Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby venky on Tue Aug 06, 2013 2:37 pm

LeBum won't come here as long as Kobe is on the team (imo).
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby therealdeal on Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:09 pm

Doc Brown wrote:I've just started paying attention to this thread.

Then I'm sure you have a lot more posts to respond to. :man10:
Doc Brown wrote:That's all fine and dandy for 2014. Hopefully the 1st rounder isn't a bust and you can fill at least 8 positions with the MLE, BAE and vet. min signings to be competitive.

If you're sporting a team of Carmelo, Kobe, and Pau you're going to do just fine. That's better than the bottom half of the West by itself (assuming Kobe recovers from his injury) and the rest of the team filled out nicely this season without the MLE or the BAE.

And that's without a great shot at being competitive.
Doc Brown wrote:2015 becomes the problem when you have Melo + 3 million from Nash + 1st round pick at around ~26 million and have Kobe/Rondo/Love/Pau to sign with 34 million in available space.

Trade the pick for a future pick. Melo/Nash- 24 million. That'll leave you roughly 36 million to figure it out. Give Love what he wants, Rondo what he wants, and if Kobe wants to play one more year you give him what's left. Without looking at the numbers I think Love's contract is worth 16 million, right? A max to him is something like 17-18 million and he might not be a max guy. Rondo's I think is the same. They should honestly go for about 30 million total and that leaves Kobe the rest to mop up. Pau gets the MLE if he wants to stay. That'd be my plan if Kobe wants desperately to stay and win a ring.

All extremely hypothetical of course.

Doc Brown wrote:And that's with the notion that you used the MLE and BAE for 1 year only deals.
Yep.
Doc Brown wrote:I said the Miami cHeat way, free agents that take pay cuts to team up with each other in their primes. All your examples involved teams trading assets for disgruntled/unwanted stars. Free agency is a whole different scenario.

I'm not sold that's necessarily true. And even then, there's plenty of examples of players who take paycuts to play with other great players. Most of the time those players are past their primes, but there's precedent there I'm just too tired to do that much research on a Tuesday in August. Even if the precedent we settle on is Miami, what's so difficult about that being a consideration? Miami's team all did it to play together in Miami, Los Angeles has the chance to be every bit as lucrative financially (assuming they're stars and that they'd make up the state taxes in endorsements which they should).

Doc Brown wrote:Provide examples of free agents that control where they go. Because Love and Rondo, according to your scenario, they are going to have to take pay cuts lower than what the cHeat players did by far.
How so? Even if you say it's 34 million, that's 17 million per season from the first year they sign. That's a massive paycut from what they're earning now? I don't think so.

After checking Rondo is getting 13 million next year. That's a pretty sizable pay increase if he splits 34 million. In fact he'd be going into the 9th year of his NBA career and the max he could be offered would be near 17 million anyway. Same with Love. Then, again, you make Kobe take whatever is left or the MLE. I guess no Pau in this scenario.

This is all the highest conjecture and I'm not entirely sure why you're spending so much time trying to tear it down when I've made it obvious that I'm just spit-balling, but I'm still right. This is all still possible.
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby Doc Brown on Tue Aug 06, 2013 6:39 pm

therealdeal wrote:This is all the highest conjecture and I'm not entirely sure why you're spending so much time trying to tear it down when I've made it obvious that I'm just spit-balling, but I'm still right. This is all still possible.


It's about looking realistically and objectively at the future. In your scenario, you changed every variable I presented to fit so that you could be right, leaving realism and objectivity out of it.

We could sit here and spit ball BS all day, but what's the point when you can't take a realistic outlook at the scenario presented?

Maybe there was a good reason I didn't visit this thread before.
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby therealdeal on Tue Aug 06, 2013 6:47 pm

:man10:

You gave me points, I gave you counter points. Tell me what was unrealistic about it and I'll see what I can do.

