Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby Kobe8Fan on Sat Mar 02, 2013 4:00 pm

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By Mike Bresnahan
March 2, 2013, 2:24 p.m.

Metta World Peace didn't want to talk. No way. No comment.

Of course, he couldn't help himself and began a 16-minute discourse on a variety of topics.

First and foremost: The NBA isn't doing enough to protect Lakers teammate Dwight Howard.

"Dwight gets fouled a lot intentionally. Dwight goes up, they push him in the back," World Peace said Saturday. "So I'll let you guys do your research from here on out, just monitor how Dwight gets fouled. Is it an intentional foul or not? Because y'all aren’t looking for those things unless it’s brought to your attention.

"I'm not complaining. Sometimes he gets hurt. Those are intentional fouls. He's getting hurt. He got hurt when he got pushed in Orlando [last season]. These guys are coming down on his back. He had to get surgery as a result of that. And he missed games. He's not complaining. He's a little upset but he goes out there and plays. And those [fouls] are multiple occasions."

World Peace also defended his own reputation after the NBA hit him with a flagrant 2 for elbowing Denver forward Kenneth Faried in the mouth while boxing out in the Lakers' 119-108 loss Monday to the Nuggets.

"The young generation coming up is being mixed with this old generation that's kind of slowly going out. And George Karl knows. Come on," World Peace said. "He's been in this NBA longer than me. He knows the era of basketball."

Karl, the Nuggets' coach, said World Peace's act was "premeditated."

World Peace countered by saying he got "flared" in the face by Denver center JaVale McGee earlier in that game.

"But I'm not going to say, 'Call it in' [to the NBA]… I'm not that type of guy," World Peace said. "A couple years ago, Marc Gasol flared his arms, broke my nose. Spitting up blood and coughing up blood. I'm not going to call it in."

World Peace, who has been suspended by the league 11 times since 2003, laid out why he shouldn't be blamed for his latest transgression. And perhaps many of them too.

"I came to the NBA in '99. I started watching NBA basketball, like, in '95. The Knicks, Miami, I was a fan of those type of playoff series that took place in the NBA on TV and I wanted to play in that atmosphere," World Peace said. "So as a young kid I had to make a decision: I'm not going to be scared to play in that type of game. That's my mind frame. You look at [Michael] Jordan against Detroit, Jordan had to grow. They were bullying him. so I'm like, 'OK, that's never going to happen to me. When I get to the league, I dare somebody from, like, the Detroit Pistons to try to bully me.'

"I was in the league when I was a rookie, I remember Alonzo Mourning saying, 'You come in here again, young fella, blahblahblah.' I went in there again. Nineteen years old. Do it."

World Peace also remembered a game in which he was elbowed several times down the court by Glenn Robinson. He finally snapped.

"I told him, 'You just elbowed the wrong person. I took him and put him on the floor. Nineteen years old," he said. "That's how I grew up watching the game. What do you want me to do?"

While growing up, World Peace said he remembered playing in New York parks and projects where "there was only one way in and one way out."

"My man got hit over the head with a bottle while he was shooting a free throw. Bats and guns come out. We've got to get out. Next day we go to another 'hood and play ball. I'm a young kid and then watching the NBA, my mentality's already, 'I'm ready for this.'

"It's not like I brung this aggression to the league. I didn't invent this. This is what we watch. This is what we saw."

World Peace has five flagrant-foul "points" in the NBA's suspension system.

If he gets the lesser flagrant 1 called on him at any point before the end of the regular-season finale, he is suspended for one game. If he gets hit with the more egregious flagrant 2, he is suspended two games.

He went back to talking about Monday's loss in Denver, and elbowing Faried.

"The best offensive rebounder in the league is coming full speed… down your back. That impact is not soft. It hurts me too," World Peace said. "This guy's coming 100 miles an hour down my back. What am I supposed to do? Skinny up?" World Peace scrunched his shoulder together and looked like a pencil.

Then he added, "You wasn't taught to go like this." He raised his arms straight in the air.

