Rebuild Rhetoric: Randle = Step #1, Step #2 = Lin, #3?

Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby Lakerjones on Sat Dec 28, 2013 4:56 pm

LTLakerFan wrote:Silly thread title. The crappy record is happening organically with all the injuries and even with the players trying. Why do people feel some formal plan to DO this is necessary. :bang:


^^ Very good point. We are going to struggle mightily just to stay close to .500 given how decimated we've been and continue to be with injuries. That's not going to get us into the playoffs in the West, so even though I don't have a crystal ball I can guess fairly certainly that we'll be in the lottery this year.

But no, I do not want us trying to lose on purpose. When I watch the Lakers as a fan I can't help but root for them to win.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby ThizGuy83 on Sat Dec 28, 2013 7:28 pm

i wouldnt say i want the lakers to tank... i want them to play hard and try to win some games... but i do see us losing alot... not because we want to lose but because we are just not a very good team... i mean u never... that draft lottery... be interesting the ball rolls in our favor and we get that number 1 pick
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby Manve77 on Sat Dec 28, 2013 9:06 pm

NO! :jam2:
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby therealdeal on Sat Dec 28, 2013 9:20 pm

Lakerjones wrote:
LTLakerFan wrote:Silly thread title. The crappy record is happening organically with all the injuries and even with the players trying. Why do people feel some formal plan to DO this is necessary. :bang:


^^ Very good point. We are going to struggle mightily just to stay close to .500 given how decimated we've been and continue to be with injuries. That's not going to get us into the playoffs in the West, so even though I don't have a crystal ball I can guess fairly certainly that we'll be in the lottery this year.

But no, I do not want us trying to lose on purpose. When I watch the Lakers as a fan I can't help but root for them to win.

This. We all knew this was coming this season. It was a crap shoot for us anyway. We filled the team with young talent designed to take the pressure off of Kobe, Pau, and Nash. When all three are either sidelined or ineffective of course this team is going to be a bad team.

I'm fine with the way this season is going. If we had those three and they were able to be effective, we'd be a playoff team. They're not. So now we're going to be a lottery team. That's fine too. Sometimes you have down seasons. All these ideas are so conflicting and I'm guilty of them too. I would love to make moves to make us great right now, but of course that'd mean a worse pick.

I'm alright with the team being what they are now. Let these kids audition for big pay checks. Make a move if we can, but other than that let's get us a nice pick and a solid player to help build around. Let's not spend our money until we have to. There'll be some really great players coming available over the next few years. Let's try to be in the market for them.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby CarFlagChris on Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:49 pm

KareemTheGreat33 wrote:yes, the Lakers don't tank otherwise, we will be the clippers


Agreed. Nevertheless, I would trade an 8th seed for a higher pick.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby KareemTheGreat33 on Sun Dec 29, 2013 12:14 am

CarFlagChris wrote:
KareemTheGreat33 wrote:yes, the Lakers don't tank otherwise, we will be the clippers


Agreed. Nevertheless, I would trade an 8th seed for a higher pick.


I wouldn't trade our glorious history for a higher pick. Unfair or not Kobe's legacy would be affected for missing another playoff.

We are the Lakers. We build our teams on trades and FA signings regardless of the CBA not on the drop of a pingpong ball.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby John3:16 on Sun Dec 29, 2013 12:17 am

You play to win. Hello!!
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby earvinfr on Sun Dec 29, 2013 3:09 am

Who's the last franchise player selected by the Lakers ? Don't answer "Kobe", because we traded for him ...
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby nduri on Sun Dec 29, 2013 4:42 am

earvinfr wrote:Who's the last franchise player selected by the Lakers ? Don't answer "Kobe", because we traded for him ...


I'd say it was Marc Gasol.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby dj vitus on Sun Dec 29, 2013 9:57 am

Always play with a winning mentality. If you practice failing, you'll cultivate a losing atmosphere.

That said, if management wants to make moves to rebuild and prepare for the future, who am I to say no?
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby unpossibl1 on Sun Dec 29, 2013 10:07 am

I think they should continue to play to win but should make moves to build for the future. Ideally I would like to see Gasol moved in order to lower the payroll below the tax threshold, which would then allow the Lakers to avoid the repeater tax in future seasons. A pick for Gasol would be great but I don't see that happening, so I'll take salary relief.

Jordan Hill and/Steve Blake should also be made available as Blake is a veteran point guard who could help some teams and Hill is probably the only player we have that could possibly bring a pick in return.

