Kobe Bryant Discussion: Reason for Lakers downfall?

Re: Kobe Discussion: "Yell at me" (592)

Postby FabFourLakers on Thu Mar 21, 2013 12:19 pm

I don't understand why Kobe is even being compared to LeBron...did it ever occur to anybody that Kobe has been in the league 7 more years than LeBron? Did it ever occur to anybody that LeBron is 3 inches taller and 50 pounds heavier than Kobe? Because i'll tell you this much...if Kobe was LeBron's size, he would average 40/10/8...and no im not exaggerating. Why people continue to compare the 2 is beyond me. Kobe should be compared to guys that actually PLAY his position...you know...like DWADE maybe? Or guys that he came into the league with ? Like ray allen?

Let me tell you this....Kobe is in his 17th NBA season, and yet, he's STILL a top 5 player...he has literally been a top 5 player for 13 straight years!!!! That is a pretty insane run....I would say that LeBron has been a top 5 player every year save for his first 2 years in the league, and he's been probably the best player since 2009 (although we can easily argue that he didn't REALLY become the best player until 2011)...so if LeBron can keep this up well into his 17th NBA season, I will give him the nod over Kobe (and this is assuming he wins multiple rings too, which its looking like he will). Kobe has outlasted so many players that either came into the league with him or a few years after him and challenged him in the playoffs/finals. I want to see LeBron do this same thing. He's definitely the best in the game right now, but just remember, the ONLY championship he has so far is in a shortened season, and IF he doesn't win it this year, the haters are gonna come out STRONG against LeBron....remember, Duncan and the Spurs got crap for winning it in a shortened season but everyone forgot about it because they won 3 more in non-shortened seasons....but if LeBron doesn't win it in a non-shortened season, then the shortened season title will be magnified but not in a good way.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: "Yell at me" (592)

Postby Lakerjones on Thu Mar 21, 2013 12:23 pm

^^ Great posts Fabfourlakers and Jazzygirl! :bow:
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Re: Kobe Discussion: "Yell at me" (592)

Postby Chillbongo on Thu Mar 21, 2013 12:32 pm

FabFourLakers wrote:I don't understand why Kobe is even being compared to LeBron...did it ever occur to anybody that Kobe has been in the league 7 more years than LeBron? Did it ever occur to anybody that LeBron is 3 inches taller and 50 pounds heavier than Kobe? Because i'll tell you this much...if Kobe was LeBron's size, he would average 40/10/8...and no im not exaggerating. Why people continue to compare the 2 is beyond me. Kobe should be compared to guys that actually PLAY his position...you know...like DWADE maybe? Or guys that he came into the league with ? Like ray allen?

This.

But it's because they're the top players in the league, arguably both top 10 players (Kobe is top 3-5 IMO). LeBron and Kobe are compared because they are the most elite players to hit the NBA since Michael Jordan. It's just like why Magic and Michael were compared.

One was a 6-9 PG that liked to dish, the other was a 6-6 athletic BEAST who could score at will. Pretty different games, but they were compared. In Magic's decline was the rise of Jordan, and they battled in the Finals. They were unparalleled at the time, that's where the comparison comes.

It actually is kind of the same if you think about it. Magic had 5 rings, Michael had none, then once he beat Magic in the Finals in '91, the comparisons became even more rampant.

It's like someone said, people rather have the 28 year old dude to cheer for than the 30 something dude.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: ankle feeling much stronger (591)

Postby MusixFinest on Thu Mar 21, 2013 12:45 pm

lakersin4 wrote:Surprised they didn't mention Farmar.. He'd act like Kobe wasn't even on the floor & he didn't hear him clapping for the ball.


That's kinda hard to NOT do with them big Dumbo ears...
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Re: Kobe Discussion: "Yell at me" (592)

Postby dwighthowardsdad on Thu Mar 21, 2013 1:04 pm

Mike Trudell ‏@LakersReporter 48m
Also practicing today: @kobebryant (ankle). The ankle may still be sore, but D'Antoni thinks he will play tomorrow.


Mike Trudell ‏@LakersReporter 47m
D'Antoni said Bryant went through practice, doing everything his teammate did, eventually stopping (as expected) to get routine treatment.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: "Yell at me" (592)

Postby DJ-RaZ-Q#24 on Thu Mar 21, 2013 1:27 pm

dwighthowardsdad wrote:
Mike Trudell ‏@LakersReporter 48m
Also practicing today: @kobebryant (ankle). The ankle may still be sore, but D'Antoni thinks he will play tomorrow.


