Kobe Thread: Bucher- Kobe = Father of Team USA Success p.819

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby checkers09 on Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:21 am

Image
Trevor Ariza wearing a Kobe Bryant jersey in Philadelphia.
http://instagram.com/trevorariza

Yet as I watched him Monday, I could not help think how little it mattered and how right he is. He is not fading into the shadows. He does not know how to go out that way.[.]
User avatar
checkers09

 
Posts: 304
Joined: Thu May 05, 2011 1:38 pm

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby LTLakerFan on Tue Jul 23, 2013 1:34 pm

lakerfan2 wrote:
HighlyFavored wrote:Vanessa better be careful...if she keep refusing to get pregnant, then Kobe will find a woman who will get pregnant and give him a son......I just hope that woman is tall, black, and athletic.


Does Dwight Howard count?

/burn


:man4: :man10: :lol: :lg2k3:
LTLakerFan

 
Posts: 6389
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 10:44 pm
Location: SoCal

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby lAKERfaNaticKID on Wed Jul 24, 2013 8:29 am

So Kobe said he has another 3-4 years of playing in him...what do you think he's contract will look like? I have a friend here at work saying he won't sign for less then 22 million a year...he saying 3 years at 23 million a year...that's almost max!
lAKERfaNaticKID

 
Posts: 685
Joined: Wed Dec 24, 2008 11:07 am

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby therealdeal on Wed Jul 24, 2013 9:28 am

Kobe will do what it takes to win. I firmly believe that. If we have a chance to sign two max deals this summer, he'll not stand in the way of that. If we really only have a shot at one, he'll take a one year deal worth more money. But if we have a shot at Carmelo and/or LeBron, he'll let the team do that and he'll take whatever is left.

I firmly believe that.
Stu : "Yeah, that's an old fashioned whoopin'."
therealdeal
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 40333
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2008 3:03 pm

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby lakerfan2 on Wed Jul 24, 2013 10:20 am

Kobe should sign a 20m/2yr - 2nd year Player option.

And then, 2015, Kobe opts out, takes vet min, sign Durant, win.

Kobe
Durant
Lebron
Melo
Dead Body

:man10:
#OURHOUSE
User avatar
lakerfan2

 
Posts: 9887
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2007 5:23 pm

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby trodgers on Wed Jul 24, 2013 11:01 am

I'll be that dead body.
blog.travisjrodgers.com
Its like Dr. Buss is guarding the Celtic rim this second half. Nothings dropping
User avatar
trodgers
Site Manager
 
Posts: 46548
Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2004 6:31 pm
Location: Orlando

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby SK8 on Thu Jul 25, 2013 3:36 pm

Dope footage of Kobe training with Dream :bow: :bow:




The second place means you're the first loser
ex Uncle Drew
User avatar
SK8

 
Posts: 1503
Joined: Tue Feb 08, 2011 11:26 am

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby therealdeal on Thu Jul 25, 2013 4:05 pm

I've watched those videos a dozen times before but it's always fun. It's really cool to see Kobe learning. It's easy to see that he picks up things quickly. He has an attention to detail and he doesn't move on until he feels he's learned the material.

Hakeem must have had a blast teaching someone who actually has the capacity to learn and utilize these moves. That baseline shake... I mean Jordan used it too, but Kobe's taken the best footwork from both of them and turned it into his own shot.
Stu : "Yeah, that's an old fashioned whoopin'."
therealdeal
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 40333
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2008 3:03 pm

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby LTLakerFan on Thu Jul 25, 2013 7:08 pm

lAKERfaNaticKID wrote:So Kobe said he has another 3-4 years of playing in him...what do you think he's contract will look like? I have a friend here at work saying he won't sign for less then 22 million a year...he saying 3 years at 23 million a year...that's almost max!


