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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby trodgers on Mon Dec 30, 2013 6:50 am

LTLakerFan wrote:
trodgers wrote:What's a "franchise" player? All-Star, arguably best at his position? Bynum.
Marc Gasol is a good answer - I don't think he's as good as healthy Bynum, but he's good and has been for years.

At any rate, Lakers don't tank.


And not having to…..it's another injury season from hell and it's just happening.

Besides', how the hell does that conversation happen between F.O., coaches and the players? And someone doesn't yap about it?

If it were going to happen, Mitch would just stare at everyone who tried hard. They'd soon stop.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby Rooscooter on Mon Dec 30, 2013 7:41 am

From the looks of the game last night a few of our guys have given up. Johnson was half-azzing it out there most of the night. Kelly gave us more than him on both ends.

The will of the team is beginning to turn IMO. It's hard to compete with the injuries but now the mental aspect of losing is starting to set in. Tanking may be a self fulfilling prophecy.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby snackdaddy on Mon Dec 30, 2013 7:52 am

It would be a good idea to get what they can for Pau. Give Sacre more minutes to see if he's the right material. Play guys like Kelly more. And when its all said and done, fire Dantoni. They can never win with him.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby lukewaltonsdad on Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:07 am

Rooscooter wrote:From the looks of the game last night a few of our guys have given up. Johnson was half-azzing it out there most of the night. Kelly gave us more than him on both ends.

The will of the team is beginning to turn IMO. It's hard to compete with the injuries but now the mental aspect of losing is starting to set in. Tanking may be a self fulfilling prophecy.


I agree with this...we're going to get a top 10 pick this year; the last one we had was with Bynum. We'll compete for now, but right now, we're just not a very good basketball team. We're going downhill and fast.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby dj vitus on Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:43 am

earvinfr wrote:
puffyusaf#2 wrote:
LTLakerFan wrote:
earvinfr wrote:Who's the last franchise player selected by the Lakers ? Don't answer "Kobe", because we traded for him ...


Kobe Bryant was the same as a draft pick, you're splitting hairs with that. Straight from high school, West wanted him and made the moves to get him on draft night.


I was going to post something similar thing. Kobe was the Lakers pick. We made a trade for the pick essentially. He was the guy we wanted and the guy we got. It would be different had Kobe not been a draft day trade then there may be some argument.


Why I didn't include Kobe in that list, is because we didn't have to tank or have a bad season to get him. We just made the right move to get the player we wanted. But our problem this year is that we might not have any valuable pieces to make a trade on the draft day. So we'll have to do it earlier.


Might be a stretch, but we could re-sign Jordan Hill and get a decent pick out of him. A number of teams will overpay for a guy like him. '96 all over again! :jam2:
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby Savory Griddles on Mon Dec 30, 2013 10:19 am

I think the word tanking has different meanings to different people. Some people view it as not trying. Others view it as putting out less than stellar players.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby therealdeal on Mon Dec 30, 2013 10:25 am

Savory Griddles wrote:I think the word tanking has different meanings to different people. Some people view it as not trying. Others view it as putting out less than stellar players.

In our case, I'm not sure we're doing either. At least not on purpose. We're losing guys left and right to injury and we didn't have much to work with to put together a roster in the first place. For what we had, I thought Mitch did an incredible job putting together a roster to work the system AND play with Nash, Gasol, and Bryant.

Now we're playing without those three and a few others to boot. We're accidentally tanking.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby laakers on Mon Dec 30, 2013 12:32 pm

Should we tank? No. This isn't a franchise that does that. But our roster is not good right now and a large part is due to injuries. With that being said, I have low expectations for this season and do not take much offense to losing a decent amount of games. The higher that the draft pick we get this year is gives us better chances to help Kobe end his career riding into the sunset after getting one more ring. But I don't think trying to tank to the bottom 5 teams is something we need to do at all, this draft is so deep.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby Pig Miller on Mon Dec 30, 2013 11:16 pm

don't take offense to this, but this tanking talk is pure idiocy.

tell me how you convince all these guys on the last year of their deal or who know they're vying for another job elsewhere to not play hard.

what moves would you make to make this team less competitive than they currently are? do you just want to run up the Defenders team and lose by 60 each night so we get a few more ping pong balls?