"Looks like a cheerleader."

World Peace has had to play a lot of power forward and center in recent games.

"I can’t wait 'til Pau [Gasol] and Jordan [Hill] get back," he said, adding a list of taller players he's had to guard in their absence: Carlos Boozer, Zach Randolph, LaMarcus Aldridge, Dirk Nowitzki and "the big boy from Minnesota, I forget his name, it's a funny name." That would be center Nikola Pekovic.

"I'm not backing down to none of these guys," World Peace said. "I'm not even a power forward. I'm a small forward. I've got to go up against these guys every single night. I can't back down. What am I going to do? Let these guys come in and rebound every single time. Enough."


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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby revgen on Sat Mar 02, 2013 4:09 pm

Big men in general are treated like crap in the NBA. Whether it's Shaq, Dwight (even in his Orlando days), Bynum, Pau, etc.

Guards are allowed to drive to the basket, initiate contact and pick up fouls even though the big man jumped straight up and came straight down. Guards who carelessly jump off one leg, take contact from a big man and fall onto the floor the wrong way are immediately given a flagrant call in their favor. Big men who try to make a move in the post where they move their off foot more than once (which you're allowed to do as long as the pivot foot is anchored) are immediately whistled for traveling by clueless referees. Even the opposing coaches and fans don't even understand what a pivot foot is. Not to mention the various rules that bigs have to follow. Defensive 3 seconds. Offensive 3 seconds. 5 second back to the basket rule. Zone defenses which allow teams to double a big man before they even receive the ball. Ever since Stern took over, he's systematically done as much as he possibly could to turn the NBA into a guards league.
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby SpencerHarrison on Sat Mar 02, 2013 5:08 pm

Even if I've had issues with Dwight this season, I do agree that the level of abuse he takes is absurd. I understand "intentional fouling" for strategic purposes. IE: Late game, stop a possession by wrapping a guy up and hope he misses his free throws. But there HAS to be some line in the sand on this stuff. Everyone in the NBA knows that Howard has a bad shoulder. So if you want to win games against the Lakers, what tactic do you think you'll use? Foul him hard, and often. Bring in big strong players with fouls to give who can go at him.

It's a lose, lose situation for Dwight. He gets hurt, misses FTs and wears down rapidly over the course of a game. It's win/win for the opposition. I think the only solution is for him to raise him game and find ways to finish with movement as opposed to strength, and become a better FT shooter.

And I agree with Metta's thoughts on dealing with offensive rebounding. What are you supposed to do? This isn't 2K where boxing out just freezes a player. In practice, the speed and intensity and violence create havoc.

Also the fouls LeBron lives on are completely absurd. If it's a touch foul league, then fine. But then Kobe should be absolutely living at the line.
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby abeer3 on Sat Mar 02, 2013 6:30 pm

i'm mixed on it. i agree that dwight gets fouled a lot, but he also gets to throw a shoulder into folks, just like shaq did. dish it and take it.

i agree with mwp on his treatment, though. dudes like faried just get to climb your back on every single missed shot? you pop that sucker right in his face if you're playing anywhere but the current nba. and that's the refs' fault: call faried for crashing into people's backs and maybe he won't get popped.
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby therealdeal on Sat Mar 02, 2013 6:55 pm

^ Agreed.

I think Metta's main point is that a lot of those are supposed to be flagrant fouls in Dwight's favor and I don't disagree.
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby lakersStan24 on Sat Mar 02, 2013 7:19 pm

abeer3 wrote:i'm mixed on it. i agree that dwight gets fouled a lot, but he also gets to throw a shoulder into folks, just like shaq did. dish it and take it.

i agree with mwp on his treatment, though. dudes like faried just get to climb your back on every single missed shot? you pop that sucker right in his face if you're playing anywhere but the current nba. and that's the refs' fault: call faried for crashing into people's backs and maybe he won't get popped.

thats what I think He did what any other person would have done
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby JLaker17 on Sat Mar 02, 2013 7:35 pm

