The Optimistic Thread! (TRD's FREEDOM THREAD!)

One positive thing I see in the NBA is that those guys are playing just as bad.

If we can go 30-20 the rest of the way, we can make the playoffs. Let's say 32-18 to be sure...

In Mitch I trust to get something decent for Pau in a trade. Even a few average players in lieu of Pau last night and we beat the Clippers.

Until we're mathematically eliminated from playoff contention I'll still hold out hope.

JGC wrote:I'll be more optimistic once someone who knows, can confirm whether or not we have a draft pick this year or did we trade it away?

Can I be realistic about THIS season and optimistic about NEXT season?

gave up this years pick in the Nash trade, believe its also unprotected

We may have won if Pau didn't eat up 30 minutes and Jordan Hill were in the game.

I think we can pull off the next to games against Denver, Houston. Denver doesn't play nearly as well on the road as they do at home; we crushed Houston once and should have beat them in the second meeting, but we had a meltdown at the end of the game; nevertheless, I like the way we match up against them.

Additonally, now that we've seen Pau with Nash, I think we're going to move him. I'm optimistic enough to believe that Mitch will find a way to improve this roster by Febuary. If we can find some pieces that mesh right away such as Gasol did we he came over from Memphis, we can still get it together by the playoffs.

Lakers have shown with great and frustrating consistency that they can and will dig themselves into deep holes in the first half of games but they have also shown that they can, when they really go at it, play good enough basketball to fight back from 15-point deficits and *nearly* win even in spite of horrible early goings. This has been a repeat occurrence for the P&G this season, so my optimism, convoluted though it may be is that maybe... just maybe, a similar drive will occur as they continue to fall in the standings and into the second half of the season only their last ditch push will actually result in a playoffs spot instead of the near-miss L they get in games.

Rudy Gay is on the block & Pau should still have enough value to atleast get the cap relief they want. Also that old Pek/Dwill2/AK rumor is something to be optimistic about.

none. after dwight saying that players dont really like eachother and dont want to be friends off court has made me lose faith that the team chemistry will work out in the end. looks like it wont happen and its reflecting in their play in games.

just looked at this months shedule and realistically the lakers will probably be .500 exactly at the end of the month. so sad.

JGC wrote:

khmrP wrote:

JGC wrote:I'll be more optimistic once someone who knows, can confirm whether or not we have a draft pick this year or did we trade it away?

Can I be realistic about THIS season and optimistic about NEXT season?

gave up this years pick in the Nash trade, believe its also unprotected

Ok. Can I be realistic about THIS season, NEXT season, and then be optimistic about the FOLLOWING season or did we move that draft pick too?

Dammit. I'm trying to find SOMETHING to cling on to. The 2014 plan maybe? I don't know. Grrr.

Why would a draft pick be reason to be optimistic anyway? So we can get another Morris, Sacre, Glock, Ebanks? Having a draft pick means very little for us other than being able to use it in a trade, or picking a late 2nd rounder, we don't even hold onto players we draft for longer than 3 or 4 seasons anymore, talented or not. What we do is trade them while valuable, or up their value through developing them well, so they can go elsewhere and get a nice contract, get paid in other words.

lakersin4 wrote:Rudy Gay is on the block & Pau should still have enough value to atleast get the cap relief they want. Also that old Pek/Dwill2/AK rumor is something to be optimistic about.

how does Mem get cap relief trading Gay for Pau?

I'm still confident that we can be a very good team. It would be stupid to remain confident that this team is a definite championship contender like I thought at the beginning of the year. Not saying it's impossible, but at the start of the year I thought it would be a certainty that we'd win the title. But there are just too many other great teams in the league, and clearly we aren't as talented as we thought or this would be coming easy despite any coaching/chemistry problems.

So here's what I'm optimistic about: we really don't HAVE to win this season. The window's still open another few years to get Kobe #6. With the way Kobe and Nash are playing this year, I'm confident an extra year of age isn't going to slow them down enough to the point where they couldn't lead us to a title with a better supporting cast next year.

