Mike must go and PJ must be brought in: TMZ video - pg3

Ariza3 wrote:we had our chance to bring him in and jim buss didnt. huge mistake but we gotta let dantoni play a full lineup before anything

yeah ... but frankly I was kinda pissed at Phil last year he was here ... we were playing like crap... So I was kinda worried it would be pretty much the same thing

Be assured that ownership and management have COMPLETELY burned that bridge. PJ will never coach this team again. Done. Kaput. Over.

RushDelivery wrote:

Murdock wrote:talent wise, how this team is built - I say Mike was the right choice

So run and gun fits this team

IMO Phil's offense would have fit this team far better than D'Antoni's rigid system, and he would have had the Lakers playing better defense. Just look up the defensive efficiency under Phil for the Lakers, I remember someone else posting that and his Lakers teams always played at least decent defense.

We don't have to play run and gun ... as Mike said it is about flow, cuts same as triangle just not that structured ... he plays european style of offense and we don't run and gun here ... we just move, set picks pass ... this team doesn't as it should

we were rigid with Phil either ... mainly when Kobe was isolating ... it's players fault not Mike's

Murdock wrote:We don't have to play run and gun ... as Mike said it is about flow, cuts same as triangle just not that structured ... he plays european style of offense and we don't run and gun here ... we just move, set picks pass ... this team doesn't as it should

we were rigid with Phil either ... mainly when Kobe was isolating ... it's players fault not Mike's

Kobe only isolated when the other plays broke down or his teammates were not hitting shots, which hasn't changed.

As for D'Antoni not preaching the run and gun mentality, I do remember a post a few days ago about him telling the Lakers to push tempo during a timeout when it was their defense that was sorely costing them the game. Sure, he may also teach certain plays and such, but his base mentality of pushing tempo remains the same as it always has. The stats also show that the Lakers have one of the faster tempos in the NBA this season, far faster than last season.

Anyway, this point is moot since D'Antoni is the coach and Phil will never coach the Lakers again.

I'm laughing everytime I read the coach is the main reason our team is garbage

wcsoldier81 wrote:I'm laughing everytime I read the coach is the main reason our team is garbage

Care to explain these insights of yours we all seem to be missing?

I'm thinking that DA should have a slight, but not serious "complication" with his surgery, need a bit more rest away from the team until Nash returns and allow Bickerstaff to steer the ship for a couple of weeks.

Alleyhoops wrote:I'm thinking that DA should have a slight, but not serious "complication" with his surgery, need a bit more rest away from the team until Nash returns and allow Bickerstaff to steer the ship for a couple of weeks.

I am so with you on that one Alleyhoops!

RushDelivery wrote:

wcsoldier81 wrote:I'm laughing everytime I read the coach is the main reason our team is garbage

Care to explain these insights of yours we all seem to be missing?

The roster is too old and too slow ... not a good fit at all for today's NBA ... sure MDA fast pace makes it worse but people thinking this team would be much better with Phil are just fooling themselves ...

Our inability to defend the perimeter ( I'm talking about chasing players through screens/doing a decent job at staying with the opposite player off the dribble , help and recover...) has been exposed in the Dallas series and NO change has been made to correct this issue since then

wcsoldier81 wrote:

RushDelivery wrote:

wcsoldier81 wrote:I'm laughing everytime I read the coach is the main reason our team is garbage

Care to explain these insights of yours we all seem to be missing?

The roster is too old and too slow ... not a good fit at all for today's NBA ... sure MDA fast pace makes it worse but people thinking this team would be much better with Phil are just fooling themselves ...

Our inability to defend the perimeter ( I'm talking about chasing players through screens/doing a decent job at staying with the opposite player off the dribble , help and recover...) has been exposed in the Dallas series and NO change has been made to correct this issue since then

I'm not sure I agree considering the Lakers did a decent job at defending OKC in last year's playoffs for a few games, and considering other older teams like Boston and San Antonio somehow find ways to put together effective defenses even when facing younger and quicker players.

The addition of Howard alone should have improved the defense had the Lakers built a system around his shot blocking ability as they did when they had Shaq. Instead, the Lakers seem confused and consistently out of place on defense, which is less about an inability to keep up and more about not even knowing where to go to begin with before the opponent runs a play at all.

Sure, it doesn't help that the Lakers lack a quick defender on the perimeter, but I don't see that as the primary reason why the Lakers are struggling so much this season. With the right system it could be overcome as shown during those games when the Lakers played solid defense last playoffs.

