Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby Fraud on Mon Oct 15, 2012 8:48 am

if we want opposing point guards to have career nights and score career highs, let's get fish again.

Dfish, truth be told. In real games, your locker room attitude i'snt worth a single point, a deuce, three, or a 4 point play.

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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby therealdeal on Mon Oct 15, 2012 8:50 am

Again I pose the question: who would you rather have and who would you trust more, Derek Fisher or Chris Duhon as your 3rd string PG?
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby therealdeal on Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:13 am

Goudelock plays worse defense than Derek Fisher and that's saying a lot. Not to mention he's an even worse passer than Fisher which is saying a little more.

That being said, I might be inclined to lean that way since he's cheaper, but if that's the way the Lakers want to go I'm going to pick Johnson-Odom over Goudelock.
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby kray28 on Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:47 am

I don't understand the part of the thread title that says, "Fish could return".

Actually no he can't. We cannot resign him until after the All-Star break at the earliest.
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby therealdeal on Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:49 am

^ Returning after the All-Star break = could return.
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby Helljumper on Mon Oct 15, 2012 12:14 pm

We could've had Sessions as a back-up PG.

Now we're debating between Blake, Duhon, Fisher, Morris, and Goudelock as our possible back-up PG. I think it would be impossible to pick a combination of 5 point guards in the league worse than that.
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby dwighthowardsdad on Mon Oct 15, 2012 12:22 pm

^So true. It sucks especially since Nash needs to be limited in minutes; can we find a productive PG to give us a decent 18-20 minutes of play every night, please?
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby therealdeal on Mon Oct 15, 2012 12:57 pm

Helljumper wrote:We could've had Sessions as a back-up PG.

Now we're debating between Blake, Duhon, Fisher, Morris, and Goudelock as our possible back-up PG. I think it would be impossible to pick a combination of 5 point guards in the league worse than that.

Well said.
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby OX1947 on Mon Oct 15, 2012 1:30 pm

Lakers need to get Blake's contract out. Duhon would be fine covering 10 min a game for Nash and then the other 8 min could go to glock and morris.

Fisher needs to retire and be a coach. He can not play anymore. Lakers have Steve Nash, he is all the "nice" leadership the Lakers need with Kobe's bad cop method.

Strictly from a money vs production stand point, I think Blake has exhausted his stay.

If by some miracle, if they were able to get rid of Blake and Duhon, then the likelihood of signing Barbosa for the vet min would be high. That's what I am hoping for.
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby therealdeal on Mon Oct 15, 2012 1:34 pm

^ Blake over Duhon every day of the week easily. You think financially Blake is bad? Duhon gets paid almost as much and he's half as effective. And considering how sub-par Blake is, that should scare you.
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby OX1947 on Mon Oct 15, 2012 1:48 pm

therealdeal wrote:^ Blake over Duhon every day of the week easily. You think financially Blake is bad? Duhon gets paid almost as much and he's half as effective. And considering how sub-par Blake is, that should scare you.


0 points is 0 points, no matter how much more talented Blake is then a Duhon. Benches need scorers off the bench, not facilitators.
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby LooN3y on Mon Oct 15, 2012 1:52 pm

ill be ok with fish as a third string PG or a special type of player (i.e. clutch situations)


anything besides that, no. and i love fish to death, but we need to upgrade our 2nd string PG
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby therealdeal on Mon Oct 15, 2012 2:15 pm

OX1947 wrote:
therealdeal wrote:^ Blake over Duhon every day of the week easily. You think financially Blake is bad? Duhon gets paid almost as much and he's half as effective. And considering how sub-par Blake is, that should scare you.


0 points is 0 points, no matter how much more talented Blake is then a Duhon. Benches need scorers off the bench, not facilitators.

Not from their PGs they don't. They need facilitators with their offense who give other people the ball with which to score. That's what a PG does.