All of our untradeable garbage (Pau, Blake, Duhon) and MWP will have much more trade value as expiring contracts. We won't have much to work with in free agency, but I'm confident that Mitch could use our trade chips to put together a better supporting cast, especially since it would be obvious that the team needs athleticism/shooting to surround Kobe, Dwight, and Nash. Ideally, we'd make those moves right now. But even if we do trade Pau for a good return this year and still don't win, my point remains. A full year of playing together with a roster that is hopefully stable after trading Pau, a full year of Nash learning his new teammates, a full summer for Dwight to train and get healthy, a full training camp next year ... I know these are all just excuses for this year, but they'd obviously help us next year to some extent.

pace was good yesterday. we need to play at that pace if we want to have a chance to beat nugs and houston and spurs.

I've conceded we aren't winning a championship this year however it would be nice to at least make the WCF so we can say getting Nash and Dwight actually resulted in an improvement from last year.

Weezy wrote:

JGC wrote:

khmrP wrote:

JGC wrote:I'll be more optimistic once someone who knows, can confirm whether or not we have a draft pick this year or did we trade it away?

Can I be realistic about THIS season and optimistic about NEXT season?

gave up this years pick in the Nash trade, believe its also unprotected

Ok. Can I be realistic about THIS season, NEXT season, and then be optimistic about the FOLLOWING season or did we move that draft pick too?

Dammit. I'm trying to find SOMETHING to cling on to. The 2014 plan maybe? I don't know. Grrr.

Why would a draft pick be reason to be optimistic anyway? So we can get another Morris, Sacre, Glock, Ebanks? Having a draft pick means very little for us other than being able to use it in a trade, or picking a late 2nd rounder, we don't even hold onto players we draft for longer than 3 or 4 seasons anymore, talented or not. What we do is trade them while valuable, or up their value through developing them well, so they can go elsewhere and get a nice contract, get paid in other words.

I know we've had to trade some of our first rounders (to get Pau and Nash), but this philosophy is part of problem. Had we been able to keep some of our picks, we wouldn't be in the boat we're in right now. Since we last had a first rounder, look at all the good players who have gone in the Mid-Late 1st Round or later (I know we've usually had picks very late in the first, but looking at other draft day trades, it's usually not that hard to move up a couple of spots).

2008: Roy Hibbert, Javale McGee, Ryan Anderson, Serge Ibaka, Nicolas Batum, George Hill, Nikola Pekovic, Deandre Jordan, Goran Dragic
2009: Jrue Holiday, Ty Lawson, Jeff Teague, Darren Collison, Taj Gibson, Marcus Thornton, Chase Budinger
2010: Eric Bledsoe, Avery Bradley, Jordan Crawford, Greivis Vasquez
2011: Kenneth Faried, Marshon Brooks, Chandler Parsons, Isaiah Thomas
2012: Jarred Sullinger

Morris, Sacre, Glock, Ebanks were all second picks. If we had a few of the players listed above to develop instead of them, we wouldn't look as old as we do now. It's impossible to get younger when you keep trading away your first rounders for vets and don't have the free agency tools to go after youngsters since all the good ones command more than the MLE. So yeah, I'd agree with JGC that actually being able to have a first rounder rookie on our squad next year for the first time since Javaris Crittenton would have been something to be optimistic about.

I'm confident that we'll become the team we're supposed to be when we become consistent on the defensive end of the floor.

That's the end of the floor that's holding us back. I'd assume that a team with D12, Kobe, and MWP would be able to play D, but so far that hasn't been the case.

winning cures a lot. guys were super happy and friendly during the win streak. losing builds frustration towards guys who arent stepping up or doing their jobs on d. if we start winning that whole "off court chemistry" issue as well as on court will lessen

khmrP wrote:

lakersin4 wrote:Rudy Gay is on the block & Pau should still have enough value to atleast get the cap relief they want. Also that old Pek/Dwill2/AK rumor is something to be optimistic about.

how does Mem get cap relief trading Gay for Pau?