Why does your friend know Jeff Goldblum or something? Only him or Woj are listened to here.
LTLakerFan

 
Posts: 6389
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 10:44 pm
Location: SoCal

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby Punk-101 on Thu Jul 25, 2013 7:21 pm

Where does Kobe rank all-time in post fundamental skills? The obvious candidates are Hakeem, Mchale, Duncan, Kareem, but I'm sure there are some old school guys Roos will bust out. Without knowing any obscure guys, I'd put kobe close to top 5.
Image
“Action has meaning only in relationship; and without understanding relationship, action on any level will only breed conflict. The understanding of relationship is infinitely more important than the search for any plan of action.”
-Jiddu Krishnamurti
User avatar
Punk-101

 
Posts: 13264
Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2005 3:24 pm
Location: Orange, CA

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby LTLakerFan on Thu Jul 25, 2013 7:29 pm

therealdeal wrote:I've watched those videos a dozen times before but it's always fun. It's really cool to see Kobe learning. It's easy to see that he picks up things quickly. He has an attention to detail and he doesn't move on until he feels he's learned the material.

Hakeem must have had a blast teaching someone who actually has the capacity to learn and utilize these moves. That baseline shake... I mean Jordan used it too, but Kobe's taken the best footwork from both of them and turned it into his own shot.


Notice how for the most part Kobe keeps his yap shut and listens. I can't see Dwight shutting up long before he has to crack a joke or rip a fart for effect. Too much work. Even if he were to pick up the intricacies or the "shake" (highly doubtful) he still has no touch or soft release. Just like Kwame.
LTLakerFan

 
Posts: 6389
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 10:44 pm
Location: SoCal

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby lakersin4 on Thu Jul 25, 2013 7:52 pm

That's why it's so easy to be a fan of Kobe Bryant.. How many players that deep in their career still get visually excited when they learn a new move? Kobe has dedicated himself to improving his game more than I've seen any other human dedicate themselves to doing anything.. It's been an honor to watch his career thus far & if anyone can figure out a way to adjust & keep performing at a top level for 3+ more seasons, it's Kobe.
lakersin4

 
Posts: 2377
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:02 pm

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby Finwë on Thu Jul 25, 2013 9:00 pm

Punk-101 wrote:Where does Kobe rank all-time in post fundamental skills? The obvious candidates are Hakeem, Mchale, Duncan, Kareem, but I'm sure there are some old school guys Roos will bust out. Without knowing any obscure guys, I'd put kobe close to top 5.

I think he's definitely top 5, and top 2 as a guard along MJ.

He's one of the most versatile post players ever. I think effective versatility has to be accounted for when you're talking "fundamentals". People often say Duncan is the most fundamentally sound player in the game but I feel that's not the case. He doesn't really have a jumpshot on the block (he's got that face-up bank shot but that's it), he doesn't really use his left hand often, and actually relies on 1 or 2 go-to moves, hasn't really shown to be as effectively versatile as someone like Hakeem, Kobe, MJ or even Pau Gasol. Obviously he's great, but I just feel there's a misconception about what it entails to truly be fundamentally sound.
"The first time I ever saw my uniform hanging in the locker I put it on right away, and it just felt like I was putting on golden armour. From that day forward, I just called it 'the golden armour', it just felt like there was something mystical and magical about it" - Kobe Bryant.
User avatar
Finwë

 
Posts: 8079
Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2011 4:32 pm

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby TIME on Fri Jul 26, 2013 12:39 am

Punk-101 wrote:Where does Kobe rank all-time in post fundamental skills? The obvious candidates are Hakeem, Mchale, Duncan, Kareem, but I'm sure there are some old school guys Roos will bust out. Without knowing any obscure guys, I'd put kobe close to top 5.



There are a lot of old school players that were better than Kobe in the post because the game was mostly played there. Now, everything is athleticism from the wings or stand at the three point line and chuck.

Here are a few more great post players:

Wilt
Elgin Baylor
Moses
Big O
Big E
Bill Walton
Adrian Dantley
Mailman
Bob Lanier
Artis Gilmore
Wes Unseld
Worthy
Bird (overshadowed as a post player because McHale was so great there)
Parish (same)
I'm lost in the fog of denial!
User avatar
TIME
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 9472
Joined: Thu Jun 09, 2005 11:06 am

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby Finwë on Fri Jul 26, 2013 1:41 am

^ TIME, where do you think Kobe would rank among the best post players of all-time? And among guards?
"The first time I ever saw my uniform hanging in the locker I put it on right away, and it just felt like I was putting on golden armour. From that day forward, I just called it 'the golden armour', it just felt like there was something mystical and magical about it" - Kobe Bryant.
User avatar
Finwë

 
Posts: 8079
Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2011 4:32 pm

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby SirJunkyBen on Fri Jul 26, 2013 4:03 am

thanks very much for those videos Uncle Drew they were very intriguing
SirJunkyBen

 
Posts: 27
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 7:17 am
Location: Australia

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby LTLakerFan on Fri Jul 26, 2013 9:24 am

TIME wrote:
Punk-101 wrote:Where does Kobe rank all-time in post fundamental skills? The obvious candidates are Hakeem, Mchale, Duncan, Kareem, but I'm sure there are some old school guys Roos will bust out. Without knowing any obscure guys, I'd put kobe close to top 5.