And 0 points is 0 points, but 3 assists is better than 0. Duhon is worse than Blake at being a PG and at scoring the ball, so I don't see any argument for him starting except maybe as a defender, but that's not set either.
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby kenzo on Mon Oct 15, 2012 2:47 pm

LooN3y wrote:ill be ok with fish as a third string PG or a special type of player (i.e. clutch situations)


anything besides that, no. and i love fish to death, but we need to upgrade our 2nd string PG

Why play Fish in the clutch when we have Nash? :man3:
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby Doc Brown on Mon Oct 15, 2012 2:52 pm

I wonder if the Lakers did release Blake/Duhon/Morris if any team would pick them up and pay their salary?
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby lakersin4 on Mon Oct 15, 2012 3:17 pm

therealdeal wrote:^ Blake over Duhon every day of the week easily. You think financially Blake is bad? Duhon gets paid almost as much and he's half as effective. And considering how sub-par Blake is, that should scare you.

Both guys are overpaid & useless for us. I'd prefer dumping Blake now because Duhon will be easier to move with that small buyout next season. We're not likely to get a better backup PG for either one of them. So the best case is dumping both by next season & signing a capable backup. I'd rather have Dojo/Glock/Morris getting the minutes than pay those 2 bums to play slightly better with no upside. Or who knows, if Fish comes back we could lose them both & still improve.
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby The Rock on Mon Oct 15, 2012 3:36 pm

Heres how bad Blake's 2011 season was. I cant believe Mitch didnt amnesty him when he got a chance


http://espn.go.com/blog/los-angeles/lakers/post/_/id/31137/2011-12-report-card-steve-blake

In 53 games, He played 23 minutes a game, shot 33% from 3s. He scored 2 or less points SIXTEEN TIMES, had assists of 2 or fewer 21 times.

In 32 games After the All star game, he played 22 minutes 4.2 points, 32% from 3s.

He started 5 games, played 23 minutes a game with averages of 1.8 points 17.5% FG, 25% from 3s

In the month of march played 17 games, 22 mins/gm with averages of 2.8 points, 31% from FG, 24% 3s

From February 10 to April 26, he scored in double figures a grand total of 3 times.

How can someone who receives significant minutes while playing alongside Pau, Kobe, Drew who receive double teams, be this atrocious? Not giving assists, not shooting well, His defense is EVEN WORSE

http://www.bdasports.com/how-chris-duhon-will-benefit-the-lakers/


In 2012 the Lakers had a Core Four of Kobe Bryant, Metta World Peace, Pau Gasol, and Andrew Bynum. Here is how the Lakers’ point guards performed defensively with the Core Four:

Points Per Possession Allowed – Lakers Point Guards + Core Four

Derek Fisher – 0.98

Ramon Sessions – 1.05

Steve Blake – 1.10

The Lakers starting four performed much worse with Steve Blake than with Fisher or Sessions.

This is particularly bad news considering Derek Fisher was past his prime and Ramon Sessions is not considered as a defensive stopper.
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby OX1947 on Mon Oct 15, 2012 3:53 pm

therealdeal wrote:
OX1947 wrote:
therealdeal wrote:^ Blake over Duhon every day of the week easily. You think financially Blake is bad? Duhon gets paid almost as much and he's half as effective. And considering how sub-par Blake is, that should scare you.


0 points is 0 points, no matter how much more talented Blake is then a Duhon. Benches need scorers off the bench, not facilitators.

Not from their PGs they don't. They need facilitators with their offense who give other people the ball with which to score. That's what a PG does.

And 0 points is 0 points, but 3 assists is better than 0. Duhon is worse than Blake at being a PG and at scoring the ball, so I don't see any argument for him starting except maybe as a defender, but that's not set either.


You keep Duhon over Blake because it doesnt make a difference talent wise but contract wise you can kill Duhon's non-guarantee next year.
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby therealdeal on Mon Oct 15, 2012 3:58 pm

OX1947 wrote:
You keep Duhon over Blake because it doesnt make a difference talent wise but contract wise you can kill Duhon's non-guarantee next year.


