The Lakers are in last place of the Western Conference

F'ing unbelieve. Last place in the Western Conference through 5 games. Worst start since 93/94. This is the worst start since Kobe got here. The Bobcats have a better record than us. SMH

it's cuz we have the worst coach in lakers history.

i am wishing evil things upon that man...

Blaming it all on the coach is short sighted. He won more games with worse players. No one expected what was thought to be one of the best teams ever assembled to actually be one of the worst.

i am not defending mike brown. just saying that people need to consider that maybe this team just isnt as good as we thought.

well so far this year, we're breaking a bunch of records....bad ones.

Phil Jackson did better with Smush/Kobe/Walton/Odom/Kwame
this potato head can't win more than one game

even the perenial bottom feeding Queens will get to their 2nd win before we do

JGC wrote:He won more games with worse players.

I agree with some of your points, but I think this statement is not entirely true.

Last season, Matt Barnes was our best bench player, but he's not longer here. Ramon Sessions was pretty good, too.

This season, we're not really getting anything from anyone except Hill. Jamison and Meeks are supposed to be our best. Jamison has been a proven scorer for what 14 straight years? And yet he's rarely used? Meeks is young and athletic and one of the most efficient outside shooters in the league, statistically. Yet, he NEVER plays. Instead, we're giving all his SG minutes to Steve Blake and Metta, and putting Morris at point.

You can blame Mike Brown for that. Of course not for ALL of our struggles, but for this in particular.

edit: grammar, and adding stuff...

^ agreed. is that because of mike brown or because the players maybe are just as good as we think they should be? mb won, somehow, 60 wins in back to back seasons. and his roster didnt have d12, nash, or pau on it tho it did have jamison i think for one year.

JGC wrote:Blaming it all on the coach is short sighted. He won more games with worse players. No one expected what was thought to be one of the best teams ever assembled to actually be one of the worst.

i am not defending mike brown. just saying that people need to consider that maybe this team just isnt as good as we thought.

That could be true if we weren't watching the games (reg. and preseason). But we are. And 95% of what Brown does in-game is wrong. Just plain dumb. And that's unquestionable. This team, talent-wise, is NOT a 1-4 team. Not even close. We should be 3-1 IMO.
Are certain guys not playing well? Definitely. Are certain guys not trying hard enough? Yeah. But it's all interconected. Some of it is the players fault, like Blake when he passes up a shot, or like when MWP tries to run the fastbreak, but a lot of it is also Brown's fault -> he's using them out of position, he's not playing matchups at all well, his rotations are inconsistent and don't let players get into rythm, and he's trying (and failing) to install very complex systems that just confuse some of our guys and have them thinking too much. We went and got a guy who could stretch the floor with 3pt shooting and play decent D (Meeks) to back up Kobe -> DNP CD. Jamison is slow? let's play him at the 3. And the list goes on, and on, and on.

Being conservative, I'd say 90% of this team's problems are caused directly and indirectly by Brown being the head coach.

fkmikebrown wrote:it's cuz we have the worst coach in lakers history.

i am wishing evil things upon that man...

We should all grab a potato and start piercing it with needles and hurting it

JGC wrote:^ agreed. is that because of mike brown or because the players maybe are just as good as we think they should be? mb won, somehow, 60 wins in back to back seasons. and his roster didnt have d12, nash, or pau on it tho it did have jamison i think for one year.

I think it's because those teams were more suited to his strengths. They were a younger team that probably listened to his coaching, and well, whenever he needed something done, instead of making an in game adjustment, he'd just tell LeBron to do it. Also, he didn't try to implement an offense that was way above his head back then.

Finwë wrote:

fkmikebrown wrote:it's cuz we have the worst coach in lakers history.

i am wishing evil things upon that man...

We should all grab a potato and start piercing it with needles and hurting it

Is it sad I'm actually contemplating doing this?

i dont really disagree with you.... what i am saying is that it is possible this roster combination just doesnt work. we dont do anything well. nothing. that goes beyond coaching.

if you spray dog doo doo with perfume it smells better.... but doo doo still stinks.

We never had a 1-4 start even in the Kwame/Mihm/Luke/Smush/Tierre Brown years... think about that for a second!

Finwë wrote:

fkmikebrown wrote:it's cuz we have the worst coach in lakers history.

i am wishing evil things upon that man...

We should all grab a potato and start piercing it with needles and hurting it

the man is even an insult to potatoes. i feel bad for associating potatoes with him. potatoes are effing delicious and awesome. mike brown is not.

Sixth or eight seed is not out of the question...

JGC wrote:^ agreed. is that because of mike brown or because the players maybe are just as good as we think they should be? mb won, somehow, 60 wins in back to back seasons. and his roster didnt have d12, nash, or pau on it tho it did have jamison i think for one year.

Oh, you mean the Cleveland years. They won because they played great team defense, consistently being at or near #1 all year. Well, plus a weak Eastern conference, and LeBron entering his prime with the additions of 18ppg Mo Williams and annoying defender Varejao.

But anywho, I do agree that our team just may not be that good to a certain extent. Pau is another year older and looks less and less interested in keeping up his aggressiveness. Dwight is still figuring out how to mesh with everyone after playing his whole career with practically the same Magic team year after year (timing is everything with lob passes and stuff). Metta, well, disappeared once again, though maybe he'll be useful again after the ASB...