With moves like that the Lakers can continue to play hard and try to win but still rack up enough losses to get a decent draft pick. The absolute worst-case scenario is the Lakers somehow squeaking into the 8th seed. It's simply too good of a draft for that. Getting the 8th seed would guarantee they stay bad next season, when they don't have a draft pick.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby 432J on Sun Dec 29, 2013 10:25 am

earvinfr wrote:Who's the last franchise player selected by the Lakers ? Don't answer "Kobe", because we traded for him ...


marc gasol
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby LTLakerFan on Sun Dec 29, 2013 11:20 am

earvinfr wrote:Who's the last franchise player selected by the Lakers ? Don't answer "Kobe", because we traded for him ...


Kobe Bryant was the same as a draft pick, you're splitting hairs with that. Straight from high school, West wanted him and made the moves to get him on draft night.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby puffyusaf#2 on Sun Dec 29, 2013 11:47 am

LTLakerFan wrote:
earvinfr wrote:Who's the last franchise player selected by the Lakers ? Don't answer "Kobe", because we traded for him ...


Kobe Bryant was the same as a draft pick, you're splitting hairs with that. Straight from high school, West wanted him and made the moves to get him on draft night.


I was going to post something similar thing. Kobe was the Lakers pick. We made a trade for the pick essentially. He was the guy we wanted and the guy we got. It would be different had Kobe not been a draft day trade then there may be some argument.
For what it's worth, the Lakers also clinched the Pacific Division, an achievement Bryant dismissed by saying "We don't hang divisions." No, only the big NBA championship banners are considered wall-worthy for the Lakers.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby LakersN4 on Sun Dec 29, 2013 12:37 pm

nduri wrote:
earvinfr wrote:Who's the last franchise player selected by the Lakers ? Don't answer "Kobe", because we traded for him ...


I'd say it was Marc Gasol.

But our constant win now mentality forced us to get rid of Marc before we knew what we had.. I can't see it being any different with our pick this year. We don't have enough good young players or future 1st rounders to build around to go the build through the draft route. If we go out & sign Bledsoe or Monroe this argument starts to hold more weight.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby puffyusaf#2 on Sun Dec 29, 2013 1:44 pm

LakersN4 wrote:
nduri wrote:
earvinfr wrote:Who's the last franchise player selected by the Lakers ? Don't answer "Kobe", because we traded for him ...


I'd say it was Marc Gasol.

But our constant win now mentality forced us to get rid of Marc before we knew what we had.. I can't see it being any different with our pick this year. We don't have enough good young players or future 1st rounders to build around to go the build through the draft route. If we go out & sign Bledsoe or Monroe this argument starts to hold more weight.

I know this is had but getting rid of Marc got us Pau which got us TWO rings. Seems like our win now mentality has served us well over the last few decades. Just sayin.
For what it's worth, the Lakers also clinched the Pacific Division, an achievement Bryant dismissed by saying "We don't hang divisions." No, only the big NBA championship banners are considered wall-worthy for the Lakers.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby LakersN4 on Sun Dec 29, 2013 2:03 pm

puffyusaf#2 wrote:
LakersN4 wrote:
nduri wrote:
earvinfr wrote:Who's the last franchise player selected by the Lakers ? Don't answer "Kobe", because we traded for him ...


I'd say it was Marc Gasol.

But our constant win now mentality forced us to get rid of Marc before we knew what we had.. I can't see it being any different with our pick this year. We don't have enough good young players or future 1st rounders to build around to go the build through the draft route. If we go out & sign Bledsoe or Monroe this argument starts to hold more weight.

I know this is had but getting rid of Marc got us Pau which got us TWO rings. Seems like our win now mentality has served us well over the last few decades. Just sayin.

I agree.. I wasn't saying we should go away from that strategy.. I'm just saying that this franchise/fanbase/Kobe aren't patient enough to wait for draft picks to develop so anyone hoping for us to rebuild through the draft is barking up the wrong tree.. Unless we sign a couple young studs like I mentioned & Kobe hangs em up or isn't the same player anymore, there's close to 0 chance we take that approach.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby puffyusaf#2 on Sun Dec 29, 2013 4:48 pm

LakersN4 wrote:
puffyusaf#2 wrote:
LakersN4 wrote:
nduri wrote:
earvinfr wrote:Who's the last franchise player selected by the Lakers ? Don't answer "Kobe", because we traded for him ...


I'd say it was Marc Gasol.

