Kobe Thread: Bucher- Kobe = Father of Team USA Success p.819

Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby SpencerHarrison on Mon Mar 18, 2013 11:49 pm

Lets Go Lakers wrote:
puffyusaf#2 wrote:Why aren't we blaiming Kobe tonight? The usual suspects are missing for some reason. The ball was spread around with 4 players getting more than 11 shots (3 of them 17+). Isn't this what the "team" guys were talking about?


Team play means nothing if you can't throw a rock into the ocean, which was the case tonight. The team looked awful. No energy. Late to react, which is a sign of fatigue. Didn't look like they had their legs under them. Forced to play way too many minutes.


So it's a lack of Kobe when shots fall, and exhaustion when they don't. Sure.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby Tobias Funke on Mon Mar 18, 2013 11:57 pm

Not that Kobe is perfect on the road or at home, but generally in road games your star player is the one who has to make up for the typical drop off in performance that a supporting cast usually has when they leave the comforts of their home arena. Dwight isn't reliable as an offensive go to guy, and Nash has to pick his spots more than usual so he doesn't get tired.

I dont know what the stats are for this roster, but Id like to think that a veteran club like this has a dropoff thats lower than average. Still though, considering that any series we play in the playoffs will be without HCA, it makes Kobe even more valuable to this team (if that's even possible).
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby puffyusaf#2 on Tue Mar 19, 2013 12:05 am

Lets Go Lakers wrote:
puffyusaf#2 wrote:Why aren't we blaiming Kobe tonight? The usual suspects are missing for some reason. The ball was spread around with 4 players getting more than 11 shots (3 of them 17+). Isn't this what the "team" guys were talking about?


Team play means nothing if you can't throw a rock into the ocean, which was the case tonight. The team looked awful. No energy. Late to react, which is a sign of fatigue. Didn't look like they had their legs under them. Forced to play way too many minutes.

LMAO.. Wow. So now it is because they were tired. The team didn't play for each other because they were tired. You know that guy you troll on all the time, Kobe, plays the most minutes out of all the players in the league per game. yet, his energy is always there. His shot is off? He still is busting his a**. It was you, and a few of your friends, who stated that Kobe was a Hero because he didn't play his selfish game. Give Dwight the ball and let him shoot. He had 18 official shots (he missed a lot of them). So did Nash, MWP, and Meeks and Blake. Yup that "TEAM" you touted missed a lot of shots. Why aren't you blaiming Kobe now? That really is the only question that matters.
For what it's worth, the Lakers also clinched the Pacific Division, an achievement Bryant dismissed by saying "We don't hang divisions." No, only the big NBA championship banners are considered wall-worthy for the Lakers.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby tttttada on Tue Mar 19, 2013 12:08 am

First time in a while where our offense lost us the game. Probably the worst offensive game this season. Our defense was quite decent, especially for a B2B game.

We may have still lost with Kobe, but this game shows how much he distorts the opponents defense. Without a scoring threat like him, they play honest defense on us, and our efficiency plummets. Even when Kobe is in chuck mode, coaches have to respect and adjust their defense.

I can't believe some posters think that the team suffers from Kobe shooting too much. Kobe's shooting opens up the shooters and faciliates the offense. And FYI his ISO in the 4th quarter works too. (proof = 5 rings)

Kobe's role is to score. This team is close to being unstoppable when he is hitting his shots, and still dangerous when he is cold. (8/22 nights)

Kobe is our system. It will stay that way until he retires.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby Lets Go Lakers on Tue Mar 19, 2013 12:09 am

puffyusaf#2 wrote:
Lets Go Lakers wrote:
puffyusaf#2 wrote:Why aren't we blaiming Kobe tonight? The usual suspects are missing for some reason. The ball was spread around with 4 players getting more than 11 shots (3 of them 17+). Isn't this what the "team" guys were talking about?


Team play means nothing if you can't throw a rock into the ocean, which was the case tonight. The team looked awful. No energy. Late to react, which is a sign of fatigue. Didn't look like they had their legs under them. Forced to play way too many minutes.

LMAO.. Wow. So now it is because they were tired. The team didn't play for each other because they were tired. You know that guy you troll on all the time, Kobe, plays the most minutes out of all the players in the league per game. yet, his energy is always there. His shot is off? He still is busting his a**. It was you, and a few of your friends, who stated that Kobe was a Hero because he didn't play his selfish game. Give Dwight the ball and let him shoot. He had 18 official shots (he missed a lot of them). So did Nash, MWP, and Meeks and Blake. Yup that "TEAM" you touted missed a lot of shots. Why aren't you blaiming Kobe now? That really is the only question that matters.


