Mike D'Antoni Discussion: RESIGNS AS LAKERS COACH (184)

Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby Weezy on Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:36 pm

Plays Kobe entire games. :disagree: I know we need to make the playoffs and we need Kobe to do it, but it's not going to matter if we get there is Kobe is spent. Also, hearing him mic'd up saying Kobe will tell him when he needs a break, he won't tell Kobe, wow, grow a pair and tell him when to rest, you get paid millions to do that.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby Herm24 on Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:42 pm

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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby Finwë on Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:07 pm

Weezy wrote:Plays Kobe entire games. :disagree: I know we need to make the playoffs and we need Kobe to do it, but it's not going to matter if we get there is Kobe is spent. Also, hearing him mic'd up saying Kobe will tell him when he needs a break, he won't tell Kobe, wow, grow a pair and tell him when to rest, you get paid millions to do that.

Kobe told him (and did the same on Saturday) that he wanted to go all out, play the whole game, assuming it was close.. On saturday he said something like "we've got 8 games left, I can deal with this (his foot problem)"..
With Nash out, I didn't really mind Kobe playing this much.. I wish the game hadn't been close so he would've gotten rest in the 4th, but the man is in his 17th season, no one knows his body more than him, if he wants to go for it, and we are much better off with him doing it (we are), then he should get to go for it...

Of all the things to point out about MDA, I don't think this one is really an important one.. I don't think many coaches in the league (with their team in this position) would deny Kobe's wish to play and step up in Nash's absence.. Kobe has kinda always determined when he was going in and out, I remember several times he would overturn a sub when in foul trouble, or ask the coach to keep him in and he would, or ask to go in and he would..
Not gonna change, especially with the season on the line.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby wcsoldier81 on Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:22 pm

Lol at blaming MDA for not playing Darrius Dribble or BenjiAlldayEveryday
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby JoelMyersScrotalSack on Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:37 pm

The minutes bugged me at first but thinking about it we have so few games left and have to perform at an exceptional level in order prolong the season. If Kobe doesn't go all out now it won't matter
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby Weezy on Wed Apr 03, 2013 12:14 am

wcsoldier81 wrote:Lol at blaming MDA for not playing Darrius Dribble or BenjiAlldayEveryday


I really don't think playing Duhon at point and Jodie or Blake at SG for a few minutes is going to kill us.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby therealdeal on Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:08 am

Weezy wrote:Plays Kobe entire games. :disagree: I know we need to make the playoffs and we need Kobe to do it, but it's not going to matter if we get there is Kobe is spent. Also, hearing him mic'd up saying Kobe will tell him when he needs a break, he won't tell Kobe, wow, grow a pair and tell him when to rest, you get paid millions to do that.

From what I understand that's Kobe's request. It helps deal with the foot pain because there's no time for it to settle if he's constantly on it. And if he's playing PG, he's not really killing himself the way he is as our scorer.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby therealdeal on Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:20 am

borri wrote:1. Hill barely cracked PT when Antoni took over for Bernie.

2. Clark only played because Pau got injured and Howard wussed out those games. Now that Pau is back Clark barely plays. Jamison is in favor. Why? Offense. It's not like we our biggest problem is defense.............

3. There's nothing in Antoni's coaching history to make me think that he'll change. IF he stays, we will need players that FIT his system. Shooters, shooters, shooters. This is the same coach who keeps Meeks in the game DESPITE a huge mismatch on D. Why? He can supposedly shoot and stretch the floor.

4. While Clark and Hill are cheap talent, they are talent that can be used in a package for players that fit Antoni's system. Why keep talent that the coach won't play or barely plays when you can parlay them into something that the coach WILL play.

Based on that, IF Antoni stays he'll want players for his system. A stretch 4, a 3 who can shoot. And bench players who can score and shoot regardless of position. Antoni will trot out 5 SG's if they can score the bucket....defense be damned.

I frankly just don't see Antoni changing his ways.

1. At first, but he figured it out eventually. Then Hill went down. Throw him on a team without Pau and there's no more debating who needs to get more playing time.