But the whole point of this thread is to be hypothetical and to look towards the future and see what you can come up with. I don't see that what I'm doing makes any less sense than you trying to poke holes in it.
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby noobiew on Tue Aug 06, 2013 7:07 pm

therealdeal wrote:30 is not the decline of a player at all, my friend. Most greats won their rings past their 30s. Even going over the last few years:
2012-2013- Wade
2011- Kidd, Nowitzski
2010- Kobe, Pau, Lamar
2009- Kobe, Pau, Lamar
2008- Pierce, Garnett, Allen
2007- Duncan, Ginobili
etc.



You're right 30 year-old is not the decline of a player at all, but definitely was near a player tail-end of their prime, the problem is not because of your superstar at age 30, but it's because its really hard to build a team around for a 30 year-old superstar, remember that Lakers signed Shaq at the age of 24 ? Miami signed Lebron at the age of 25 and Bosh at 26, they were not able to win the championship immediately, they can only reached the peak and win the championship after a few years trying, that's exactly what happen here, you can't expect you could win the championship immediately after you signed a superstar, they need to wait few years for the team to gather chemistry and momentum before they are able to push for a championship, by the time when the chemistry is there and the team is ready, your superstar will be already 32-33 year-old.

When a team get a future franchise player, normally you would wish the player acquired would be a bit younger so that it's easy for the team to build around him, someone like Kyrie Irving, John Wall, Paul George, Kevin Love would be so perfect for us :man6:
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby therealdeal on Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:32 am

noobiew wrote:
therealdeal wrote:30 is not the decline of a player at all, my friend. Most greats won their rings past their 30s. Even going over the last few years:
2012-2013- Wade
2011- Kidd, Nowitzski
2010- Kobe, Pau, Lamar
2009- Kobe, Pau, Lamar
2008- Pierce, Garnett, Allen
2007- Duncan, Ginobili
etc.



You're right 30 year-old is not the decline of a player at all, but definitely was near a player tail-end of their prime, the problem is not because of your superstar at age 30, but it's because its really hard to build a team around for a 30 year-old superstar, remember that Lakers signed Shaq at the age of 24 ? Miami signed Lebron at the age of 25 and Bosh at 26, they were not able to win the championship immediately, they can only reached the peak and win the championship after a few years trying, that's exactly what happen here, you can't expect you could win the championship immediately after you signed a superstar, they need to wait few years for the team to gather chemistry and momentum before they are able to push for a championship, by the time when the chemistry is there and the team is ready, your superstar will be already 32-33 year-old.

When a team get a future franchise player, normally you would wish the player acquired would be a bit younger so that it's easy for the team to build around him, someone like Kyrie Irving, John Wall, Paul George, Kevin Love would be so perfect for us :man6:

That's a fair point. I think the idea there though is that by 30 the player has become what they're going to be and Carmelo has pretty much hit that point. I think there's room there to improve if he feels like his team can win (and if he plays with a competitor that holds him accountable) in the rebounding and a little bit in the defense category. But he's basically just a scorer at this point in his career and I can easily sympathize with people who are concerned about him being one-dimensional.

My point is that at 30 a player reaches what I call his "player-prime" instead of his "athletic prime". I think Kobe during our recent 2-Peat was a better player than he was when he was enjoying his 3-Peat days because he was more well rounded and relied less on his athleticism to make things happen on the court. I think Carmelo's scoring game ages well because it's diversified and doesn't require a ton of athleticism. Kind of like Paul Pierce. That's why at 30-34 I can see him still being effective enough to win a lot of games given the right circumstances.

I agree that obviously it would be far better to get an Irving, a Wall, or a George, but they're going to be extremely hard to come by these days. The Lakers aren't going to be able to grab a 24 year old player in free agency very much anymore. To get one of those young players under this new CBA, they're going to have to draft them.

