Roster Improvements: addition by subtractions

Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby Center Court on Mon Apr 01, 2013 1:05 pm

therealdeal wrote:I actually am with khmrp on this one Chill.

If Minnesota wants Pau (I think they do), then we'll get lucky to get Kirilenko, Williams, Barea at this point. Hell I'd take that package in a second though. Bring in those guys (doesn't really affect our future plans too much) and then we still have the mini-MLE to spend, we can still use the amnesty, and we make Blake/Duhon expendable (nice expiring contracts).

Nash/Barea
Bryant/Meeks
Artest/Clark
Kirilenko/Jamison
Howard/Hill

More balance already.


before I'd say lets move Pau for that deal, I'd really want to see a) how Pau and Dwight play together from here on out b) if Pau's struggles are more health or more age c) who out coach is and what his system will be.

If we say F it and fire Mike favor of would know how to use 2 bigs (PJ and maybe Byron Scott) then we should keep Pau. However, I don't see us firing MDA, and so Pau should be be moved. Mike can't make Pau work consistently in his system and while maybe he can slow things down, he still needs spacing, 3 point shooters, and speed. None of which are Pau anymore.

I still think D Will can develop into a 16/8 guy and AK is good PF fit. Barea would able to probe and open opportunities for others. If that's all we could get, then I'd do it, but a part of me still hopes we make this thing work- if it's possible.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby Chillbongo on Mon Apr 01, 2013 1:06 pm

I'm not disputing that Minny could get better. And to hold our breaths expecting Love is foolish.

Personally if that's the best we can get I'd almost want to let Gasol expire. I understand the value of contract money coming back for pieces, but Kirlenko is STUPID paid....proportionally his contract is as bad as Pau's at $10M. Barea is paid until 2015 and Williams until 2016 I believe. I do like what Barea brings though.

I think that is what khmrp is referring to in terms of "ruining" the 2014 plan. I'd much rather let Gasol expire if and only if that's the best we can get.

Realistically I think we can move Nash and Pau for some legitimate help.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby khmrP on Mon Apr 01, 2013 1:10 pm

Battle Tested20 wrote:I love that Barea has always been so great in the pick and roll. With him and Jamison with that 2nd unit would be golden.


I know it failed already defensively with blake @ the 2 but I'd have Blake/Barera play together....Dall got away with it by playing small with Terry/Barera, this is small ball league anyways. At this point I'd trust Blake with his 3pt shooting then I do with Meeks.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby khmrP on Mon Apr 01, 2013 1:12 pm

Chillbongo wrote:I'm not disputing that Minny could get better. And to hold our breaths expecting Love is foolish.

Personally if that's the best we can get I'd almost want to let Gasol expire. I understand the value of contract money coming back for pieces, but Kirlenko is STUPID paid....proportionally his contract is as bad as Pau's at $10M. Barea is paid until 2015 and Williams until 2016 I believe. I do like what Barea brings though.

I think that is what khmrp is referring to in terms of "ruining" the 2014 plan. I'd much rather let Gasol expire if and only if that's the best we can get.

Realistically I think we can move Nash and Pau for some legitimate help.


fyi AK47 also expires and what do we get out of Pau expiring over having Barear/Williams on the team? Its not like they have cap killing contracts.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby Chillbongo on Mon Apr 01, 2013 1:12 pm

Ok, I take it back. We can't let Gasol expire. He has to be moved, but I know Mitch will shop before accepting that deal. Williams is unproven and Kirilenko makes too much, even for that one year.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby therealdeal on Mon Apr 01, 2013 1:15 pm

khmrP wrote:
Chillbongo wrote:I'm not disputing that Minny could get better. And to hold our breaths expecting Love is foolish.

Personally if that's the best we can get I'd almost want to let Gasol expire. I understand the value of contract money coming back for pieces, but Kirlenko is STUPID paid....proportionally his contract is as bad as Pau's at $10M. Barea is paid until 2015 and Williams until 2016 I believe. I do like what Barea brings though.

I think that is what khmrp is referring to in terms of "ruining" the 2014 plan. I'd much rather let Gasol expire if and only if that's the best we can get.

Realistically I think we can move Nash and Pau for some legitimate help.


fyi AK47 also expires and what do we get out of Pau expiring over having Barear/Williams on the team? Its not like they have cap killing contracts.

Gasol expiring doesn't help us though. It just means a guy expires and we ask ourselves "should we bring him back for cheap?"

Kirilenko gets paid a lot, but he expires next season. Barea gets paid in 2015, but only 4 million. And Williams on a rookie deal means if we don't want him, can't we not pick up his rookie option?
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby lakersin4 on Mon Apr 01, 2013 1:18 pm

I'd take AK + Barea alone.. Dwill2 is a good trade chip for the future though.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby Battle Tested20 on Mon Apr 01, 2013 1:19 pm

khmrP wrote:
Battle Tested20 wrote:I love that Barea has always been so great in the pick and roll. With him and Jamison with that 2nd unit would be golden.


