Pau Appreciation: UnBullievable, no S&T - Thx 4 the Memories

Would you re-sign Pau for ~7 million per?

Yes
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38%
No
71
52%
Maybe (explain)
12
8%
 
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby The Rock on Mon Apr 29, 2013 1:25 am

He hasnt been the same since this play lol

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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby escobar8 on Mon Apr 29, 2013 2:39 am

i admit he frustrated me for long time...and i want him gone for long time...but i would still miss him if he is gone...
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby lakersyunowin on Mon Apr 29, 2013 4:08 am

a person of great character.

a championship level basketball player no more. unless he's like the 6th+ man.

you got old and had some sort of mental block, but thanks for the memories pau.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby Chillbongo on Mon Apr 29, 2013 11:05 am

^The new CBA really f***** us. I mean we gave Pau that deal what, 4 years ago? There was no notion the new CBA would be THIS restrictive.

Teams that signed players to long term deals over like $70M should have been given an option for contract restructuring. This is ridiculous...I'm almost certain if we could bring him back for $8-10M as a 6th man he'd stay on the Lakers.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby therealdeal on Mon Apr 29, 2013 11:12 am

^ I don't think he would Chill. From everything he's said, I think he still thinks of himself as a premier player in the world. I'm not sure either side is wrong, but I think both sides know his time here is just about over.

I think Pau has all the talent still to be a premier world player, but not really any of the fire. At least not here in LA.

I'd love him back in a few years when he recognizes that he's no longer the player that he once was. Come be depth for Dwight Howard. It'd be great. But for now, it's time to part ways.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby Chillbongo on Tue Apr 30, 2013 10:30 am

I guess he doesn't watch his defense, because that's what's hurting his status as a starter. Offensively he's more than a plus.

He must really have bad knees. It's upsetting this is the first summer he'll have off. If he got a knee procedure or whatever and it made a difference, I'd like to think his D would improve. In THAT case he would be a premier world player, and more worthy of his contract.

If he does get better, will we know in time?
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby The Rock on Tue Apr 30, 2013 12:41 pm

Now that his time with the Lakers is probably over, Pau should pursue a career in being a Pop Star

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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby dwighthowardsdad on Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:06 pm

Pau Gasol appeared in 49 games (the fewest of his 12-year career), starting 42 towards averages of 13.7 points, 8.6 rebounds and 4.1 assists. Gasol battled injuries the entire year, missing eight games because of tendinitis in both knees, five games due to a concussion and 20 more after suffering a torn plantar fascia at Brooklyn on Feb. 5.

In four postseason games, Gasol averaged 14.0 points, 11.5 boards and 6.3 assists. He recorded his triple-double of the season in Game 3, the other two coming in the final week of the regular season.

Below is a summary of his exit interview:

- On if he’ll be back to the Lakers: “I understand he position I find myself in. It can be a little draining. It’s not ideal. But I also accept it. I accept where I am. I accept the circumstances the team is in. I’m not upset about it. It’s just the way it is. The future is uncertain. There’s a possibility I could be gone. There’s a possibility I could stay. But I’m prepared either way. I understand the challenges the franchise is facing and the decision they have to make in order to keep the team in the direction they want looking at the present and the future. It’s a lot going on. I wish things were simpler, but they’re not. I appreciate Mitch (Kupchak’s) honesty and everything that he’s done and the franchise has done to keep me here, and have me on the team. There’s been two difficult years for different reasons, but we fought through it.”

- On the standing ovation he received when he was subbed out of Game 4, and what it meant to him, with Kobe coming over to console him: “At first I was upset because of the score, and I recognized it was our last game of the season … and then the emotional part kicked in. I saw and perceived the recognition from our fans, which is something I highly appreciate and am thankful for.”

- On his relationship with Kobe: “It’s grown and gotten stronger. We’ve gotten closer as friends and teammates. I’m happy and proud that we’ve grown so much as friends, and it’s been great. We communicate with each other a lot more now than we ever have. We’re on the same page, and I have great respect for who he is, what he brings to the table, what he brings to the franchise and to a lot of people.”

