Kendall Marshall Thread: The Marshall is Out! (waived)

Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby trodgers on Sat Feb 08, 2014 8:12 am

Expect some rust from Blake and Nash, but all three of our real PGs and Farmar, too, do a good job protecting the ball. Any of those four as a second unit player is a godsend.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby revgen on Sun Feb 09, 2014 11:06 am

trodgers wrote:Interesting. The more I watch Marshall the more convinced I am that his size and intellect makes him a better defender even if he doesn't try at all (but he does). He's not a bad defender at all. I know Rooscooter calls Sasha a fake hustle player; I think Marshall is just the opposite. He's working, even if he's not doing some of the things you look for in a hustle player.


Marshall plays a very conservative style of defense. Which I tend to like more than most.

Unfortunately, conservative defensive players are often called "lazy and slow" even though they don't do some of the headscratching stuff that the "aggressive" defenders do. Such as unnecessary double-teaming in the post, helping off a cutter, and picking up goal-tending calls just to pad their blocked shot stats.

Marshall can make improvements, such as fighting over the screen, and diving for a loose ball more often if he sees the opportunity. I also want to see him use his length to bother the opposing PG on pass attempts. Too often he plays the PG to score. If the PG is a pass-first player, try taking away the passing lanes.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby lotus on Sun Feb 09, 2014 11:24 am

Oft times "conservative" defensive players can play in the way Marshall does BECAUSE their teammates are hustling their a$$es off. They just cherry pick the passing lanes waiting for a pressured offensive player to unload a bad pass. I think a team of conservative defensive players would not be a very good defensive team.

And as for aggressive defense, (unlike the moronic double teamming the Lakers sometimes get caught up in), there's something positive to be said for ratcheting up the overall defensive pressure on the floor.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby Barnstable on Sun Feb 09, 2014 11:30 am

lotus wrote:Oft times "conservative" defensive players can play in the way Marshall does BECAUSE their teammates are hustling their a$$es off. They just cherry pick the passing lanes waiting for a pressured offensive player to unload a bad pass. I think a team of conservative defensive players would not be a very good defensive team.

And as for aggressive defense, (unlike the moronic double teamming the Lakers sometimes get caught up in), there's something positive to be said for ratcheting up the overall defensive pressure on the floor.


IMO you need both styles on a good defensive team. If everyone is diving for every ball, and running full steam at the open man, you start to open up lanes for the opponent to exploit your mistakes.

Marshall isn't a great defender, but I don't mind his style. I like that he's under control and not taking too many big risks. As long as he develops and becomes a headier defender as he matures as a player, I'm good with it.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby revgen on Sun Feb 09, 2014 11:34 am

lotus wrote: I think a team of conservative defensive players would not be a very good defensive team.


That depends upon the group of players. Marshall is 6'4. He can afford to play conservatively due to his size advantage. He can back off a little on drives. He doesn't need to jump immediately on a shot attempt either, so he's unlikely to fall for shotfakes.

If you have a 6'4 PG, 6'9 SG, 6'10 SF, 6'10 PF and a 7'1 center, you can play a conservative style and be successful. Everybody can simply switch on a P & R since everybody is the same size except for the PG.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby lotus on Sun Feb 09, 2014 11:48 am

Barnstable wrote:
lotus wrote:Oft times "conservative" defensive players can play in the way Marshall does BECAUSE their teammates are hustling their a$$es off. They just cherry pick the passing lanes waiting for a pressured offensive player to unload a bad pass. I think a team of conservative defensive players would not be a very good defensive team.

And as for aggressive defense, (unlike the moronic double teamming the Lakers sometimes get caught up in), there's something positive to be said for ratcheting up the overall defensive pressure on the floor.


IMO you need both styles on a good defensive team. If everyone is diving for every ball, and running full steam at the open man, you start to open up lanes for the opponent to exploit your mistakes.

Marshall isn't a great defender, but I don't mind his style. I like that he's under control and not taking too many big risks. As long as he develops and becomes a headier defender as he matures as a player, I'm good with it.

I agree to a degree, but I wonder how the more hustling teammates feel about Marshall's efficient conservative defense. For example, we all know Meeks is not a lockdown defender by any stretch, but he hustles a lot to the point of being ineffective at times. But with all of Meeks' effort, Marshall gets credit for smart "conservative" defense, even though Meeks' effort may be a contributing factor for the effectiveness of Marshall's defensive style.

I'll never know the answer to that query, but it is possible that the sentiment exists on a team with that situation.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby lotus on Sun Feb 09, 2014 11:56 am

revgen wrote:
lotus wrote: I think a team of conservative defensive players would not be a very good defensive team.


That depends upon the group of players. Marshall is 6'4. He can afford to play conservatively due to his size advantage. He can back off a little on drives. He doesn't need to jump immediately on a shot attempt either, so he's unlikely to fall for shotfakes.

If you have a 6'4 PG, 6'9 SG, 6'10 SF, 6'10 PF and a 7'1 center, you can play a conservative style and be successful. Everybody can simply switch on a P & R since everybody is the same size except for the PG.