Dwight gets away with the shoulder move, but also teams can not even play the ball against this guy and get away with it. The labrum injury I understand will continue to happen, can't help guys swiping at his arms and holding them down. I do agree however with Metta that it is ridiculous that players can push him in the back and it is just a regular foul.
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby JSM on Sat Mar 02, 2013 8:50 pm

The league has down an awful job protecting and properly officiating the elite big men for some time now. Sad thing is I've seen zero progress made on the matter. Shaq took the same beating in the post 13 years ago that Dwight takes today and the refs still let criminal acts occur against big men. Elite guards get protection from the refs today, elite bigs still get nothing but injuries and built up frustration that they end up taking out on the opposition (or the refs).
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby last stand on Sat Mar 02, 2013 9:07 pm

shaq used to get abused. difference was he was 350lbs so you couldn't tell. in orlando when dwight was healthy and his full playing weight the hits weren't as noticeable. now that his core is weaker and he's smaller it's more noticeable.

remember the ridiculous scratches that would appear on paus shoulders and back. this isn't new. just more noticeable the smaller the big man is.
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby GinoDB on Sat Mar 02, 2013 9:07 pm

also the "energy" guys like Faried get away with too much out there, and guys like him basically
dont even really know how to play basketball
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby last stand on Sat Mar 02, 2013 9:11 pm

GinoDB wrote:also the "energy" guys like Faried get away with too much out there, and guys like him basically
dont even really know how to play basketball


kenneth faried is pretty annoying. he has no BBALL IQ. he basically runs like a chicken without a head, jumps around uselessly, and runs into people, and dunks. and his hair just adds to the chaos. now he's a good player because he does rebound and run the fastbreak incredibly well considering the way he plays but he's the prototypical athlete playing basketball instead of basketball player who's athletic
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby Center Court on Sat Mar 02, 2013 9:21 pm

last stand wrote:
GinoDB wrote:also the "energy" guys like Faried get away with too much out there, and guys like him basically
dont even really know how to play basketball


kenneth faried is pretty annoying. he has no BBALL IQ. he basically runs like a chicken without a head, jumps around uselessly, and runs into people, and dunks. and his hair just adds to the chaos. now he's a good player because he does rebound and run the fastbreak incredibly well considering the way he plays but he's the prototypical athlete playing basketball instead of basketball player who's athletic



is something wrong with that? He's a flat out difference every time he plays...
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby last stand on Sat Mar 02, 2013 9:26 pm

Center Court wrote:
last stand wrote:
GinoDB wrote:also the "energy" guys like Faried get away with too much out there, and guys like him basically
dont even really know how to play basketball


kenneth faried is pretty annoying. he has no BBALL IQ. he basically runs like a chicken without a head, jumps around uselessly, and runs into people, and dunks. and his hair just adds to the chaos. now he's a good player because he does rebound and run the fastbreak incredibly well considering the way he plays but he's the prototypical athlete playing basketball instead of basketball player who's athletic



is something wrong with that? He's a flat out difference every time he plays...


did i say he wasnt
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby Rooscooter on Sat Mar 02, 2013 10:15 pm

Sooo... if a player is hurt he should be officiated different? Really guys? You want that to be a rule? Any sport I've every played if a player was injured you put as much pressure on that body part as you could within the rules. Wrapping up a player is within the rules isn't it?

He can get away from the hard fouls if he starts actually practicing his free throws instead of posing for videos trying to prove he's doing it. If he were he wouldn't be shooting under 50%. I'm pretty sure I could teach a person off the street to shoot 50% in 6 months....

Like Shaq he uses his elbows to create space and always seems to leave them at face level when rebounding. He's always done that and rarely gets called for it so I'm not sure I see the lopsided officiating on him.... What do you guys want? Him shooting MORE free throws?....