I know it failed already defensively with blake @ the 2 but I'd have Blake/Barera play together....Dall got away with it by playing small with Terry/Barera, this is small ball league anyways. At this point I'd trust Blake with his 3pt shooting then I do with Meeks.

I'd be fine with that too. I really like the chemistry that Blake and Jamison have established so I don't necessarily want to forget about that either.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby therealdeal on Mon Apr 01, 2013 1:32 pm

Battle Tested20 wrote:
Sure and I'd more like to see a line-up like this with those players:

Nash/Barea/Blake
Bryant/Meeks/Blake
Kirilenko/Artest or Clark
Williams/Jamison
Howard/Hill

That's a real nice balanced team for sure even though I think Metta could be an amnesty victim.

I don't know if I'd start Williams. I think I'd still start Clark because of the continuity and the pure WORK.

Give me Williams, Barea, Meeks, Jamison, and Hill off the bench. That's a lot of youth and a lot of energy. Defense would be tough to come by, but that unit could score with ease.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby khmrP on Thu Apr 04, 2013 10:51 am

Duhon/maybe some incentive for G. Green

Green has fallen out of the rotation with Indy.....pretty obvious his #'s were misleading during his short stint with Nets. However with that said he is an athlete and shooting wise he is as streak as Meeks but at least he's a legit 6-6 guard, relatively cheap @ 3.5mill per for the next 2 seasons.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby therealdeal on Thu Apr 04, 2013 11:16 am

Pass. He's dumb as a sack of rocks. That's why the Lakers sat on him for years and never offered him a spot.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby khmrP on Thu Apr 04, 2013 11:27 am

therealdeal wrote:Pass. He's dumb as a sack of rocks. That's why the Lakers sat on him for years and never offered him a spot.


so is Jr Smith but hasn't stopped him from being a solid bench piece, it has prevented him from being an elite player though. what do you mean sat him for years? He played on the Defender for like a season or two and had what like 1 legit camp invite? Comments like yours were easily applicable to Ariza/Clark too before their emergence here, Ariza always thought he was better than he was and Clark, well people always questionned his IQ too.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby Rooscooter on Thu Apr 04, 2013 12:08 pm

khmrP wrote:
therealdeal wrote:Pass. He's dumb as a sack of rocks. That's why the Lakers sat on him for years and never offered him a spot.


so is Jr Smith but hasn't stopped him from being a solid bench piece, it has prevented him from being an elite player though. what do you mean sat him for years? He played on the Defender for like a season or two and had what like 1 legit camp invite? Comments like yours were easily applicable to Ariza/Clark too before their emergence here, Ariza always thought he was better than he was and Clark, well people always questionned his IQ too.


The only thing JR Smith is "solid" for is as a substrate for tattoos..... try counting on him in a real playoff situation and see how "solid" he is.... He, like most of those guys on that team fold like deck chairs when it the pressure is on....
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby khmrP on Thu Apr 04, 2013 12:15 pm

Rooscooter wrote:
khmrP wrote:
therealdeal wrote:Pass. He's dumb as a sack of rocks. That's why the Lakers sat on him for years and never offered him a spot.


so is Jr Smith but hasn't stopped him from being a solid bench piece, it has prevented him from being an elite player though. what do you mean sat him for years? He played on the Defender for like a season or two and had what like 1 legit camp invite? Comments like yours were easily applicable to Ariza/Clark too before their emergence here, Ariza always thought he was better than he was and Clark, well people always questionned his IQ too.


The only thing JR Smith is "solid" for is as a substrate for tattoos..... try counting on him in a real playoff situation and see how "solid" he is.... He, like most of those guys on that team fold like deck chairs when it the pressure is on....


we are talking bout bench players here right? Dude avg. 15/gm albeit on horrible % from the field but that was against Mia last year. Do you think any of our bench player could've even remotely sniff that type of contribution over the past few seasons? Even our 6th man of the year Odom failed us against Dall.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby therealdeal on Thu Apr 04, 2013 3:41 pm

khmrP wrote:
therealdeal wrote:Pass. He's dumb as a sack of rocks. That's why the Lakers sat on him for years and never offered him a spot.


so is Jr Smith but hasn't stopped him from being a solid bench piece, it has prevented him from being an elite player though. what do you mean sat him for years? He played on the Defender for like a season or two and had what like 1 legit camp invite? Comments like yours were easily applicable to Ariza/Clark too before their emergence here, Ariza always thought he was better than he was and Clark, well people always questionned his IQ too.

No. Comments like mine are absolutely justified. He was on our D-League roster for years and we never called him up. We passed on him repeatedly. We could have used his athleticism over the last couple of years, why didn't we give him a shot?

