Xavier Henry Discussion: Xmin

Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby Punk-101 on Mon Oct 07, 2013 12:15 pm

Wes was given the green light last night, actually i think he was commanded to be aggressive. He tried, but sucked. Hopefully whatever is holding him down goes away.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby Lakerjones on Mon Oct 07, 2013 12:39 pm

^^ And Wes played the SF last night finally, not the PF spot (Williams did a great job there). I didn't love what I saw. I agree a bit with what Roo said about him - he's an athlete for sure, but he doesn't seem very basketball savvy to me. Not just lack of experience, but that he doesn't seem to really get where he should be on either end of the court. He's like the Anti-Ariza that way. Ariza was a smart player who inherently knew where to be, especially on help defense. Wes looks lost. I don't think he's really starting material. But with his length and athleticism maybe they can develop him.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby therealdeal on Mon Oct 07, 2013 1:53 pm

I know he's being told he has the green light, but it's not the same as guys like Xavier or Nick. Those guys are creators and Wes is not. So far we've asked him to be a creator in the offense and to play PF. What? That's crazy. Play the guy to his strengths: defensive guy who shoots open shots and cuts to the basket. That should be his niche and that should be his green light.

Not taking guys off the dribble from the 3 point line. That's not now nor has it ever been a strength of his.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby Weezy on Mon Oct 07, 2013 1:58 pm

I agree he isn't being used right. He should be a catch and shoot guy, a find while cutting to the basket guy, and a fast break finisher. He is not a guy that should be trying to take guys off the dribble on the perimeter. Mainly he should be used for defense IMO though.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby therealdeal on Mon Oct 07, 2013 2:05 pm

Weezy wrote:I agree he isn't being used right. He should be a catch and shoot guy, a find while cutting to the basket guy, and a fast break finisher. He is not a guy that should be trying to take guys off the dribble on the perimeter. Mainly he should be used for defense IMO though.

Yeah that's what I'm saying. He seriously cannot handle the ball. I think I could probably do better than him. But defensively along the perimeter he can be solid and honestly it's why I'd prefer him in the starting lineup. Although so far it looks like Henry might deserve it the most.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby Aonex on Mon Oct 07, 2013 2:10 pm

In the real world, the day Steph awoke at 9 a.m. to begin his Ustream show, Kobe Bryant probably awoke at the same time, even if it was 6 a.m. in California, and lifted weights.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby last stand on Mon Oct 07, 2013 2:11 pm

Xavier is more skilled than Wes. Both guys were high picks but one was a great athlete who kind of is another in a long line of Syracuse athletes who struggle with the MBA transition

The other is a top 3 high school recruit with all of he physical talent and the right skillset who absolutely flopped in college and early NBA for some reason

Both guys have potential, and both should be kept but at 22 years old Xavier is the really interesting one because coming out of high school this guy was supposed to be a scoring machine and something mentally blocked him

You see the talent, the ability to use his tank build to get to the rim at will, but something obviously is wrong with him upstairs that has prevented him from reaching that potential even a little bit in college or the NBA
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby Punk-101 on Mon Oct 07, 2013 2:43 pm

therealdeal wrote:I know he's being told he has the green light, but it's not the same as guys like Xavier or Nick. Those guys are creators and Wes is not. So far we've asked him to be a creator in the offense and to play PF. What? That's crazy. Play the guy to his strengths: defensive guy who shoots open shots and cuts to the basket. That should be his niche and that should be his green light.

Not taking guys off the dribble from the 3 point line. That's not now nor has it ever been a strength of his.

This may validate Roos' point about him not understanding the game at the pro level. Maybe he doesn't understand where and when to be in the offense to get those open looks or cuts to the basket. Maybe he's the anti-Jamison, who had no athleticism yet knew the game at a cerebral level to find those cracks/open spots on the floor. Or, maybe it falls on the coach for not getting him to understand where to be, what to do, and when. Obviously we are going to give he and MDA more time to do just that. We'll see.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby Balla4life8 on Mon Oct 07, 2013 2:54 pm

Kobe Bryant just followed him on twiiter. The Mamba from germany is watching and approves. :jam2:
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby therealdeal on Mon Oct 07, 2013 2:55 pm

Punk-101 wrote:
therealdeal wrote:I know he's being told he has the green light, but it's not the same as guys like Xavier or Nick. Those guys are creators and Wes is not. So far we've asked him to be a creator in the offense and to play PF. What? That's crazy. Play the guy to his strengths: defensive guy who shoots open shots and cuts to the basket. That should be his niche and that should be his green light.

Not taking guys off the dribble from the 3 point line. That's not now nor has it ever been a strength of his.