But our constant win now mentality forced us to get rid of Marc before we knew what we had.. I can't see it being any different with our pick this year. We don't have enough good young players or future 1st rounders to build around to go the build through the draft route. If we go out & sign Bledsoe or Monroe this argument starts to hold more weight.

I know this is had but getting rid of Marc got us Pau which got us TWO rings. Seems like our win now mentality has served us well over the last few decades. Just sayin.

I agree.. I wasn't saying we should go away from that strategy.. I'm just saying that this franchise/fanbase/Kobe aren't patient enough to wait for draft picks to develop so anyone hoping for us to rebuild through the draft is barking up the wrong tree.. Unless we sign a couple young studs like I mentioned & Kobe hangs em up or isn't the same player anymore, there's close to 0 chance we take that approach.

ah ok. Now I am tracking what you are saying and I agree.
For what it's worth, the Lakers also clinched the Pacific Division, an achievement Bryant dismissed by saying "We don't hang divisions." No, only the big NBA championship banners are considered wall-worthy for the Lakers.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby trodgers on Sun Dec 29, 2013 5:18 pm

What's a "franchise" player? All-Star, arguably best at his position? Bynum.
Marc Gasol is a good answer - I don't think he's as good as healthy Bynum, but he's good and has been for years.

At any rate, Lakers don't tank.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby therealdeal on Sun Dec 29, 2013 7:33 pm

Ugh! This constant win now mentality! We traded a clear franchise center for two Championships and three Finals runs!

Dumb! So short sighted...
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby Center Court on Sun Dec 29, 2013 8:06 pm

I hate the whole term "tank". It's rarely applicable but often bestowed upon teams.

Unlike football where you can go from the worst team to a contender soley based on coaching/chemistry/health, success in the NBA relies on star talent. This draft is the opportunity to draft a franchise changer. A guy who can end up in the D Wade/Carmelo/Westbrook/Harden/George/Love level. I left Durant and Bron off because IMO those are (like Kobe) once in a generation players. Maybe someone in this draft can get there but who knows.

Point is that it's the ideal time to rebuild. We have our franchise player injured which makes it easier to stomach a lotto appearance in the deepest draft since 04, have a ton of cap space coming up, and need for change.

So while I wouldn't like to "tank", I not upset with all these losses piling up.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby LTLakerFan on Sun Dec 29, 2013 10:30 pm

trodgers wrote:What's a "franchise" player? All-Star, arguably best at his position? Bynum.
Marc Gasol is a good answer - I don't think he's as good as healthy Bynum, but he's good and has been for years.

At any rate, Lakers don't tank.


And not having to…..it's another injury season from hell and it's just happening.

Besides', how the hell does that conversation happen between F.O., coaches and the players? And someone doesn't yap about it?
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby earvinfr on Sun Dec 29, 2013 11:00 pm

puffyusaf#2 wrote:
LTLakerFan wrote:
earvinfr wrote:Who's the last franchise player selected by the Lakers ? Don't answer "Kobe", because we traded for him ...


Kobe Bryant was the same as a draft pick, you're splitting hairs with that. Straight from high school, West wanted him and made the moves to get him on draft night.


I was going to post something similar thing. Kobe was the Lakers pick. We made a trade for the pick essentially. He was the guy we wanted and the guy we got. It would be different had Kobe not been a draft day trade then there may be some argument.

Why I didn't include Kobe in that list, is because we didn't have to tank or have a bad season to get him. We just made the right move to get the player we wanted. But our problem this year is that we might not have any valuable pieces to make a trade on the draft day. So we'll have to do it earlier.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby LTLakerFan on Sun Dec 29, 2013 11:49 pm

I disagree. We make a deal again like we did with Charlotte for Kobe. Check it…… we trade Sacre to a team picking earlier to draft Parker or Wiggins for us. :man1: The Wand! :jam2: :bow:
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby noobiew on Mon Dec 30, 2013 12:08 am

We are not "tanking". Tanking is the term of deliberately trying to lose games on purpose, but we're just aren't that good, our role players were playing hard in the court with hearts but we were just beaten by the better teams out there.

Frankly speaking, with Kobe, Pau and Nash out long term and all the injuries strike the Lakers this season, we probably are the worst team in the NBA in term of talent, we will be one of the lottery team due to all the injuries which next year happen to be one of the best and deep draft ever in the NBA history since 2003, so the losses wouldn't bother me as we can rebuild and reload faster for the future. (Parker, Wiggins, Smart, Exum, Randle, Embiid, Gordon)

We are not "tanking" or losing on purpose we just don't have any star talent to compete and loss to the better teams.
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