But what they CAN do is try to snatch those players up in Free Agency AFTER their rookie extensions which puts them roughly at 27-29 years old when they become available. They'll be almost complete players at that point and it becomes harder to develop chemistry, yes, but that's the best the Lakers will likely do in Free Agency now.
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby khmrP on Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:47 am

my personal feeling is that IF Lebron can't give us a definite yes or no w/o Melo then we dont sign Melo at all. Split that max money between 2 players i.e. GSW paying Iggy 12 mill or so. We could do alot more with 2 of those 10-12mill range guy than 1 Melo at MAX and then push for those 2015 guys....say that pipe comes true of a elite PG like Rondo and than Love...now you have those 2 plus 2 more cogs in a championship piece than a guy who disrupts the offense like Melo can and does on a constant basis. We've seen what his game is from the WCF several years ago to now, its ALL iso and the ball sticks once it gets to him, NOTHING has progressed in his offensive game when it comes to team ball. I dont buy into that notion that playing next to Kobe is gona magically change Melo game at the end of the day he's a scorer/chucker, nothing will change that. People say that bout Kobe being a chucker but we saw early in his game he can pick and choose as he please how he plays, Melo not so much.
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby therealdeal on Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:56 am

khmrP wrote:my personal feeling is that IF Lebron can't give us a definite yes or no w/o Melo then we dont sign Melo at all. Split that max money between 2 players i.e. GSW paying Iggy 12 mill or so. We could do alot more with 2 of those 10-12mill range guy than 1 Melo at MAX and then push for those 2015 guys....say that pipe comes true of a elite PG like Rondo and than Love...now you have those 2 plus 2 more cogs in a championship piece than a guy who disrupts the offense like Melo can and does on a constant basis. We've seen what his game is from the WCF several years ago to now, its ALL iso and the ball sticks once it gets to him, NOTHING has progressed in his offensive game when it comes to team ball. I dont buy into that notion that playing next to Kobe is gona magically change Melo game at the end of the day he's a scorer/chucker, nothing will change that. People say that bout Kobe being a chucker but we saw early in his game he can pick and choose as he please how he plays, Melo not so much.

I'm not suggesting he'd radically change to a facilitator, I'm suggesting he would work harder knowing he has a running mate who won't stop working hard on the perimeter. That's all. Effort doesn't necessarily mean a different game, but it can.

I can see what you're saying about who else you'd sign. Who do you suggest we'd get?
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby khmrP on Wed Aug 07, 2013 8:10 am

therealdeal wrote:
khmrP wrote:my personal feeling is that IF Lebron can't give us a definite yes or no w/o Melo then we dont sign Melo at all. Split that max money between 2 players i.e. GSW paying Iggy 12 mill or so. We could do alot more with 2 of those 10-12mill range guy than 1 Melo at MAX and then push for those 2015 guys....say that pipe comes true of a elite PG like Rondo and than Love...now you have those 2 plus 2 more cogs in a championship piece than a guy who disrupts the offense like Melo can and does on a constant basis. We've seen what his game is from the WCF several years ago to now, its ALL iso and the ball sticks once it gets to him, NOTHING has progressed in his offensive game when it comes to team ball. I dont buy into that notion that playing next to Kobe is gona magically change Melo game at the end of the day he's a scorer/chucker, nothing will change that. People say that bout Kobe being a chucker but we saw early in his game he can pick and choose as he please how he plays, Melo not so much.

I'm not suggesting he'd radically change to a facilitator, I'm suggesting he would work harder knowing he has a running mate who won't stop working hard on the perimeter. That's all. Effort doesn't necessarily mean a different game, but it can.

I can see what you're saying about who else you'd sign. Who do you suggest we'd get?


just minor names like Granger, Dang, Ariza type....I would say Gay but dude probably wants MAX again and he'll probably get it. I know those names aren't sexy big name like a Anthony but they're also players that are more condusive to team ball minus Gay who I feel is the same type of player as Anthony but not as good. As I said before if Melo is needed to get Lebron on board so be it but if he's here on his own I dont see us winning much even with Rondo/Love on board in 2015, just my personal feeling thats all. I feel like last yr Knick team had a lot of success because of the defensive side, offensively from what I watch not much team game just ISO everywhere and mostly for Melo.
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby therealdeal on Wed Aug 07, 2013 8:26 am

I can agree with that somewhat. I'm not as against Carmelo as you are, but I agree to an extent. The end game is to draw LeBron and I feel like Carmelo actually works pretty well with LeBron. LeBron doesn't like to score much anyway, but he controls the ball, rebounds well, and is a pretty versatile defender. I think he'd work pretty nicely next to Carmelo. If Carmelo DOESN'T draw LeBron, then there's some issues there for sure.

