Mike D'Antoni Discussion: RESIGNS AS LAKERS COACH (184)

Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby trodgers on Tue Mar 18, 2014 11:19 am

Magic Skywalker wrote:That about Kobe made me curious so I investigated a bit...

With Kobe on the team (since 96-97) we've given up 130+ points three times: A 147-141 OT loss in 2006 against the Wizards (Arenas's 60 point game), a 139-137 3OT win in 2011 against the Suns and a 133-124 3OT loss in 2006 (06-07 season though) against the Bobcats (Kobe's 58 point game).

We've permitted 130+ points 6 times this season... so... uhm... yeah, not good.

All OT games, none of them blowouts. That's more salt in the wound. We're just getting destroyed.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby sister golden hair on Tue Mar 18, 2014 11:02 pm

I also find it appalling that people are making the injury excuse -- and that includes the coach -- for the horrific defensive play. That not only throws the players under the bus, but also should throw into question the coach's competence. Is there really nothing you could do to better slow down the other team? How about slowing down your own tempo? How about using something other than a three-points or bust philosophy?

Excuses. results. MDA's regime has been marked by to much of one and not enough of the other.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby Weezy on Wed Mar 19, 2014 10:03 pm

Another 125 points given up, pathetic. On the other hand I want 'Antoni fired day the season ends, I continue to hope that this is justifiable cause, or however you wanna put it, building up.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby Lakerjones on Wed Mar 19, 2014 10:04 pm

"was"?
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby Ariza3 on Sat Mar 22, 2014 11:42 am

how did he not see the gooden-young altercation? how do you not see that sitting courtside are the COACH. what are you watching?
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby Vasashi17 on Tue Mar 25, 2014 10:50 pm

Well, since I love piling on this guy for setting all types of franchise records...here's one that actually is a positive. Our 51 point 3rd quarter is a franchise record.

But for the majority of the quarter, we went with a non-small ball lineup of Kaman/Hill/Wes/Meeks/Marshall...
You know I couldn't give MDA all the credit...right? :man9:
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby gcclaker on Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:24 am

That 51 point explosion will serve to rationalize in the FO minds that D'Antoni is a good coach and that his system works [rolls eyes].
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby TIME on Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:26 am

gcclaker wrote:That 51 point explosion will serve to rationalize in the FO minds that D'Antoni is a good coach and that his system works [rolls eyes].


You know he was. In his post game interview he implied they can do this every night with whoever is on the floor as long as they "move the ball".
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby therealdeal on Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:57 am

TIME wrote:
gcclaker wrote:That 51 point explosion will serve to rationalize in the FO minds that D'Antoni is a good coach and that his system works [rolls eyes].


You know he was. In his post game interview he implied they can do this every night with whoever is on the floor as long as they "move the ball".

It wasn't about moving the ball it was about shooting lights freaking out from the three point line. How often can we repeat that?
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby LTLakerFan on Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:05 am

How often do the long rebounds when they're missing those 3s kill us on fast break points?
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby jlkr on Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:13 am

well MDA was already not going to be fired. team is committed to paying him next year and they're not going to hire somebody else during the rebuild.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby Vasashi17 on Wed Mar 26, 2014 12:45 pm

This being D’Antoni, the hilarious stat from that historic quarter: The Lakers defense still let the Knicks shoot 57 percent with only one turnover.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby puffyusaf#2 on Wed Mar 26, 2014 2:12 pm

TIME wrote:
gcclaker wrote:That 51 point explosion will serve to rationalize in the FO minds that D'Antoni is a good coach and that his system works [rolls eyes].


You know he was. In his post game interview he implied they can do this every night with whoever is on the floor as long as they "move the ball".


In actuality he is right. I have defended the basic idea behind his offense in that it can be exceptionally effective. His problem has been his idiotic rotations and reliance on small ball. Add to that no communication on defense and you are left with this years Lakers. On the side of the FO I really doubt they are going to keep him because money or not they can't afford to have the same type of turnout for next years team. I think they are just letting him go down with the ship.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby Chillbongo on Wed Mar 26, 2014 3:18 pm

So since when did "move the ball" become D'Antoni offense?

SMH. This Potato chip coach is preaching basketball 101...move the f***** ball. No sh** sherlock.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby Chillbongo on Wed Mar 26, 2014 3:19 pm

So since when did "move the ball" become D'Antoni offense?

SMH. This Potato chip coach is preaching basketball 101...move the f***** ball. No sh** sherlock.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby therealdeal on Wed Mar 26, 2014 3:26 pm

puffyusaf#2 wrote:
TIME wrote:
gcclaker wrote:That 51 point explosion will serve to rationalize in the FO minds that D'Antoni is a good coach and that his system works [rolls eyes].


You know he was. In his post game interview he implied they can do this every night with whoever is on the floor as long as they "move the ball".