There are a lot of old school players that were better than Kobe in the post because the game was mostly played there. Now, everything is athleticism from the wings or stand at the three point line and chuck.

Here are a few more great post players:

Wilt
Elgin Baylor
Moses
Big O
Big E
Bill Walton
Adrian Dantley
Mailman
Bob Lanier
Artis Gilmore
Wes Unseld
Worthy
Bird (overshadowed as a post player because McHale was so great there)
Parish (same)


I have a very hard time believing that most or possibly any of those players, aside from Hakeem and Jordan discussed above, had the sheer "precision" and "variety" and "speed" of footwork and offensive moves that Kobe has developed with his back to the basket, from going to school on ALL the best before him. Sure they were great in there because they were exceptional and they were Big Men.

Elgin and Adrian similar "height", but everything else compared strictly back to the basket, from back then to what Kobe does in his prime best back to the basket game, I think Kobe had more.
LTLakerFan

 
Posts: 6389
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 10:44 pm
Location: SoCal

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby TIME on Fri Jul 26, 2013 10:37 am

Finwë wrote:^ TIME, where do you think Kobe would rank among the best post players of all-time? And among guards?


Hard to say since there were so many post players in those days. I can say without hesitation that Kobe is the #1 or #1A in the post among all current players along with Duncan.

All time post guards: Big O was unstoppable in the post. MJ was amazing in his 30+ years. I think Kobe is as good as either of them in the post, he just, so far, has not spent as much time down there as they did. I expect we will see Kobe come into his own as a post player in the next three years. At least I hope so.
I'm lost in the fog of denial!
User avatar
TIME
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 9472
Joined: Thu Jun 09, 2005 11:06 am

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby therealdeal on Fri Jul 26, 2013 10:41 am

I'm not sold on some of those bigger guys being BETTER than Kobe as far as strict post work goes. I'm not sold Wilt or Lanier had better post moves and footwork...

But I will grant you that they were far more EFFECTIVE in the post because of their size and athleticism. Wilt wasn't the greatest at creating a variety of shots from the post, but he was damn effective down there. Like Shaq. Shaq wasn't the greatest post player ever, but he was sure effective down there.
Stu : "Yeah, that's an old fashioned whoopin'."
therealdeal
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 40333
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2008 3:03 pm

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby TIME on Fri Jul 26, 2013 10:42 am

LTLakerFan wrote:
TIME wrote:
Punk-101 wrote:Where does Kobe rank all-time in post fundamental skills? The obvious candidates are Hakeem, Mchale, Duncan, Kareem, but I'm sure there are some old school guys Roos will bust out. Without knowing any obscure guys, I'd put kobe close to top 5.



There are a lot of old school players that were better than Kobe in the post because the game was mostly played there. Now, everything is athleticism from the wings or stand at the three point line and chuck.

Here are a few more great post players:

Wilt
Elgin Baylor
Moses
Big O
Big E
Bill Walton
Adrian Dantley
Mailman
Bob Lanier
Artis Gilmore
Wes Unseld
Worthy
Bird (overshadowed as a post player because McHale was so great there)
Parish (same)


I have a very hard time believing that most or possibly any of those players, aside from Hakeem and Jordan discussed above, had the sheer "precision" and "variety" and "speed" of footwork and offensive moves that Kobe has developed with his back to the basket, from going to school on ALL the best before him. Sure they were great in there because they were exceptional and they were Big Men.

Elgin and Adrian similar "height", but everything else compared strictly back to the basket, from back then to what Kobe does in his prime best back to the basket game, I think Kobe had more.


