Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby abeer3 on Tue Jan 22, 2013 8:15 am

coach needs to be replaced (new system) and players need to move (pau for better fitting pieces). until both are addressed, what we've seen so far is what we'll get.

i do think that a better coach would have this team over .500, though, warts and all.
abeer3

 
Posts: 10355
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 4:15 pm

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby Rooscooter on Tue Jan 22, 2013 8:33 am

abeer3 wrote:coach needs to be replaced (new system) and players need to move (pau for better fitting pieces). until both are addressed, what we've seen so far is what we'll get.

i do think that a better coach would have this team over .500, though, warts and all.


I'm not as confident that just Pau is the issue. Team after team is going right at Nash.... and Kobe is being forced to guard the opposing team's point guard.... that's not system dependent.... it's desperation not based in a system but based on aging one-way players.

I love what Nash does on the offensive end but his glaring deficiencies on the defensive end can't be ignored.

Pau is mentally done on this team.

Howard's post game issues are not related to his back issues.... this is who he is. He needs floor spacers because he can't work in a crowded lane with any real success. He also needs a guard that can break down defenses and give him lobs/dunks etc. to be really effective on the offensive end.

If Howard is who we want to build around we need a new point guard, new SF and new PF... none of these pieces work well with him. I'm not aware of a system that can cover all of these issues with "motion" or "sharing".... or whatever.
"If the past sits in judgment on the present, the future will be lost." Winston Churchill

“The prospect of domination of the nation's scholars by Federal employment, project allocations, and the power of money is ever present - and is gravely to be regarded." Dwight Eisenhower

"Socialism in general has a record of failure so blatant that only an intellectual could ignore or evade it" Thomas Sowell
User avatar
Rooscooter

 
Posts: 22554
Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2011 4:25 pm
Location: Chandler AZ and Andalué

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby Ludachris on Tue Jan 22, 2013 8:37 am

Well, I'll admit, I was one of the few fans who actually thought D'Antoni would do well with this team. I just figured we would learn how to run the pick and roll effectively with him coaching and Nash running the point. Obviously that's not working well. We have nobody that can set a good pick, and then the guy who sets that half assed pick doesn't roll to the hoop, they roll to a random spot outside the key... I don't understand it.

What I really don't understand about how this offense is run is that nobody cuts to the basket, I mean almost ever, when Nash is dribbling around under the hoop. I'm always waiting for a cutter and it never happens. Everyone is just standing around. Hardly any back picks are being set. How does anyone expect to get open? Howard is pushing people around and getting called for it. When Howard is on the bench Pau STILL stays up at the free throw line setting picks and staying in that general area - even last night when Noah had 5 fouls! Pau should have been working on getting Noah's 6th foul when Howard sat down, didn't happen, and I was yelling at the TV.

I thought D'Antoni was an offensive guy. And sure, the offense isn't the major problem area, but when you see the way they execute and it looks like it's still preseason, there's a problem. These are veteran players who shouldn't take this long to mesh on offense. Seems to me the coach isn't making it happen. Howard looks like he's beyond frustrated all the time, Artest doesn't look like he wants to be there (even though he's playing well), Nash looks 10 years older than he did last season, Kobe is playing well but can't seem to bring everyone together, and Pau has made it known that he cares more about being a starter even if the stats show that him playing with Howard makes the team more ineffective. I don't know.

Seems to me it's time to reevaluate everything. Is Howard really the guy you want to build around, or is there a trade out there that brings back another player you can build around? Is there a scenario where it makes sense to keep Pau? Is Artest's elevated level of play this season making him more valuable in a trade? Is it even possible to make a few trades to bring in players that better fit around the core of Howard and Kobe and Nash? Would firing a second coach in the same season give this team a better chance? Seems like we lose no matter what.
Buck Foston, LA Rules
Ludachris

 
Posts: 445
Joined: Sun May 07, 2006 7:34 am

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby JGC on Tue Jan 22, 2013 8:40 am

*Waiting for people to bash the fact he is commenting about the offense when the problems are the 'defense'*

Honestly, it doesn't really look like we're running any system at all. What system are we running exactly? A system would mean that you see certain patterns that emerge on most nights. We're not running D'Antoni's offense, at all, that's for sure.

