WMC 12/13: Mercy kill. (0-4)

Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby denimPortugal on Thu Apr 18, 2013 12:15 pm

The Rock wrote:Harden

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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby Chillbongo on Thu Apr 18, 2013 12:21 pm

that was some paul pierce s***

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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby JGC on Thu Apr 18, 2013 12:36 pm

Doc Brown wrote:
JGC wrote:
Already answered this for you. IMO, the expectations and measuring sticks for Steve Blake and Kobe Bryant should be different.

Do you agree? If so, then hope that resolves your mass confusion.

If not, you'd have to agree it would be acceptable for Kobe to then post Steve Blake numbers.


Yea it makes perfect sense....

Blake shoots 6-20, 4-12.........great game no criticism from you.

Kobe shoots 6-20, 4-12.........ballhog that doesn't get his teammates involved.

It couldn't be any more transparent.


Same with you. Same. With. You.

Earl Clark shoots 4-9, 9 rebounds.........great game no criticism from you.

Dwight Howard shoots 4-9, 9 rebounds.........Uber clown that spends more time joking around instead of playing defense and being fierce 24/7.

If there was any way I could be more transparent, it would only be accomplished by you.
Last edited by JGC on Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby Forward Three on Thu Apr 18, 2013 1:40 pm

WMC is Bill Simmons, it's one thing that he is a Celtics fan/Lakers hater, I 'get' that, but that twobit homerism really needs to keep itself in check when he's prominently featured on TV. But it's like, not even enough that he hates the Lakers, he has that smug and smarmy disposition about everything all the time, like he's just waiting for anyone to say anything at all less-than-positive about Kobe or the Lakers so he can pounce. That stuff is fine for print media, it's fine for local media, but man, how does that stuff stay gainfully employed in the national televised arena? I know ESPN tends to have a bit of an anti-Lakers bias overall anyway, but that's at least somewhat of an inevitable consequence of the Lakers being so good all the time(having a pro-Lakers bias in such conditions wouldn't be nearly as good for ratings). But there is a line between a bit of a bias against a (historically) top franchise and the straight up, unapologetic, fanboyism that Simmons displays.


Other WMC is James Harden and Jeremy Lin both being floppers. I'll readily admit that both of them probably did deserve a few calls late in the game, Harden clearly got hit a couple of times and there was no whistle. But that in no way indemnifies for his overall strategy of flailing around loosely every time he goes to the rim. Lin has started to exhibit a similar tendency, which he no doubt picked up from observing Harden. It's annoying in the same way CP3's flopping is annoying, where you have these players who realistically are good enough that they shouldn't need to resort to that stuff but instead they center large aspects of their game around it specifically.

one of the turning points of the game was when Harden DIDN'T get some of the calls he normally gets and it was like "oh yeah, without the whistle he's about half as effective offensively as he is with the whistle", that's annoying basketball to watch and I really wish the League would actually DO something about it.
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby Doc Brown on Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:03 pm

JGC wrote:Same with you. Same. With. You.

Earl Clark shoots 4-9, 9 rebounds.........great game no criticism from you.

Dwight Howard shoots 4-9, 9 rebounds.........Uber clown that spends more time joking around instead of playing defense and being fierce 24/7.

If there was anyway I could be more transparent, it would only be accomplished by you.


Changing the subject now ehh?

Toodles.
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby JGC on Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:51 pm

Doc Brown wrote:
JGC wrote:Same with you. Same. With. You.

Earl Clark shoots 4-9, 9 rebounds.........great game no criticism from you.

Dwight Howard shoots 4-9, 9 rebounds.........Uber clown that spends more time joking around instead of playing defense and being fierce 24/7.

If there was anyway I could be more transparent, it would only be accomplished by you.


Changing the subject now ehh?

Toodles.


Bye!
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby SpencerHarrison on Thu Apr 18, 2013 3:40 pm

Agreed 100% with this:

one of the turning points of the game was when Harden DIDN'T get some of the calls he normally gets and it was like "oh yeah, without the whistle he's about half as effective offensively as he is with the whistle[/i]", that's annoying basketball to watch and I really wish the League would actually DO something about it.


Every single time I watch Harden I see two things:

*Jacking up 3s.

*Free calls at the rim no matter what.

He is NOT this amazing explosive player that the league wants to make him into. He NEEDS free throws to operate. They give him space to shoot later in games when defenders get in absurd foul trouble, and it keeps his point totals up even on bad shooting nights.

