WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby Lets Go Lakers on Mon Jul 14, 2014 4:23 pm

Weezy wrote:It's not rocket science though. If stars don't want to come here because we suck, you build with young talent and go after a star when Kobe's money is off the books. I have to think Mitch is not stupid and knows this, if so many on this board know this and we don't get paid to do that job.


That's the thing. It is so obvious and most Laker fans know this yet the actions of our FO proves they don't want to rebuild the right way. The proof is in the pudding. Even Mitch has a history of being on the side of going after stars. He's great at it but I question his ability to really rebuild the right way cause he's never really gone that route. Kobe was a West pick. Shaq was also West's move.
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby Weezy on Mon Jul 14, 2014 4:37 pm

Now you're scaring me, because I'm flashing back to Mitch giving Devean George, Luke Walton, and Sasha big contracts rather than being creative and looking elsewhere. And the Vlad Rad deal...

But eh, his trades have been a lot better than his signings I guess. It's hard for me to get too down on him this soon after the Pau trade, Ariza, Shannon Brown, and some others that led to titles only a few years ago. Too many more years of this kind of "rebuilding" and I'll be pretty down on all of this FO, they better get lucky along the way here.
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby Snakell Beast on Mon Jul 14, 2014 4:52 pm

Mitch still has my confidence. In my opinion, his home run trades have contributed more to our fat years than any bad trades or signings contributed to lean ones. He has a grace period with me. I'm not sure how long it will last, but certainly a few more free agent and draft cycles to say the least.
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby Rooscooter on Mon Jul 14, 2014 9:34 pm

Snakell Beast wrote:Mitch still has my confidence. In my opinion, his home run trades have contributed more to our fat years than any bad trades or signings contributed to lean ones. He has a grace period with me. I'm not sure how long it will last, but certainly a few more free agent and draft cycles to say the least.


Outside of the Pau trade..... what are you referencing? Howard left for nothing after the "home run". Nash is/was worthless after the home run.... Lamar was traded for a trade exception that was squandered in the Nash deal....

I'd say the trades he was afraid or unable to make have been the ones that have put us here. How many players have expired over the last few years that we could have traded for at least something. It seems that come the deadline a ton of teams move these types of guys for assets to use down the line. SA does it with surgical accuracy in fact. Indiana has done it very well.... as has GS. We, OTOH, make or try and make blockbusters only and negotiate them for weeks on end to only have them collapse at the deadline and get nothing. Not unlike this FA period where we waited on a player that wasn't going to really help us beyond giving us some sizzle for the TV contract and then did what? Made a trade for Lin, re-signed Young and Hill.... which, if done in another order, may have left us with more room to get more players from what I understand.

I'm done waiting him out. He's playing a 2008 game thinking the team is a player or two away..... it's 2014 and we're 12 players away.......
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby DarthRekal on Tue Jul 15, 2014 10:26 am

Tired of this whole forum being a wmc
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby TIME on Tue Jul 15, 2014 2:58 pm

DarthRekal wrote:Tired of this whole forum being a wmc


+10,000 :bricks:
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby puffyusaf#2 on Thu Jul 17, 2014 8:55 pm

WMC: Every thread, every transaction, every non-transaction, every utterance of the word Lakers has nothing but complaints with it. At this rate I am not sure how any one is going to watch this team.
For what it's worth, the Lakers also clinched the Pacific Division, an achievement Bryant dismissed by saying "We don't hang divisions." No, only the big NBA championship banners are considered wall-worthy for the Lakers.
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby trodgers on Thu Jul 17, 2014 9:02 pm

The Tank is dead. Long live the Tank!
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby puffyusaf#2 on Thu Jul 17, 2014 9:14 pm

trodgers wrote:The Tank is dead. Long live the Tank!