Lol. My comment in the hero/zero thread was below the belt wasn't it? So i should expect the type of response.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby Doc Brown on Tue Mar 19, 2013 5:29 am

Lets Go Lakers wrote:Team play means nothing if you can't throw a rock into the ocean, which was the case tonight. The team looked awful. No energy. Late to react, which is a sign of fatigue. Didn't look like they had their legs under them. Forced to play way too many minutes.


LOL at these excuses or should I say our usual responses to you guys when you say Kobe is the problem, especially the bolded.

I can't count how many times we've said Kobe can't get assists if no one makes shots. It happens all the time with this team. But when Kobe doesn't play, the blame gets shifted to the actual people at fault, his teammates.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby Congo Cash on Tue Mar 19, 2013 7:22 am

Hmm, so:

others missing shots = just tired
Kobe missing shots = doesn't pass

Makes sense to me... :man11:
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby Cleansed on Tue Mar 19, 2013 7:45 am

...i've always been curious as to why this forum doesnt have a "stickied " / permanent "Rules of Trolling", "Helping the Troll Understand" or "Official Troll Logic" thread.

if you've been a member here since at least 2004 you've seen some incredible trolls come and go . There have been some guys on here in the past who should have earned awards for the level of illogical lines of thinking they pulled out of their ***. To see lesser trolls post here over the years who have tried and failed to hide behind all types of ideologies ("team play", "playing the right way" , "Kobe shots too much!1!") and conspiracies has been a let down and the gimmick has lost its appeal. I get that sex and conflict appeal and trolls are allowed to exist for a reason but having a dedicated "troll " thread that has refutations (that have been repeated ad nauseum for years now) of their ill logic would allow threads not to be derailed and, perhaps, give the truly oblivious troll an education. We'd simply point them to the appropriate thread highlighting why they have no idea what the **** they are speaking about and they can thrust their fist against the post there.

Also...what is required for a troll to get sent to RealGm.. err... i mean get banned? How many trolls do we need here to play the clown? There are 2-4 guys here off of the top of my head who are duplicating the court jester services all forums need when we only need 1 max. Can we cut the other 3 already?
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby puffyusaf#2 on Tue Mar 19, 2013 7:47 am

^ :man10: :bow: ^
For what it's worth, the Lakers also clinched the Pacific Division, an achievement Bryant dismissed by saying "We don't hang divisions." No, only the big NBA championship banners are considered wall-worthy for the Lakers.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby Lakerjones on Tue Mar 19, 2013 8:04 am

puffyusaf#2 wrote:Why aren't we blaiming Kobe tonight? The usual suspects are missing for some reason. The ball was spread around with 4 players getting more than 11 shots (3 of them 17+). Isn't this what the "team" guys were talking about?


Now listen Puffy - I put the blame squarely on Kobe for this loss. 100%. Because . . . if he had played we most likely would have won! Damn that Kobe Bean Bryant and his non passing ways!
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby JGC on Tue Mar 19, 2013 8:13 am

tttttada wrote:First time in a while where our offense lost us the game. Probably the worst offensive game this season. Our defense was quite decent, especially for a B2B game.

We may have still lost with Kobe, but this game shows how much he distorts the opponents defense. Without a scoring threat like him, they play honest defense on us, and our efficiency plummets. Even when Kobe is in chuck mode, coaches have to respect and adjust their defense.

I can't believe some posters think that the team suffers from Kobe shooting too much. Kobe's shooting opens up the shooters and faciliates the offense. And FYI his ISO in the 4th quarter works too. (proof = 5 rings)

Kobe's role is to score. This team is close to being unstoppable when he is hitting his shots, and still dangerous when he is cold. (8/22 nights)

Kobe is our system. It will stay that way until he retires.


I don't agree this was our worst offensive game of the season but it is definitely pretty close. We had a game earlier in the season against Indiana at home with multiple days rest where we shot like 31% for the game and had fewer assists than we had last night against Phoenix.

I do agree with the idea that Kobe's shooting opens up the shooters (and other players) for shots. Having said that, it would be pointless to open up shooters if you're not going to get it to them. So the part about facilitating the offense, only occurs when you do some action that opens up an opportunity to a player and then you also pass said player the ball.