I can see that with the current Miami Heat team. Wade and Lebron feast off of team defensive pressure creating cherry pick opportunities, but they are good on ball defenders. I would want Marshall to do a bit more than what he's doing.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby jbiggs on Fri Feb 14, 2014 1:39 am

really stoked to have this guy :jam2:
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby LTLakerFan on Fri Feb 14, 2014 2:16 am

:man10: 17 assists doesn't buy as much respect as it used to it seems. I didn't see much of the game against OKC. Did he suck elsewhere or something?
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby Quik Z06 on Fri Feb 14, 2014 2:43 am

If this team actually had shooters Marshall would have had 25 assists (easily) last night. There were so many missed open shots it wasn't even funny. I'll admit I haven't watched many games this year, but I thought he looked pretty good. He was being aggressive and he has a good eye. We need to keep him, I'd like to see him with shooters around him.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby KB24 on Fri Feb 14, 2014 2:49 am

Even though he is putting up big numbers, especially in the assist department, I'm still not sold on him. He does obviously belong in the NBA but I don't see him keeping up the same numbers longterm. He is still slow, his shot looks clumsy (but goes in right now for whatever reason) and he doesn't seem to be that competitive in nature.

This team is playing awful and losing every game. Until Marshall contributes to wins the numbers are the provervial lipstick on a pig.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby KareemTheGreat33 on Fri Feb 14, 2014 4:51 am

Amazing passes... I love that he can give it a bend to the opposite direction, Beckham-esque :bow:
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby revgen on Fri Feb 14, 2014 5:15 am

KB24 wrote:This team is playing awful and losing every game. Until Marshall contributes to wins the numbers are the provervial lipstick on a pig.


Marshall is a Mark Jackson. Not a CP3 or D-Will.

A team isn't going to win much with him as their best player. His job is to be a timekeeper and keep everybody else in rhythm.

If Marshall's numbers are "lipstick on a pig" on this squad, then so are Rondo's for Boston this season. Since returning from injury, Rondo's putting up 13ppg and 9.4 AST per 36 minutes, yet his team still stinks.

Marshall right now is Rondo-lite. Not too bad for the price we're paying him. If we had an elite shotblocker, an elite wing scorer, and some solid shooters, he'd fit in much better than he is. Marshall's job is to make it easier for our top 3 scorers during periods 1 through 3, so they can go to work with fresh legs in period 4. The guys we have now absolutely depend upon a playmaker to set them up all the time. Not a good combination.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby trodgers on Fri Feb 14, 2014 5:58 am

Despite missing some starts and having some low MPG early this month, look at this:

Assists in January+February
1. Marshall 228
2. Wall 190

He's blowing people away.

Here's that double double list:
1. Magic 329
2. Kobe 80
3. Van Exel 69
4. Threatt 41
5. Cooper / Marshall 11

Marshall has one fewer point/assist double double than Fisher, Blake, Sessions, Atkins, and Smush combined.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby trodgers on Fri Feb 14, 2014 6:10 am

I think that people are approaching Marshall all wrong. He's my favorite Laker right now. Here's why.

1. He has ARGUABLY the best passing ability in the NBA. It's right up there with anyone.
2. He has a commitment to improving.
3. He is establishing a track record of addressing his weaknesses.
4. He's YOUNG.
5. He's so cheap it's ridiculous.

If you're cash strapped and trying to build a team, you want Kendall Marshall as your starting PG next season simply because he can hold it down for the league minimum. We have far greater needs - a big and a wing - that we can address one through trade and one through draft.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby kenzo on Fri Feb 14, 2014 6:39 am

trodgers wrote:I think that people are approaching Marshall all wrong. He's my favorite Laker right now. Here's why.

1. He has ARGUABLY the best passing ability in the NBA. It's right up there with anyone.
2. He has a commitment to improving.
3. He is establishing a track record of addressing his weaknesses.
4. He's YOUNG.
5. He's so cheap it's ridiculous.

If you're cash strapped and trying to build a team, you want Kendall Marshall as your starting PG next season simply because he can hold it down for the league minimum. We have far greater needs - a big and a wing - that we can address one through trade and one through draft.

QFT. I also think he is the guy that can play with Kobe (meaning he will give the ball to a person with the best chance of scoring, instead of just dumping it to Kobe).
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby KareemTheGreat33 on Fri Feb 14, 2014 7:33 am

remains to be seen if he can play with Kobe...but he should be locked up if we can get Embiid.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby lakerfan2 on Fri Feb 14, 2014 9:28 am

I like his game. He really kept us in the game toward the end, until the Thunder started to read the passes and KD took over.

I like that he tries to make certain passes, but some passes are a no no, like when Kaman/Sacre are between 3 defenders.

He'd be perfect off the bench, even if the bench isn't as solid as you would like, but he could make them work. 3 solid quarters against top ranked OKC, props.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby Lakerjones on Fri Feb 14, 2014 9:48 am

I'm sort of in between the extremes here on Marshall. I saw him live on Tuesday night at the Staples against Utah and I was underwhelmed with his lack of speed, his lack of D, and his poor shooting. But even in a terrible losing effort by the team it was impossible not to recognize his incredible passing skills (I think he still had like 8 assists). I don't know what his ceiling is or where exactly he could be in time but I definitely would like to keep him another year to develop him off the bench. I still prefer Farmar as starter, but Marshall is as good a passer as I've seen in ages at the PG and I think he could probably split minutes with Jordan.