No doubt, Kobe is as slick as anyone in post skills. I realize the original question Punk asked was focused purely on skill, but I broadened the answer to describe best post players. It kind of depends on what matters most to you. For instance, while everyone touts Hakeem as the ultimate post player, I will take prime Kareem over prime Hakeem all day long. Hakeem had quicker feet, greater overall quickness, and a greater variety of post moves and shots, but Kareem was the better post player because he could do one thing from any spot in the post so exceptionally well that he could not be stopped.
I'm lost in the fog of denial!
User avatar
TIME
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 9472
Joined: Thu Jun 09, 2005 11:06 am

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby TIME on Fri Jul 26, 2013 10:47 am

therealdeal wrote:I'm not sold on some of those bigger guys being BETTER than Kobe as far as strict post work goes. I'm not sold Wilt or Lanier had better post moves and footwork...

But I will grant you that they were far more EFFECTIVE in the post because of their size and athleticism. Wilt wasn't the greatest at creating a variety of shots from the post, but he was damn effective down there. Like Shaq. Shaq wasn't the greatest post player ever, but he was sure effective down there.


I'm going to take you to task, you young whippersnapper... :man2:

Wilt had an an array of shots in the post from every conceivable spot and angle in the post. His foot work was phenomenal for a man his size.

On the Shaq point, see my post above for the skill / variety versus effectiveness in defining what makes a great post player. Shaq was not the greatest post player ever, but he certainly is in the top 5 all time. Who cares about skill when you can dunk on anyone all game long?
I'm lost in the fog of denial!
User avatar
TIME
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 9472
Joined: Thu Jun 09, 2005 11:06 am

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby therealdeal on Fri Jul 26, 2013 10:51 am

:man10:

Maybe I'm just foggy this morning, but I remember him really using this move:
-Wilt on either block, let's say left.
-He dribbles with the left hand towards the middle of the basket
-He uses his right hand to duck over/around the defender and lay it in/dunk it

That was the move I remember seeing the most. I know he had other moves, but for the most part that's what I remember. Please correct me though, I can sometimes have a terrible memory for these things.
Stu : "Yeah, that's an old fashioned whoopin'."
therealdeal
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 40333
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2008 3:03 pm

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby TIME on Fri Jul 26, 2013 11:14 am

therealdeal wrote::man10:

Maybe I'm just foggy this morning, but I remember him really using this move:
-Wilt on either block, let's say left.
-He dribbles with the left hand towards the middle of the basket
-He uses his right hand to duck over/around the defender and lay it in/dunk it

That was the move I remember seeing the most. I know he had other moves, but for the most part that's what I remember. Please correct me though, I can sometimes have a terrible memory for these things.


There are a few decent youtube Wilt vids but I don't have them bookmarked. He of course had dunks with either hand, he had the finger roll, he had kind of a half jump hook-push shot, and he had a solid turn around fade away. But, the thing was he could do any of those from any starting spot in the post. Wilt tends to get overlooked in post skills because he gets thrown into the overpowering brute category with Shaq, but he was more skilled than Shaq and really took pride in his skills, not just his brute strength and size.
I'm lost in the fog of denial!
User avatar
TIME
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 9472
Joined: Thu Jun 09, 2005 11:06 am

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby TIME on Fri Jul 26, 2013 11:17 am

The first shot he takes in this vid show his turn around for an example.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8xr3i9jpiTE[/youtube]

I have no idea why the video did not imbed. :man3:
I'm lost in the fog of denial!
User avatar
TIME
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 9472
Joined: Thu Jun 09, 2005 11:06 am

Re: Wolverine Discussion: 3 months ahead of schedule! p.682

Postby Punk-101 on Fri Jul 26, 2013 11:22 am

Put it this way, for fun. If Kobe was 7' 280lbs, playing primarily in the post; with his footwork, shooting touch, body control, coordination, understanding of spacing and creating space and getting to his sweet spots, and mental awareness to use which move and which counter move, where would he rank in the broader question of effective post players?
Image
“Action has meaning only in relationship; and without understanding relationship, action on any level will only breed conflict. The understanding of relationship is infinitely more important than the search for any plan of action.”
-Jiddu Krishnamurti
User avatar
Punk-101

 
Posts: 13264
Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2005 3:24 pm
Location: Orange, CA

PreviousNext

Return to Lakers Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot], strategos and 16 guests

cron
Advertise Here | Privacy Policy | ©2008 Sculu Sports. Come Strong.