 35 years and this is really the saddest, most dissapointed I've been with the Lakers."

Magic: "Jim, if you got the reigns, you got to be a great owner like your dad was."

He followed it with a laugh but it was hard to hear @MagicJohnson say, "I gave them up. I gave the Lakers up."



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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby Alcindor on Wed Feb 22, 2012 5:12 pm

Sigh. Magic is always complaining about this team. As wary as I am about Jim, and I am, to date he is guilty of bad communication only. Don't communicate and people will fill that void with their own ideas which very often are bad. Most of the talk about him is speculation.

He had Stern pull the carpet out from under him on the CP3 trade and has had to regroup and recover. I don't blame him for Odom and we still don't know what that TPE and pick will transform into. This deadline and/or summer will likely define the guy's reign so I'll give him the benefit of the doubt until then. After that, he's fair game.
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby lakerfan2 on Wed Feb 22, 2012 5:20 pm

The Rock wrote:
Magic Johnson views Jerry Buss as a father. Magic publicly bashing Jim Buss really shows how deep Lakers' problems are.

Magic: "I've been with the Lakers orginization almost 35 years and this is really the saddest, most dissapointed I've been with the Lakers."

Magic: "Jim, if you got the reigns, you got to be a great owner like your dad was."

He followed it with a laugh but it was hard to hear @MagicJohnson say, "I gave them up. I gave the Lakers up."



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saddest? most disappointed?

disappointed - okay. we should be doing better with the talent we have.

saddest - magic where were you when Smush Parker, Luke Walton, Brian Cook and Kwame Brown were our starters.

:hurl:

It's been essentially what, 1 year since Jim has really taken over? If you say his involvement was prior, then he would be involved with the championships we've won. But since, he's made moves with what we've got.

Again, he had CP3 in our hands only to be snatched by Fatty Stern. That left our team scrambling to find what was left in the league to get, slim pickings with the lockout and new CBA.
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby Congo Cash on Wed Feb 22, 2012 5:28 pm

Magic Johnson opening his mouth, AGAIN... [Swearing is not permitted at Clublakers. You must edit this post prior to submitting.] him...
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby Weezy on Wed Feb 22, 2012 5:44 pm

I never actually watched Magic play (aside from his quick return in like 95 or whenever that was) as I started watching the Lakers in '92, but even still watching him say "I gave them up, I gave the Lakers up" while laughing was kinda harsh. I think he might have gone a little too far there, I know he's not from LA and he sold his share of the team, but he's still majorly associated with the Lakers, longtime fans had to feel a little stung hearing he's given up the Lakers.
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby TIME on Wed Feb 22, 2012 5:50 pm

Weezy wrote:I never actually watched Magic play (aside from his quick return in like 95 or whenever that was) as I started watching the Lakers in '92, but even still watching him say "I gave them up, I gave the Lakers up" while laughing was kinda harsh. I think he might have gone a little too far there, I know he's not from LA and he sold his share of the team, but he's still majorly associated with the Lakers, longtime fans had to feel a little stung hearing he's given up the Lakers.


He might be right in everything he is saying and implying about Jim Buss, but Magic still sucks for saying he has given up the Lakers.
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby lakers_09tv on Wed Feb 22, 2012 5:57 pm

Weezy wrote:I never actually watched Magic play (aside from his quick return in like 95 or whenever that was) as I started watching the Lakers in '92, but even still watching him say "I gave them up, I gave the Lakers up" while laughing was kinda harsh. I think he might have gone a little too far there, I know he's not from LA and he sold his share of the team, but he's still majorly associated with the Lakers, longtime fans had to feel a little stung hearing he's given up the Lakers.

He was joking when he said "given up on the Lakers". During the interview you could see that he was pretty upset with how Jim Buss is running things.

I honestly don't understand the hate that Magic gets on Laker forums. He is part of the media now. He is suppose to speak his opinion else he wouldn't have a job on television. Its not like what he is saying isn't true.

Magic is a Laker and will always be a Laker.
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby Weezy on Wed Feb 22, 2012 6:17 pm

Considering he said said earlier in the season that we weren't going to win anything as is and that he did sell his share in the team I don't think he was joking when he said he's given up the Lakers. I agree that he is a media guy now and it's not a huge deal that he says certain things, it just seemed a bit harsh the way he said that and was laughing. Then again right before that he said he was sad and disappointed with the Lakers so he obviously still cares. I for one am not hating on Magic at all, I'll always like him, just being that he is still one of the faces of the franchise even if no longer really associated with them, he might want to think about how some of his comments could come off to longtime fans.
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Re: Jim Buss = End of the Lakers as we know them...

Postby cthroatgtr on Wed Feb 22, 2012 6:21 pm

Jim has exerted a stronger influence over the last several years. He really need Phil gone to put his stamp on things. People forget that the Rudy T hiring was Jimmy boy and he messed that one up. Then Phil came in to restore order. Jimmy did everything he could to rid the team of any remnants of Phil. From the coaching hire to dumping Lamar.

To me it looks like he really want a big splash with CP3 and when that failed he went home. Everything since then has been like the Lakers not the Hornets are up for sale. Unfortunately the cupboard is bare. No signs of life in the FO. Rumblings of Mitch wanting to leave. Ronnie Lester dismissed. Seriously this just feels like one F*** Up mess and worst it aint getting better cuz Jimbo wants to do it his way when he clearly has no idea what he is doing. Smart owners let the basketball guys run things and Mitch should be calling the shots. All indications are Jimmy is not only running things but not even fully vested while doing that.

Proud organizations shouldn't do this...
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