I WMC this post the Tank is alive. We need to kill the tank and then trade it for a 3-way PF/PG combo that can play defense, score, sign for 30K and cook a mean pizza pie.
For what it's worth, the Lakers also clinched the Pacific Division, an achievement Bryant dismissed by saying "We don't hang divisions." No, only the big NBA championship banners are considered wall-worthy for the Lakers.
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby D.B. Cooper on Thu Jul 17, 2014 9:23 pm

Rooscooter wrote:
Snakell Beast wrote:Mitch still has my confidence. In my opinion, his home run trades have contributed more to our fat years than any bad trades or signings contributed to lean ones. He has a grace period with me. I'm not sure how long it will last, but certainly a few more free agent and draft cycles to say the least.


Outside of the Pau trade..... what are you referencing? Howard left for nothing after the "home run". Nash is/was worthless after the home run.... Lamar was traded for a trade exception that was squandered in the Nash deal....

I'd say the trades he was afraid or unable to make have been the ones that have put us here. How many players have expired over the last few years that we could have traded for at least something. It seems that co""me the deadline a ton of teams move these types of guys for assets to use down the line. SA does it with surgical accuracy in fact. Indiana has done it very well.... as has GS. We, OTOH, make or try and make blockbusters only and negotiate them for weeks on end to only have them collapse at the deadline and get nothing. Not unlike this FA period where we waited on a player that wasn't going to really help us beyond giving us some sizzle for the TV contract and then did what? Made a trade for Lin, re-signed Young and Hill.... which, if done in another order, may have left us with more room to get more players from what I understand.

I'm done waiting him out. He's playing a 2008 game thinking the team is a player or two away..... it's 2014 and we're 12 players away.......

Oh how quickly we forget that aside from getting Pau he got key players like Ariza, Brown and Ron. Drafted Farmar, Sasha and Marc Gasol. Also Gasol was traded at the right time but we all know how that went down. Where the FO went wrong was not hiring a respectable coach. Yes they went for the home run hit with Howard and Nash and failed but it was probably one of the last few wishes ol man Buss had and the FO complied.

And SA hasn't had surgical accuracy either, they thought they hit a home run when they traded for RJ and struck out. SA excels because the coach and GM are on the same page. Even so Tim and Kobe have the same ring count with Timmy not being able to three peat.
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby dj vitus on Fri Jul 18, 2014 1:38 pm

Seems like we're still trying the easy way out by attempting to hit home runs instead of building a home-grown team with a winning attitude.

Players are LEAVING us for LESS money these days! Maybe it's time to focus on actually re-building again. No star player is coming here unless we can actually win 45-50 games with a home-grown team.
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby halekulani on Fri Jul 18, 2014 8:16 pm

some of ya'll are so impatient
we've seen more trips to the finals in the kobe era than some fans will see in their entire lives

the lakers could literally not win for the rest of my life and i'd still have seen more championships than like 20 other fan bases.

nobody needs to get fired, esp mitch. a rebuild is a rebuild. at least give him the opportunity to rebuild after kobe retires.
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby LakerJack on Fri Jul 18, 2014 8:38 pm

Positive I cant find 5 teams worse than the Lakers this year. That means another lotto pick. Hopefully Kobe shuts it down after Xmas to save up for next year.
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby puffyusaf#2 on Sun Aug 10, 2014 7:04 am

LakerJack wrote:Positive I cant find 5 teams worse than the Lakers this year. That means another lotto pick. Hopefully Kobe shuts it down after Xmas to save up for next year.

not 5? This may be the earliest "Kobe shut it down" post i have ever seen :bow:
For what it's worth, the Lakers also clinched the Pacific Division, an achievement Bryant dismissed by saying "We don't hang divisions." No, only the big NBA championship banners are considered wall-worthy for the Lakers.
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby LTLakerFan on Sun Aug 10, 2014 9:55 am

LakerJack wrote:Positive I cant find 5 teams worse than the Lakers this year. That means another lotto pick. Hopefully Kobe shuts it down after Xmas to save up for next year.