He does NOT have any semblance of a superstar game. He's a chucker who eurosteps his way to a lot of free points. It's boring and irritating to watch. When Tim Duncan puts Pau into the brick oven, I'm okay watching it. "Wow that was a dope move, Tim. You bastard." But watching Harden is obnoxious and depressing.
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby puffyusaf#2 on Thu Apr 18, 2013 3:52 pm

Doc Brown wrote:
JGC wrote:Same with you. Same. With. You.

Earl Clark shoots 4-9, 9 rebounds.........great game no criticism from you.

Dwight Howard shoots 4-9, 9 rebounds.........Uber clown that spends more time joking around instead of playing defense and being fierce 24/7.

If there was anyway I could be more transparent, it would only be accomplished by you.


Changing the subject now ehh?

Toodles.


You really shouldn't be suprised Doc. All conversations end the same way when you call him out
For what it's worth, the Lakers also clinched the Pacific Division, an achievement Bryant dismissed by saying "We don't hang divisions." No, only the big NBA championship banners are considered wall-worthy for the Lakers.
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby KBJelleyBean24 on Thu Apr 18, 2013 4:24 pm

Forward Three wrote:one of the turning points of the game was when Harden DIDN'T get some of the calls he normally gets and it was like "oh yeah, without the whistle he's about half as effective offensively as he is with the whistle", that's annoying basketball to watch and I really wish the League would actually DO something about it.


Not sure if anyone has seen this but....

A press release from the NBA:

The NBA has set the league’s anti-flopping disciplinary schedule to be used during the 2013 Playoffs, NBA Executive Vice President, Basketball Operations Stu Jackson announced today.

“Flopping” is defined as any physical act that appears to have been intended to cause the referees to call a foul on another player. The primary factor in determining whether a player committed a flop is whether his physical reaction to contact with another player is inconsistent with what would reasonably be expected given the force or direction of the contact.

The NBA’s anti-flopping rule, adopted at the beginning of the 2012-13 season, had 24 violations during the 2012-13 regular season. Fourteen players received warnings while five players received a $5,000 fine for violating the anti-flopping rule twice.

Physical acts that constitute legitimate basketball plays (such as moving to a spot in order to draw an offensive foul) and minor physical reactions to contact are not deemed to be flops.

Any player who is determined to have committed a flop during the 2013 Playoffs will be subject to the following:

Violation 1: $5,000 fine
Violation 2: $10,000 fine
Violation 3: $15,000 fine
Violation 4: $30,000 fine


If a player violates the anti-flopping rule five times or more, he will be subject to discipline that is reasonable under the circumstances, including an increased fine and/or suspension.


This is not so different from the league's regular-season anti-flopping program, although a key difference is that in the regular season every player's first offense was granted with only a warning. Now the fines start immediately and quickly get steep.

Whether or not such a program is effective depends entirely on how active the league is in noticing and punishing flops.

In the regular season they spotted one flop for every 51 games played. (That's one for roughly every 25,000 minutes of player time on the court.) At that rate, the whole playoffs will feature a grand total of two flops. In other words, the entire anti-flopping effort would amount to a couple of $5,000 holes in a couple of guys' wallets -- but no real need for any flopper to change strategy.

There are other ways the flopping program could be better. Why wait until after the game is over to review three seconds of video that affect the game in real time? That delay means, for instance, that effectively there are no flopping rules worth worrying about for any team facing elimination. Or, picture Game 7 of the NBA Finals, when any flop would be punished next season. Flop away, gentlemen.

And finally, I'm not a fan of any of these NBA rules (for instance, with technical totals) that accumulate through the playoffs. The risk of a five-flops-in-the-playoffs suspension is effectively zero for every NBA player -- except maybe those on very top contending teams that expect to play a couple dozen games. If you play for the Thunder, Spurs or Heat, in other words, you're facing anti-flopping, anti-technical and anti-flagrant pressure no other team has. It also means that if anyone is to get suspended, it's most likely in the Finals, when fans would most appreciate having them on the court.

Hardly seems like the smartest set up, but of course it's better than no punishment at all -- which is how the NBA treated flops before this season.


http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/56904/nbas-new-playoff-flopping-rules
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby JGC on Thu Apr 18, 2013 5:27 pm

puffyusaf#2 wrote:
Doc Brown wrote:
JGC wrote:Same with you. Same. With. You.

Earl Clark shoots 4-9, 9 rebounds.........great game no criticism from you.

Dwight Howard shoots 4-9, 9 rebounds.........Uber clown that spends more time joking around instead of playing defense and being fierce 24/7.

If there was anyway I could be more transparent, it would only be accomplished by you.


Changing the subject now ehh?