Eh. Blake actually is better than Duhon in almost every way offensively. It's a bigger difference than you're giving him credit for. And while I understand where you're coming from, we can move Duhon now and Blake becomes a pretty valuable 4 million dollar contract next season. We got Sessions with Walton and a first and Walton was more useless and still had an extra year on there.
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby Center Court on Mon Oct 15, 2012 4:18 pm

OX1947 wrote:Lakers need to get Blake's contract out. Duhon would be fine covering 10 min a game for Nash and then the other 8 min could go to glock and morris.

Fisher needs to retire and be a coach. He can not play anymore. Lakers have Steve Nash, he is all the "nice" leadership the Lakers need with Kobe's bad cop method.

Strictly from a money vs production stand point, I think Blake has exhausted his stay.

If by some miracle, if they were able to get rid of Blake and Duhon, then the likelihood of signing Barbosa for the vet min would be high. That's what I am hoping for.



Nash can't play 38 mins...his number should be around 30- for the regular season.

Blake is obviously the best choice out of all these guys. Problem is that since he's been in LA, he has been far from reliable. If there was a way to move Blake/Duhon/Morris/gl0ck then I'm sure Mitch would. Who do you think is going to want to take such crap? nobody which means we are most likely stuck with Blake.
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby Pig Miller on Mon Oct 15, 2012 10:28 pm

therealdeal wrote:^ 1. Agreed.
2. Agreed.
3. Fisher provides the same thing that Duhon/Morris do combined along with a winning attitude, experience, and as a cheaper player. Who do you want more Fisher or Duhon/Morris?
4. Agreed.
5. Of course someone would take our garbage PGs. We unloaded Luke Walton, we can unload Blake and/or Duhon. Well you might say "we gave up a first with Luke!" and that's true, but we also asked for a decent player in return. If we're giving up crap for free or for someone the other team doesn't really want/need anyway, then why couldn't we use them in a trade? It seems they're just trying to free up room for more qualified players, or at least players that are more financially friendly. I'm talking CDR first and Fisher second. If we gave a team Blake or Duhon for a conditional draft pick, why wouldn't they do that? That's basically free depth that becomes valuable next season as expirings or a guy that's easily bought out.


3. i'd probably go with Duhon than Fish, but honestly, we both know there's no right answer there.
5. i recall how i felt when we unloaded walton (and probably many other laker fans felt the same). but that feeling of excitement that we actually moved him and fooled someone to take him was something. if it were that easy to move guys like walton, duhon, etc, we wouldn't get as excited as we do when we move a player like them. i also look at it from this perspective: if we are that anxious to move a guy who's been with the tam for 2 months, he's probably not too valuable of a player on most other rosters. funny enough, but 5 years ago, i would have loved to get duhon on this team.
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby therealdeal on Tue Oct 16, 2012 9:44 am

3. True. :man10: I'd go with Fisher for veteran leadership, clutch ability, and the same basic production on the court (which is almost nothing).

5. I wouldn't call it easy to unload a player like that, and I definitely see your point. But I do think it's possible. We don't have any more picks to throw around, but we've got some young talent like Ebanks or Clark or Duhon. I know these guys aren't exactly valuable, but neither was Walton.

I get your point about not expecting anything because if they were easy to accomplish it'd be done more. I definitely am not expecting anything to happen. Although the timing seems odd on some of these things.
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby revgen on Tue Oct 16, 2012 9:52 am

Helljumper wrote:We could've had Sessions as a back-up PG.

Now we're debating between Blake, Duhon, Fisher, Morris, and Goudelock as our possible back-up PG. I think it would be impossible to pick a combination of 5 point guards in the league worse than that.