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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby puffyusaf#2 on Sun Aug 10, 2014 10:42 am

Im still waiting for the 5 teams we are actually better than
For what it's worth, the Lakers also clinched the Pacific Division, an achievement Bryant dismissed by saying "We don't hang divisions." No, only the big NBA championship banners are considered wall-worthy for the Lakers.
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby Toklat on Sun Aug 10, 2014 11:42 pm

Doesn't happen to be a few people around prone to panicking is there??....lol
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby Rooscooter on Mon Aug 11, 2014 9:30 am

D.B. Cooper wrote:
Rooscooter wrote:
Snakell Beast wrote:Mitch still has my confidence. In my opinion, his home run trades have contributed more to our fat years than any bad trades or signings contributed to lean ones. He has a grace period with me. I'm not sure how long it will last, but certainly a few more free agent and draft cycles to say the least.


Outside of the Pau trade..... what are you referencing? Howard left for nothing after the "home run". Nash is/was worthless after the home run.... Lamar was traded for a trade exception that was squandered in the Nash deal....

I'd say the trades he was afraid or unable to make have been the ones that have put us here. How many players have expired over the last few years that we could have traded for at least something. It seems that co""me the deadline a ton of teams move these types of guys for assets to use down the line. SA does it with surgical accuracy in fact. Indiana has done it very well.... as has GS. We, OTOH, make or try and make blockbusters only and negotiate them for weeks on end to only have them collapse at the deadline and get nothing. Not unlike this FA period where we waited on a player that wasn't going to really help us beyond giving us some sizzle for the TV contract and then did what? Made a trade for Lin, re-signed Young and Hill.... which, if done in another order, may have left us with more room to get more players from what I understand.

I'm done waiting him out. He's playing a 2008 game thinking the team is a player or two away..... it's 2014 and we're 12 players away.......

Oh how quickly we forget that aside from getting Pau he got key players like Ariza, Brown and Ron. Drafted Farmar, Sasha and Marc Gasol. Also Gasol was traded at the right time but we all know how that went down. Where the FO went wrong was not hiring a respectable coach. Yes they went for the home run hit with Howard and Nash and failed but it was probably one of the last few wishes ol man Buss had and the FO complied.

And SA hasn't had surgical accuracy either, they thought they hit a home run when they traded for RJ and struck out. SA excels because the coach and GM are on the same page. Even so Tim and Kobe have the same ring count with Timmy not being able to three peat.


Oh... how quickly we move to just one side of those transactions. Pau might have been traded at the right time but no reason not to finish the intention. Sasha, Farmar, Brown and Ariza were let go for nothing. Artest was only signed to a deal that was way too long because Mitch couldn't deal with Ariza's agent. Oh... I know.... it's all Ariza's agent's fault.... it's always that way when Mitch strikes out around here.

Giving Mitch an out and laying it on the death bed of Ol Man Buss is beyond apologetic IMHO. Mitch gets paid to make decisions for the Owners. I'll say it again.... if he's just a puppet for them (as most here contend when something doesn't go well) then he needs to go.... if not then this current team and our near future prospects are on him..... and he needs to go.

Finally.... I love how you relate Timmy's and Kobe's individual ring counts into a team and player acquisition post. Which is it? Players winning rings or organizations? Can't have it each way unless you believe that 4 stooges and Tim/Kobe win rings.....
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby Vasashi17 on Mon Aug 11, 2014 4:06 pm

^^^Agreed! Mitch is most definitely part of the problem. During the 3peat, he was pretty bad at prolonging that championship window and was in the dog house with the fanbase till the Pau deal.

But here's the most damning IMHO. West is known for Shaq/Kobe and Mitch is known for Pau/CP3/Dwight....looking around, only one guy remains from that group. The fact that Mitch is still piggy-backing off of West's guy pretty much tells me, that Houston isn't the only one with a problem.
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby abeer3 on Fri Aug 15, 2014 6:43 pm

I was on board with what the FO was doing...until the lin trade/hill signing. I understand the star-chasing, but when it fails, you don't just re-load for another round--especially when very few stars project to be available in the near future. they should have looked for better long term pieces with the cap space this year. instead, they rolled it over. that's loser mentality, imo.
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby unpossibl1 on Fri Aug 15, 2014 7:32 pm

abeer3 wrote:I was on board with what the FO was doing...until the lin trade/hill signing. I understand the star-chasing, but when it fails, you don't just re-load for another round--especially when very few stars project to be available in the near future. they should have looked for better long term pieces with the cap space this year. instead, they rolled it over. that's loser mentality, imo.


