TWC/Charter/Verizon/AT&T/Cox/DTV Ch. Guide (see 1st post)

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby nthydro on Sun Oct 21, 2012 11:27 am

revgen wrote:
LTLakerFan wrote:
revgen wrote:^The bitrate on the TWC stream is 11000 kbps at 1920x1080i resolution. That's way too low for a stream that uses the ancient MPEG-2 codec. A stream using the MPEG-4 AVC codec (like DirecTV and DISH use) wouldn't look bad at that kind of bitrate.

That's why you get those pixelations in motion sequences.

If they're going to stream the broadcast at 11000kbps, they should at least bump the resolution down to 720p to reduce the artifacts.


Rev, I hope you're just describing this bit starved situation for what TW Cable itself puts out. When Charter gets a good uplink I get a great picture, and same with what I've seen from DTV and Dish. What I mean is that I'm hoping their production in the field and uplinks to the "bird" for distribution is as good as my benchmark now (usually) of ESPN and ABC, NBC, CBS.

If they suck at that, after this whole stressful period, they should rightfully so get killed and embarrassed on the major forums that cover stations' image quality. Fox was good and so was KCAL.


Yes, I'm describing TWC's stream to my digital cable box.

I don't have access to Charter, DTV, or DISH. All I do know is that DISH and DirecTV utilize MPEG-4 AVC for streaming to end users, which is a superior video codec, so lower bitrates probably don't look nearly as bad as they do for MPEG-2. I'm not aware of what codec Charter uses.

I very much doubt the stream being sent through the satellite is the same one that goes to the digital cable box at home. I believe recompression is being done to save bandwidth.


Wouldn't the type of TV you have play a role in the picture quality as well?
nthydro

 
Posts: 1385
Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2010 10:55 am

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby revgen on Sun Oct 21, 2012 12:52 pm

nthydro wrote:
revgen wrote:
LTLakerFan wrote:
revgen wrote:^The bitrate on the TWC stream is 11000 kbps at 1920x1080i resolution. That's way too low for a stream that uses the ancient MPEG-2 codec. A stream using the MPEG-4 AVC codec (like DirecTV and DISH use) wouldn't look bad at that kind of bitrate.

That's why you get those pixelations in motion sequences.

If they're going to stream the broadcast at 11000kbps, they should at least bump the resolution down to 720p to reduce the artifacts.


Rev, I hope you're just describing this bit starved situation for what TW Cable itself puts out. When Charter gets a good uplink I get a great picture, and same with what I've seen from DTV and Dish. What I mean is that I'm hoping their production in the field and uplinks to the "bird" for distribution is as good as my benchmark now (usually) of ESPN and ABC, NBC, CBS.

If they suck at that, after this whole stressful period, they should rightfully so get killed and embarrassed on the major forums that cover stations' image quality. Fox was good and so was KCAL.


Yes, I'm describing TWC's stream to my digital cable box.

I don't have access to Charter, DTV, or DISH. All I do know is that DISH and DirecTV utilize MPEG-4 AVC for streaming to end users, which is a superior video codec, so lower bitrates probably don't look nearly as bad as they do for MPEG-2. I'm not aware of what codec Charter uses.

I very much doubt the stream being sent through the satellite is the same one that goes to the digital cable box at home. I believe recompression is being done to save bandwidth.


Wouldn't the type of TV you have play a role in the picture quality as well?


The bigger the TV, the worse the image quality is going to look.
"Every time he’s hurt, he always plays, he always comes through."

- Metta World Peace on teammate Kobe Bryant
revgen
HDTV/Multimedia Guru
 
Posts: 21723
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2006 10:53 pm
Location: Southern California

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby LTLakerFan on Sun Oct 21, 2012 12:54 pm

If it is high quality the larger the display is magnifies the faults. The fact it can look absolutely glorious with a great signal from an event or venue doesn't excuse the crap when you see it. Like the couple of cameras, or one at the very least, from every one of TNT's broadcasts last year looked horrendous. Just what Revgen is describing above..... bit starved and full of blocks of pixels artifacting. It's a very nice projector on an over 8' wide, very bright type of screen surface.

