Pau Appreciation: UnBullievable, no S&T - Thx 4 the Memories

Would you re-sign Pau for ~7 million per?

Yes
53
38%
No
71
52%
Maybe (explain)
12
8%
 
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby Weezy on Fri Feb 21, 2014 11:16 pm

Pau kept us close early tonight, even showed some effort on D, not a bad game overall.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby Savory Griddles on Sat Feb 22, 2014 2:21 pm

sister golden hair wrote:
Savory Griddles wrote:
Chillbongo wrote:^ Can you post the salary numbers for our new team with Love, Stephenson, and Lowry? Off the top of my head I can't see that it works.


Kobe 23.5
Love 15.8
Stephenson 11
Lowry 7
Nash 3 (stretch)
Sacre 1
Marshall 1
Young 1.3

63.6

The cap is expected to be 62-63 million. Like I said, maybe Lowry. Lowry at 7 is low, but he might bite. We may have to ship out Sacre in the Pau deal. it's REAL close, but not impossible.


That line-up is depressing.


Depressing?

Lowry/Marshall
Stephenson/Young
Kobe/Young
Love/Kelly
Ring Chasing D Anchor/Sacre

That's a depressing lineup to you? That's a WCF contender as long as Kobe comes back at 85-90% of his former self.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby sister golden hair on Sat Feb 22, 2014 4:51 pm

Who is the center you have in mind, because without a force on defense in the middle, I don't even think that's a play-off team in the west. The big problem Love has had is on defense. You need an elite defender back there to help him out. You can't just assume the lakers will make one materialize out of thin air. How many of them are there, anyway?

In fact, that line-up features several below average defenders. And as this season has shown without even an average D this team isn't going anywhere.
Last edited by sister golden hair on Sat Feb 22, 2014 5:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby CarFlagChris on Sat Feb 22, 2014 5:00 pm

lukewaltonsdad wrote:The Pau issue will finally be resolved this summer; Ding reports and has maintained the Lakers are not going to re-sign him...they want to go in a different direction. Forget any S&T's; Pau will walk, IMO.


If MDA remains the coach, I expect all of the Laker bigs to walk.
And, if there is a plan, I suppose that is fine, except the current plan of jacking up 3s is not working.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby davriver290 on Sat Feb 22, 2014 9:52 pm

I can see Kobe talking Pau staying for cheap. They're butt buddies. Plus, if we were to get guys like K Love or Stephenson, I think that could make Pau potentially stay.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby sister golden hair on Sat Feb 22, 2014 10:34 pm

davriver290 wrote:I can see Kobe talking Pau staying for cheap. They're butt buddies. Plus, if we were to get guys like K Love or Stephenson, I think that could make Pau potentially stay.


Pau does a have a mind of his own. With Kobe earning 24 million per, how much less do you figure pau will settle for? One-half? One-0third? One-fourth of that 24 million? Pau has options. The Laker FO treatment of him in recent years , not to mention the treatment he got from MDA, leads me to think that wooing him will be no easy task.

pau seems like a nice guy, but why should be subsidize the re-build?
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby trodgers on Sun Feb 23, 2014 10:47 am

I don't see many of these lineups as depressing. I see them as obvious playoff teams.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby angrypuppy on Sun Feb 23, 2014 12:03 pm

That line-up is depressing for a couple of reasons. If the WC is weak next season, they might contend for an 8th spot with an ancient Kobe... but probably not as that is a poor defensive team with no defensive anchor at C. No future, as you've obviously traded Pau for Love plus our first round pick.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby trodgers on Sun Feb 23, 2014 12:34 pm

angrypuppy wrote:That line-up is depressing for a couple of reasons. If the WC is weak next season, they might contend for an 8th spot with an ancient Kobe... but probably not as that is a poor defensive team with no defensive anchor at C. No future, as you've obviously traded Pau for Love plus our first round pick.