There isn't an effective system out there that is based on lack of ball and player movement so I'm not sure changing systems will do much if anything at all.
JGC

 
Posts: 3781
Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2012 9:07 am

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby The Laker Link on Tue Jan 22, 2013 8:53 am

Lakeshow24 wrote:
Chillbongo wrote:Kobe at odds with the "system".

Kobe upset with MDA.

Kobe death stare coming?


Kobe upset at "the system" is code for BRING PHIL JACKSON BACK.


I said it before and I will say it again.....Jim will have to suck soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo much face just to get Phil to pick up the phone. Then when he does, Jim is out of a job for sure and Phil is running a lot of the team.
User avatar
The Laker Link

 
Posts: 8087
Joined: Tue Feb 08, 2005 2:16 pm
Location: Orange, CA and Provo, UT

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby dj vitus on Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:29 am

More like "Need to dismantle the system." Or just play street ball from here on out.
"Why are they blocking out all the good stuff? They let Sarah Jessica Parker's face on TV and she looks like a foot!!"
User avatar
dj vitus

 
Posts: 9349
Joined: Sun May 02, 2004 6:59 pm
Location: Walnut, CA by way of Laaaas Vegas!

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby phoenixrisingla on Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:46 am

nameant wrote:Wait....we have a system?
Image
User avatar
phoenixrisingla

 
Posts: 2277
Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2008 11:49 am
Location: Manhattan Beach, CA!

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby charvin on Tue Jan 22, 2013 1:35 pm

I agree on the PNR point. I stayed mum about it and never bought or believed into the hype that just because we have one of the best or best PNR tandem (one a great PNR PG, the other a supposed 'best' roller), they each ran it in a different system or had different physical characteristics. It is akin to the USA Olympic teams that didn't win a Gold Medal in 2004; putting together the best talent apparently is only good on paper, not reality.

It has been mentioned that Jameer is faster, so I would assume that allows him to get out of traps or find Howard much earlier. Nash, however, had Amare who could shoot a mid-range jump shot. Ultimately though, both Howard and Nash, when they were still with the Magic and the Suns, respectively, were surrounded by shooters at all times.

Ludachris wrote:Well, I'll admit, I was one of the few fans who actually thought D'Antoni would do well with this team. I just figured we would learn how to run the pick and roll effectively with him coaching and Nash running the point. Obviously that's not working well. We have nobody that can set a good pick, and then the guy who sets that half assed pick doesn't roll to the hoop, they roll to a random spot outside the key... I don't understand it.

What I really don't understand about how this offense is run is that nobody cuts to the basket, I mean almost ever, when Nash is dribbling around under the hoop. I'm always waiting for a cutter and it never happens. Everyone is just standing around. Hardly any back picks are being set. How does anyone expect to get open? Howard is pushing people around and getting called for it. When Howard is on the bench Pau STILL stays up at the free throw line setting picks and staying in that general area - even last night when Noah had 5 fouls! Pau should have been working on getting Noah's 6th foul when Howard sat down, didn't happen, and I was yelling at the TV.

I thought D'Antoni was an offensive guy. And sure, the offense isn't the major problem area, but when you see the way they execute and it looks like it's still preseason, there's a problem. These are veteran players who shouldn't take this long to mesh on offense. Seems to me the coach isn't making it happen. Howard looks like he's beyond frustrated all the time, Artest doesn't look like he wants to be there (even though he's playing well), Nash looks 10 years older than he did last season, Kobe is playing well but can't seem to bring everyone together, and Pau has made it known that he cares more about being a starter even if the stats show that him playing with Howard makes the team more ineffective. I don't know.

Seems to me it's time to reevaluate everything. Is Howard really the guy you want to build around, or is there a trade out there that brings back another player you can build around? Is there a scenario where it makes sense to keep Pau? Is Artest's elevated level of play this season making him more valuable in a trade? Is it even possible to make a few trades to bring in players that better fit around the core of Howard and Kobe and Nash? Would firing a second coach in the same season give this team a better chance? Seems like we lose no matter what.
charvin

 
Posts: 539
Joined: Fri Jul 20, 2012 12:53 pm

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby revgen on Tue Jan 22, 2013 1:49 pm

"We're going to have to change something … probably going to have to post the ball a lot more, slow the game down a lot more," he said.


http://www.latimes.com/sports/lakersnow/la-sp-ln-kobe-bryant-lakers-20130122,0,4156470.story?track=rss&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter&dlvrit=53297

If we're going to do that, then Pau (stop being pushed off the block by Andre Miller of all people) and Dwight (stop being stripped on every postup opportunity) are going to have to step up their game.