The smaller the display the less any of this stuff is noticed. So my stance is if Fox West and KCAL both could do very well game to game there is no excuse for TW not to.
LTLakerFan

 
Posts: 6501
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 10:44 pm
Location: SoCal

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby Snake Eyes on Sun Oct 21, 2012 1:07 pm

I get what he is saying. In the long run this TV deal is a good thing though. Yeah, us fan are losing out, but isn't the deal going to allow the Lakers to pay luxury taxes for a while?
User avatar
Snake Eyes

 
Posts: 9564
Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 6:44 pm

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby XXIV on Sun Oct 21, 2012 1:17 pm

I'm surprised there hasn't been any news/updates on the negotiations. We're about a week away from the season debut, and TWC is still the only provider that has the channel. Very frustrating.
XXIV

 
Posts: 6386
Joined: Sat Dec 18, 2010 11:20 am
Location: Los Angeles

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby nthydro on Sun Oct 21, 2012 1:19 pm

revgen wrote:
nthydro wrote:
revgen wrote:
LTLakerFan wrote:
revgen wrote:^The bitrate on the TWC stream is 11000 kbps at 1920x1080i resolution. That's way too low for a stream that uses the ancient MPEG-2 codec. A stream using the MPEG-4 AVC codec (like DirecTV and DISH use) wouldn't look bad at that kind of bitrate.

That's why you get those pixelations in motion sequences.

If they're going to stream the broadcast at 11000kbps, they should at least bump the resolution down to 720p to reduce the artifacts.


Rev, I hope you're just describing this bit starved situation for what TW Cable itself puts out. When Charter gets a good uplink I get a great picture, and same with what I've seen from DTV and Dish. What I mean is that I'm hoping their production in the field and uplinks to the "bird" for distribution is as good as my benchmark now (usually) of ESPN and ABC, NBC, CBS.

If they suck at that, after this whole stressful period, they should rightfully so get killed and embarrassed on the major forums that cover stations' image quality. Fox was good and so was KCAL.


Yes, I'm describing TWC's stream to my digital cable box.

I don't have access to Charter, DTV, or DISH. All I do know is that DISH and DirecTV utilize MPEG-4 AVC for streaming to end users, which is a superior video codec, so lower bitrates probably don't look nearly as bad as they do for MPEG-2. I'm not aware of what codec Charter uses.

I very much doubt the stream being sent through the satellite is the same one that goes to the digital cable box at home. I believe recompression is being done to save bandwidth.


Wouldn't the type of TV you have play a role in the picture quality as well?


The bigger the TV, the worse the image quality is going to look.


I mean as far as the display's refresh rates, wouldn't it affect fast motion videos such as sports?
nthydro

 
Posts: 1385
Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2010 10:55 am

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby nthydro on Sun Oct 21, 2012 1:23 pm

LTLakerFan wrote:If it is high quality the larger the display is magnifies the faults. The fact it can look absolutely glorious with a great signal from an event or venue doesn't excuse the crap when you see it. Like the couple of cameras, or one at the very least, from every one of TNT's broadcasts last year looked horrendous. Just what Revgen is describing above..... bit starved and full of blocks of pixels artifacting. It's a very nice projector on an over 8' wide, very bright type of screen surface.

The smaller the display the less any of this stuff is noticed. So my stance is if Fox West and KCAL both could do very well game to game there is no excuse for TW not to.


Is this channel specific or just TIme Warner Cable in general? If another provider like Cox or Verizon gets Sportsnet, will it still look like crap or better? I used to have Time Warner and their tv quality was not too bad. I was watching on a 50" plasma.
nthydro

 
Posts: 1385
Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2010 10:55 am

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby therealdeal on Sun Oct 21, 2012 1:25 pm

I watch on a 50" HD LCD tv and it looks just fine to me.

Maybe I'm not as discriminating as others, but I have no problem with it.
Stu : "Yeah, that's an old fashioned whoopin'."
therealdeal
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 40322
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2008 3:03 pm

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby CaCHooKa Man on Sun Oct 21, 2012 1:33 pm

until time warner completely switches from mpeg2 to h264, their HD channels will always look subpar. i have a newer box that supports h264 but a lot of households dont so that would be a problem.
User avatar
CaCHooKa Man
Human Highlight Reel
 
Posts: 20560
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2004 8:22 pm
Location: Los Angeles

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby nthydro on Sun Oct 21, 2012 1:35 pm

therealdeal wrote:I watch on a 50" HD LCD tv and it looks just fine to me.

Maybe I'm not as discriminating as others, but I have no problem with it.