- On his role changing as the year went on: “We finished the year a lot happier of how I was placed on the court, and how I was used. My productivity shows that. (Mike D’Antoni and I) agreed that we all took our time to know each other and figure each other out, and figure out how to utilize the personnel to play the (best way). Nothing to regret from that part, but as any player would, I’d like to be used the right way so I can maximize what I bring to the table.”

- On his health, after what was the most challenging season of his career from that standpoint: “My knees have been an issue this year from beginning to end, and then I had to deal with my (torn plantar fascia) to come back as soon as I could. The soreness increased as I was playing more on it (when I returned). I’m going to go through several medical tests in the next several days to see the status in my knees and the arch, and then decide what kind of procedure if any or treatment I need to go through to get healthy. Hopefully next season I’ll come back at full strength.”

- We learned that Gasol has been working on a book – some photographic, some written – to express himself from a personal standpoint.

- Gasol thinks his unselfish nature as a passer and playmaker means that the team is best off when going through him, which he’s proven to be true in the past. Yet the Lakers have been in such a unique situation, with Dwight Howard and Andrew Bynum – two of the only other bigs in the league that would take some time from him on the block – on the roster. This season, Gasol’s injuries limited his effectiveness at times on the defensive end in particular, as he wasn’t always able to protect the rim like he has when healthy.

- He described how things were difficult, but got better, with what the team wanted to do: “In the beginning, we struggled more because everybody wanted to assert themselves and establish themselves. Things didn’t work out that well from the beginning. The coaching change had a big role into it, but we progressed as the season went on and put our individual desires aside and found what worked. We finished the season playing the right way as far as a balance.” Gasol said Kobe was willing to facilitate and distribute, and get players involved. He also stated he was able to be utilized at the post more on offense and create for others.

- Gasol was asked how he’s maintained a positive state of mind through what have been two whirlwind seasons full of trade rumors, health issues and more losing than expected: “I have a positive mind. I try to put myself in the position of others and understand where they come from. If I saw something malicious or saw something of bad intention, then I might say something. But I understand everybody’s position here. There’s a lot of pressure, a lot of expectations, a lot of coverage and a lot of fans please. I’ve been extremely lucky to play for this franchise for so long.”

- Here’s what Tim Duncan had to say about Gasol after the Round 1 series: “I don’t see how he’s changed much at all. He’s in a different system, and he’s asked to do different things. He’s as skilled as there are of big men out there. He can do just about everything, and he’s unselfish. I see him playing the way he’s been asked to play. I think if he’s asked to be more of a scorer, or be something else, he can do that as well. I don’t see why he doesn’t have many years left in him.”


http://blog.lakers.com/lakers/2013/04/3 ... terview-2/
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby SpencerHarrison on Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:13 pm

One thing I saw a LOT in the SA series and the end of the season was this scenario:

Pau gets fed in the post, and actually makes plays or scores. Multiple times in a row. LA goes on a mini run. Then at the next whistle, he gets subbed out for Jamison. LA struggles offensively and opposition goes on a mini run.

I remember seeing a cut to him walking to the bench and thinking 'REALLY? HE'S THAT TIRED?! Let him play when he's got a hot hand!"

It's obviously because it was necessary and Pau was tired, but damn. It seems like he got taken out right in the midst of a momentum swing so many times. If Pau could stay in a game and be the primary post player offensively, he could score 20+ a game and dish 5-8 assists nightly.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby bnr034 on Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:16 pm

SpencerHarrison wrote:One thing I saw a LOT in the SA series and the end of the season was this scenario:

Pau gets fed in the post, and actually makes plays or scores. Multiple times in a row. LA goes on a mini run. Then at the next whistle, he gets subbed out for Jamison. LA struggles offensively and opposition goes on a mini run.

I remember seeing a cut to him walking to the bench and thinking 'REALLY? HE'S THAT TIRED?! Let him play when he's got a hot hand!"

It's obviously because it was necessary and Pau was tired, but damn. It seems like he got taken out right in the midst of a momentum swing so many times. If Pau could stay in a game and be the primary post player offensively, he could score 20+ a game and dish 5-8 assists nightly.