Houston is the third seed at present. How isn't that team on par with Houston?
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby angrypuppy on Sun Feb 23, 2014 1:19 pm

trodgers wrote:
angrypuppy wrote:That line-up is depressing for a couple of reasons. If the WC is weak next season, they might contend for an 8th spot with an ancient Kobe... but probably not as that is a poor defensive team with no defensive anchor at C. No future, as you've obviously traded Pau for Love plus our first round pick.

Houston is the third seed at present. How isn't that team on par with Houston?



Houston is anchored by Dwight Howard, who atones for the defensive sins of James Harden. Who cleans up for the sins of Kobe and Love on defense? Sacre? Sacre is awful. Or are we referring to some defensive stud center who will sign for the minimum, just to play on a non-championship contending team? You either get Sacre or someone else who will give you little to no offense or defense. Lowry as a PG? It'll be Kobe as the de facto PG. Hypothetically Kobe might be convinced by a strong coach to work off the ball with a healthy Nash last season, but that's because healthy Nash commands respect, Lowry (like Ramon Sessions) does not. It is a total stretch to believe that a 36 year old Kobe Bryant will be working off the ball with someone like Lowry. Hence the chemistry in the line up is lacking and no, this team is much worse than Houston.

Last but not least, that line up has no future. You have Love with no stud center, an aging Kobe in decline, Stephenson who is a quality third option and... nothing else. No primary scorer, no draft pick next season and Love who is going to be re-signing (hopefully) for another max contract, and still no quality defensive center. Kobe comes off the books in two years, you'll have a marginal team with an above average PG, an above average SG, a PF who can shoot, rebound but not defend. No depth. If Kobe retires (not a given) I don't see that non-contending team as being all that attractive to that impact free agent they'll court with a slot far, far less than the max.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby Rooscooter on Sun Feb 23, 2014 2:02 pm

Oh dear god...... The anchor crap again..... That is such a bunch of media poof it's not funny. If a player gets beat and a team has to react to that it's advantage offense every time. Howard rotated all the time here and it was still a layup line on most nights. One game in particular Karl game planned for Howard's obvious and undisciplined rotations and McGee killed us on the back side. One player a defense does not make. It's a team working together......not an award for stats and one players "anchoring".... Or covering for others. Howard blocks a few shots and alters others...... That's seen by all watching..... The fact that most of those possessions end in a score or second chance isn't. Also what isn't seen is the many, many times he gets out of position anticipating and breaks the defense.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby revgen on Sun Feb 23, 2014 3:19 pm

A defense anchored by a big man only works when the team "helps the helper". Otherwise, what's the point exactly? And even when we "help the helper", we don't do a good job of securing the rebound. The Pacers are a great example of a team that does both. The only downside is that they can lose to teams with quick triggers from the 3pt line like the Phoenix Suns.

Dwight's DPOY's were the result of being coached by SVG, who emphasized proper help rotations. He made sure that D12's shotblocking actually worked for the team rather than just padding his statsheet.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby trodgers on Sun Feb 23, 2014 5:15 pm

Not really worth a response, especially after the other responses.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby TIME on Sun Feb 23, 2014 5:18 pm

trodgers wrote:Not really worth a response, especially after the other responses.


I considered responding to your non-response before I decided to not respond.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby TheOp on Sun Feb 23, 2014 5:34 pm

I woudlnt resign Pau for 1 million. Sorry but the dude is GARBAGE!

What happeened to Laker fans I thought we used to care about defense here.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby trodgers on Sun Feb 23, 2014 5:37 pm

TIME wrote:
trodgers wrote:Not really worth a response, especially after the other responses.


I considered responding to your non-response before I decided to not respond.

Pshaw. You call that a non-response?
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby puffyusaf#2 on Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:42 pm

Im not even sure what the big fight is in this thread right now :man3:
For what it's worth, the Lakers also clinched the Pacific Division, an achievement Bryant dismissed by saying "We don't hang divisions." No, only the big NBA championship banners are considered wall-worthy for the Lakers.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby karacha on Sun Feb 23, 2014 7:06 pm

Rooscooter wrote:Oh dear god...... The anchor crap again..... That is such a bunch of media poof it's not funny. If a player gets beat and a team has to react to that it's advantage offense every time. Howard rotated all the time here and it was still a layup line on most nights.