Well some people are more sensitive to the motion blurring and artifacts. But yeah, you're definitely one of the least [Swearing is not permitted at Clublakers. You must edit this post prior to submitting.] retentive people on this board LOL.
nthydro

 
Posts: 1385
Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2010 10:55 am

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby revgen on Sun Oct 21, 2012 3:27 pm

CaCHooKa Man wrote:until time warner completely switches from mpeg2 to h264, their HD channels will always look subpar. i have a newer box that supports h264 but a lot of households dont so that would be a problem.


Agreed.

I live in Ventura County. I haven't gotten any news of h264/MPEG-4 AVC here. I'll call them and find out.
"Every time he’s hurt, he always plays, he always comes through."

- Metta World Peace on teammate Kobe Bryant
revgen
HDTV/Multimedia Guru
 
Posts: 21723
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2006 10:53 pm
Location: Southern California

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby LTLakerFan on Sun Oct 21, 2012 4:31 pm

nthydro wrote:
LTLakerFan wrote:If it is high quality the larger the display is magnifies the faults. The fact it can look absolutely glorious with a great signal from an event or venue doesn't excuse the crap when you see it. Like the couple of cameras, or one at the very least, from every one of TNT's broadcasts last year looked horrendous. Just what Revgen is describing above..... bit starved and full of blocks of pixels artifacting. It's a very nice projector on an over 8' wide, very bright type of screen surface.

The smaller the display the less any of this stuff is noticed. So my stance is if Fox West and KCAL both could do very well game to game there is no excuse for TW not to.


Is this channel specific or just TIme Warner Cable in general? If another provider like Cox or Verizon gets Sportsnet, will it still look like crap or better? I used to have Time Warner and their tv quality was not too bad. I was watching on a 50" plasma.


Nothing about Time Warner as I don't have them and am in Charter territory. Just saying when it is done right from the venue and camera equipment and truck and uplink to the satellite for all the providers, sporting events and HDTV in general can look spectacular. I'm not a fan of Charter for other reasons but picture quality isn't one of them when they are given a good signal on whichever channel.

Only 2 years ago ESPN used to look like crap with what they were sending out. A game with a parquet floor, the floor was a crawling mess. Then BOOM they and ABC turned it right around to where now they put out consistently great feeds for the providers. I hope TWC's gear.....all of it....the cameras, the trucks and their uplinks is all state of the art. As Revgen has said this is totally separate from what their "cable service" gives its customers.
LTLakerFan

 
Posts: 6501
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 10:44 pm
Location: SoCal

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby LTLakerFan on Sun Oct 21, 2012 4:35 pm

nthydro wrote:
therealdeal wrote:I watch on a 50" HD LCD tv and it looks just fine to me.

Maybe I'm not as discriminating as others, but I have no problem with it.


Well some people are more sensitive to the motion blurring and artifacts. But yeah, you're definitely one of the least [Swearing is not permitted at Clublakers. You must edit this post prior to submitting.] retentive people on this board LOL.


LOL at the "a" word preceding retentive being bleeped out.... :man10:
LTLakerFan

 
Posts: 6501
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 10:44 pm
Location: SoCal

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby nthydro on Sun Oct 21, 2012 6:32 pm

blacked out :bang: :bang:
nthydro

 
Posts: 1385
Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2010 10:55 am

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby EvoXR1 on Sun Oct 21, 2012 6:33 pm

wtf?!?!?! blacked out!!! screw you time warner!!!
EvoXR1

 
Posts: 11
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2010 7:30 pm

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby lakersyunowin on Sun Oct 21, 2012 6:37 pm

the artist formerly known as fklukewalton, fksteveblake, and fkmikebrown
User avatar
lakersyunowin

 
Posts: 10415
Joined: Sat Apr 25, 2009 7:19 pm

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby WilliamHaven on Sun Oct 21, 2012 6:54 pm

I wish the HD quality wasn't so crummy. Maybe we should tell the players to not run so fast :bang:
Move along ho, Super Lakers don't hang out with no skanks.
User avatar
WilliamHaven

 
Posts: 342
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2007 7:25 pm

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby puffyusaf#2 on Sun Oct 21, 2012 7:00 pm

I havent been pissed until i stumbled on nbatv then the bastards blacked it out
I don't always bring down the hammer but when I do it is usually to a troll! Stay TROLL FREE my freinds!
User avatar
puffyusaf#2
Clublakers Moderator
 