In actuality he is right. I have defended the basic idea behind his offense in that it can be exceptionally effective. His problem has been his idiotic rotations and reliance on small ball. Add to that no communication on defense and you are left with this years Lakers. On the side of the FO I really doubt they are going to keep him because money or not they can't afford to have the same type of turnout for next years team. I think they are just letting him go down with the ship.

Agreed. The very basic tenets of his offense (movement, flow, speed, and shooting) are not inherently bad. Most of the league operates the same way. But when the game slows down for our older players, there's got to be a better system than simply dumping into the post and standing around watching. There's no cuts, there's no back screens, there's nothing going on in those situations. The fast breaking is fine. The three pointers aren't ideal, but that's the league today. The half-court system is too generic though.

And of course the fact that this team doesn't know two poops about defense. It really isn't that hard to run the Miami defense. You just need guys who are athletic enough to cover ground and willing to do it. Is anyone on Miami's team a really good defender besides LeBron? Chalmers? Wade? Bosh? No they're not exceptional defenders, they just work hard for the system which uses a lot of trapping and ball pressure while relying on their athleticism to play the passing lanes.

I agree he's gone this summer. There's almost no reason to keep him and almost every reason to let him go.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby TIME on Wed Mar 26, 2014 3:35 pm

puffyusaf#2 wrote:
TIME wrote:
gcclaker wrote:That 51 point explosion will serve to rationalize in the FO minds that D'Antoni is a good coach and that his system works [rolls eyes].


You know he was. In his post game interview he implied they can do this every night with whoever is on the floor as long as they "move the ball".


In actuality he is right. I have defended the basic idea behind his offense in that it can be exceptionally effective. His problem has been his idiotic rotations and reliance on small ball. Add to that no communication on defense and you are left with this years Lakers. On the side of the FO I really doubt they are going to keep him because money or not they can't afford to have the same type of turnout for next years team. I think they are just letting him go down with the ship.


I'm going to disagree Puffy. I think his "system" is fundamentally flawed. Nothing wrong with the concept of spacing the floor, except when doing so to the extreme like his system dictates essentially vacates the paint (the single most important space on the court), forces his teams into a rebounding deficit, and places the team in full dependence on made 3 point shots. This is exactly why, even with a prime Nash and a very talented squad his teams never even made the Finals let alone got close to sniffing a ring.

We've seen this over and over again this season. If the team happens to be hot from the 3 point line then they look amazing. If not, they stink like hot garbage. Not a system I want to see for another season.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby Chillbongo on Wed Mar 26, 2014 4:23 pm

^Not to mention the dependence on 3 pointers leads to tons of MISSED three pointers. Which leads to LONG REBOUNDS. Which leads to EASY TRANSITION offense for other teams.

Offense dictates defense. Another reason the Triangle was great - it put the players in a position on Offense to be ready for defense.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby Lakerjones on Wed Mar 26, 2014 4:30 pm

TIME wrote:
puffyusaf#2 wrote:
TIME wrote:
gcclaker wrote:That 51 point explosion will serve to rationalize in the FO minds that D'Antoni is a good coach and that his system works [rolls eyes].


You know he was. In his post game interview he implied they can do this every night with whoever is on the floor as long as they "move the ball".


In actuality he is right. I have defended the basic idea behind his offense in that it can be exceptionally effective. His problem has been his idiotic rotations and reliance on small ball. Add to that no communication on defense and you are left with this years Lakers. On the side of the FO I really doubt they are going to keep him because money or not they can't afford to have the same type of turnout for next years team. I think they are just letting him go down with the ship.


I'm going to disagree Puffy. I think his "system" is fundamentally flawed. Nothing wrong with the concept of spacing the floor, except when doing so to the extreme like his system dictates essentially vacates the paint (the single most important space on the court), forces his teams into a rebounding deficit, and places the team in full dependence on made 3 point shots. This is exactly why, even with a prime Nash and a very talented squad his teams never even made the Finals let alone got close to sniffing a ring.

We've seen this over and over again this season. If the team happens to be hot from the 3 point line then they look amazing. If not, they stink like hot garbage. Not a system I want to see for another season.


+1 with TIME. I hope this 51 point outburst doesn't ensure another year of this guy's garbage coaching.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby Vasashi17 on Wed Mar 26, 2014 4:48 pm

^^^I can't recall a TIME when I disagreed with this guy.

The irony is that the team is watching an advanced screening of the movie Noah tonight and then they'll go right back to the power of 3 tomorrow night.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby sister golden hair on Wed Mar 26, 2014 5:32 pm

51 point quarters are fool's gold. MDA's system can fool some folks into thinking it's viable long-term because every once in a while the team will get hot from range and hot 60%, many of the shots falling from distance. (I've notes this several times in my criticism of MDA's "system" -- it's not sustainable, and you can't rely on outlier games like last nite's -- which will happen every now and then -- as any kind of evaluative benchmark.)