Mike Trudell ‏@LakersReporter 47m
D'Antoni said Bryant went through practice, doing everything his teammate did, eventually stopping (as expected) to get routine treatment.

:jam2:
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Re: Kobe Discussion: ankle feeling much stronger (591)

Postby puffyusaf#2 on Thu Mar 21, 2013 2:49 pm

Savory Griddles wrote:
Not trying to troll, but Lebron is better at this moment than Kobe was at any point in Kobe's career. I'm 34, so I have seen Kobe's entire career as an adult. Kobe is top 6-7 all time, but if LBJ has another 4-5 years at this lvl, he may go down as the GOAT. His efficiency and versatility are amazing. His weaknesses from a couple years ago have now become strengths. He is clutch and ruthless. He is the best defensive player every year outside of Dwight if he's healthy. Is Kobe more "talented?" Maybe, from a pure scorer standpoint.

The Lakers are my team and Kobe has brought me great joy, but Lebron is ridiculous.

Savory-

I know you are knowledgeable from your posting so I respect your opinion, however, I disagree pretty much completely with it on this.

I believe Lebron's greatness is inflated by the media and people's short memory. How come it seems like he has been amazing, clutch and ice cold his whole career now through the media? Now it seems like Lebron has never failed in his career and he has carried a bunch of scrubs all these years. What Kobe has done with his teams and over his career has been deminished at every turn. Kobe goes on a crazy run all the reports are going to hint at what he didn't do. Lebron on the other hand goes on a crazy run and all the reports are about how amazing he is and how great the run was. I know we over hate ESPN but the truth is they have grown LBJ's status above approach so much so that everyone around him gets deminished. A few games ago LBJ put up 40 in a game and the headline read something like, "Lebron drops 40 to carry Heat to victory." Nothing wrong with that headline except that Wade dropped like 36 in the same game. I think many people have begun to believe all the reports from ESPN too much. Kobe has been there, done that and has the rings to prove it.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: Went Through Full Practice (593)

Postby Tobias Funke on Thu Mar 21, 2013 3:34 pm

More quotes on Kobe from yesterday's Jamison interview JSM posted.

Antawn Jamison on the Kobe Bryant teammate experience

By Dave McMenamin
ESPNLosAngeles.com




Antawn Jamison is pretty much the definition of an NBA veteran.

The Los Angeles Lakers are the fifth team the 37-year-old has played for in his 15-season career, meaning he literally has had hundreds of teammates during his time in the league.

None of them have been quite like Kobe Bryant.

"This guy's a different dude," Jamison said of Bryant while a guest on the "Max & Marcellus Show" on ESPNLA 710 radio on Wednesday.

Jamison said Bryant has helped create a contentious atmosphere with him and his teammates, but the conflict has helped the team congeal.

"Kobe will tell you," Jamison said. "He's like, 'Look, you guys as my teammates, yell at me. Let me know that you're open because I'm so programmed,' and this guy has told me this, 'I see nothing but that basket. You could be open, there could be three guys on me, but the only thing I see is that basket so you have to tell me, Look, I was open. Or yell at me mid-play. That doesn't affect me at all and I respect that.' "

Jamison said the veteran-laden roster has adapted to Bryant's style and the players have no problem with confronting the five-time champion.

"I think the thing we've seen in the past was most teammates might have been afraid to come to him or express, 'Kob' I was open,' or, 'That's not what we drew up,' " Jamison said. "The thing I like about this team, Steve Nash -- who is a Hall of Famer -- and Dwight [Howard] as well, Dwight and Kobe have gotten into shouting matches on the bench because Dwight will be like, 'Kob', that's your rotation. Get there.' And after the game he'll be like, 'Appreciate it, big fella. I needed that.' "

Jamison said he doesn't even have to speak to express his concerns with Bryant, and can just let his big eyebrows do the talking.

"I come in there and I look at him a certain way, he'll be like, 'OK, Jamison, you're right. My bad.' "

Through it all, Bryant has grown comfortable with his new crop of teammates.

"It takes a certain time for him to be able to trust us," Jamison said. "I think the thing that he has learned now is that he can trust us."

How does that trust manifest itself?

"With 24 seconds on the clock, we're down one, instead of him, 'I got to do this, I got to do this,' he trusts Steve Nash to run the play," Jamison said. "Or, he trusts us to throw the ball into Dwight. Or, 'You know what, the double team is coming, normally I might try to force this, but Antawn is open in the corner. I trust him that he'll make that shot.' "

Jamison called Bryant a "legend," ranking him right up there with the most impressive teammates he has ever had in LeBron James, Shaquille O'Neal and Gilbert Arenas in his prime, and said that despite Bryant's past accomplishments, he only wants more.