RushDelivery wrote:

wcsoldier81 wrote:

RushDelivery wrote:

wcsoldier81 wrote:I'm laughing everytime I read the coach is the main reason our team is garbage

Care to explain these insights of yours we all seem to be missing?

The roster is too old and too slow ... not a good fit at all for today's NBA ... sure MDA fast pace makes it worse but people thinking this team would be much better with Phil are just fooling themselves ...

Our inability to defend the perimeter ( I'm talking about chasing players through screens/doing a decent job at staying with the opposite player off the dribble , help and recover...) has been exposed in the Dallas series and NO change has been made to correct this issue since then

I'm not sure I agree considering the Lakers did a decent job at defending OKC in last year's playoffs for a few games, and considering other older teams like Boston and San Antonio somehow find ways to put together effective defenses even when facing younger and quicker players.

The addition of Howard alone should have improved the defense had the Lakers built a system around his shot blocking ability as they did when they had Shaq. Instead, the Lakers seem confused and consistently out of place on defense, which is less about an inability to keep up and more about not even knowing where to go to begin with before the opponent runs a play at all.

Sure, it doesn't help that the Lakers lack a quick defender on the perimeter, but I don't see that as the primary reason why the Lakers are struggling so much this season. With the right system it could be overcome as shown during those games when the Lakers played solid defense last playoffs.

Boston play in a Conference with considerable less offensive firepower ... SAS isn't a defensive juggernaut but still has young players on the perimeter ( Leonard, Green )...

As for the OKC series , we couldn't defend Westbrook to save our life ( and still can't) ... while the SAS or Heat of this world kept him in check efficiency wise ...

I agree that part of our defensive struggles are related to schemes but Phil couldn't do anything against Dallas ... that's why thinking Phil would save this team is ridiculous ...

I'm not sure how anyone could think this isn't our biggest pb... just watch the games and focus on MWP, Kobe and Duhon D

The best team right now has great-shooting, fast, athletic guys on the perimeter, and some quality bigs down low. Memphis is going to kick some major butt this year. LeBron always attacks from the perimeter, as does Wade. The Lakers need to find a way to defend those fast, powerful perimeters. Maybe West will be helpful, since he's a good perimeter defender, and can play better than Duhon and Morris. For the most part, unless we unload Pau for a couple of great defenders, we're stuck with what we have.

I still contend that the only way for a D'Antoni team to succeed is to hire a tough defensive coach, and lots of defense-first guys. Younger would be nice, but a committment to defense is more important.

man i only wish this would happen

buss fires dan tony and goes to phil, gets on his knees and begs and begs for him to return while admitting how wrong he was in the first place. all this while telling phil he'll be in full control of the team and allowed to make any sort of move he wants to

Like Phil would come now...having been disrespected the way he was. He is loving this.

So it looks like Buss has made 2 straight dumb coach hirings. I honestly scratched my head when D'Antoni was even considered and really questioned it when he was hired. His style of play did not fit our personnel. I just don't see how anyone with any basketball common sense can't see this. Nash can't make everyone younger on the break. He can make them better but not younger. We are a very old, very unathletic team and playing up tempo is the opposite of what this team should be doing.

jimmer needs to go

u cant just change the coach every time something doesn't go right

it's going to take at least 1 season for everything to mesh before the lakers win another ring

for boston to assemble a big 3 and win it in the same year is the exception, not the rule.

halekulani wrote:u cant just change the coach every time something doesn't go right

it's going to take at least 1 season for everything to mesh before the lakers win another ring

for boston to assemble a big 3 and win it in the same year is the exception, not the rule.

none of those teams have been through so much struggle, and we have more talent than both the heat and boston.



i dont know what the hell this is that we're dealing with.

gcclaker wrote:That ship sailed at midnight...

Funny, but sad at the same time.

RushDelivery wrote:

wcsoldier81 wrote:

RushDelivery wrote:

wcsoldier81 wrote:I'm laughing everytime I read the coach is the main reason our team is garbage

Care to explain these insights of yours we all seem to be missing?

The roster is too old and too slow ... not a good fit at all for today's NBA ... sure MDA fast pace makes it worse but people thinking this team would be much better with Phil are just fooling themselves ...

Our inability to defend the perimeter ( I'm talking about chasing players through screens/doing a decent job at staying with the opposite player off the dribble , help and recover...) has been exposed in the Dallas series and NO change has been made to correct this issue since then

I'm not sure I agree considering the Lakers did a decent job at defending OKC in last year's playoffs for a few games, and considering other older teams like Boston and San Antonio somehow find ways to put together effective defenses even when facing younger and quicker players.

