Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby Kobe8Fan on Tue Aug 20, 2013 4:00 pm

Corner Three Time?

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Published by Mike Trudell on August 20, 2013 2:50 pm in Jodie Meeks, Nick Young and Off-Season.

We’ve exhausted the storyline of how little Mike D’Antoni actually had the chance to run his system due to a plethora of factors in 2012-13.

But with an entire offseason of planning, a full training camp and some added shooters, 2013-14 should be a different story.

Among the most important shots in D’Antoni’s system is the corner three pointer, as the corners provide the necessary width to open up space in the middle of the floor for screen/roll and other sets. As such, a guard and a forward are instructed to get to those spots at almost all times once the half court line is breached.

The five Lakers most likely to be standing in the corners next season are: Jodie Meeks, Nick Young, Jordan Farmar, Wesley Johnson and Steve Blake. Kobe Bryant and Steve Nash will be there from time to time, but they often have the ball in their hands, more likely to be setting up corner attempts.

Last season, Meeks didn’t shoot the ball as well from the corners as one might expect due to his pretty stroke and quick release. He shot 34.48 percent from the left corner and 41.86 percent from the right corner.

JODIE MEEKS: 2012-13

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Young, meanwhile, was no better, hitting 18.42 percent from the left side and 32.26 from the right.

NICK YOUNG: 2012-13 (in Philadelphia)

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New player development coach Larry Lewis told me that he’s already been watching tape of how players like Joe Johnson and Raja Bell used to get their shots in D’Antoni’s system, so that he can share it with Young, Meeks and Co. Bell drained 47.15 percent on the left and 44.9 percent on the right in 2005-06, while Johnson connected on 49.47 and 53.85 percent, respectively, in 2004-05:

JOE JOHNSON: 2005-06 (Phoenix)

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Wesley Johnson wasn’t great from the corners last season (32.14 percent left, 34.78 percent right), and while Blake was off from the left (32.43 percent), he was red hot from the right, draining 15 of 24 attempts (62.5 percent).

Farmar had a very small sample size in his last NBA season (2011-12), but was terrific from the corners, hitting 53.85 percent from the left and 45.45 percent from the right, rivaling Joe Johnson’s success rate (though JJ did take 175 more shots than Farmar’s 24).

For more D’Antoni comps, you can look at Steve Novak in 2011-12 (46.15 left, 50.0 right), but the perception has long been that shooters have some had their best numbers operating his system. That’s certainly the case for Johnson, who’s never replicated his corner numbers since that 2004-05 campaign, albeit in part because he’s done more ball-handling and less spotting up.

L.A.’s prospective corner shooters will have to show that they can splash the nets while Nash, Bryant and Pau Gasol create shots, but the opportunities will certainly be there.


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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby trodgers on Wed Aug 21, 2013 4:24 am

It's nice to see guys looking at tape AND numbers to try to improve the team. I guess I shouldn't be surprised, but how did we suck so bad at corner threes?
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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby lakerfan2 on Wed Aug 21, 2013 9:52 am

trodgers wrote:It's nice to see guys looking at tape AND numbers to try to improve the team. I guess I shouldn't be surprised, but how did we suck so bad at corner threes?


When you don't need to double Superwoman in the post, the defenders can close out a lot faster.
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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby therealdeal on Wed Aug 21, 2013 1:43 pm

trodgers wrote:It's nice to see guys looking at tape AND numbers to try to improve the team. I guess I shouldn't be surprised, but how did we suck so bad at corner threes?

Spacing was just horrendous... I think D'Antoni will fix a lot of those problems this season with guys who are willing to do those things.
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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby karacha on Wed Aug 21, 2013 1:57 pm

Corner 3 is a very important shot in basketball. We have players who should be able to hit them now, especially after spending some time in training camp. This is one of those things I believe MDA is going to do a good job with.

Farmar, Nash and Blake should be able to convert many of these (although Nash is also money from the top of the key). Young and Kobe are not exactly shooters, but they are both scorers who could work on this some more. Meeks did not have a good season last year, but he is known as a shooter and hopefully he'll be able to bounce back.

Speaking of shooting -- Pau, Hill and Kaman all have good mid-range jumpers, especially Kaman. And no, they should not shoot corner threes. I am simply saying we are deeper, younger, more athletic this season, and we do have some shooters who should be able to spread the floor effectively. MDA finally got some nice pieces for his offense, no doubt.