"You can't even tell he has five [rings]," Jamison said. "This guy would get rid of his kids to win that championship."

Jamison was being extreme, of course, but Bryant certainly will and does get rid of postgame entertainment indulgences in his pursuit to excellence.

"It's great to be with him," Jamison said. "I love a guy who expects so much from his teammates. He pushes his teammates. After games, we're traveling, guys are on their laptops, their iPads, watching movies, listening to music, this guy is watching film. He's breaking down situations. I'll be watching a movie, he'll tap me like, 'Come here.' He'll dissect plays like, 'This is what we got to do, me and you got to get this going.' I mean, this guy eats, sleeps basketball and the only thing he wants to do is to win another championship and I've never seen anybody as focused, as dedicated as Kobe."
"Come hell or high water we're gonna be there again. Its just something about the Lakers organization. Mitch is really, really good at it, he's really really good man...."

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Re: Kobe Discussion: Went Through Full Practice (593)

Postby puffyusaf#2 on Thu Mar 21, 2013 3:53 pm

Unappreciated for his work ethic.... Kobe is a once in a generation great
"It's great to be with him," Jamison said. "I love a guy who expects so much from his teammates. He pushes his teammates. After games, we're traveling, guys are on their laptops, their iPads, watching movies, listening to music, this guy is watching film. He's breaking down situations. I'll be watching a movie, he'll tap me like, 'Come here.' He'll dissect plays like, 'This is what we got to do, me and you got to get this going.' I mean, this guy eats, sleeps basketball and the only thing he wants to do is to win another championship and I've never seen anybody as focused, as dedicated as Kobe."
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Re: Kobe Discussion: Went Through Full Practice (593)

Postby gcclaker on Thu Mar 21, 2013 4:00 pm

^24's been doing THAT for 17 seasons. It is taken for granted by fans outside of Lakerdom and not exactly news to us. Borders on the fanatical if not already...
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Re: Kobe Discussion: Went Through Full Practice (593)

Postby Alleyhoops on Thu Mar 21, 2013 7:01 pm

Quick question: Anyone know how Bryant's sprain differed from Tony Parker's? Is it that Parker's was considerably worse and coupled with Popovich's penchant to rest players he is down for months? Or were the injuries similar to one another's and because of our dire situation struggling to make the playoffs, Bryant has gone into superhuman mode? Just wondering if the severity of the actual injuries were similar. Chime in if you have any idea.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: Went Through Full Practice (593)

Postby charvin on Thu Mar 21, 2013 7:20 pm

I don't know the answer as to whether their sprains were different. I do know that different players have different healing times, and that's it. You look at athletes like Derrick Rose and Adrian Peterson, they suffered very similar injuries with Peterson also tearing his MCL. Peterson was back up and going full-speed within 6-8 months of his injury. There was just an innate healing ability on his part that was probably just inherited.

Rose has been out close to 10 months now and we still have not seen him play 1 game yet. The plausible explanation might be that Kobe just is able to heal faster regardless of what and where the injury is located. Given that the Lakers employ a very well-respected physical therapist (Judy Seto), and Bryant's focus to fully understand his body parts so as to not aggravate another area when one is injured, it further lessens any damage done (unless it was like this freak injury of him stepping on Jones' foot).

Alleyhoops wrote:Quick question: Anyone know how Bryant's sprain differed from Tony Parker's? Is it that Parker's was considerably worse and coupled with Popovich's penchant to rest players he is down for months? Or were the injuries similar to one another's and because of our dire situation struggling to make the playoffs, Bryant has gone into superhuman mode? Just wondering if the severity of the actual injuries were similar. Chime in if you have any idea.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: Went Through Full Practice (593)

Postby Rooscooter on Thu Mar 21, 2013 7:28 pm

Alleyhoops wrote:Quick question: Anyone know how Bryant's sprain differed from Tony Parker's? Is it that Parker's was considerably worse and coupled with Popovich's penchant to rest players he is down for months? Or were the injuries similar to one another's and because of our dire situation struggling to make the playoffs, Bryant has gone into superhuman mode? Just wondering if the severity of the actual injuries were similar. Chime in if you have any idea.


I thought Parker's was the infamous "High Ankle Sprain".... where Kobe's is more of the run of the mill sprain.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: Went Through Full Practice (593)

Postby checkers09 on Thu Mar 21, 2013 8:08 pm

Image

Yet as I watched him Monday, I could not help think how little it mattered and how right he is. He is not fading into the shadows. He does not know how to go out that way.[.]
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Re: Kobe Discussion: Went Through Full Practice (593)

Postby Rooscooter on Thu Mar 21, 2013 8:48 pm

So Kobe went through practice with a sprained ankle and said he would play tomorrow....