The addition of Howard alone should have improved the defense had the Lakers built a system around his shot blocking ability as they did when they had Shaq. Instead, the Lakers seem confused and consistently out of place on defense, which is less about an inability to keep up and more about not even knowing where to go to begin with before the opponent runs a play at all.

Sure, it doesn't help that the Lakers lack a quick defender on the perimeter, but I don't see that as the primary reason why the Lakers are struggling so much this season. With the right system it could be overcome as shown during those games when the Lakers played solid defense last playoffs.

What is the right system? We gone through two damn coach with this team. Phil last year coaching us, we did poorly too. Maybe we need to stop finding scapegoats and accept, our players are not motivated to win anymore or isn't capable of winning.

Lets Go Lakers wrote:So it looks like Buss has made 2 straight dumb coach hirings. I honestly scratched my head when D'Antoni was even considered and really questioned it when he was hired. His style of play did not fit our personnel. I just don't see how anyone with any basketball common sense can't see this. Nash can't make everyone younger on the break. He can make them better but not younger. We are a very old, very unathletic team and playing up tempo is the opposite of what this team should be doing.

^^ Actually it was three bad hires. First was the Rudy T debacle in '05. The guy has now struck out.

The sad thing this time was they had a chance to right the ship - it was a golden opportunity to get it right. Instead they swapped a guy with no O for a guy with no D. And neither one fit for our personnel. It was boneheaded.

Phil will not come in mid-season when he was dissed like this. He deserved better treatment than that. If it happens, that means ALL 3 decision makers were wrong? Jim, James, Kupchak about taking the team into a showtime type team. I don't see that happening.

Phil is not coming this season, 'Antoni is not being fired this season. I've said it in 2 other threads, you cannot fire 'Antoni already, it's not fair to him, it's admitting a huge mistake on the front office's part, and the media and other teams would tear the Lakers apart for doing it. Nobody fires 2 coaches 20-some games in, 'Antoni will get, and deserves a full season at least. I hated the hire, still don't like it, but fair is fair, Lakers front office looks like they made a mistake and they have to live with it now. They can't go crawling back to Phil either, whether or not he had large demands before, if they go to him now after firing 'Antoni and exhausting all options he sure will have any demands he wants. So no, this is not happening now, if it were to happen it would be the offsesaon, but I doubt that too, the Buss' made it clear they are done with Phil for whatever stupid reason.

frankrj wrote:Phil will not come in mid-season when he was dissed like this. He deserved better treatment than that. If it happens, that means ALL 3 decision makers were wrong? Jim, James, Kupchak about taking the team into a showtime type team. I don't see that happening.

Agreed all the way. I wouldn't put Kupchak's name in the hat with these hirings though. We know good and well that he has been relegated to mouthpiece and clean up man. If Mitch were in charge of the decisions regarding coaching hires he already stated that he was interested in Adelman last year. He always had a good relationship with Phil, too, so he would either gone with him or I think he would have at least pondered some other options. Given Mitch's basketball knowledge I think I can safely say D' Antoni was probably not his idea. I have serious doubts that the architect of this team's personnel would truly believe that D' Antoni's system would be the best possible fit of all the available head coaches out there. That BS he was forced to spin about Showtime 2 you could tell that even he didn't really put any credence in. That was total damage control once again.

Lakerjones wrote:

frankrj wrote:Phil will not come in mid-season when he was dissed like this. He deserved better treatment than that. If it happens, that means ALL 3 decision makers were wrong? Jim, James, Kupchak about taking the team into a showtime type team. I don't see that happening.

Agreed all the way. I wouldn't put Kupchak's name in the hat with these hirings though. We know good and well that he has been relegated to mouthpiece and clean up man. If Mitch were in charge of the decisions regarding coaching hires he already stated that he was interested in Adelman last year. He always had a good relationship with Phil, too, so he would either gone with him or I think he would have at least pondered some other options. Given Mitch's basketball knowledge I think I can safely say D' Antoni was probably not his idea. I have serious doubts that the architect of this team's personnel would truly believe that D' Antoni's system would be the best possible fit of all the available head coaches out there. That BS he was forced to spin about Showtime 2 you could tell that even he didn't really put any credence in. That was total damage control once again.

Agreed. I seriously doubt a man of Kupchak's basketball knowledge would hire D'Antoni given our personnel. Maybe it was Jerry who suggested the hire because he wanted a "Showtime" type style again? He's in bad health and on his way out so you can understand if his judgment is a bit bad. But someone should've put a clamp down on this before it happened. Or does Jim truly run the show and Mitch is just a yes man for Jim?