MDA :mad1:
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby dj vitus on Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:26 pm

If Pau is gone, I'm not sure we can rely on two minimum PFs to replace him. That just spells disaster. We need like an $8M type of player or more.

If we want Hill at PF, he's gotta develop an outside shot a la Serge Ibaka. Right now, he's too inconsistent.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby lakersyunowin on Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:45 pm

kobe at the mic vouching for pau:

we need him[pau]. it's not my money, and i don't have to suffer those penalties, but we need him to get to where we want to go

made my position clear to mitch. it's not even a question, it's not even a discussion. it gives us the best chance to win titles
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby Doc Brown on Tue Apr 30, 2013 2:04 pm

And it gives you the best chance to play 48 minutes again next season.

You don't need Pau to win titles, did you need him in 08-10 hell yes, but now it's not like we can ONLY win titles with Pau on the team.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby SK8 on Tue Apr 30, 2013 2:31 pm

I am not surprised by Kobe's comments on Pau, we all know he would say something like that, but Pau know what's up and how is situation right now, he basically said goodbye in his exit interview, so no matter what Kobe want, i think Pau is gone.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby Chillbongo on Tue Apr 30, 2013 2:41 pm

Doc Brown wrote:And it gives you the best chance to play 48 minutes again next season.

What is the commonality between Kobe's minutes and Pau on the Laker roster?
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby Doc Brown on Tue Apr 30, 2013 2:52 pm

Chillbongo wrote:
Doc Brown wrote:And it gives you the best chance to play 48 minutes again next season.

What is the commonality between Kobe's minutes and Pau on the Laker roster?


When you have a 19 million dollar 3rd/4th option......you don't have guys 7,8,9.

We went through this season with no backup SF, an inconsistent backup SG with no replacement and two injury riddled point guards that Kobe had to cover for.

That equals 48 minutes of work based on no depth because we have a frontloaded starting unit.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby Chillbongo on Tue Apr 30, 2013 2:57 pm

Got ya. That's what I was thinking. He's definitely a $19M 3rd option that doesn't defend as well as we hoped.

In another thread I suggested a purely speculative option. Trade Nash and filler for a starting PG or SF (non-all star level) and a $2-3M bench player. Use mini MLE for another bench piece. Retain Clark/Jamison. Amnesty MWP or ask him to re-sign on the cheap. That could save us about $7-8M and still obtain some new pieces. We'd not be substantially better, but with a PG who could play defense, a couple of bench pieces that produce, and better health I think we could win 50+ without losing Pau's expiring.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby Vasashi17 on Tue Apr 30, 2013 3:09 pm

Doc, I know you don't like to put all your eggs in one basket. But hypothetically speaking, if there was a chance to bring in Bron in one year and you only had to sacrifice dealing with Pau for one more season, wouldn't you entertain that possibility?

I certainly would.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby Doc Brown on Tue Apr 30, 2013 4:12 pm

In a vacuum, yes you would deal with it for one more year, but that's not the situation.....

1.) Kobe and Nash need to win now, they might not be here in two years.
2.) This team currently constructed can't win right now, which falls back to point 1
3.) Who's to say we can't trade Pau AND have enough room to get a Lebron?
4.) Are you willing to sacrifice Kobe having to play big minutes again with no depth for a chance to get Lebron in a year? This isn't a blame the coach question, that's reality. We have too many holes on this team to address what is wrong with this team with just a mini-MLE and vet min. contracts.

All things considered, I move Pau now and take my stance on the subject that I've always had. Acquire the role players now, while preserving cap space in the future for a max free agent.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby Vasashi17 on Tue Apr 30, 2013 5:23 pm

I hear ya...I don't want to waste a year of Kobe's career.