Toodles.


You really shouldn't be suprised Doc. All conversations end the same way when you call him out


Call me out? About what? That I think the standard by which you measure success should vary across players? If that's what you think he called me out on, then I guess you're right. I do that. I judge different players, differently. I hold players to different standards. Well done. Great investigative work. Wunderbar.

The reality is you both know what Doc Brown is trying to argue makes no actual sense. To say that I have to applaud all players equally who post the same or similar stat lines is laughable at BEST. If Robert Sacre was getting 10 pts and 8 rebs every game I'd applaud him and so should everyone else. If Dwight Howard were doing that, everyone should bag on him and rightfully so.

I completely understand why he didn't want to go down this road. It's "victim card" all over again. Stop it. You know, sometimes I wonder if guys even watch the games. Or do they just check the box scores with stuff like this.
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby dwighthowardsdad on Thu Apr 18, 2013 5:36 pm

WMC? Right now, I have plenty of concerns with this roster going forward; offensively, we get stagnant, have no shot creator, and our long-range shooting isn't great at all. Houston was able to pack the paint bring 2-3 defenders making it difficult for Pau & Dwight. We had no spacing. I pray Nash gets back to fix some of that; but that could be a problem going forward.
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby borri on Thu Apr 18, 2013 6:03 pm

If Meeks and Ron get hot, we'll beat SAS, even without Nash.

But that's a TALL order.
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby Scnottaken on Sat Apr 20, 2013 7:05 am

My WMC for the season: watching that Kobe 3 highlight video reminded me that we lost a lot of close games that, if we had just played with this urgency, we could have easily won.
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby Lakerjones on Sat Apr 20, 2013 10:18 am

Scnottaken wrote:My WMC for the season: watching that Kobe 3 highlight video reminded me that we lost a lot of close games that, if we had just played with this urgency, we could have easily won.


^^ I agree with you Scnottaken. There were so many games that we just lacked life, especially in the third quarter. It's like our guys just fell asleep at half time. I know it can get tiresome for people here to continue to bang on the coach, but that's exactly who I place the blame on for a lot of those lackluster performances this year. Scoff if you will, but when our guys were playing under Bernie they didn't have that look at all. Sure they were happy to be free of Brown and that inspired them some, but I think they actually dug Bernie and played hard under him. As soon as D' Antoni came in it was a change in the air. They got tight. He was kind of a jerk to Pau. I hardly get the feeling like they've played hard FOR him. Kobe was killing himself to get wins, but that's what he does. I mean, this is really a discussion for the off-season probably, we need to see how the team plays in these playoffs. But still, like you said, I think we could have won more games playing with greater intensity, even with the injury depleted roster we've had this year. And I'm not at all convinced that D' Antoni inspires them in that regard.
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby Finwë on Sat Apr 20, 2013 11:13 am

SpencerHarrison wrote:Agreed 100% with this:

one of the turning points of the game was when Harden DIDN'T get some of the calls he normally gets and it was like "oh yeah, without the whistle he's about half as effective offensively as he is with the whistle[/i]", that's annoying basketball to watch and I really wish the League would actually DO something about it.


Every single time I watch Harden I see two things:

*Jacking up 3s.

*Free calls at the rim no matter what.

He is NOT this amazing explosive player that the league wants to make him into. He NEEDS free throws to operate. They give him space to shoot later in games when defenders get in absurd foul trouble, and it keeps his point totals up even on bad shooting nights.

He does NOT have any semblance of a superstar game. He's a chucker who eurosteps his way to a lot of free points. It's boring and irritating to watch. When Tim Duncan puts Pau into the brick oven, I'm okay watching it. "Wow that was a dope move, Tim. You bastard." But watching Harden is obnoxious and depressing.

I agree but I wouldn't bash him that much. He's a great talent, very skilled, and has good bball IQ for the most part.
Is he a superstar? No. Is he close to Kobe as some writers suggested? No. Not if you actually know basketball and make an effort in understanding what originates the stats and helps them sustain.
Like you said, he relies on FTs A LOT, and that really helps his game, but it's not like he's terrible.
With the right coaching (someone that didn't just say "put 'em up" or "run, run, run") he could be a more effective and reliable player, even if he isn't getting star treatment.
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby therealdeal on Sat Apr 20, 2013 12:31 pm

Harden would be a very solid piece for us in the future next to Howard. He's better than how he plays, which is a little intimidating. He relies on some really stupid tricks to get to the line, but he can be better than that.