But for the other names: I like Luol Deng a lot. I'm not sure how much Deng gets on the open market, but I think it's more than he's worth meaning we'd have to overspend on him. He's getting 14 million now and I suspect he'll command at least that on the open market... Otherwise I'd be all over that. Trading for him is one thing, but signing him at 29 years old for 4 years at probably 14-15 million to eat at your Cap Space? I'm not so sure. And Granger is even older than Carmelo and his knees show signs of degenerating cartilage so I'm not sure I'd want to give him a contract longer than 2-3 years. I actually like Granger a lot and I've been high on getting him before. If he came for a reasonable salary and for limited guaranteed years (barring a full recovery this season) I'd be all for it.

And yes the Knicks offense is horrid, but that's due as much in part to the coach as it is to the players.
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby khmrP on Wed Aug 07, 2013 8:35 am

^^^Iggy got 12mill/yr or so, Iggy is younger than Deng I believe. I do not see Deng getting $14mill again
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby therealdeal on Wed Aug 07, 2013 8:49 am

khmrP wrote:^^^Iggy got 12mill/yr or so, Iggy is younger than Deng I believe. I do not see Deng getting $14mill again

Then I'm on board with that signing if he comes at 12 million a year. BUT I'd need another signing along with him as well before I felt comfortable at all in passing on a better player. I'd need two almost All-Stars to pass on a guaranteed All-Star. (and before people get hung up on the All-Star being a media driven thing, it still is a relatively fair indicator of talent)
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby khmrP on Wed Aug 07, 2013 9:08 am

^^^a name I didn't want to throw out there is Chandler Parsons....after this season he can sign an offer sheet I believe forcing Hou to match. I kinda hoped we offer him that poison pill offer just to F up Hou cap :man10: i.e. Lin/Asik type contract and if Hou doesn't match hey at least we get a pretty young solid player for the future :man10:
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby Center Court on Wed Aug 07, 2013 9:11 am

therealdeal wrote:
khmrP wrote:^^^Iggy got 12mill/yr or so, Iggy is younger than Deng I believe. I do not see Deng getting $14mill again

Then I'm on board with that signing if he comes at 12 million a year. BUT I'd need another signing along with him as well before I felt comfortable at all in passing on a better player. I'd need two almost All-Stars to pass on a guaranteed All-Star. (and before people get hung up on the All-Star being a media driven thing, it still is a relatively fair indicator of talent)


Weren't there already talks between Deng and the Bulls about an extension?

Also, not sure Mitch is going to saddle us with max/very large contracts unless they are superstars/franchise players.

Miami is the mold for how to build a team without high draft picks. Clearly space for 2-3 max contracts, get 2 superstars and a third great option then fill around that via mMLE, vet min, bae, etc.

The problem is that guys like George/Wall are not going to turn down max extensions because they want to choose their destination. It's their first opportunity to get paid and they are going to take it. Plus, the CBA makes it more attractive financially to stick with your team.

In a wet dream scnario, Bron and Melo would team up here, both feeling like their franchises are stuck and will struggle to rebuild. (That is far from the truth- both can have max space around their star). I just don't see that happening. Although, it is fun to think about:

Pau
Melo
LeBron
Kobe
Nash
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby Rooscooter on Wed Aug 07, 2013 9:13 am

I see all of the Melo talk as a way for him to leverage another long term big money deal from NY. He doesn't strike me as a guy that cares about winning in the least..... other than trying to blame the lack there of on his teammates and coaches by continually wanting to go somewhere else to "win"....