The Lin trade was a solid one because he's a quality PG and we got a first rounder too. Can't argue with the return we got for pure cap space. The Hill deal...well, he was the only center truly available, but it does hurt that Lance Stephenson essentially got the same money as Hill. He would have been a nice addition. Isaiah Thomas would have been a great pickup as well, and we could have had him for slightly more than we paid Nick Young. I love Swaggy but IT has way more upside and is the better player.

I would've liked to see the Lakers at least return to respectable status by adding guys like Stephenson or IT, especially since the contract they received will be easily tradeable should a superstar become available. Unless the goal is to tank hard enough to keep our pick next summer (which would be extremely difficult and damaging to the franchise) I don't think this offseason was a success at all. Rolling over the cap space only works if a 2015 Fa signs with us and I don't think that's something we can count on.
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby The Rock on Tue Aug 19, 2014 11:37 pm

Hello there :jam2:
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby BDG on Wed Aug 20, 2014 3:57 am

halekulani wrote:some of ya'll are so impatient
we've seen more trips to the finals in the kobe era than some fans will see in their entire lives

the lakers could literally not win for the rest of my life and i'd still have seen more championships than like 20 other fan bases.

nobody needs to get fired, esp mitch. a rebuild is a rebuild. at least give him the opportunity to rebuild after kobe retires.
This. This. This.

People forget it took 12 years from the end of the Showtime era until we won our next championship. And we had Jerry West running things!

Forget about the Randy Pfund era? The awful Magic Johnson coaching run? We had exciting players like Van Exel, Jones, Ceballos and Threatt but we were a mediocre team until Shaq got here. And even then, we didn't win a damn thing until Kobe turned into a star after a couple years.

And again, let's not blame Mitch for failing at prolonging the Kobe-Pau era. Blake and Barnes were great offseason acquisitions at the time but that team just ran out of gas. And you don't radically shake up a squad that just won back to back titles, you give them the opportunity to prove they can do it again while improving the supporting cast (which Kupchak did).

Then when he realized that core had run its course, he traded Pau/LO for CP3 only to have the league block it. Not his fault. Would have been the catalyst to assemble a CP3/Kobe/Dwight core and I'm pretty damn sure that team would have at the very least been in the hunt for a title. If that move happens, D'Antoni probably never ends up here and Kobe never tears his tendon either. It cost us a prime Odom as well, who could have been a valuable asset either on the team or in trade. To be fair, it was a series of very unfortunate and weird events. Kupchak new when the time was up for that team but got blocked by Stern.

These things take time, stars have to align, etc. And having large contracts with both Hill & Lin can prove valuable in trades when they're expiring. Remember Kwame Brown?

I really hope we can somehow get Kobe at least one more championship ring. But if we don't it's understandable. It's also tough to sell free agents to play here when Kobe's health is still a question mark. No Kobe, no ring.

We just have to keep collecting youth and looking for opportunities in trade. I think banking it all on free agency is risky. But you gotta take risks is you want to win. Eventually I have faith we'll pull off another home run move.
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby Center Court on Wed Aug 20, 2014 9:44 am

IF we do end up with out pick in this years draft: KARL TOWNS JR

just throwing that out there way ahead of time. I'd grow a chubby to see a Towns/Randle front court.
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Re: WMC 14/15: The Lost Cause! Tank 2014

Postby lakerfan2 on Wed Aug 20, 2014 11:01 am

Center Court wrote:IF we do end up with out pick in this years draft: KARL TOWNS JR

just throwing that out there way ahead of time. I'd grow a chubby to see a Towns/Randle front court.


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