mda has actually done a decent job, but you want him to just completely stop caring so he won't be taken seriously as a coaching candidate for another franchise?

or should we as fans be happy watching the next 51 games with lackluster effort so we can hope to be a few games worse than the worst east team to have a shot at a top pick?

people complain about professional athletes not caring and not giving their all, but i see jordan hill out there working his tail off. i see farmar giving the team a boost, and nick young bringing some excitement, and apparently those aren't good things because there are 'fans' who just want us to lose.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby Snakell Beast on Tue Dec 31, 2013 1:07 am

It's not always in your best interest to fight a battle you cannot win. The players on the Lakers who are on one year deals can still play well, even on a bad team. Treat it like the d-league or summer league, except they are going up against the NBA, so they have a leg up. The team is flat out horrible at this point. Let's embrace it. Dump Kaman, Blake, Pau, Meeks, Nash, Nick Young, Wesley Johnson...and every coach/employee that isn't in the long term future of the organization...start totally from scratch. Let's get nuts! :jam2:
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby TheOp on Tue Dec 31, 2013 3:20 am

Could you imagine how good we could be if we got a top 10 player in this years draft?
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby Pig Miller on Tue Dec 31, 2013 9:24 am

Snakell Beast wrote:It's not always in your best interest to fight a battle you cannot win. The players on the Lakers who are on one year deals can still play well, even on a bad team. Treat it like the d-league or summer league, except they are going up against the NBA, so they have a leg up. The team is flat out horrible at this point. Let's embrace it. Dump Kaman, Blake, Pau, Meeks, Nash, Nick Young, Wesley Johnson...and every coach/employee that isn't in the long term future of the organization...start totally from scratch. Let's get nuts! :jam2:


you're not going 1st round picks for kaman, meeks, nash, blake or johnson.

but essentially you'd like to waive any player we have that is decent and start kendall marshall, some guy from the local ymca, and a few random guys we can sign from the chinese basketball league?

we're not good anyway, we'll likely be picking ~#10 in the draft, but you run a d-league lineup out there on purpose and you're gonna get some pissed off fans who just spent $500 for their family to watch a glorified ymca game.

this team is a 35-40 win team as it is, difficult to imagine any reasonable moves that make them worse, especially with all the injuries
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby Savory Griddles on Tue Dec 31, 2013 10:12 am

Pig Miller wrote:
Snakell Beast wrote:It's not always in your best interest to fight a battle you cannot win. The players on the Lakers who are on one year deals can still play well, even on a bad team. Treat it like the d-league or summer league, except they are going up against the NBA, so they have a leg up. The team is flat out horrible at this point. Let's embrace it. Dump Kaman, Blake, Pau, Meeks, Nash, Nick Young, Wesley Johnson...and every coach/employee that isn't in the long term future of the organization...start totally from scratch. Let's get nuts! :jam2:


you're not going 1st round picks for kaman, meeks, nash, blake or johnson.

but essentially you'd like to waive any player we have that is decent and start kendall marshall, some guy from the local ymca, and a few random guys we can sign from the chinese basketball league?

we're not good anyway, we'll likely be picking ~#10 in the draft, but you run a d-league lineup out there on purpose and you're gonna get some pissed off fans who just spent $500 for their family to watch a glorified ymca game.

this team is a 35-40 win team as it is, difficult to imagine any reasonable moves that make them worse, especially with all the injuries


I think the Kobe injury really took the wind out of their sails. It's almost as if they were playing above their heads knowing they needed to hold down the fort for Kobe and he'd come back and bring them home. Now that he's out again they've lost almost every game.

It'd be like Star Wars where rebels are fighting the Empire knowing Luke is on his way, then as soon as Luke gets there he gets his head lobbed off by a Sith Lord. The rebels would lose hope and crumble.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby therealdeal on Tue Dec 31, 2013 10:18 am

1. The rebel cause wasn't dependent on Luke, especially at first. Luke was just some kid from Tatooine that nobody ever heard of. Even in Empire Strikes Back, he's just a guy in a ship. A high ranking official maybe, but not really vital to the cause. Leia was far more important to the cause.