Posts: 31459
Joined: Sun Apr 02, 2006 3:15 pm
Location: Making folks sexy with dancin'

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby CaCHooKa Man on Sun Oct 21, 2012 7:08 pm

the game wouldve been blacked out on nbatv if it was on fsn west too. although people wouldve been able to watch it since they have that channel.
User avatar
CaCHooKa Man
Human Highlight Reel
 
Posts: 20560
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2004 8:22 pm
Location: Los Angeles

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby Snake Eyes on Sun Oct 21, 2012 7:10 pm

puffyusaf#2 wrote:I havent been pissed until i stumbled on nbatv then the bastards blacked it out


Today is the day I became pissed off too. I figured NBA TV would be blacked out but I checked out a bunch of streams and they were all horrible quality. Unless they zoom in for a close shot, it can be difficult to tell who is who. It is getting time for the cable companies to get an agreement done.
User avatar
Snake Eyes

 
Posts: 9564
Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 6:44 pm

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby OX1947 on Sun Oct 21, 2012 7:13 pm

Explain to me why the (bleep) they would black it out when we can not watch the (bleep) game anywhere else? Explain that to me, all you Business Administration majors in here with your "it's business" mantra? Go ahead, I'll wait right here and watch the FX channel since I can not watch the game because of greed and stupidity.
OX1947

 
Posts: 1872
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2005 12:48 am

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby CaCHooKa Man on Sun Oct 21, 2012 7:30 pm

OX1947 wrote:Explain to me why the (bleep) they would black it out when we can not watch the (bleep) game anywhere else? Explain that to me, all you Business Administration majors in here with your "it's business" mantra? Go ahead, I'll wait right here and watch the FX channel since I can not watch the game because of greed and stupidity.


because the NBA made the decision to black out games based on geographic region. doesnt matter if TWC sportsnet isnt available for everyone yet. it wouldve been blacked out if it were on KCAL or FSN west as well.
User avatar
CaCHooKa Man
Human Highlight Reel
 
Posts: 20560
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2004 8:22 pm
Location: Los Angeles

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby OX1947 on Sun Oct 21, 2012 7:45 pm

CaCHooKa Man wrote:
OX1947 wrote:Explain to me why the (bleep) they would black it out when we can not watch the (bleep) game anywhere else? Explain that to me, all you Business Administration majors in here with your "it's business" mantra? Go ahead, I'll wait right here and watch the FX channel since I can not watch the game because of greed and stupidity.


because the NBA made the decision to black out games based on geographic region. doesnt matter if TWC sportsnet isnt available for everyone yet. it wouldve been blacked out if it were on KCAL or FSN west as well.


Yah, and IF my sister had a schlong, she would be my brother. Now, I get it. Move along, move along.....
OX1947

 
Posts: 1872
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2005 12:48 am

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby therealdeal on Sun Oct 21, 2012 8:22 pm

That saying doesn't fit the situation at all.
Stu : "Yeah, that's an old fashioned whoopin'."
therealdeal
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 40322
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2008 3:03 pm

Re: TWC and Lakers Sign Long-Term Agreement for Lakers Games

Postby Phil XI on Sun Oct 21, 2012 8:34 pm

OX1947 wrote:
CaCHooKa Man wrote:
OX1947 wrote:Explain to me why the (bleep) they would black it out when we can not watch the (bleep) game anywhere else? Explain that to me, all you Business Administration majors in here with your "it's business" mantra? Go ahead, I'll wait right here and watch the FX channel since I can not watch the game because of greed and stupidity.


because the NBA made the decision to black out games based on geographic region. doesnt matter if TWC sportsnet isnt available for everyone yet. it wouldve been blacked out if it were on KCAL or FSN west as well.


Yah, and IF my sister had a schlong, she would be my brother. Now, I get it. Move along, move along.....


therealdeal wrote:That saying doesn't fit the situation at all.


No, but if your brother had melons he'd be your sister.....
Get 17!!
User avatar
Phil XI

 
Posts: 1680
Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2010 11:23 pm
Location: Thanks Ron for Gm7! You'll always be a Laker Legend!

PreviousNext

Return to Lakers Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 7 guests

cron
Advertise Here | Privacy Policy | ©2008 Sculu Sports. Come Strong.