Even if the uber-pipe of LeBron coming here (which is beyond a No Way in Hell IMO) there is no compelling reason to add Melo even if he'd come here for less..... Cancer at half the price is still cancer.....
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby khmrP on Wed Aug 07, 2013 9:18 am

Center Court wrote:
therealdeal wrote:
khmrP wrote:^^^Iggy got 12mill/yr or so, Iggy is younger than Deng I believe. I do not see Deng getting $14mill again

Then I'm on board with that signing if he comes at 12 million a year. BUT I'd need another signing along with him as well before I felt comfortable at all in passing on a better player. I'd need two almost All-Stars to pass on a guaranteed All-Star. (and before people get hung up on the All-Star being a media driven thing, it still is a relatively fair indicator of talent)


Weren't there already talks between Deng and the Bulls about an extension?

Also, not sure Mitch is going to saddle us with max/very large contracts unless they are superstars/franchise players.

Miami is the mold for how to build a team without high draft picks. Clearly space for 2-3 max contracts, get 2 superstars and a third great option then fill around that via mMLE, vet min, bae, etc.

The problem is that guys like George/Wall are not going to turn down max extensions because they want to choose their destination. It's their first opportunity to get paid and they are going to take it. Plus, the CBA makes it more attractive financially to stick with your team.

In a wet dream scnario, Bron and Melo would team up here, both feeling like their franchises are stuck and will struggle to rebuild. (That is far from the truth- both can have max space around their star). I just don't see that happening. Although, it is fun to think about:

Pau
Melo
LeBron
Kobe
Nash


if talks were good the deal would be done by now...Chi is a cheapskate orgnaization. They're probably not going to give Deng anything near double figure millions anymore. As far as Mia being the mold, well this new CBA will prevent that from happening again so why follow a mold thats already gona be facing a nasty tax hit very soon.
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby Center Court on Wed Aug 07, 2013 10:00 am

khmrP wrote:
Center Court wrote:
therealdeal wrote:
khmrP wrote:^^^Iggy got 12mill/yr or so, Iggy is younger than Deng I believe. I do not see Deng getting $14mill again

Then I'm on board with that signing if he comes at 12 million a year. BUT I'd need another signing along with him as well before I felt comfortable at all in passing on a better player. I'd need two almost All-Stars to pass on a guaranteed All-Star. (and before people get hung up on the All-Star being a media driven thing, it still is a relatively fair indicator of talent)


Weren't there already talks between Deng and the Bulls about an extension?

Also, not sure Mitch is going to saddle us with max/very large contracts unless they are superstars/franchise players.

Miami is the mold for how to build a team without high draft picks. Clearly space for 2-3 max contracts, get 2 superstars and a third great option then fill around that via mMLE, vet min, bae, etc.

The problem is that guys like George/Wall are not going to turn down max extensions because they want to choose their destination. It's their first opportunity to get paid and they are going to take it. Plus, the CBA makes it more attractive financially to stick with your team.

In a wet dream scnario, Bron and Melo would team up here, both feeling like their franchises are stuck and will struggle to rebuild. (That is far from the truth- both can have max space around their star). I just don't see that happening. Although, it is fun to think about:

Pau
Melo
LeBron
Kobe
Nash


if talks were good the deal would be done by now...Chi is a cheapskate orgnaization. They're probably not going to give Deng anything near double figure millions anymore. As far as Mia being the mold, well this new CBA will prevent that from happening again so why follow a mold thats already gona be facing a nasty tax hit very soon.


If you're in a position to 3 peat, I think you take that hit. Certainly, we've been a franchise willing to do so. My suggestion as to mold, was not how to avoid luxury tax. It was how to build a dynasty level team.

Boston is going the OKC route of drafting top prospects and developing stars. Looks like we're going/been going the Miami route of signing free agents.