Absolutely. I have nothing to add to this.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby sister golden hair on Sun Feb 23, 2014 8:32 pm

Rooscooter wrote:Oh dear god...... The anchor crap again..... That is such a bunch of media poof it's not funny. If a player gets beat and a team has to react to that it's advantage offense every time. Howard rotated all the time here and it was still a layup line on most nights. One game in particular Karl game planned for Howard's obvious and undisciplined rotations and McGee killed us on the back side. One player a defense does not make. It's a team working together......not an award for stats and one players "anchoring".... Or covering for others. Howard blocks a few shots and alters others...... That's seen by all watching..... The fact that most of those possessions end in a score or second chance isn't. Also what isn't seen is the many, many times he gets out of position anticipating and breaks the defense.


What have you seen from the players in savory's post that indicates that any of those guys are good defenders? Kobe used to be elite, but has really slowed down on that end (or has put all his efforts into offense with the exception of a few showcase games each season). So let me get this straight: a team with mediocre defenders needs a good big man defender in the middle even less than a team with good defenders 1 through 5?

Anyone care to venture why Kyle Lowry never seems to stick with any one team -- but he's going to be a difference maker in LA? Watch Kevin Love on D -- he's like a turnstile and cannot swat. Kobe has seemingly lost all interest in defending, preferring to free-lance to cherry pick steals and swipe the ball away from bigs. A disciplined and willing defender these days he is not. Stephenson seems to have the clay to defend well, but i confess I've only seen him play a handful of times. People have already questioned Marshall's dedication to defense. And then there's this mysterious center who will come here for cheap and tie the whole thing together.

The lakers are awful on defense. That line-up proposed by Savory doesn't remedy that. Even if you bring in a guy like Thibs (who can coach a hell of a defensive scheme), I would wager that that team is below average on D.

But, okay.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby trodgers on Sun Feb 23, 2014 9:02 pm

SGH - really different points you've addressed.

#1: We need an anchor. I disagree. That was the gist of Roo's post - nothing has been suggested to gainsay it.

#2: Kyle Lowry will be a difference maker. He's played on 3 teams in 8 years. Artest played on 5 in his first 11 in the NBA. Battier played on three, but he changed teams an additional time, returning to a previous team. I'm not sure what we're supposed to take away from the Lowry name drop. Personally I don't think we need him - and I wouldn't pursue him. But why on earth would we need him to be a difference maker? It's not like every player on every championship team is a difference maker - not even all the starters. Mario Chalmers isn't a difference maker. Haslem wasn't either.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby davriver290 on Sun Feb 23, 2014 9:14 pm

sister golden hair wrote:
Rooscooter wrote:Oh dear god...... The anchor crap again..... That is such a bunch of media poof it's not funny. If a player gets beat and a team has to react to that it's advantage offense every time. Howard rotated all the time here and it was still a layup line on most nights. One game in particular Karl game planned for Howard's obvious and undisciplined rotations and McGee killed us on the back side. One player a defense does not make. It's a team working together......not an award for stats and one players "anchoring".... Or covering for others. Howard blocks a few shots and alters others...... That's seen by all watching..... The fact that most of those possessions end in a score or second chance isn't. Also what isn't seen is the many, many times he gets out of position anticipating and breaks the defense.


What have you seen from the players in savory's post that indicates that any of those guys are good defenders? Kobe used to be elite, but has really slowed down on that end (or has put all his efforts into offense with the exception of a few showcase games each season). So let me get this straight: a team with mediocre defenders needs a good big man defender in the middle even less than a team with good defenders 1 through 5?

Anyone care to venture why Kyle Lowry never seems to stick with any one team -- but he's going to be a difference maker in LA? Watch Kevin Love on D -- he's like a turnstile and cannot swat. Kobe has seemingly lost all interest in defending, preferring to free-lance to cherry pick steals and swipe the ball away from bigs. A disciplined and willing defender these days he is not. Stephenson seems to have the clay to defend well, but i confess I've only seen him play a handful of times. People have already questioned Marshall's dedication to defense. And then there's this mysterious center who will come here for cheap and tie the whole thing together.