2. Clark wasn't playing because he was clearly tired and banged up. Now that he is (apparently) feeling better he played 30 minutes last night. Sure he only got a look because of injuries, but sometimes that's what happens. Not many coaches around the league would have given him a shot for any reason. He'd been in the league for 3 years already.

3. He's changed all year. Whether that's his choice or not, we're not anything like any team he's ever coached. We're slow. We're old. We're now playing big and throwing the ball inside. We still take a lot of threes, but it's off of space provided by our bigs and Kobe. I know people don't want to recognize it, but that's change. It might not be his CHOICE, but it's change.

4. When Clark is healthy he plays and he fits the system just like Marion used to fit the system. Hill fits ANY system because he works hard, gets boards, and defends. And in my scenarios we were moving forward without Gasol weren't we? That means no more arguing about who gets minutes. The minutes are there and Hill/Clark must take them. Trading Hill isn't going to bring us much back anyway in anything we need unless someone is willing to give us Michael Kidd-Gilchrist or Bradley Beal for Jordan Hill. At 3.1 million he's one of the best values that we have. Same with Clark (assuming his contract is similar). Meanwhile we have bloated contracts like Blake, Gasol, Artest, Kobe, Nash, even Duhon. We need to get rid of those. Even if it means not getting "full value" back, we rid ourselves of dead weight. There'll be plenty of talent in the pool of FA as far as role players go. If we can move Gasol for a few cheaper pieces, we can attract a few cheap vets or young guys. The way Pau is playing right now a trade of Gasol for Kirilenko/Williams/Barea isn't terribly far fetched. Those 3 aren't winning Minnesota anything. Pau probably isn't either, but at least he's going to get them bank from Spain. Now we have some movable pieces, some freed up room, and we're more balanced and attractive to FAs. Trade away Blake and Duhon, maybe Artest. Fill in the blanks with cheap guys who'll work hard. Boom.

If D'Antoni stays he'll basically be doing what he's doing now: letting the starters run their own offense and running his offense with the bench. That's what we were doing when we were on our run and at our "healthiest". It was working really well too with Blake/Jamison running that show along with Meeks. Throw in Hill and that's a decent bench (what we thought we'd have at the start). But trade Blake for Barea and throw in another young body (Williams?) and that's a pretty dynamic bench that works in D'Antoni's favor. Meanwhile Kobe/Nash/Howard continue to run the show for the starters.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby Tobias Funke on Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:32 am

Finwë wrote:
Weezy wrote:Plays Kobe entire games. :disagree: I know we need to make the playoffs and we need Kobe to do it, but it's not going to matter if we get there is Kobe is spent. Also, hearing him mic'd up saying Kobe will tell him when he needs a break, he won't tell Kobe, wow, grow a pair and tell him when to rest, you get paid millions to do that.

Kobe told him (and did the same on Saturday) that he wanted to go all out, play the whole game, assuming it was close.. On saturday he said something like "we've got 8 games left, I can deal with this (his foot problem)"..
With Nash out, I didn't really mind Kobe playing this much.. I wish the game hadn't been close so he would've gotten rest in the 4th, but the man is in his 17th season, no one knows his body more than him, if he wants to go for it, and we are much better off with him doing it (we are), then he should get to go for it...

Of all the things to point out about MDA, I don't think this one is really an important one.. I don't think many coaches in the league (with their team in this position) would deny Kobe's wish to play and step up in Nash's absence.. Kobe has kinda always determined when he was going in and out, I remember several times he would overturn a sub when in foul trouble, or ask the coach to keep him in and he would, or ask to go in and he would..
Not gonna change, especially with the season on the line.


I sort of agree with both of you. I think Pringles should grow a pair. This isn't Kobe from 2-3 years ago, his minutes should be managed, and its the coach's job to do it. Kobe doesn't want to come out, you make him, unless "coach" is another one of the duties that MDA's decided to assign to Kobe as well.

At the same time, the "damage" has already been done sadly. An entire season gone and he's played more minutes than almost anyone in the league. There's not any point in resting him anymore if it means not making the playoffs.