But Kobe himself, wants Pau and Dwight back with the philosophy of playing through the post (Which we didn't do for the majority of the year and as we saw how it cost us dearly. As we've been saying from day 1, MDA killed our title shots and LA would have to win in spite of him...which they did (even with injuries)...bring in a defensive coach that likes playing inside out and we get a different result....but I digress). Kobe is happy if we bring in his frontline and technically, coming off the injury he knows better than to want to play entire games going forward (which wouldn't have even beeen the case had we played to our strengths of inside-out from the jump with a different coach...oops, I'm doing it again).

So with your franchise player happy, you're still in play for Bron.

With Dwight making close to 20M (via the max) and Nash making about 10M, we are already committed to 30M once the summer of 2014 hits. We can literally only add on other max type player to bring us into the 50M threshold and have about 8M to give another free agent. Now would Kobe re-up to the sounds of 8M? I'm not sure he would...which means that if it were Bron, him and Kobe would have to work something out to make sure they both fit within the cap. Now with Kobe, Dwight, Bron and Nash we have to round out the roster with vet mins and the MLE.

You begin to see that bringing in role players and their contracts via Pau's 19M for next season, could seriously impact the way we can bring in a max player for 2014. Is it worth it to endanger? I personally, don't think it is.

With 19M going out, you can expect a significant amount of money to come in and that will take away from the cap we could have offered a max player next summer.

I believe the best route is to move Nash (for an expiring like Lowry) in order to clear the most cap possible for 2014. That way we'll have Lowry's Bird rights and can bring in a max player while still entertaining resigning Kobe and Lowry to accommodate and not breach the tax threshold of about 70M.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby Weezy on Tue Apr 30, 2013 5:28 pm

Kobe's suggestion of keeping core guys while adding speedy and athletic role players so that you have continuity and guys that now know how to play together instead of starting fresh again sounds good, but how do you GET these players without trading some of the core?
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby Doc Brown on Tue Apr 30, 2013 5:32 pm

Weezy wrote:Kobe's suggestion of keeping core guys while adding speedy and athletic role players so that you have continuity and guys that now know how to play together instead of starting fresh again sounds good, but how do you GET these players without trading some of the core?


Mark Medina ‏@MarkG_Medina 1h
Main takeaway from Mitch: he's optimistic Dwight to return and it's unlikely core group will return
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By busting some of that core up.....

Vash I will get to your post here shortly.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby Weezy on Tue Apr 30, 2013 5:34 pm

Well that's what I'm saying Doc, in a perfect world we surround Kobe, Pau, Nash, and Dwight with a great supporting cast full of shooters and athletic, speedy players that play defense, but in reality you most likely can't do that.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby therealdeal on Tue Apr 30, 2013 5:50 pm

Kobe/Dwight/Nash with Dwight as the literal centerpiece is going to be just fine next season.

If we can flip Pau for two wing players that can play the 2/3 spot we're going to do it. If not for financial reasons then for personnel reasons. Sure Pau/Dwight worked nicely at the end of the season but that's because Pau was our number one option at the time basically. Is that really how we want to play? I don't think so.

He's got to go. I spoke to some of my friends that follow NBA basketball and they all seemed to think a Granger for Pau swap was totally reasonable. Given Granger's injuries this season and Pau's play to get into the playoffs. Heck they thought the percentage of getting Love wasn't 0% (more like .1%-.9% :man10:)

Over the next few days I'm going to start going over some scenarios where we could move Pau and get a guy like Granger.

Nash/Kobe/Granger/Clark/Howard is better than Nash/Kobe/Artest/Pau/Howard. It just is.
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Re: Pau Discussion: Paussibly the last time we see him in P&G

Postby Doc Brown on Tue Apr 30, 2013 9:06 pm

But Kobe himself, wants Pau and Dwight back with the philosophy of playing through the post (Which we didn't do for the majority of the year and as we saw how it cost us dearly. As we've been saying from day 1, MDA killed our title shots and LA would have to win in spite of him...which they did (even with injuries)...bring in a defensive coach that likes playing inside out and we get a different result....but I digress). Kobe is happy if we bring in his frontline and technically, coming off the injury he knows better than to want to play entire games going forward (which wouldn't have even beeen the case had we played to our strengths of inside-out from the jump with a different coach...oops, I'm doing it again).