If that's the case, then what happens when we strike out this summer? Do we delay rebuild plans for a year and go after Rondo/Love/Hibbert? Maybe LMA or Gasol. IMO, we're looking for that next face of the franchise and none of those guys are in the Kobe/LeBron/KD status level. Dwight wasn't either, but he could have turned into that with a commitment to LA and winning.

The only way I see us going after Deng and guys on that tier is if we say F it, let's put together a competitive roster then wait until a mega unrestricted free agency class comes along in 3-5 years. IF the Clips are a contender for the next 5 years with 2 superstars (at least perceived as such) while we wallow in playoff mediocrity, most Laker fans will get tired.

Either way, Mitch already hinted that we shouldn't expect much in 2014. I'm gonna guess 2015 is big for us.

Unless Cousins really doesn't get his extension from Sac. Then, despite all the baggage, I hope we go after him. I beleive he has the tools to be the best center in the NBA and right now he needs a change of scenery. Rumors are that new ownership is not too happy with him. If we offer him a max, do they match? Follow up in 2015 with Love and Rondo?

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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby therealdeal on Wed Aug 07, 2013 10:24 am

khmrP wrote:^^^a name I didn't want to throw out there is Chandler Parsons....after this season he can sign an offer sheet I believe forcing Hou to match. I kinda hoped we offer him that poison pill offer just to F up Hou cap :man10: i.e. Lin/Asik type contract and if Hou doesn't match hey at least we get a pretty young solid player for the future :man10:

:man10:
That would actually be hilarious. I'm not that high on Parsons personally. I think he's just an okay role player, but when okay role players are on okay teams, they seem like they're better than they are so they blow up in popularity around the league. He's okay.

I like your sadistic plan though. :man10:
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby LAL4EVA on Wed Aug 07, 2013 10:47 am

Hi guys, been a long time lurker here and occasionally post whenever I have extended time.

Anyways, in regards to Carmelo being signed as a 30 year old, while I'm not the biggest Carmelo fan out there, I think his game will age very well. He doesn't rely on his athleticism as much as other stars do and he plays extremely well below the rim. I think he has one of the best footwork in the league and those things by themselves, I think, will ensure that he doesn't just fall off a cliff with his production as he ages. Also, I've always been of the idea that Melo in the triangle would be devastating. It will give him enough room to operate while hiding his defensive flaws, with the right team in place. Of course that all depends on him getting his head in the game and buying into the system, which i think Phil would have a good chance of doing. I wouldn't be opposed to signing him to a 4 year deal next year assuming we bring back Phil and the 4th year being a team option.

What do you fellows think?
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby therealdeal on Wed Aug 07, 2013 10:57 am

LAL4EVA wrote:Hi guys, been a long time lurker here and occasionally post whenever I have extended time.

Anyways, in regards to Carmelo being signed as a 30 year old, while I'm not the biggest Carmelo fan out there, I think his game will age very well. He doesn't rely on his athleticism as much as other stars do and he plays extremely well below the rim. I think he has one of the best footwork in the league and those things by themselves, I think, will ensure that he doesn't just fall off a cliff with his production as he ages. Also, I've always been of the idea that Melo in the triangle would be devastating. It will give him enough room to operate while hiding his defensive flaws, with the right team in place. Of course that all depends on him getting his head in the game and buying into the system, which i think Phil would have a good chance of doing. I wouldn't be opposed to signing him to a 4 year deal next year assuming we bring back Phil and the 4th year being a team option.

What do you fellows think?

Actually that's an excellent point. I'm not sure the Lakers ever revisit the Triangle necessarily, but he certainly would be a good fit and I know Phil wanted him at one point.

I agree that he'll be able to score the ball well into his 30s and that at 34 he'll still be worth a lot of money because of that. I'm with others that I'm not entirely convinced he should be our end game target, but I wouldn't just shrug him off either.
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby LAL4EVA on Wed Aug 07, 2013 11:20 am

therealdeal wrote:
LAL4EVA wrote:Hi guys, been a long time lurker here and occasionally post whenever I have extended time.