MWP gets officiated differently and that's because of his past.... he's always an eyelash from chaos it seems. I'm sure the NBA is very concerned about his ability to go off so they reign him in. Howard and the fact he plays very physically makes him difficult to officiate. I'm sure a fan of an opposing team could make a fairly decent argument that most of Shaq's jump hooks were offensive fouls.
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby V.V.V.V.V. on Sat Mar 02, 2013 11:11 pm

Dwight needs to sue the league after he retires, for officiating in such a way that encourages injuries like his herniated disc to happen. Letting an opposing team rough up a player without calling fouls is beyond the ethics of good sportsmanship. I'm sure that in their heads they're just trying to keep the games close for the sake of ratings/entertainment. But they have to do a better job, since when they swallow their whistles against a targeted player, they promote "roughing up" at best, and violence/injury at worst.

The NFL might set the precedent, if retired players suffering from concussion injuries file a class action suit against the league for not protecting them enough. Some retired players, who suffered career-altering injuries due to overly rough fouls, might follow suit in the NBA.

Leagues have a responsibility to protect their players, and Stern has done a terrible job of it during his tenure.
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby Scnottaken on Sun Mar 03, 2013 1:13 am

Rooscooter wrote:Sooo... if a player is hurt he should be officiated different? Really guys? You want that to be a rule? Any sport I've every played if a player was injured you put as much pressure on that body part as you could within the rules. Wrapping up a player is within the rules isn't it?

He can get away from the hard fouls if he starts actually practicing his free throws instead of posing for videos trying to prove he's doing it. If he were he wouldn't be shooting under 50%. I'm pretty sure I could teach a person off the street to shoot 50% in 6 months....

Like Shaq he uses his elbows to create space and always seems to leave them at face level when rebounding. He's always done that and rarely gets called for it so I'm not sure I see the lopsided officiating on him.... What do you guys want? Him shooting MORE free throws?....

MWP gets officiated differently and that's because of his past.... he's always an eyelash from chaos it seems. I'm sure the NBA is very concerned about his ability to go off so they reign him in. Howard and the fact he plays very physically makes him difficult to officiate. I'm sure a fan of an opposing team could make a fairly decent argument that most of Shaq's jump hooks were offensive fouls.

I don't think that's what people are saying at all. I think people are saying to even out the officiating. Either loosen up the calls perimeter players like CP3 get, or tighten up the calls around the rim for big men. It's only fair.
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby lakefansac on Sun Mar 03, 2013 1:32 am

Its a different league these days and the officiating favors more slashing and jumpshooting Euro style basketball. That being said, Dwight has a horrible post game, although he is a good defender and rebounder.
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby wcsoldier81 on Sun Mar 03, 2013 1:50 am

" Protection " would only mean more bricks at the line ..
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby therealdeal on Sun Mar 03, 2013 10:00 am

Scnottaken wrote:
Rooscooter wrote:Sooo... if a player is hurt he should be officiated different? Really guys? You want that to be a rule? Any sport I've every played if a player was injured you put as much pressure on that body part as you could within the rules. Wrapping up a player is within the rules isn't it?

He can get away from the hard fouls if he starts actually practicing his free throws instead of posing for videos trying to prove he's doing it. If he were he wouldn't be shooting under 50%. I'm pretty sure I could teach a person off the street to shoot 50% in 6 months....

Like Shaq he uses his elbows to create space and always seems to leave them at face level when rebounding. He's always done that and rarely gets called for it so I'm not sure I see the lopsided officiating on him.... What do you guys want? Him shooting MORE free throws?....

MWP gets officiated differently and that's because of his past.... he's always an eyelash from chaos it seems. I'm sure the NBA is very concerned about his ability to go off so they reign him in. Howard and the fact he plays very physically makes him difficult to officiate. I'm sure a fan of an opposing team could make a fairly decent argument that most of Shaq's jump hooks were offensive fouls.

I don't think that's what people are saying at all. I think people are saying to even out the officiating. Either loosen up the calls perimeter players like CP3 get, or tighten up the calls around the rim for big men. It's only fair.

This.

No one is saying give Howard a break because he's hurt. We're saying when someone takes an intentional foul on him by beating down on his upper body or shoving him hard while he's in the air, they should get penalized. And I thought the same about Shaq.