We're just slow on defense (probably because of age?) while all the younger/athletic players are running circles around us. It's a guard's league these days, but we decided to go big and slow anyway if it meant getting Nash/Howard and Jamison for cheap.

But yeah, guys like Morris really are not great at all, and MB needs to know that and bench him. I still think MB could be better by NOT playing guys out of position (no, I'm not an expert at the Princeton, but it doesn't take rocket science to NOT put Metta at the 2) for at least few games in a row.

There is simply no excuse.

fkmikebrown wrote:

Finwë wrote:

fkmikebrown wrote:it's cuz we have the worst coach in lakers history.

i am wishing evil things upon that man...

We should all grab a potato and start piercing it with needles and hurting it

the man is even an insult to potatoes. i feel bad for associating potatoes with him. potatoes are effing delicious and awesome. mike brown is not.

dj vitus wrote:

JGC wrote:^ agreed. is that because of mike brown or because the players maybe are just as good as we think they should be? mb won, somehow, 60 wins in back to back seasons. and his roster didnt have d12, nash, or pau on it tho it did have jamison i think for one year.

Oh, you mean the Cleveland years. They won because they played great team defense, consistently being at or near #1 all year. Well, plus a weak Eastern conference, and LeBron entering his prime with the additions of 18ppg Mo Williams and annoying defender Varejao.

But anywho, I do agree that our team just may not be that good to a certain extent. Pau is another year older and looks less and less interested in keeping up his aggressiveness. Dwight is still figuring out how to mesh with everyone after playing his whole career with practically the same Magic team year after year (timing is everything with lob passes and stuff). Metta, well, disappeared once again, though maybe he'll be useful again after the ASB...

We're just slow on defense (probably because of age?) while all the younger/athletic players are running circles around us. It's a guard's league these days, but we decided to go big and slow anyway if it meant getting Nash/Howard and Jamison for cheap.

But yeah, guys like Morris really are not great at all, and MB needs to know that and bench him. I still think MB could be better by NOT playing guys out of position (no, I'm not an expert at the Princeton, but it doesn't take rocket science to NOT put Metta at the 2) for at least few games in a row.

Honestly, for me, it's less about our W-L record. If we were playing well in spurts, or had areas of the game we were doing well in spite of others, then I might say it's the coaching. For instance, with Phil we complained that the team had bad defense because Phil never emphasized or practiced it. And you could see our offensive execution was good most of the time and it was the defense where we were lacking. With Miami, they lost because they could stay in games but not close them out. (Obviously, they figured that out).

But I'm starting to wonder if this combination of players just ... might be wrong because of how bad we actually look. We keep saying it's the turnovers. But do we really look that good on plays that aren't turnovers? I don't think so. Was Rudy T a better coach? Did he have better players or, a better combination of players? I don't think so.

Uhhh no dead wrong. The team gets better with Mike Brown's departure. Period.

Finwë wrote:

fkmikebrown wrote:

Finwë wrote:

fkmikebrown wrote:it's cuz we have the worst coach in lakers history.

i am wishing evil things upon that man...

We should all grab a potato and start piercing it with needles and hurting it

the man is even an insult to potatoes. i feel bad for associating potatoes with him. potatoes are effing delicious and awesome. mike brown is not.

hahahaha

at piercing potato's with needles hahaha.

someone take one to the next lakers game with needles in it

dj vitus wrote:

JGC wrote:He won more games with worse players.

I agree with some of your points, but I think this statement is not entirely true.

Last season, Matt Barnes was our best bench player, but he's not longer here. Ramon Sessions was pretty good, too.

This season, we're not really getting anything from anyone except Hill. Jamison and Meeks are supposed to be our best. Jamison has been a proven scorer for what 14 straight years? And yet he's rarely used? Meeks is young and athletic and one of the most efficient outside shooters in the league, statistically. Yet, he NEVER plays. Instead, we're giving all his SG minutes to Steve Blake and Metta, and putting Morris at point.

You can blame Mike Brown for that. Of course not for ALL of our struggles, but for this in particular.

edit: grammar, and adding stuff...

Yeah I agree. But... why aren't the starters even any good? It's not like the starters are just OK and the bench and substitutions suck. But the starters don't even look... OK. They look BAD.

If you didn't know who the players were, you'd think this is one of the worst Laker teams ever assembled. That goes beyond coaching IMO. There have been horrific coaches that didn't have teams that looked this bad.

I've probably said or heard the word "Potato" more times in the past 4 weeks than I had in the last 10 years of my life combined.

Brown had a young, athletic team in Cleveland that fits his ideas. Press...run...play in space. His ideas here whatever they are don't jive with a slower, methodical group. Bottom line is a savvy coach tailors a scheme to maximize the talent he has on hand. Is that happening so far? Training camp? Check! Available practice time? Check! Having Peace play 2? Bench players not allowed to play through and get a feel for the game? Starters having to play heavy minutes? Long, ardous practices for a older team? Reports of free agents spurning the opportunity to play here because of him? If those aren't red flags...then what can be considered red flags at this point?