At this point, and only if we can't find a way to get Dallas to give up West who they don't seem to like right now, we may have to think about possibly giving up Sacre to get a decent backup PG.
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby revgen on Tue Oct 16, 2012 11:14 am

A member at LG who claims to know the Portuguese language says that Leandro Barbosa told the interviewer in this article that he's talked to Kobe and Nash and is willing to sign with the Lakers for the minimum, but he's waiting for Duhon or Blake to be let go first.

http://www.lancenet.com.br/minuto/Leandrinho-aceita-salario-NBA-Lakers_0_772122909.html

I used Google Translate, but some of words are translated weirdly.

Is there anybody here that knows Portuguese and can confirm this? (Bystander, that means you. :man12:)
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Re: Stein: Blake/Duhon on the block, Fish could return

Postby Doc Brown on Tue Oct 16, 2012 11:56 am

Here it is...

Leandrinho says accepts earn minimum wage to play in the NBA Lakers
On holiday in Flamengo player trains and shows that also in talks with Nets and Suns. If you do not hit, you can return to Brazil

Leandrinho poses in front of his picture on Helium Mauritius Gymnasium in Gávea (Photo: Paulo Sergio)
On the wall of the Gymnasium Helium Mauritius, the headquarters of Flamengo in Rio de Janeiro, the photo of the wing-guard Leandro Barbosa wearing the shirt of the club has not yet been withdrawn. But that does not mean that the player, who has trained in Crimson-Black while on vacation in Brazil, is back on the team that defended last year during the NBA strike. He follows in negotiations with league franchises and agrees to receive the minimum wage to play in the almighty Los Angeles Lakers.

- The negotiation is still hot. The Nash (Steve, Canadian owner) even sent me a message telling me to go. I said I was just connect to my agents. During the London Olympics, it was even hotter and I got to talk with Kobe (Bryant). Now, for me to go, the Lakers need to dispose of a shipowner. To play there, or a good team, it's worth hitting the minimum wage - Leandrinho said.

Currently, the Lakers account in your squad with four players for the positions of guard and wing-guard. This hampers the recruitment of the Brazilian. Because of this, Arthur's brother Leandro, seeking other options. Phoenix Suns franchise advocated by wing-armardor between 2003 and 2010, and Brooklyn Nets (former New Jersey Nets) have an interest in the athlete.

Voted the best reserves in the season 2006/2007, Barbosa said he was not bothered by the delay in hitting with a new team. Last season, he defended Toronto Raptors and Indiana Pacers and is now seeking new option. Acknowledging that may be being "cooked" by franchises to receive as little as possible, the player admits that, if hit, will receive less than last season. And if you do not hit, his desire is to return to Brazil.

- I do not have a set day to hit. This can even happen with the season already underway (begins on November 1). These negotiations are consuming it. The guys think they'll ask for my money very historic and even gets a little afraid of coming up with a proposed low. As this is a business, do what they can to lower values. And do not think about money today, I think of being champion. Should not be in the NBA, I return to Brazil. It would be important to stay close to family - said Barbosa, who is married to actress Samara Felippo and has a daughter, Alicia, 3 years.

If hit with the Lakers, Leandro Barbosa will play a team full of stars. Besides Nash's friend, with whom he served in the Suns, he will have as companions Kobe Bryant, Dwight Howard and Pau Gasol.
Training at Flamengo While not decide his future in the NBA, Leandrinho maintains form in Flamengo team that defended between September and December last year during a strike in the league. At that time, the wing-guard participated in the campaign Crimson-Black winning the heptacampeonato State, played the first phase of the South American League and the first rounds of the NBB.

- I received a great affection in such a short time at the club. I will never forget and I hope to return one day. Flamengo is a very good house, fun to spend time and train. I know several players here - said the player, glad to see your photo with the shirt on the wall of 28 remains Gym Helium Mauritius.
Leandrinho not said whether there is interest Flamengo in his residence. According to the athlete, the club set up a group to be champion. But for now, his priority is to resolve your situation in the NBA. According to the director of basketball Crimson-Black, Arnaldo Szpiro, there is no possibility of contracting the wing-guard at the time.
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