We're also going to have to put our best shooters on the floor, who aren't necessarily our best defenders. D12 absolutely needs the maximum space possible in order to work. He's not like Bynum where he can operate in a crowded lane.

We also need to do a better job of moving off the ball. Only guys I see doing that are Jamison and Clark. None of the guards really move off the ball well at all.
"Every time he’s hurt, he always plays, he always comes through."

- Metta World Peace on teammate Kobe Bryant
revgen
HDTV/Multimedia Guru
 
Posts: 21706
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2006 10:53 pm
Location: Southern California

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby JGC on Tue Jan 22, 2013 1:52 pm

revgen wrote:
"We're going to have to change something … probably going to have to post the ball a lot more, slow the game down a lot more," he said.


http://www.latimes.com/sports/lakersnow/la-sp-ln-kobe-bryant-lakers-20130122,0,4156470.story?track=rss&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter&dlvrit=53297

If we're going to do that, then Pau (stop being pushed off the block by Andre Miller of all people) and Dwight (stop being stripped on every postup opportunity) are going to have to step up their game.

We're also going to have to put our best shooters on the floor, who aren't necessarily our best defenders. D12 absolutely needs the maximum space possible in order to work. He's not like Bynum where he can operate in a crowded lane.

We also need to do a better job of moving off the ball. Only guys I see doing that are Jamison and Clark. None of the guards really move off the ball well at all.


Maybe they can run the Princeton :man10:

These guys are hopeless *sigh*
JGC

 
Posts: 3781
Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2012 9:07 am

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby lotus on Tue Jan 22, 2013 1:53 pm

The only thing they can do is make trades to get players that will make MDA's system more productive. Or eat MDA's contract and let Bernie Bickerstaff coach for a year or two until Brown's salary drops off. jimmy screwed this franchise.
lotus

 
Posts: 1804
Joined: Sat May 13, 2006 8:15 am

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby dwighthowardsdad on Tue Jan 22, 2013 1:53 pm

The Mike Brown pace. Slow down the game to a grinding halt to try to hide our defensive weaknesses. One thing Kobe is right about in this situation is working from the free-throw line extended down concering HIM; he's best operating in the post at this point in his career...
dwighthowardsdad

 
Posts: 1695
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2012 11:31 am

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby revgen on Tue Jan 22, 2013 1:57 pm

dwighthowardsdad wrote:The Mike Brown pace. Slow down the game to a grinding halt to try to hide our defensive weaknesses. One thing Kobe is right about in this situation is working from the free-throw line extended down concering HIM; he's best operating in the post at this point in his career...


Yep. Pretty sad that we have to resort to that again top pick up some W's. Hopefully, Eddie Jordan can incorporate some Princeton elements so that we don't stand around and watch like we did last season.
"Every time he’s hurt, he always plays, he always comes through."

- Metta World Peace on teammate Kobe Bryant
revgen
HDTV/Multimedia Guru
 
Posts: 21706
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2006 10:53 pm
Location: Southern California

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby JGC on Tue Jan 22, 2013 2:00 pm

lotus wrote:The only thing they can do is make trades to get players that will make MDA's system more productive. Or eat MDA's contract and let Bernie Bickerstaff coach for a year or two until Brown's salary drops off. jimmy screwed this franchise.


Most of the current players are not ideal for MDA's system. That would mean losing Dwight, Pau and Kobe. That is not happening (nor should it).

I think what Kobe is saying is just babble honestly anyway. We don't have a system. How can you assess a system that doesn't exist?
JGC

 
Posts: 3781
Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2012 9:07 am

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby charvin on Tue Jan 22, 2013 2:00 pm

revgen wrote:
"We're going to have to change something … probably going to have to post the ball a lot more, slow the game down a lot more," he said.