He'll just have to pace himself throughout the games.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby karacha on Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:38 am

I agree with the realdeal.

We have to get rid of some contracts. Duhon will be let go. Blake is solid, but he should probably be traded. Same goes for Pau. His contract has to be traded. Kobe will retire. Nash is likely gone next summer (nice expiring contract). Metta might be traded or amnestied. Alternatively, his contract can be restructured and he comes back very cheap as a stricly bench player to play the D. Jamison should be re-signed, and I count on Hill and Easy staying with Dwight on this team. Then we add some young guys (who can run back on D and shoot) and two vets (who can shoot!) and we're back in championship mode.

If we can do this (do it, Mitch!) then MDA is going to look better as well. I think he's here to stay for the length of his contract. Maybe he can do something with the new team in 2014/15.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby Vasashi17 on Wed Apr 03, 2013 11:06 am

I'm sorry, but playing Kobe the entire game is absurd. If you can't create a game plan to counter injuries (which is the way of life in the NBA), then you ain't earning your pay.

Kobe could say all he wants about he is capable of playing the entire game, but that doesn't mean you should take him up on it. How about playing him appropriate minutes and then while he's on the bench, he can still receive treatment.

Kobe could have crushed his 81 point game had Phil left him in for the 4th quarter of the Dallas game where he scored 62...yet, Phil saw the big picture. What good is it to risk further injuring Kobe, just to make the 8th seed and play without him? And lets say Kobe didn't exacerbate the ankle injury in these next 7 games...you got your number 1 guy gassed for the start of the postseason. WTF?

I understand that this isn't entirely MDA's fault, but I'd be damned if this isn't bad coaching.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby Chillbongo on Wed Apr 03, 2013 11:37 am

While I usually agree with the criticism on Mike D'Antoni, this was done per Kobe's request not because he's a sociopath who wants to play nearly 48 minutes, but because the bone spur in his foot would have inflamed to the point that he could not play on it.

During halftime he was probably doing some gnarly stretching/treatment that kept it from getting stiff, (stuff he cannot do on the bench, like ice) which also serves as another reason he was unable to be out during Shaq's retirement ceremony.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby Lakerjones on Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:27 pm

karacha wrote:
If we can do this (do it, Mitch!) then MDA is going to look better as well. I think he's here to stay for the length of his contract. Maybe he can do something with the new team in 2014/15.


:hurl: Sorry Karacha. Not meant as commentary on your posting but just on the thought of MDA here for the full length of his contract horrifies me. We won't be winning a single thing in that time if that's the case. That will truly challenge my patience and ability to stay a Laker fan if true.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby karacha on Thu Apr 04, 2013 6:01 am

That's not my fault. :man1: I don't expect the Lakers to fire him then pay three coaches for the remaining of their contracts.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby Magic Skywalker on Thu Apr 04, 2013 6:20 am

Neither do I, unless he really does a horrible job through an extended period of time, and I really don't think next year will be as bad as this one.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby JSM on Fri Apr 05, 2013 10:06 pm

Hey Mikey, Kobe is not a product of Cyberdyne. You can't run him until the wheels fall off. Not really a big fan of him not resting Kobe in the previous two game, but this was a bigger deal tonight IMO. You have to know your personnel and your opponent's personnel. MDA doesn't. It doesn't compute to him that a more physical team that makes Kobe work harder to get free and makes him work harder to hit ridiculously difficult shots is extremely draining on a player. There is no reason he should have been huffing and puffing like that during his last jumper attempt. It doesn't take a physic to figure this out, just look at his damn body language. If we can figure it out at home, you should be able to figure it out being 5 feet from the man.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby Doc Brown on Fri Apr 05, 2013 10:10 pm

^^^How would you have handled the rotation then?
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby XXIV on Fri Apr 05, 2013 10:19 pm

Yeah at this point I don't see how we can rest Kobe for much longer than he did tonight without losing games. He's currently playing starting SF and backup SG because our bench is pretty depleted. If we were to have Morris or Ebanks out there, there's no chance we'd have won this game.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby JSM on Fri Apr 05, 2013 10:29 pm

Doc Brown wrote:^^How would you have handled the rotation then?