Did he give a scale of 1-10 how much pain he was in?..... or a detailed account of his arduous recovery?...
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Re: Kobe Discussion: Went Through Full Practice (593)

Postby dwighthowardsdad on Thu Mar 21, 2013 10:30 pm

Rooscooter wrote:So Kobe went through practice with a sprained ankle and said he would play tomorrow....

Did he give a scale of 1-10 how much pain he was in?..... or a detailed account of his arduous recovery?...


LOL! No, he didn't. One of the many, many reasons why I respect & will miss him when he retires...
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Re: Kobe Discussion: Went Through Full Practice (593)

Postby Barnstable on Thu Mar 21, 2013 10:33 pm

I really wish he would rest one more game.

The Lakers are just playing the Wizards tomorrow. It's not like they're playing a professional basketball team or anything.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: ankle feeling much stronger (591)

Postby Rooscooter on Thu Mar 21, 2013 10:46 pm

puffyusaf#2 wrote:
Savory Griddles wrote:
Not trying to troll, but Lebron is better at this moment than Kobe was at any point in Kobe's career. I'm 34, so I have seen Kobe's entire career as an adult. Kobe is top 6-7 all time, but if LBJ has another 4-5 years at this lvl, he may go down as the GOAT. His efficiency and versatility are amazing. His weaknesses from a couple years ago have now become strengths. He is clutch and ruthless. He is the best defensive player every year outside of Dwight if he's healthy. Is Kobe more "talented?" Maybe, from a pure scorer standpoint.

The Lakers are my team and Kobe has brought me great joy, but Lebron is ridiculous.

Savory-

I know you are knowledgeable from your posting so I respect your opinion, however, I disagree pretty much completely with it on this.

I believe Lebron's greatness is inflated by the media and people's short memory. How come it seems like he has been amazing, clutch and ice cold his whole career now through the media? Now it seems like Lebron has never failed in his career and he has carried a bunch of scrubs all these years. What Kobe has done with his teams and over his career has been deminished at every turn. Kobe goes on a crazy run all the reports are going to hint at what he didn't do. Lebron on the other hand goes on a crazy run and all the reports are about how amazing he is and how great the run was. I know we over hate ESPN but the truth is they have grown LBJ's status above approach so much so that everyone around him gets deminished. A few games ago LBJ put up 40 in a game and the headline read something like, "Lebron drops 40 to carry Heat to victory." Nothing wrong with that headline except that Wade dropped like 36 in the same game. I think many people have begun to believe all the reports from ESPN too much. Kobe has been there, done that and has the rings to prove it.


Not to jump,in on the good back and forth, but the media has been hyping players for a long time.... Magic's 42....ever hear a word about what Wilkes did in that game? Willis Reed's inspirational 4 minutes.... And Jordan's flu over Kareem's 14 points ,6 boards (40 and.15 overall) and the final bucket for LA on a severely sprained ankle in the game before Magic's big game?.... It's nothing new for the league and its partners to promote certain players.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: Went Through Full Practice (593)

Postby odom1year on Thu Mar 21, 2013 11:23 pm

checkers09 wrote:Image


Poor Yao.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: Went Through Full Practice (593)

Postby Battle Tested20 on Fri Mar 22, 2013 12:53 am

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"I just put my faith in God. Through him we can do all things"
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Re: Kobe Discussion: ankle feeling much stronger (591)

Postby puffyusaf#2 on Fri Mar 22, 2013 7:51 am

Rooscooter wrote:
Not to jump,in on the good back and forth, but the media has been hyping players for a long time.... Magic's 42....ever hear a word about what Wilkes did in that game? Willis Reed's inspirational 4 minutes.... And Jordan's flu over Kareem's 14 points ,6 boards (40 and.15 overall) and the final bucket for LA on a severely sprained ankle in the game before Magic's big game?.... It's nothing new for the league and its partners to promote certain players.