Anyways, in regards to Carmelo being signed as a 30 year old, while I'm not the biggest Carmelo fan out there, I think his game will age very well. He doesn't rely on his athleticism as much as other stars do and he plays extremely well below the rim. I think he has one of the best footwork in the league and those things by themselves, I think, will ensure that he doesn't just fall off a cliff with his production as he ages. Also, I've always been of the idea that Melo in the triangle would be devastating. It will give him enough room to operate while hiding his defensive flaws, with the right team in place. Of course that all depends on him getting his head in the game and buying into the system, which i think Phil would have a good chance of doing. I wouldn't be opposed to signing him to a 4 year deal next year assuming we bring back Phil and the 4th year being a team option.

What do you fellows think?

Actually that's an excellent point. I'm not sure the Lakers ever revisit the Triangle necessarily, but he certainly would be a good fit and I know Phil wanted him at one point.

I agree that he'll be able to score the ball well into his 30s and that at 34 he'll still be worth a lot of money because of that. I'm with others that I'm not entirely convinced he should be our end game target, but I wouldn't just shrug him off either.


Realistically speaking, there aren't better options available to us next summer and so I think we can build a team that can compete for a title with Melo. The only down side with this viable plan is that it includes a lot of ifs that we won't know until the end of this upcoming year. The ifs include; Phil coming back, kobe being relatively close to what he was prior to the injury, and Pau being able to score in a more slowed down offense while still being an elite passer out of the post. Now, 08-10 Pau is long gone, but I do feel like he can be a good starting center at a reasonable price and the same thing goes for kobe. All we would need is a PF that is a good shot blocker and a help defender and more of a defensive minded PG with the ability to hit the three. Fill out the roster with journeymen at the minimum and I think we’d have a good shot at the title considering the situation we’re in at the moment. I think the CBA will be even more restrictive for teams like Miami and other super teams, which gives us a 1-2 year period for a title.

Again, this isn’t a perfect scenario, but I think we could make it work with the right pieces. I know the league has up and coming teams like the pelicans (and others), but our team has a lot of seasoned veterans to overcome these young guns when it counts.
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby khmrP on Wed Aug 07, 2013 11:22 am

therealdeal wrote:
khmrP wrote:^^^a name I didn't want to throw out there is Chandler Parsons....after this season he can sign an offer sheet I believe forcing Hou to match. I kinda hoped we offer him that poison pill offer just to F up Hou cap :man10: i.e. Lin/Asik type contract and if Hou doesn't match hey at least we get a pretty young solid player for the future :man10:

:man10:
That would actually be hilarious. I'm not that high on Parsons personally. I think he's just an okay role player, but when okay role players are on okay teams, they seem like they're better than they are so they blow up in popularity around the league. He's okay.

I like your sadistic plan though. :man10:


they did it with Lin and Asik, its only fair someone else does it to them :man12:
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby therealdeal on Wed Aug 07, 2013 11:40 am

LAL4EVA wrote:
Realistically speaking, there aren't better options available to us next summer and so I think we can build a team that can compete for a title with Melo. The only down side with this viable plan is that it includes a lot of ifs that we won't know until the end of this upcoming year. The ifs include; Phil coming back, kobe being relatively close to what he was prior to the injury, and Pau being able to score in a more slowed down offense while still being an elite passer out of the post. Now, 08-10 Pau is long gone, but I do feel like he can be a good starting center at a reasonable price and the same thing goes for kobe. All we would need is a PF that is a good shot blocker and a help defender and more of a defensive minded PG with the ability to hit the three. Fill out the roster with journeymen at the minimum and I think we’d have a good shot at the title considering the situation we’re in at the moment. I think the CBA will be even more restrictive for teams like Miami and other super teams, which gives us a 1-2 year period for a title.

Again, this isn’t a perfect scenario, but I think we could make it work with the right pieces. I know the league has up and coming teams like the pelicans (and others), but our team has a lot of seasoned veterans to overcome these young guns when it counts.