Pau to 3rd team that provides cap relief. Hence "Pau should still have enough value to atleast get the cap relief they want"

Ariza3 wrote:winning cures a lot. guys were super happy and friendly during the win streak. losing builds frustration towards guys who arent stepping up or doing their jobs on d. if we start winning that whole "off court chemistry" issue as well as on court will lessen

This team is full of front running weak idiots. When we're winning in a blow out against some scrub team everyone is cheering like it's the NBA Finals, but when we lose a game it's back to the end of the world.

Helljumper wrote:

Weezy wrote:

JGC wrote:

khmrP wrote:

JGC wrote:I'll be more optimistic once someone who knows, can confirm whether or not we have a draft pick this year or did we trade it away?

Can I be realistic about THIS season and optimistic about NEXT season?

gave up this years pick in the Nash trade, believe its also unprotected

Ok. Can I be realistic about THIS season, NEXT season, and then be optimistic about the FOLLOWING season or did we move that draft pick too?

Dammit. I'm trying to find SOMETHING to cling on to. The 2014 plan maybe? I don't know. Grrr.

Why would a draft pick be reason to be optimistic anyway? So we can get another Morris, Sacre, Glock, Ebanks? Having a draft pick means very little for us other than being able to use it in a trade, or picking a late 2nd rounder, we don't even hold onto players we draft for longer than 3 or 4 seasons anymore, talented or not. What we do is trade them while valuable, or up their value through developing them well, so they can go elsewhere and get a nice contract, get paid in other words.

I know we've had to trade some of our first rounders (to get Pau and Nash), but this philosophy is part of problem. Had we been able to keep some of our picks, we wouldn't be in the boat we're in right now. Since we last had a first rounder, look at all the good players who have gone in the Mid-Late 1st Round or later (I know we've usually had picks very late in the first, but looking at other draft day trades, it's usually not that hard to move up a couple of spots).

2008: Roy Hibbert, Javale McGee, Ryan Anderson, Serge Ibaka, Nicolas Batum, George Hill, Nikola Pekovic, Deandre Jordan, Goran Dragic
2009: Jrue Holiday, Ty Lawson, Jeff Teague, Darren Collison, Taj Gibson, Marcus Thornton, Chase Budinger
2010: Eric Bledsoe, Avery Bradley, Jordan Crawford, Greivis Vasquez
2011: Kenneth Faried, Marshon Brooks, Chandler Parsons, Isaiah Thomas
2012: Jarred Sullinger

Morris, Sacre, Glock, Ebanks were all second picks. If we had a few of the players listed above to develop instead of them, we wouldn't look as old as we do now. It's impossible to get younger when you keep trading away your first rounders for vets and don't have the free agency tools to go after youngsters since all the good ones command more than the MLE. So yeah, I'd agree with JGC that actually being able to have a first rounder rookie on our squad next year for the first time since Javaris Crittenton would have been something to be optimistic about.

I'm not saying there aren't good players to be had in the mid to late 1st round, I'm saying we don't seem to know which guys those are even if we do have the picks. Our first round picks since '99: Devean George (mediocre player, out of the league), Mark Madsen (out of the league), Brian Cook (garbage), Sasha Vujacic (out of the league), Andrew Bynum (our only lottery pick, one of the bests of that draft, became an All-Star), Jordan Farmar (very useful to us, but now out of the league), Javaris Crittenton (out of the league, probable criminal), and Toney Douglas (for the Knicks). Compared to some other teams, we don't find gems in the late 1st round, more of our 2nd rounders are still in the league in fact, though still mediocre at best. So it seems unless we have a lottery pick, having a 1st rounder is pointless for us, whoever our scouts are they're no San Antonio, Portland, or OKC level scouts.

I don't think management likes building a team through the draft ala OKC. They tend to go for blockbuster trades.