- Kobe also wanted JO and Kidd here. His take on personnel is just like Jordan's take on personnel, it's not too great. And of course he's saying he wants Pau back, they are like brothers, he isn't going to put him on blast and say they need to go a different direction.

- I'm not talking about anything involving the coaching in this discussion.

- What have we got abused by in the playoffs the last couple of years? Pau's pick and roll defense. There's a nice video breakdown of what Pau doesn't do on defense. He's so easily exploited on defense it's like playing 4 on 5. He's a terrible defender, injuries or not, he can't do anything unless he's anchored in the paint and even then it's a layup line. Nash's defense is terrible, Kobe's defense is off/on, MWP's defense is average now, Pau's is awful. Keep this team as is and we are another year older, another year slower and then we have to play 82 games. He's a complete liability on one end of the court and a limited player on offense. For 19m, I'd rather amnesty him and take my chances with Jordan Hill and Earl Clark.

- Kobe playing 48 minutes isn't going to change with the frontline back. We have two injury prone PG's Kobe has to cover for. Nash needs screens just to get past half court. Kobe also has to cover for the lack of a backup at SG and the lack of a backup at SF and the lack of a starting competent SF. We can survive with D12/Clark/Hill as our bigs, we CANNOT survive with Nash/Blake/Kobe/ ?????. We need help in the backcourt desperately.


So with your franchise player happy, you're still in play for Bron.

With Dwight making close to 20M (via the max) and Nash making about 10M, we are already committed to 30M once the summer of 2014 hits. We can literally only add on other max type player to bring us into the 50M threshold and have about 8M to give another free agent. Now would Kobe re-up to the sounds of 8M? I'm not sure he would...which means that if it were Bron, him and Kobe would have to work something out to make sure they both fit within the cap. Now with Kobe, Dwight, Bron and Nash we have to round out the roster with vet mins and the MLE.


Teams with a s*** ton of cap room couldn't pull off Nash/Kobe/D12/Lebron. That's a pipe dream and something the new CBA was made to stop. If anything they will go with D12/Kobe/Lebron and use the stretch provision on Nash's contract. And that's pushing it, no one is going to being pulling moves like that. It will be two at max IMO. 2014 is a lot of hoping and wishing for a very select few players that need to opt out. I'm not holding my breath for that.

You begin to see that bringing in role players and their contracts via Pau's 19M for next season, could seriously impact the way we can bring in a max player for 2014. Is it worth it to endanger? I personally, don't think it is.

With 19M going out, you can expect a significant amount of money to come in and that will take away from the cap we could have offered a max player next summer.


Since hypotheticals are being thrown around...

D12 - 20m
Nash - 3m stretched over 3 seasons
Max player - 19m
Kobe - 10m (KG, Duncan got the same contracts, Kobe will get the same)
Two role players - 8 million combined (3rd player in Pau trade was expiring)

~60 million right where the cap is.

I believe the best route is to move Nash (for an expiring like Lowry) in order to clear the most cap possible for 2014. That way we'll have Lowry's Bird rights and can bring in a max player while still entertaining resigning Kobe and Lowry to accommodate and not breach the tax threshold of about 70M.


I want Nash traded regardless, so I am taking this deal either way.

If the FO wants to stand pat, they need to get creative.....

-Trading Duhon's buy out friendly contract to a team looking to open up space to resign their own players. I used the Brandon Rush example in a different thread.

- Trade Blake for a TPE/2nd rounder to clear money for the player incoming in the Duhon trade.

- Vet. min signings of Livingston/Glock/Stephen Jackson

- Use the mini-MLE on a SF like Dorell Wright or Budinger that can play the 2 or 3.

(Use any names you want for trades, I'm just spit ballin', but the general plan is the same)

Nash/Livingston/Glock
Kobe /Wright
Rush / Jackson
Pau / Clark
D12 / Hill

Can we win that way while keeping everyone? Yes we can because we upgraded the backup 1, backup 2, starting SF, backup SF and we have our deep frontcourt at the 4-5. I can live with that, but can the FO due that after continually overlooking these small moves?
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