When Shaq was throwing elbows into faces, I said he should get offensive fouls. When Dwight does the same, he should get the same. But when guys smash on these players, they should get warnings at least that those plays aren't safe and will be punished.

Meanwhile Metta isn't allowed to be physical with anyone except Carmelo Anthony and he picks up flagrants for trying to box out a high fly act. Where's the sense in that?
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby lakersin4 on Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:53 am

Rooscooter wrote:Sooo... if a player is hurt he should be officiated different? Really guys? You want that to be a rule? Any sport I've every played if a player was injured you put as much pressure on that body part as you could within the rules. Wrapping up a player is within the rules isn't it?

He can get away from the hard fouls if he starts actually practicing his free throws instead of posing for videos trying to prove he's doing it. If he were he wouldn't be shooting under 50%. I'm pretty sure I could teach a person off the street to shoot 50% in 6 months....

Like Shaq he uses his elbows to create space and always seems to leave them at face level when rebounding. He's always done that and rarely gets called for it so I'm not sure I see the lopsided officiating on him.... What do you guys want? Him shooting MORE free throws?....

MWP gets officiated differently and that's because of his past.... he's always an eyelash from chaos it seems. I'm sure the NBA is very concerned about his ability to go off so they reign him in. Howard and the fact he plays very physically makes him difficult to officiate. I'm sure a fan of an opposing team could make a fairly decent argument that most of Shaq's jump hooks were offensive fouls.
It's not about being officiated differently, it's not like these guys do this to everyone they defend. When they know you're hurt, they attack it.. When it's obvious that someone is intentionally trying to injure another player, yes the refs should step in.
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby Pig Miller on Sun Mar 03, 2013 1:27 pm

perimeter players are to the nba what QBs are to the NFL.

they're the big names that need to be protected, whether it be a cp3, lebron, kobe,etc. the nba wanted a more up tempo game (away from what the cavs were doing in the late 90's and early 2000's.

for the last 7 or 8 years, there's been no incentive for big guys to develop a great post game because rules don't favor that style of play (whether due to zone defense or otherwise)

also, i think a big part of it is the influence of international players and their big men who can shoot from the outside.

the other piece is that big men don't get the chance to develop in college, so many of them are one and out and apparently the coaches in the nba can't coach them up (unlike KAJ did with bynum).

also, since the game is faster, big men have less of an impact unless you can be disciplined and play with a certain pace.
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby Juronimo on Sun Mar 03, 2013 1:57 pm

Shaq, Yao, Dwight, Bynum, they're all officiated a little differently than other players. Since they're significantly bigger and stronger than everyone else, the refs assume they can handle more contact. Also they tend to dish out a lot of punishment themselves, especially Shaq, which leads to the dilemma that we're witnessing right now.
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby Rooscooter on Sun Mar 03, 2013 2:17 pm

I don't think the league should protect any player so you won't get me to say that the hard fouls on Howard should be different than a hard foul on DeAndre Jordan....another crappy free throw shooter.

If wrapping up Howard hurts his already hurt shoulder I'm not sure how that is anything more than a simple foul. Wrapping up is not a flagrant or a technical offense is it?

It's like some want the league to remove a strategic weakness we have through officiating. Should our best free throw shooter also get to shoot in those situations..... :man10:
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby therealdeal on Sun Mar 03, 2013 2:19 pm

So Howard getting shoved in the back while he's in the air shouldn't be a flagrant?

It should be. Why is that so hard to understand?
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Re: Metta: NBA Doesn't Protect Dwight

Postby Rooscooter on Sun Mar 03, 2013 2:24 pm

therealdeal wrote:So Howard getting shoved in the back while he's in the air shouldn't be a flagrant?

It should be. Why is that so hard to understand?


So conspiracies again..... Is it only Howard that gets pushed in the back in this league?

I think waaaaaay too many Flagrant fouls are called in the league. Why would I want more?

If Howard wants it to stop make your damn free throws and it will magically stop..... No need for special officiating...... Just some work.
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