No team EVER has sustained that kind of shooting being strictly a perimeter oriented team. Games like last nite's are therefore a mirage -- that kind of shooting (against that bad of a defensive opponent as the Knicks) are the exception, not the rule. You can't play the Knicks every night, and even if you could, some nite's their shots will fall, and your's won't -- then what will you do? You need a foundation for consistency. You need a balanced attack: inside game to place pressure on the defense, draw fouls against their bigs, wear them down. You need outside shooting to help open up the floor for the bigs and for slashers. You need consistent rebounding on both ends. You need opportunistic breaks for easy shots. You need to force at lest some turnovers. You need to defend both the half court and in transition, and so on and so forth. Being a one-trick pony team with only one way to play is just a suicidal strategy (when the conditions you are facing are not optimal -- such as when the team is having an off-nite) and limits your tactical options. That's what I've seen with this team: it's either hit your long ball of lose by 15. And all MDA says ain the post-game is: well, we didn't bring enough effort or we simply couldn't hit shots. A good coach gives your team a chance to win when the shots aren't falling. In fact, that should be one of the pre-requisites before you make a coaching hire: how good is this guy when things are going south? As Mike Tyson said, "everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face."

Just go back a few games to where even if this team shoots moderately well from distance they still get crushed because they can't defend consistently and the shooting is decent, not quite up to snuff -- not 60% from the field decent. And spare me the "but injuries have killed this team." Really? Doesn't seem to mess with their ability to take early threes. If you can shoot 20+ three-point shots a game, I assume you can move your feet enough to offer the other team more than token resistance.

The issue isn't whether the team moves the ball or not. I think everyone can agree that moving the ball is good. But it's simplistic ( or maybe a better word is "idiotic") to think that moving the ball fixes all the team's maladies.

That's just quackery (Or should I say snake-oil salesmanship?) of the first order.

Get this clown as far from the LA bench as possible. What a fraud.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby jlkr on Wed Mar 26, 2014 5:45 pm

I beg to differ about "never made the Finals". While that is factually true, it ignores what happened the year Robert Horry hip checked Steve Nash into the scorer's table. An excellent case could be made that if it hadn't been for that hip check and the subsequent suspensions that resulted, the Suns could have made it to the Finals that year. And likely would have won since they would have faced Lebron and the Nobodies (I mean No-Cavs). I call it one of Horry's most brilliant and dastardly plays ever. Likely preserved San Antonio's championship hopes right there.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby sister golden hair on Wed Mar 26, 2014 5:49 pm

jlkr wrote:I beg to differ about "never made the Finals". While that is factually true, it ignores what happened the year Robert Horry hip checked Steve Nash into the scorer's table. An excellent case could be made that if it hadn't been for that hip check and the subsequent suspensions that resulted, the Suns could have made it to the Finals that year. And likely would have won since they would have faced Lebron and the Nobodies (I mean No-Cavs). I call it one of Horry's most brilliant and dastardly plays ever. Likely preserved San Antonio's championship hopes right there.


I disagree. That series wasn't even the WCF. It was the round before, and that hipcheck happened in game 4, iirc. There was plenty of time to right the ship. But that Suns team lost it's composure. People have started to trumpet the "but-for an Horry hipcheck" the Suns would have won a ring. But the facts don't back that up. They still had a lot of basketball to play when that hipcheck happened. Who is to say Nash wouldn't turned an ankel in the next series, even if they get past SA?

The fact is MDA and the Suns were always bridesmaids, even when 'Seven seconds or less" was in it's prime and they never got it done, and for MDA it's been all down hill since then,.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby Vasashi17 on Wed Mar 26, 2014 6:01 pm

^^^Thank you!

I never understood the hipcheck argument. It was a Game 4 (the Suns just tied up the series) in the 2nd round....how is that anywhere close to the Finals?

The suspended players all came back for Game 6 and the Suns could have avenged the Game 5 loss, but didn't. And that's a wrap.

Like MDA's offense, the hipcheck theory is an absolute farce.
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Re: Mike D'Antoni Discussion: "I was an idiot..." (155)

Postby sister golden hair on Wed Mar 26, 2014 6:31 pm

Vasashi17 wrote:^^^Thank you!

I never understood the hipcheck argument. It was a Game 4 (the Suns just tied up the series) in the 2nd round....how is that anywhere close to the Finals?

The suspended players all came back for Game 6 and the Suns could have avenged the Game 5 loss, but didn't. And that's a wrap.

Like MDA's offense, the hipcheck theory is an absolute farce.


Yep. It was the western conference semi-finals. So the "but for a hip check" argument simply doesn't hold water.\

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