2. I agree that Kobe getting injured took the sails out of the team. For sure.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby Savory Griddles on Tue Dec 31, 2013 10:22 am

therealdeal wrote:1. The rebel cause wasn't dependent on Luke, especially at first. Luke was just some kid from Tatooine that nobody ever heard of. Even in Empire Strikes Back, he's just a guy in a ship. A high ranking official maybe, but not really vital to the cause. Leia was far more important to the cause.

2. I agree that Kobe getting injured took the sails out of the team. For sure.


Well, I'm talking in a theoretical time period AFTER Return of the Jedi when the Empire is still very powerful, and Luke is the most powerful Jedi in the galaxy (ie the Thrawn Trilogy). Perhaps I should have been more clear on the time frame that was in my head. :man10:
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby therealdeal on Tue Dec 31, 2013 11:40 am

Savory Griddles wrote:
therealdeal wrote:1. The rebel cause wasn't dependent on Luke, especially at first. Luke was just some kid from Tatooine that nobody ever heard of. Even in Empire Strikes Back, he's just a guy in a ship. A high ranking official maybe, but not really vital to the cause. Leia was far more important to the cause.

2. I agree that Kobe getting injured took the sails out of the team. For sure.


Well, I'm talking in a theoretical time period AFTER Return of the Jedi when the Empire is still very powerful, and Luke is the most powerful Jedi in the galaxy (ie the Thrawn Trilogy). Perhaps I should have been more clear on the time frame that was in my head. :man10:

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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby puffyusaf#2 on Tue Dec 31, 2013 1:50 pm

^ :man10: ^ This outlandish thread has made a great turn.... We are now in Starwars! :man1:
For what it's worth, the Lakers also clinched the Pacific Division, an achievement Bryant dismissed by saying "We don't hang divisions." No, only the big NBA championship banners are considered wall-worthy for the Lakers.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby West's Formula 44 on Tue Dec 31, 2013 6:09 pm

Doc Brown wrote:Tanking doesn't guarantee you good players, scouting and putting in the time to distinguish the duds, from the over-hyped and the actual gems of the draft get you the good players.
2006 - #1 Andrea Bargnani.........#21 Rajon Rondo

It's not always about where you draft, it's about what you draft.


'In 1997, shortly after Jerry divested himself of the last of his increasingly unprofitable horse racing stock, he asked Jimmy to join the Lakers as a sort of Jerry West in waiting. (On Sept. 4, West, 60, signed on for another four years as Lakers executive vice president.) There is some intra-family skepticism about this move. "Jeez!" says Janie. "Jerry West is like a god. It's hard to think of him and Jimmy in the same sentence."

Not for Jimmy. "I always wanted to be a G.M.," he says. He thinks sizing up a player is no different from assessing a stallion. "With a colt, you watch his stride and how he pops to extension," he says. "I just have to learn the qualities to look for in humans."

Jimmy's tutor, West, may be the shrewdest judge of talent in the NBA, and Jimmy has tagged along with him and general manager Mitch Kupchak on several scouting trips. "I've gotten a ton of knowledge from him," Jimmy says of West. "For instance, that watching how a player acts on the bench is as important as how he acts on the floor. [West] looks at what a player does when he comes out of a game and how he interacts with his coach. He'll walk up to a prospect and say, 'How ya doin'? I've got word that you beat up a woman.' And I'm sitting there thinking, Wow! Is this legal?" Yet Jimmy thinks scouting is vastly overrated. "Evaluating basketball talent is not too difficult," he says. "If you grabbed 10 fans out of a bar and asked them to rate prospects, their opinions would be pretty much identical to those of the pro scouts."

That comment mystifies West. "I have great admiration for what our scouts do," he says. "If the job is so easy, then why do some teams always have more success than others?"
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby last stand on Tue Dec 31, 2013 7:30 pm

We are unintentionally tanking, the best kind
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby LooN3y on Tue Dec 31, 2013 7:50 pm

West's Formula 44 wrote:
Doc Brown wrote:Tanking doesn't guarantee you good players, scouting and putting in the time to distinguish the duds, from the over-hyped and the actual gems of the draft get you the good players.
2006 - #1 Andrea Bargnani.........#21 Rajon Rondo

It's not always about where you draft, it's about what you draft.