Secret implication for the fans to chant "We want Phil!" :man1: :man10:
charvin

 
Posts: 539
Joined: Fri Jul 20, 2012 12:53 pm

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby khmrP on Tue Jan 22, 2013 2:11 pm

the system is flawed but Kobe isn't helping with his volume shooting. I see his comments about having to try and pass Howard the ball but seriously he makes it sound like its Howard fault for turning his back in hopes of getting position to get the a MISSED shot when Kobe goes up. Who goes up to shoot and thinks teammates should prep for a pass knowing Kobe's rep?
User avatar
khmrP

 
Posts: 10406
Joined: Sat May 26, 2007 10:45 pm

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby Chillbongo on Tue Jan 22, 2013 2:24 pm

khmrP wrote:the system is flawed but Kobe isn't helping with his volume shooting. I see his comments about having to try and pass Howard the ball but seriously he makes it sound like its Howard fault for turning his back in hopes of getting position to get the a MISSED shot when Kobe goes up. Who goes up to shoot and thinks teammates should prep for a pass knowing Kobe's rep?


While I agree with your post, not the bolded part. As a basketball player you ALWAYS keep an eye on the ball AND the defense.

Howard's too good for that excuse. Sure, Kobe's shooting habits might make those kinds of passes less frequent, but as a basketball player you ALWAYS expect a pass.

That one's on Dwight.
User avatar
Chillbongo

 
Posts: 3224
Joined: Thu Jun 22, 2006 2:25 pm
Location: Los Angeles

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby khmrP on Tue Jan 22, 2013 2:27 pm

Chillbongo wrote:
khmrP wrote:the system is flawed but Kobe isn't helping with his volume shooting. I see his comments about having to try and pass Howard the ball but seriously he makes it sound like its Howard fault for turning his back in hopes of getting position to get the a MISSED shot when Kobe goes up. Who goes up to shoot and thinks teammates should prep for a pass knowing Kobe's rep?


While I agree with your post, not the bolded part. As a basketball player you ALWAYS keep an eye on the ball AND the defense.

Howard's too good for that excuse. Sure, Kobe's shooting habits might make those kinds of passes less frequent, but as a basketball player you ALWAYS expect a pass.

That one's on Dwight.


well its not just Howard when Kobe goes up for a shot and decides last minute to try and pass cause he realize's he's gona be forced into a bad shot that aren't expecting a pass from Kobe when this happens.
User avatar
khmrP

 
Posts: 10406
Joined: Sat May 26, 2007 10:45 pm

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby BDG on Tue Jan 22, 2013 2:51 pm

When you say "we're not gonna run a lot of plays" at your introductory presser, that better come with success on that end.

Otherwise it just looks foolish.

That is all.
Image
Slava laughed at the suggestion his skills might be affected by the down time. "Are you kidding?" he said. "Basketball is like ball. It's all a circle."

BEST VIDEO EVER ... AND AND THE SECOND BEST.
User avatar
BDG
Retired Admin
 
Posts: 40953
Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2003 10:45 pm
Location: Los Angeles

Re: Kobe: "Need to assess the system"

Postby phoenixrisingla on Tue Jan 22, 2013 3:54 pm

khmrP wrote:
Chillbongo wrote:
khmrP wrote:the system is flawed but Kobe isn't helping with his volume shooting. I see his comments about having to try and pass Howard the ball but seriously he makes it sound like its Howard fault for turning his back in hopes of getting position to get the a MISSED shot when Kobe goes up. Who goes up to shoot and thinks teammates should prep for a pass knowing Kobe's rep?


While I agree with your post, not the bolded part. As a basketball player you ALWAYS keep an eye on the ball AND the defense.

Howard's too good for that excuse. Sure, Kobe's shooting habits might make those kinds of passes less frequent, but as a basketball player you ALWAYS expect a pass.

That one's on Dwight.


well its not just Howard when Kobe goes up for a shot and decides last minute to try and pass cause he realize's he's gona be forced into a bad shot that aren't expecting a pass from Kobe when this happens.


Although Dwight CERTAINLY isn't doing everything he should to succeed, I agree.

And a few of those recent passes looked more like panicked bail outs than planned passes to an open Howard under the hoop.
Image
User avatar
phoenixrisingla

 
Posts: 2277
Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2008 11:49 am
Location: Manhattan Beach, CA!

Previous

Return to Lakers Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Armani, CaCHooKa Man, Google [Bot], Punk-101, thkthebest and 19 guests

cron
Advertise Here | Privacy Policy | ©2008 Sculu Sports. Come Strong.