There's just way too many ifs right now for this Laker team. It's fun to kind of speculate on where this team will go (knowing they're at least targeting LeBron and Carmelo), but there's not much that we can predict.

It'll be interesting that's for sure.
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby Rooscooter on Wed Aug 07, 2013 12:43 pm

LAL4EVA wrote:Hi guys, been a long time lurker here and occasionally post whenever I have extended time.

Anyways, in regards to Carmelo being signed as a 30 year old, while I'm not the biggest Carmelo fan out there, I think his game will age very well. He doesn't rely on his athleticism as much as other stars do and he plays extremely well below the rim. I think he has one of the best footwork in the league and those things by themselves, I think, will ensure that he doesn't just fall off a cliff with his production as he ages. Also, I've always been of the idea that Melo in the triangle would be devastating. It will give him enough room to operate while hiding his defensive flaws, with the right team in place. Of course that all depends on him getting his head in the game and buying into the system, which i think Phil would have a good chance of doing. I wouldn't be opposed to signing him to a 4 year deal next year assuming we bring back Phil and the 4th year being a team option.

What do you fellows think?


From this point you may be right. He used to go to the hoop quite a bit and he even had a decent back to the basket game in Karl's offense. Last year in NY he was just a jump shooter and a streaky one at that. For me that's the biggest problem with his game. He's a jump shooter at this point and in the playoffs not a good one at all.

There are a whole host of reasons I don't what the guy anywhere near the Lakers but based just on his game he's become a one dimensional offensive player and never was a good defender or facilitator. Add in that he's a mental midget that can't control his ego or temper and to me he's one of the more overrated players in the game.
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Re: Melo AND Bron are Laker targets in 2014 (Ramona pg. 10)

Postby LAL4EVA on Wed Aug 07, 2013 1:23 pm

Rooscooter wrote:
LAL4EVA wrote:Hi guys, been a long time lurker here and occasionally post whenever I have extended time.

Anyways, in regards to Carmelo being signed as a 30 year old, while I'm not the biggest Carmelo fan out there, I think his game will age very well. He doesn't rely on his athleticism as much as other stars do and he plays extremely well below the rim. I think he has one of the best footwork in the league and those things by themselves, I think, will ensure that he doesn't just fall off a cliff with his production as he ages. Also, I've always been of the idea that Melo in the triangle would be devastating. It will give him enough room to operate while hiding his defensive flaws, with the right team in place. Of course that all depends on him getting his head in the game and buying into the system, which i think Phil would have a good chance of doing. I wouldn't be opposed to signing him to a 4 year deal next year assuming we bring back Phil and the 4th year being a team option.

What do you fellows think?


From this point you may be right. He used to go to the hoop quite a bit and he even had a decent back to the basket game in Karl's offense. Last year in NY he was just a jump shooter and a streaky one at that. For me that's the biggest problem with his game. He's a jump shooter at this point and in the playoffs not a good one at all.

There are a whole host of reasons I don't what the guy anywhere near the Lakers but based just on his game he's become a one dimensional offensive player and never was a good defender or facilitator. Add in that he's a mental midget that can't control his ego or temper and to me he's one of the more overrated players in the game.


To be fair to him, it’s better to judge the man for what he’s done for almost his entire career versus what he did last year. Which means I’m still looking at him as a player who is extremely capable in the post in Isolation situations. I do agree with you that last year he had a far worse year than what most proclaimed, but that’s just one season. I think they gave him too much freedom if you know what I mean. While he’s not the most mentally tough star in the league, he’d fare better as kind of a 1a or 1b type player. Much like Odom did upon the arrival of Pau, I think Melo would thrive not having that pressure with Kobe and Pau in the fold. He’s not a great defender or a passer, but he’s not as bad as you’re making him sound. He does have the capability to pass out of the post and even be a viable defender in the right defensive schemes, the only question is if he’d be able to get his head in the game and Kobe and Phil might be able to rein him in. I’m not saying this is ideal, but considering our realistic options, I think this is our best one.
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