Howard and Harden would be a really nice one-two punch. I think if put them with one more athletic guard you could really do some damage out there.
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby Doc Brown on Sat Apr 20, 2013 12:58 pm

Harden needs to pull his head out of his a** in crunch time, if he wants to be a true #1 on a team that goes deep into the playoffs every year.
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby wcsoldier81 on Sat Apr 20, 2013 1:25 pm

Harden is the most fabricated star by the league... the guy is hogging the ball like crazy in 4th quarters and relies on getting phantom calls and not getting called for obvious travels ... more than any other player in the league ...

he's a 3rd option on a NBA champion , nothing more
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Re: WMC 12/13: (43-37)

Postby JoelMyersScrotalSack on Sat Apr 20, 2013 1:25 pm

Rooscooter wrote:
Weezy wrote:if they CAN play this hard on defense, why the hell don't they?.


:man3: It's obvious.... I can't believe you don's see it.... it's right there in front of us...

Kobe's not on the floor therefore we'er better on both ends...... and according to some here so much better it's not even funny.....

Just imagine how much better we would be if he just gave it up and retired or we amnestied him.....


No one thinks we're better without Kobe. But we're better defensively and that's the only thing I have ever argued. Too many people get their panties in a bunch over any criticism towards Kobe like he can do no wrong on the court and it's like the notion that we're better at anything without him is considered blasphemy.
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby Finwë on Sat Apr 20, 2013 2:44 pm

Doc Brown wrote:Harden needs to pull his head out of his a** in crunch time, if he wants to be a true #1 on a team that goes deep into the playoffs every year.

Yeah his ISO plays against us were terrible down the stretch.. he sized up the defender for like 10 seconds, did nothing, forced Lin or Parsons to take a contested shot a couple of times. Awful.
"The first time I ever saw my uniform hanging in the locker I put it on right away, and it just felt like I was putting on golden armour. From that day forward, I just called it 'the golden armour', it just felt like there was something mystical and magical about it" - Kobe Bryant.
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Re: WMC 12/13: (43-37)

Postby Finwë on Sat Apr 20, 2013 2:49 pm

JoelMyersScrotalSack wrote:
Rooscooter wrote:
Weezy wrote:if they CAN play this hard on defense, why the hell don't they?.


:man3: It's obvious.... I can't believe you don's see it.... it's right there in front of us...

Kobe's not on the floor therefore we'er better on both ends...... and according to some here so much better it's not even funny.....

Just imagine how much better we would be if he just gave it up and retired or we amnestied him.....


No one thinks we're better without Kobe. But we're better defensively and that's the only thing I have ever argued. Too many people get their panties in a bunch over any criticism towards Kobe like he can do no wrong on the court and it's like the notion that we're better at anything without him is considered blasphemy.

So, basically, it comes down to this statement: Meeks > Kobe as a team defender?
Maybe, but I dunno.. I think the defensive improvement has more to do with the fact that guys were really, really ampted up to win those last couple of games, in part because of Kobe going down and wanting to win for him, in part to show that they can win by themselves too, and obviously because it was the last 2 games of the season and we had to make the playoffs...
I don't think you see any real improvement on D, say, in January if you took Kobe out and put Meeks in..
Kobe roams and gambles which burned us a couple of times but he's a much better 1 on 1 defender than Meeks, especially against guys who like to post up or take mid-range shots..
Not to mention that prior to him going down he was actually playing some great D, particurarly highlighted in the game against the Blazers.. We've been actually playing good D for a while now, with certain exceptions for a couple of stretches, but not really related to Kobe's presence or absence IMO..

Blake starting instead of Nash is much more significant defensively.
"The first time I ever saw my uniform hanging in the locker I put it on right away, and it just felt like I was putting on golden armour. From that day forward, I just called it 'the golden armour', it just felt like there was something mystical and magical about it" - Kobe Bryant.
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby The Laker Link on Sun Apr 21, 2013 12:29 pm

Achievement Unlocked

"Win for Kobe without Kobe"
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby lotus on Sun Apr 21, 2013 1:43 pm

Meeks can't make a 3pt shot to save his life. Lucky Lakers!

We need some kick out 3's to loosen up the middle so D12 and Pau can go to work!
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby KB24 on Sun Apr 21, 2013 1:48 pm

Meeks should start planting trees. He is a waste of oxygen.
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Re: WMC 12/13: #7 achieved for Kobe! (16 wins)

Postby Doc Brown on Sun Apr 21, 2013 2:04 pm

KB24 wrote:Meeks should start planting trees. He is a waste of oxygen.


I hope he's gone next year. No way he's worth more than league minimum.
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