Like TRodgers said, he's dirt cheap so there's no reason not to keep him and see what he can do in hopefully a more competitive season.

Blake needs to go. Too expensive, too injury prone, too much of a bust for us over these 4 years.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby lakerfan2 on Fri Feb 14, 2014 9:57 am

The thing with Marshall is, that his game doesn't require speed to be effective. His handling is pretty efficient, as you saw how many times he got to the paint for those scoop layups. Everyone is so worried that he's going to make some sort of pass that they kinda leave him open, kinda like what Nash does.

His defense could be improved, but point guard defense is kind of a moot point because 1. actual pg's that can defend are rare 2. they get picked off anyway. The team has to buy into the defense and there has to be an anchor back there so that the perimeter players know they can play aggressive.

His shooting is not that bad, and he's actually been hitting a high clip of his 3's. Albeit an awkward form, he's been shooting 46.5% from outside per 4 attempts per game in his 25 games.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby therealdeal on Fri Feb 14, 2014 10:06 am

I actually prefer him to start with star players than Farmar. Farmar makes a great change of pace, he brings tremendous energy, and he is still very athletic.

Marshall is a metronome. When he is your PG, the offense moves very naturally. He plays decently off the ball offensively, he obviously makes tremendous passes, and he spaces the floor better than anyone in the League (he is literally shooting at a better percentage than Kyle Korver). He's the perfect PG to run an offense that has more than one option on it.

Give him Kobe and give him a post presence inside and I think Marshall makes a great PG for this team for at least next season. Eventually we would probably opt for a better defender, but with Kobe coming off of two major surgeries and no other legitimate scoring threat on this team (maybe Nick if he stays), it's great to have a PG that is so adept at finding others in the right spot.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby Lakerjones on Fri Feb 14, 2014 10:12 am

therealdeal wrote:I actually prefer him to start with star players than Farmar. Farmar makes a great change of pace, he brings tremendous energy, and he is still very athletic.

Marshall is a metronome. When he is your PG, the offense moves very naturally. He plays decently off the ball offensively, he obviously makes tremendous passes, and he spaces the floor better than anyone in the League (he is literally shooting at a better percentage than Kyle Korver). He's the perfect PG to run an offense that has more than one option on it.

Give him Kobe and give him a post presence inside and I think Marshall makes a great PG for this team for at least next season. Eventually we would probably opt for a better defender, but with Kobe coming off of two major surgeries and no other legitimate scoring threat on this team (maybe Nick if he stays), it's great to have a PG that is so adept at finding others in the right spot.


Solid points realdeal. I see what you mean.

Either way I really like the idea of Farmar and Marshall next year . . . as long as we aren't picking a PG in the draft of course.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby therealdeal on Fri Feb 14, 2014 10:19 am

Lakerjones wrote:
therealdeal wrote:I actually prefer him to start with star players than Farmar. Farmar makes a great change of pace, he brings tremendous energy, and he is still very athletic.

Marshall is a metronome. When he is your PG, the offense moves very naturally. He plays decently off the ball offensively, he obviously makes tremendous passes, and he spaces the floor better than anyone in the League (he is literally shooting at a better percentage than Kyle Korver). He's the perfect PG to run an offense that has more than one option on it.

Give him Kobe and give him a post presence inside and I think Marshall makes a great PG for this team for at least next season. Eventually we would probably opt for a better defender, but with Kobe coming off of two major surgeries and no other legitimate scoring threat on this team (maybe Nick if he stays), it's great to have a PG that is so adept at finding others in the right spot.


Solid points realdeal. I see what you mean.

Either way I really like the idea of Farmar and Marshall next year . . . as long as we aren't picking a PG in the draft of course.

Agreed. If we end up 4th or 5th and take Exum then I would rather see Exum/Farmar just because it'd be more exciting and more in line with what other teams trot out for the most part.

I still like Marshall a lot though. I think on a good team he can average 10/10 even if he's not controlling the ball every possession. In fact trodgers what's his consumption look like? Does it compare with other ball dominant guards?
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby lukewaltonsdad on Fri Feb 14, 2014 10:28 am

I'm glad for Marshall and all of his success so far...however, after seeing Exum and what he could potentially bring to the table with his talent, depending how he works out this summer for the Lakers, I'm kind of digging his talent so far. I just hate he's in Australia, and I can't seen him against Division 1 level competition.

Either way, Marshall has definitely carved out a nice with this team. We need to pick up his option. I'm loving the way he quarterbacks this team...he plays a great floor game, plays with his head up, and has outstanding vision. Keep him.
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Re: Kendall Marshall Discussion: There's a new Marshall in town!

Postby pound4pound1 on Fri Feb 14, 2014 10:46 am

it took me a while but i think Marshall is our guy
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