Kobe's primary role is to score of course, but the point is that IMO, his role should be expanded to also create for others because as you said, his scoring opens up the offense. Plus, in line with what you are saying, when he does create for others, it opens up opportunities for himself to give him higher percentage looks.

I also disagree that we are close to unstoppable when he is hitting his shots and also dangerous when he is cold because we're a .500 team right now essentially. If that were true, we'd be an elite team. IMO, you're close there but it should be that we're nearly unstoppable when Kobe makes it a point to create for others. That doesn't mean he has to give it up on every play, it means you never really know what he is going to do.

Finally, I'm not quite sure what you're trying to get at when you say "his role is to score". Does this mean you WANT his role to be to score and score only? So, if you had the choice between Kobe scoring and never setting up teammates, or, Kobe scoring AND setting up teammates, or, Kobe only setting up teammates and never scoring, which would you choose?

I'd choose #2 and that's the Kobe I'd like to see all day every day if possible.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby JGC on Tue Mar 19, 2013 8:20 am

Cleansed wrote:...i've always been curious as to why this forum doesnt have a "stickied " / permanent "Rules of Trolling", "Helping the Troll Understand" or "Official Troll Logic" thread.

if you've been a member here since at least 2004 you've seen some incredible trolls come and go . There have been some guys on here in the past who should have earned awards for the level of illogical lines of thinking they pulled out of their ***. To see lesser trolls post here over the years who have tried and failed to hide behind all types of ideologies ("team play", "playing the right way" , "Kobe shots too much!1!") and conspiracies has been a let down and the gimmick has lost its appeal. I get that sex and conflict appeal and trolls are allowed to exist for a reason but having a dedicated "troll " thread that has refutations (that have been repeated ad nauseum for years now) of their ill logic would allow threads not to be derailed and, perhaps, give the truly oblivious troll an education. We'd simply point them to the appropriate thread highlighting why they have no idea what the **** they are speaking about and they can thrust their fist against the post there.

Also...what is required for a troll to get sent to RealGm.. err... i mean get banned? How many trolls do we need here to play the clown? There are 2-4 guys here off of the top of my head who are duplicating the court jester services all forums need when we only need 1 max. Can we cut the other 3 already?


Do you feel the same way about people who want Nash to score more, or say that he is old?

Do you feel the same way about people who say they want Howard to learn how to shoot a free throw?

Do you feel the same way about people who bash MDA's coaching?

Do you feel the same way about people who bash Jim Buss?

Are people who make statements about what they think Kobe SHOULD do, all trolls in your opinion? Because, for instance, I've seen people suggest that Kobe should sit out some of these games because they think that is to his benefit. Are they trolls too? If not, then what's the difference between that and someone who thinks that if he creates more looks for others, that would be to this benefit too?
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby Battle Tested20 on Tue Mar 19, 2013 2:43 pm

Congo Cash wrote:Hmm, so:

others missing shots = just tired
Kobe missing shots = doesn't pass

Makes sense to me... :man11:


Pretty much has been the case for the past 17 years :man10:
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby Battle Tested20 on Tue Mar 19, 2013 2:46 pm

Cleansed wrote:...i've always been curious as to why this forum doesnt have a "stickied " / permanent "Rules of Trolling", "Helping the Troll Understand" or "Official Troll Logic" thread.

if you've been a member here since at least 2004 you've seen some incredible trolls come and go . There have been some guys on here in the past who should have earned awards for the level of illogical lines of thinking they pulled out of their ***. To see lesser trolls post here over the years who have tried and failed to hide behind all types of ideologies ("team play", "playing the right way" , "Kobe shots too much!1!") and conspiracies has been a let down and the gimmick has lost its appeal. I get that sex and conflict appeal and trolls are allowed to exist for a reason but having a dedicated "troll " thread that has refutations (that have been repeated ad nauseum for years now) of their ill logic would allow threads not to be derailed and, perhaps, give the truly oblivious troll an education. We'd simply point them to the appropriate thread highlighting why they have no idea what the **** they are speaking about and they can thrust their fist against the post there.

Also...what is required for a troll to get sent to RealGm.. err... i mean get banned? How many trolls do we need here to play the clown? There are 2-4 guys here off of the top of my head who are duplicating the court jester services all forums need when we only need 1 max. Can we cut the other 3 already?


:bow: :man10: Preach IT
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby Vasashi17 on Tue Mar 19, 2013 4:35 pm

Our mod staff, site managers and admins are working on something to address certain issues that have been brought up in this thread. So hopefully most of you can remain patient till then.