The lakers are awful on defense. That line-up proposed by Savory doesn't remedy that. Even if you bring in a guy like Thibs (who can coach a hell of a defensive scheme), I would wager that that team is below average on D.

But, okay.


I disagree with you completely. You bring in Thibs, this team does turn into a much more efficient defensive team. Here is the thing, defense is a team concept. If a team isn't disciplined on defense, everything falls apart. The Lakers in its current state, either don't practice defense, or just don't care. Is it beneficial to have guys like Durant, Lebron, Westbrook? Sure, they are huge for their position and also have the ability to move just as fast as anyone in the league. BUT! In the grand scheme of things, organized, team defense conquers all. Look at the Spurs... Chicago... even the Heat. They have excellent team defense, not just individual. One great defender will not change anything. It starts from coaching, and then to the individual.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby Savory Griddles on Mon Feb 24, 2014 10:01 am

sister golden hair wrote:
Rooscooter wrote:Oh dear god...... The anchor crap again..... That is such a bunch of media poof it's not funny. If a player gets beat and a team has to react to that it's advantage offense every time. Howard rotated all the time here and it was still a layup line on most nights. One game in particular Karl game planned for Howard's obvious and undisciplined rotations and McGee killed us on the back side. One player a defense does not make. It's a team working together......not an award for stats and one players "anchoring".... Or covering for others. Howard blocks a few shots and alters others...... That's seen by all watching..... The fact that most of those possessions end in a score or second chance isn't. Also what isn't seen is the many, many times he gets out of position anticipating and breaks the defense.


What have you seen from the players in savory's post that indicates that any of those guys are good defenders? Kobe used to be elite, but has really slowed down on that end (or has put all his efforts into offense with the exception of a few showcase games each season). So let me get this straight: a team with mediocre defenders needs a good big man defender in the middle even less than a team with good defenders 1 through 5?

Anyone care to venture why Kyle Lowry never seems to stick with any one team -- but he's going to be a difference maker in LA? Watch Kevin Love on D -- he's like a turnstile and cannot swat. Kobe has seemingly lost all interest in defending, preferring to free-lance to cherry pick steals and swipe the ball away from bigs. A disciplined and willing defender these days he is not. Stephenson seems to have the clay to defend well, but i confess I've only seen him play a handful of times. People have already questioned Marshall's dedication to defense. And then there's this mysterious center who will come here for cheap and tie the whole thing together.

The lakers are awful on defense. That line-up proposed by Savory doesn't remedy that. Even if you bring in a guy like Thibs (who can coach a hell of a defensive scheme), I would wager that that team is below average on D.

But, okay.


Stephenson and Lowry are both above average defenders. Say you get Okafor (assuming he comes back healthy) with the vet's minimum to fill that center spot. Then ancient Kobe and Love are your only two weak defenders. And as horrible as Love is one-on-one, he grabs a s---ton of boards (a very important part of playing defense).

D'Antoni is the biggest problem on D. If you hired a Van Gundy (either one) I am positive they could coach a team with Stephenson, Lowry and Okafor to be solid defensively.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby LakersN4 on Mon Feb 24, 2014 12:51 pm

Anyone hoping for a new coach to come in & turn things around defensively better hope we get that #1 pick & take Embiid.. Unless the future of the franchise is a big that they feel D'antoni won't utilize properly I can't see them making a change.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby therealdeal on Mon Feb 24, 2014 1:49 pm

The Lakers will take the most talented player available at the position they have. So if they get number 1 then they'll probably look really hard at Embiid. If they pick number 4 they'll probably look really hard at Exum.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Pau-dini escapes another trade deadline!

Postby Doc Brown on Tue Feb 25, 2014 8:05 pm

Mark Medina ‏@MarkG_Medina 1m
Gasol also mentioned how there seems to be no discipline on the team
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Mark Medina ‏@MarkG_Medina 1m
Pau Gasol critical of MIke D'Antoni going w/ a small lineup after Wesley Johnson left the game because of foul trouble.
Expand


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