I just wonder if we're going to sign another PF, because Hill... he's a great guy and all, but he might get hurt again, and then we're left with the rookie starting at the 4.
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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby wcsoldier81 on Thu Aug 22, 2013 1:44 am

I've never seen a player who has a "shooter reputation" missed so many wide open threes as Meeks did during last season

I guess he's qualified as a shooter cause he had one season at 0.397 from downtown/can't do anything else offensively at an average level .
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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby wcsoldier81 on Thu Aug 22, 2013 1:52 am

lakerfan2 wrote:
trodgers wrote:It's nice to see guys looking at tape AND numbers to try to improve the team. I guess I shouldn't be surprised, but how did we suck so bad at corner threes?


When you don't need to double Superwoman in the post, the defenders can close out a lot faster.


Lol no ... we had plenty of open looks ... you just can't have MWP and Meeks shooting 10 threes a game and converting at a 35% clip .

This is where the spacing pb came from ( + teams not respecting, rightfully, Pau midrange game) ... not from Coward
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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby lakersin4 on Thu Aug 22, 2013 3:55 am

We have a chance to be really deadly from 3 this season, but it all depends on health & the new additions fitting in. If Nash can stay relatively healthy & Farmar can lead the bench & shoot 40% or better from 3 like he did with the Nets, that allows Blake to hopefully push Meeks out of the SG rotation or atleast limit his minutes. Our 3 point attack & defense both improve with Blake over Meeks.

In the frontcourt, having someone other than MWP take all those wide open 3's is going to be great.. The combo of Nick Young & Wes Johnson should be an improvement, hopefully a big one..

We had Jamison knocking down 3's from the 4 last season & to a lesser extent Earl Clark, so replacing or surpassing that will be on the shoulders of Kelly & Harris unless we sign another PF.. Not impossible but highly unlikely in their rookie seasons..

If we do decide to bring in another PF, I think LO can still hit 3's if that's what he needs to do & he's comfortable in the offense.. He's not near his athletic peak anymore but anyone who watched prime LO knows he would have been amazing in D'antoni's system.. We also have the unlikely possibility of Jamison returning if the Clips sign LO, which I wouldn't mind at all.. Jamison as a stretch 4 doesn't hurt us as much on defense with athletic young guys on the wings & hopefully at PG if Farmar can play his way into big minutes. I know Shawne Williams got a camp invite & there's always the chance D'antoni sees some Channing Frye in him.

Overall, I think if Farmar/Blake/Young/Johnson all see good minutes & hit their open 3's, we're in good shape.. Nash will get his 3's he always does it's just a matter of keeping him healthy, & Kobe is the wildcard.. Maybe he'll decide to be a 3 point specialist while he's limited until he's near 100%.. You really never know with Kobe.. He decided to take the PG duties from Steve Nash last season & made it work & translate to more wins for our team.. If he's too limited athletically to create his shot off the dribble he could very well set his mind to becoming a spot up shooter. I've learned not to doubt the guy.. If that's what he decides to do, our 3 point attack will be ever more deadly. But as it stands, we're a legit stretch 4 & health away from being 1 of the best 3 point shooting teams in the league, if not the best.
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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby Lakerjones on Thu Aug 22, 2013 11:03 am

wcsoldier81 wrote:I've never seen a player who has a "shooter reputation" missed so many wide open threes as Meeks did during last season

I guess he's qualified as a shooter cause he had one season at 0.397 from downtown/can't do anything else offensively at an average level .


I have and his name was Sasha AKA "The Machine." That guy was a practice shooter extraordinaire, but he sure didn't get it done come game time. Meeks is reminding me more and more of Sasha which I don't find a good thing. Same kind of chicken with his head cut off defense, same kind of either hot or cold shooting with not much in between.
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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby jlkr on Fri Aug 23, 2013 3:11 pm

It's fun to bag on MDA's offense, but he should have made it to the Finals the year that Horry hip checked Nash into the scorer's table. Probably would have beaten the Cavs too. He did lead a team with a slightly younger Nash and a bunch of nobodies to the WC Finals just a few years ago. So give him his due: if he has the shooters, he knows player and ball movement well enough that he can usually find them open shots.

Also ... notice the Spurs like those corner 3's too. So I'm thinking, give MDA some shooters with energy, the offense could work this year provided the core stays healthy.

Yes a lot depends on health, but this could be an interesting team. No I'm not pronouncing them championship contenders, the defense will have too many issues for that. But still fun to watch.
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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby Pig Miller on Sat Aug 24, 2013 10:24 am

unless you have a deadly shooter from the corner or have a very athletic team, i'm not a fan of the corner 3.

corner 3's mean long rebounds and one of your perimeter guys having to cover extra ground to get back on D.
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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby dj vitus on Sun Aug 25, 2013 9:35 pm

wcsoldier81 wrote:I've never seen a player who has a "shooter reputation" missed so many wide open threes as Meeks did during last season

I guess he's qualified as a shooter cause he had one season at 0.397 from downtown/can't do anything else offensively at an average level .