You are absolutely right the Media would promote certain players for the things they did on the court. What they wouldn't do is downplay others to do it. Remember when Shaq and Kobe were dominating in a stacked West all the Media supported and promoted the great teams in the West. On the otherside they called the East for what it was, has been and continues to be the Leastern Conference because there have been 1-3 (maybe) real teams out there each year. In any case, I don't think things were so vastly tainted and manufactured as it was back in those days. That is my opinion of course. Kobe has been deminished pretty much his whole career. He did start off as the "golden boy" with a lot of love (although a lot of detractors too) but after the CO rape case he fell from grace and it has been mostly hate unless he did something outragous (62 in 3 quarters, 4 straight 50 pgs, 81...etc..etc) Just look at say Tony Parker who has been SAS MVP for the last 3 years yet the media barely talks about him because that team is, frankly, boring. Now Flop city and the Nuggets on the other hand? Exciting basketball that is highlighted every second. I find it interesting that you never see any of the "experts" call Denver out for their dirty play or the Clippers out for their constant flopping. Nope those teams are the one's to be "hyped" and thus are above reproach. I get your point but I am just saying that it is different in todays media market.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: ankle feeling much stronger (591)

Postby Rooscooter on Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:33 am

puffyusaf#2 wrote:
Rooscooter wrote:
Not to jump,in on the good back and forth, but the media has been hyping players for a long time.... Magic's 42....ever hear a word about what Wilkes did in that game? Willis Reed's inspirational 4 minutes.... And Jordan's flu over Kareem's 14 points ,6 boards (40 and.15 overall) and the final bucket for LA on a severely sprained ankle in the game before Magic's big game?.... It's nothing new for the league and its partners to promote certain players.


You are absolutely right the Media would promote certain players for the things they did on the court. What they wouldn't do is downplay others to do it. Remember when Shaq and Kobe were dominating in a stacked West all the Media supported and promoted the great teams in the West. On the otherside they called the East for what it was, has been and continues to be the Leastern Conference because there have been 1-3 (maybe) real teams out there each year. In any case, I don't think things were so vastly tainted and manufactured as it was back in those days. That is my opinion of course. Kobe has been deminished pretty much his whole career. He did start off as the "golden boy" with a lot of love (although a lot of detractors too) but after the CO rape case he fell from grace and it has been mostly hate unless he did something outragous (62 in 3 quarters, 4 straight 50 pgs, 81...etc..etc) Just look at say Tony Parker who has been SAS MVP for the last 3 years yet the media barely talks about him because that team is, frankly, boring. Now Flop city and the Nuggets on the other hand? Exciting basketball that is highlighted every second. I find it interesting that you never see any of the "experts" call Denver out for their dirty play or the Clippers out for their constant flopping. Nope those teams are the one's to be "hyped" and thus are above reproach. I get your point but I am just saying that it is different in todays media market.


Pretty much on target. This extends to the post season awards, HOF and most of the other forms of "Recognition" IMO as well. Just the other night I saw a segment on NBA TV where they went over the CP3 flop and all kind of chuckled about it and said it was no big deal while there was a big deal..... Kamla noted it's CP3..... what do you do?.... Who does he work for again?.....
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Re: Kobe Discussion: Went Through Full Practice (593)

Postby lakerfan2 on Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:51 am

Coming back from ankle injury? Watch out Nene, you gettin dunk on tonight...
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Re: Kobe Discussion: ankle feeling much stronger (591)

Postby puffyusaf#2 on Fri Mar 22, 2013 9:20 am

Rooscooter wrote:
Pretty much on target. This extends to the post season awards, HOF and most of the other forms of "Recognition" IMO as well. Just the other night I saw a segment on NBA TV where they went over the CP3 flop and all kind of chuckled about it and said it was no big deal while there was a big deal..... Kamla noted it's CP3..... what do you do?.... Who does he work for again?.....


And that is the problem. Look how they approach the CP3 flop and how they approached the Jones undercut of Kobe. The Lakers are in an exciting race for 8th (disgust me to say that) and arguably one of the best players ever gets undercut by some second tier wanna be defensive player. Had that been Blake Griffen (Kia man), LBJ (Leagues golden boy), Wade (golden boys side-kick), KD (the feel good story) and even Harden (old school player and star of upstart team) there would of been a lot more hate for Jones. I actually saw an article the other day that said, "Lebron James IS Michael Jordan in front of our eyes." I have never blamed LBJ for the hype that he gets because that is media driven. However, I blame the fans who take this stuff in as if it is all "pure" fact. Isn't it amazing how we still hear about Kobe's missed threes against Utah but never about Lebrons many (and i mean MANY) playoff failures? Its pretty sad to me.
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Re: Kobe Discussion: Went Through Full Practice (593)

Postby dwighthowardsdad on Fri Mar 22, 2013 11:50 am

Kobe Bryant ‏@kobebryant 50m
Ankle was a lil sore from practice yesterday but should be good to go tonight #mambaface
Retweeted by Mike Trudell
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