'In 1997, shortly after Jerry divested himself of the last of his increasingly unprofitable horse racing stock, he asked Jimmy to join the Lakers as a sort of Jerry West in waiting. (On Sept. 4, West, 60, signed on for another four years as Lakers executive vice president.) There is some intra-family skepticism about this move. "Jeez!" says Janie. "Jerry West is like a god. It's hard to think of him and Jimmy in the same sentence."

Not for Jimmy. "I always wanted to be a G.M.," he says. He thinks sizing up a player is no different from assessing a stallion. "With a colt, you watch his stride and how he pops to extension," he says. "I just have to learn the qualities to look for in humans."

Jimmy's tutor, West, may be the shrewdest judge of talent in the NBA, and Jimmy has tagged along with him and general manager Mitch Kupchak on several scouting trips. "I've gotten a ton of knowledge from him," Jimmy says of West. "For instance, that watching how a player acts on the bench is as important as how he acts on the floor. [West] looks at what a player does when he comes out of a game and how he interacts with his coach. He'll walk up to a prospect and say, 'How ya doin'? I've got word that you beat up a woman.' And I'm sitting there thinking, Wow! Is this legal?" Yet Jimmy thinks scouting is vastly overrated. "Evaluating basketball talent is not too difficult," he says. "If you grabbed 10 fans out of a bar and asked them to rate prospects, their opinions would be pretty much identical to those of the pro scouts."

That comment mystifies West. "I have great admiration for what our scouts do," he says. "If the job is so easy, then why do some teams always have more success than others?"



this is ridiculous.


i find it so hard to have an intellectual basketball conversation at a bar with random people.

its ridiculous, 95% of people have no idea what they're talking about, and for damn sure most cant even start with the salary caps, DOABLE trades, etc etc.

most people say LEBRONS THE BEST, HEAT!, CLIPPERS! BLAKE GRIFFIN IS THE BEST BIG MAN IN THE GAME (even though, hes failed to work on his post and cant even do a simple up and under correctly, becoming a dwight 2.0)

its just ridiculous, i remember saying the spurs are grandpas, and they aint gonna win it if they lose this game 6, and people are like "theyre not old, parker and giniboli and duncan are all under 40!" ridiculous stuff like that.

i often have to correct them (most probably think im a douche bag, but sometimes they are so wrong, i HAVE to correct them, its like meeting somebody that thinks its OK to put your hand in a pot of boiling water, i just HAVE To tell them)


its just ridiculous dude, kobe/melo has a bad night, they say he sucks blah blah blah, some no name scrub has a 20 point game, they say, "WE SHOULD SIGN HIM!"

this franchise has done nothing but gone down hill since jim buss took over.


Personally i dont know much people that can really evaluate talent. dudes dont know what a good post game is.

I mean the other day some one was going off about griffin, and i said he needs GET a post game and play some better defense. dude said "He Has Good Post Game", i know its not much, but its coming from a dude that lets it be known hes a basketball fan.


the faster jimmy is ousted, the faster we'll be heading towards the right direction
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby kray28 on Tue Dec 31, 2013 8:01 pm

I think things have to get considerably worse...particularly on the financial end for any real action to take place that would impact Jimmy's role with the team.

FTR: I don't care if the Buss kids keep the team, fine. But get Jimbo's dilettante butt out of the front office please.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby kray28 on Tue Dec 31, 2013 8:03 pm

I'll take losing while trying to win....but I'll never accept losing on purpose. It would break my heart to see the Lakers as no different than Boston.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby LooN3y on Tue Dec 31, 2013 8:16 pm

well atleast we dont have donald sterling.

i wouldnt be surprised if he turned down a kevin love-blake trade just because blake is more marketable
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby Doc Brown on Tue Dec 31, 2013 8:59 pm

Anybody that watched the 1st quarter of tonight's game wouldn't ask if we should actively tank.
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Re: Am I the only one that wants to tank?

Postby last stand on Tue Dec 31, 2013 9:13 pm

Ya I think we can yank without even intentionally doing so
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1. emma watson
2. Natalie Portman
3. Mila Kunis
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6. jessica biel
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