Watching Meeks is like watching a shortstop in baseball constantly bobbling easy ground balls.

He does have one of the best shooting strokes in the game, but hey, you can have a great looking swing but never hit the ball.

For one season I want to see him hit shots just as well as how it looks upon release.
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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby BadCoaching on Wed Aug 28, 2013 6:38 am

We can't rebound for crap.. let alone chase long rebuonds.. no athletic wing players. We'd be eaten alive by fast breaks, can't even keep up with young teams now.. let alone on a fast break.

OKC would feast on those misses. If this is really the plan of attack then.. it's going to be an awfully long hard fought season just to get to .500 ball. Would be very sad to see Kobe (and even Nash) play out their last few seasons struggling....

2014 is the obvious goal IMO. I know they claim to not be throwing the next season but I don't see it being productive at all either. Would need to pray for a mid-season trade.
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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby therealdeal on Wed Aug 28, 2013 9:20 am

^ You know we picked up Johnson, Young, Harris, and Farmar right? Those are four good-to-great athletes.

We're a more athletic team than last season by a wide, wide margin.
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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby BadCoaching on Thu Aug 29, 2013 6:31 am

Yes I know that, but I also know the coach is afraid to play anyone and will have a 7 man rotation too. Will any of them actually play?

Probably not.
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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby therealdeal on Thu Aug 29, 2013 9:37 am

When the Phoenix Suns were at their best under D'Antoni he ran with 9 deep sometimes 10.

Last season we were forced to play 6-7 guys at times due to injuries, but that's not normal either.

This season he'll likely run 8-9 deep on most nights.
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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby karacha on Fri Aug 30, 2013 4:34 pm

I also think he will play more guys -- if everyone is healthy, of course.

Nash
Blake
Farmar
Kobe (when he returns)
Johnson
Young
Pau
Hill
Kaman

Those guys will all get serious minutes, and that's 9 right there. In addition, he might give some limited minutes to Meeks and Kelly.

This is not a championship roster, but it is better and deeper then before. We added youth and athleticism, and MDA likes that.
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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby lakersin4 on Sun Sep 01, 2013 4:32 pm

karacha wrote:I also think he will play more guys -- if everyone is healthy, of course.

Nash
Blake
Farmar
Kobe (when he returns)
Johnson
Young
Pau
Hill
Kaman

Those guys will all get serious minutes, and that's 9 right there. In addition, he might give some limited minutes to Meeks and Kelly.

This is not a championship roster, but it is better and deeper then before. We added youth and athleticism, and MDA likes that.

I also believe these guys will all see regular minutes.. But D'antoni is going to find lineups with 1 of our rookies at the 4 unless they're flat out terrible.
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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby themasterphil on Mon Sep 02, 2013 12:52 pm

I must admit that after the Howard saga I was little bit disappointed but now after few months and all these additions i am really excited about next season. Maybe we are not team for Finals or WCF but it will be funny to watch this team next year no Q about that. This team with the few young additions i think can take 5th or 6th place on the west and give us some great moments during the season. Obviously we cant expect nothing more, but good fun and maybe a few surprises are guaranteed. Health and defense under MDA are in my opinion two major issues . I hope we are going to have some luck with the first one and also i hope Rambis can fix some of the problems in defense.I also hope farmar is going to have a good season, thats really important for this team bc he is leader for 2nd unit now. With him, Young and Johnson we are going to be fast like hell. In that situation farmar role is crucial.
On the other hand I expect maybe the best season for Gasol in his entire career bc he is 2nd option again, with lots of space under the basket, he is the only guy who can play in the paint so if he stays healthy i can see him with 20-22 points and 11 boards. Kobe is going to be fine. I can see him playing on opening night. Its Kobe what to say more. About nash, I just hope he is going to be healthy, nothing more. this team is good, I have lots of faith in them, especially if they build some team chemistry. i think 3 points shots are going to have big part in our game. I can see us at the top of the league in 3s also in FT I think we can be among first 3 teams in the league.
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Re: Open Corner 3 Looks Next Season In Mike D'Antoni's System

Postby CarFlagChris on Sat Oct 05, 2013 12:42 pm

Pig Miller wrote:unless you have a deadly shooter from the corner or have a very athletic team, i'm not a fan of the corner 3.

corner 3's mean long rebounds and one of your perimeter guys having to cover extra ground to get back on D.


Once again, that is Antoni trying to force his system. I don't think the Lakers have the personnel for that.
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