However, one thing I never understood is why do members who take such great offense in what others' say not take the power into their own hands and utilize certain functions that this forum already offers you:

http://www.clublakers.com/ucp.php?i=zebra&mode=foes

I encourage these users to compile their own personal "troll list". Essentially, those members in question will be "banished" from your CL forum experience.

At CL, the mod staff does its due diligence to allow members to reform their technique since banishment is the absolute last resort we want to turn to. If some of you are inpatient with this process, take the power in your own hands and toggle your account accordingly via the aforementioned link.

But don't get it twisted...none of you better add your's truly to any such "list" :man12:

Now stop trolling the staff and get back to the topic at hand.... :man9:
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby jOeyB7000 on Tue Mar 19, 2013 4:47 pm

I miss Shaqfan.

He was the Troll of all trolls.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby Crono0801 on Tue Mar 19, 2013 5:03 pm

jOeyB7000 wrote:I miss Shaqfan.

He was the Troll of all trolls.



Lol I had to log in for the first time in ages just to say :man10: Shaqfan was definitely something special
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby JoelMyersScrotalSack on Tue Mar 19, 2013 5:11 pm

jOeyB7000 wrote:I miss Shaqfan.

He was the Troll of all trolls.


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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby Doc Brown on Tue Mar 19, 2013 7:27 pm

Mike Trudell ‏@LakersReporter 25s
Kobe Bryant (ankle) received treatment today at the team's facility. He's not expected to practice tomorrow, but is "day to day."
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby therealdeal on Tue Mar 19, 2013 7:35 pm

Doc Brown wrote:
Mike Trudell ‏@LakersReporter 25s
Kobe Bryant (ankle) received treatment today at the team's facility. He's not expected to practice tomorrow, but is "day to day."
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They're just trolling the other teams at this point. He's not playing for a while.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby Juronimo on Tue Mar 19, 2013 7:42 pm

Cleansed wrote:...i've always been curious as to why this forum doesnt have a "stickied " / permanent "Rules of Trolling", "Helping the Troll Understand" or "Official Troll Logic" thread.

if you've been a member here since at least 2004 you've seen some incredible trolls come and go . There have been some guys on here in the past who should have earned awards for the level of illogical lines of thinking they pulled out of their ***. To see lesser trolls post here over the years who have tried and failed to hide behind all types of ideologies ("team play", "playing the right way" , "Kobe shots too much!1!") and conspiracies has been a let down and the gimmick has lost its appeal. I get that sex and conflict appeal and trolls are allowed to exist for a reason but having a dedicated "troll " thread that has refutations (that have been repeated ad nauseum for years now) of their ill logic would allow threads not to be derailed and, perhaps, give the truly oblivious troll an education. We'd simply point them to the appropriate thread highlighting why they have no idea what the **** they are speaking about and they can thrust their fist against the post there.

Also...what is required for a troll to get sent to RealGm.. err... i mean get banned? How many trolls do we need here to play the clown? There are 2-4 guys here off of the top of my head who are duplicating the court jester services all forums need when we only need 1 max. Can we cut the other 3 already?


Thanks for clearing up what a troll is. Just so that i'm clear and I can avoid being accused of being a troll, let's run down the list of activities that would be considered ok for someone to post about on here, and a list of topics that would be considered trolling.

Complain about Dwight's maturity, cool.
Complain about Pau being soft, cool.
Complain about D'Antoni being clueless, cool
Complain about Nash not shooting enough, cool.
Complain about Meeks missing 3's, cool.
Complain about Artest's bball IQ, cool.
Complain about our thin bench, cool.
Complain about Jim Buss and the bartender ruining the team or whatever, cool.
Making up disrespectful nicknames and signatures for Laker players (Gasoft, Odumb, Puke, Gump), cool.
Talk about Kobe's shot selection, trolling.

Is there anything else I missed?
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby Vasashi17 on Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:08 pm

In due time, the "troll" issue will be addressed, but for now, lets put off on calling other members trolls and lets stick to discussing/praising/critiquing Kobe.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby Lakerjones on Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:14 pm

Kobe's really been sucking lately. It's like he's not making any impact out there on the court at all. He's pulling a Casper.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby Battle Tested20 on Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:19 pm



short, but sweet!
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Re: Kobe Discussion: coaching like crazy

Postby Lakerjones on Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:24 pm

^^^ :stunoice:
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