Because he sucks. They didn't want him in NJ and now they don't want him in Indiana. He got his shot. He got his flash in the pan. Now the world knows he's dumb, he's inconsistent, and he doesn't deserve an NBA roster spot just because he's athletic.

JR Smith is smarter than he is as a basketball player at this point in Smith's career.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby Ariza3 on Thu Apr 04, 2013 7:26 pm

watching D-Fish destroy the Spurs with 4 3's in a row in 5 mins of play really makes me miss him. idk why we didn't try playing him off the bench. he's doing great for OKC. defense isn't bad either. fighting through screens better than ANY of our current point guards and just drilling the open 3's our guys get. forced a jup ball by fighting through the screen instead of giving up and getting a hand on the ball.

dude is a champ and I wish we kept him off the bench instead of getting rid of him. I know we got hill who has been amazing but I just wish there was a way to get both
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby Ariza3 on Thu Apr 04, 2013 7:26 pm

d fish 4 3's in a row! in like 7 mins of play
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby lakersin4 on Thu Apr 04, 2013 7:52 pm

therealdeal wrote:Pass. He's dumb as a sack of rocks. That's why the Lakers sat on him for years and never offered him a spot.

I don't know.. I could see him getting around Kobe & having an Ariza/Clark type breakout. Kobe pushes those athletic young fowards.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby therealdeal on Thu Apr 04, 2013 8:14 pm

lakersin4 wrote:
therealdeal wrote:Pass. He's dumb as a sack of rocks. That's why the Lakers sat on him for years and never offered him a spot.

I don't know.. I could see him getting around Kobe & having an Ariza/Clark type breakout. Kobe pushes those athletic young fowards.

If I'm not mistaken, he's been a camp invite. If he was that kind of player, he'd be a Laker right now.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby Ariza3 on Thu Apr 04, 2013 8:45 pm

DFish 17 points 6/8 FG 5/7 3PT 14 mins
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby Battle Tested20 on Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:26 pm

Ariza3 wrote:DFish 17 points 6/8 FG 5/7 3PT 14 mins

before that though he was just god awful. Any player looks nice when he's hitting his shots and tonight was just one of those nights.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby XXIV on Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:47 pm

Battle Tested20 wrote:
Ariza3 wrote:DFish 17 points 6/8 FG 5/7 3PT 14 mins

before that though he was just god awful. Any player looks nice when he's hitting his shots and tonight was just one of those nights.


Yep. Shooting 31% FG, 29% from three this season.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby lakersin4 on Thu Apr 04, 2013 10:04 pm

therealdeal wrote:
lakersin4 wrote:
therealdeal wrote:Pass. He's dumb as a sack of rocks. That's why the Lakers sat on him for years and never offered him a spot.

I don't know.. I could see him getting around Kobe & having an Ariza/Clark type breakout. Kobe pushes those athletic young fowards.

If I'm not mistaken, he's been a camp invite. If he was that kind of player, he'd be a Laker right now.

Earl didn't look like that kind of player until he got significant minutes.. You can't tell everything in camp.. Some guys get amped up when the lights are on.. Green had a nice little run with the Nets & has been a solid rotation player in Indy.. At worst he'd give us a legit backup SF that we haven't had this season.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby therealdeal on Thu Apr 04, 2013 11:11 pm

He's been kicked OUT of the rotation in New Jersey and then in Indiana AFTER getting his shot at the rotation. At worst he'd give us an uber-athletic moron instead of a decently athletic backup SF. Oh except he comes at a higher price for more guaranteed years.

What are you people thinking?

I'd rather have CDR.
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Re: Roster Improvement: Free Agents Now and Later?

Postby Center Court on Fri Apr 05, 2013 12:10 am

Ariza3 wrote:watching D-Fish destroy the Spurs with 4 3's in a row in 5 mins of play really makes me miss him. idk why we didn't try playing him off the bench. he's doing great for OKC. defense isn't bad either. fighting through screens better than ANY of our current point guards and just drilling the open 3's our guys get. forced a jup ball by fighting through the screen instead of giving up and getting a hand on the ball.

dude is a champ and I wish we kept him off the bench instead of getting rid of him. I know we got hill who has been amazing but I just wish there was a way to get both


as great as we are at making the big moves.. we are horrid at rounding out our bench.

Birdman, K Mart, Nate Rob, Fisher, Barnes

These are all guys that easily could have been Lakers.

Letting Barnes go was a big loss, considering how well he is playing. Nate Rob would be a great back up PG/scorer off the bench, and K Mart and Birdman are big bench pieces. Once HIll went down, we should have gone after either of those 2.

I feel like our franchise just completely against taking the gamble on the end of the bench guy who needs a "comeback" so to speak.

That's one area we NEED to improve this off season- rounding out our bench with guys who when given mins can actually play meaningful mins.
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