Would've bought him at least 3 minutes with Duhon in the ball game.

Dwight - Pau - Clark - Duhon - Blake

You can survive with that for at least 3 minutes. Clark and D12 can cover for their shortcomings with their quickness, length, and activity on D. And I guarantee Duhon wouldn't have been any worse than Meeks.

On offense run it through Pau at the top of the key. He can hit Dwight in the post, hit a cutting Clark, Duhon/Blake in the corner, or take it himself.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby wcsoldier81 on Fri Apr 05, 2013 10:47 pm

Memphis has the best D in the league that's why he was so tired ... Allen, Prince , Pondexter ... tough task ... we got "lucky" Bayless was on him for a good portion of the 1st half ...

Pb is the more you would have rested Kobe , the more Duhon and Blake would have turned the ball over ...

We barely get away with the win by resting 6 mins ... we just couldn't afford to rest him more minutes ...

My complaint is about the supposed "draw plays" at the end of the game ... that's all this offensive genius got :man10:
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby JSM on Fri Apr 05, 2013 10:52 pm

wcsoldier81 wrote:My complaint is about the supposed "draw plays" at the end of the game ... that's all this offensive genius got

You don't realize just how good some coaches are until you watch the coaching elite like MDA, Brown, Woodson try to call a final play of the game -- iso superstar from 30 feet out and pray for the best.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby FabFourLakers on Sat Apr 06, 2013 12:04 am

Honestly with Nash out, I don't think we have any choice. Our backs are against the wall...I definitely woulda bought Kobe a few minutes....but with Duhon at the 2? I don't know...I mean you could put him in but i can understand why Dantoni decided not to. Kobe played against the best defense in the league, and yet he didn't have one of those 3 for 16 nights like I thought he would. He controlled the game, although tired, he gutted it out. To be honest i didn't like the plays we run down the stretch, but Kobe and Blake both got good looks and Kobe made the right play giving it to Pau on the pick and roll. Expect to see Kobe play nearly the entire game while Nash is out. The reality is we need Nash back.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby karacha on Sat Apr 06, 2013 7:37 am

Yes, we absolutely need Nash back. You can always try some Nash/Blake combo and let Kobe rest for a few minutes. When is Nash coming back BTW? Any news?
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby Weezy on Sat Apr 06, 2013 3:44 pm

This is the first game where I can understand the heavy minutes. Kobe WAS getting a rest, Dwight and Pau I believe were both in, it was a critical stretch of the game, we were down 4, and Dwight picked up his 4th or 5th foul and had to go out of the game immediately. The time before that when he sat the Grizzlies went on a huge run, so I feel like Kobe had to come back in, to make up for losing Dwight on D by carrying us on offense. If Kobe doesn't come back then who knows what happens with a lineup of only Pau as as the main guy on offense plus no Dwight on d, instead of catching up we may have fallen way back.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: post in 7 seconds or less

Postby Helljumper on Sat Apr 06, 2013 5:48 pm

Jeff Van Gundy credits Coach Mike D'Antoni for guiding the Lakers through a challenging year.

"He's never looked to lash out and say, 'Are you guys nuts? I was thrown into this situation and you're going to blame me?''' said Van Gundy. "He's resisted that temptation because it is nuts when you think about it."

Instead, the Lakers have a chance to make the playoffs despite the injuries, coaching changes and chemistry issues.

"They go about their business," said Van Gundy. "They haven't lashed out as they were earlier in the year, pointing fingers of blame. I think they've really conducted themselves very well and I think that, in a large part, has to do with then even-keel demeanor of Mike D'Antoni."

"The easiest thing to do when a team struggles or a team doesn't have the number of wins that their fans expect them to is to start pointing the fingers of blame at coaches," he continued. "That's easier to stomach than just to say, 'We're in a little bit more of a down period. We don't have a real good team this year.' I think that's where the Lakers are."
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