This may validate Roos' point about him not understanding the game at the pro level. Maybe he doesn't understand where and when to be in the offense to get those open looks or cuts to the basket. Maybe he's the anti-Jamison, who had no athleticism yet knew the game at a cerebral level to find those cracks/open spots on the floor. Or, maybe it falls on the coach for not getting him to understand where to be, what to do, and when. Obviously we are going to give he and MDA more time to do just that. We'll see.

I mean it's two games in which he's been played out of position. I'd say it's been failure on both sides. I don't know that I'd question his understanding of the game just yet, that's extreme. He's a kid who's got some tools and his head and heart are in the right place. The team needs to understand his niche and give it to him. When he takes a little mid range shot I'm always happy with it. I would like to see them get him the ball on the move a little more.

I'm not going to take anything away from his first game. His second game was certainly underwhelming, but I'll give it another shot on Thursday before I start throwing his understanding under the buss.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby ElginTheGreat on Mon Oct 07, 2013 3:01 pm

last stand wrote:Xavier is more skilled than Wes. Both guys were high picks but one was a great athlete who kind of is another in a long line of Syracuse athletes who struggle with the MBA transition

The other is a top 3 high school recruit with all of he physical talent and the right skillset who absolutely flopped in college and early NBA for some reason

Both guys have potential, and both should be kept but at 22 years old Xavier is the really interesting one because coming out of high school this guy was supposed to be a scoring machine and something mentally blocked him

You see the talent, the ability to use his tank build to get to the rim at will, but something obviously is wrong with him upstairs that has prevented him from reaching that potential even a little bit in college or the NBA


I always felt like Xavier came to KU expecting to dominate right off the bat. While he was solid and showed flashes, I think you could see his frustration in making the transition to college ball. I thought he was a guy who would have benefited from sticking around a couple more seasons, but I don't knock him for leaving. The frustrations only grew when he got to the league though and here we are.

Still, he is showing he has a ton of potential and both he and his family always seemed to be pretty first class. I think we have got ourselves a steal.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby Punk-101 on Mon Oct 07, 2013 3:14 pm

therealdeal wrote:
Punk-101 wrote:
therealdeal wrote:I know he's being told he has the green light, but it's not the same as guys like Xavier or Nick. Those guys are creators and Wes is not. So far we've asked him to be a creator in the offense and to play PF. What? That's crazy. Play the guy to his strengths: defensive guy who shoots open shots and cuts to the basket. That should be his niche and that should be his green light.

Not taking guys off the dribble from the 3 point line. That's not now nor has it ever been a strength of his.

This may validate Roos' point about him not understanding the game at the pro level. Maybe he doesn't understand where and when to be in the offense to get those open looks or cuts to the basket. Maybe he's the anti-Jamison, who had no athleticism yet knew the game at a cerebral level to find those cracks/open spots on the floor. Or, maybe it falls on the coach for not getting him to understand where to be, what to do, and when. Obviously we are going to give he and MDA more time to do just that. We'll see.

I mean it's two games in which he's been played out of position. I'd say it's been failure on both sides. I don't know that I'd question his understanding of the game just yet, that's extreme. He's a kid who's got some tools and his head and heart are in the right place. The team needs to understand his niche and give it to him. When he takes a little mid range shot I'm always happy with it. I would like to see them get him the ball on the move a little more.

I'm not going to take anything away from his first game. His second game was certainly underwhelming, but I'll give it another shot on Thursday before I start throwing his understanding under the buss.

Oh absolutely. I'm not coming to any conclusions yet. Still extremely premature. I'm very much in the 'give him and coach some time to find their groove' camp. I hope it doesn't turn out to be a lack of understanding thing, cause there are some nice, level-headed, hard-working kids in the NBA that just never seem to grasp the NBA game after years of trying.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby therealdeal on Mon Oct 07, 2013 4:23 pm

Punk-101 wrote:Oh absolutely. I'm not coming to any conclusions yet. Still extremely premature. I'm very much in the 'give him and coach some time to find their groove' camp. I hope it doesn't turn out to be a lack of understanding thing, cause there are some nice, level-headed, hard-working kids in the NBA that just never seem to grasp the NBA game after years of trying.


Yeah there is. I still think that Wes isn't one of them, but maybe he proves me wrong. The offense so far hasn't been as exciting as I would like. It's a lot of one-on-one creating with only some movement. It seems like it can stagnate very quickly. Wes has definitely been a victim of that.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby dwighthowardsdad on Mon Oct 07, 2013 6:05 pm

This kid has potential. As many others have noted, he is working his way onto a roster spot. He can flat out score, has a nice set shot, and is a good finisher around the rim; he's able to absorb and finish through contact with his thick frame. He does get out of control at times which leads to turnovers but he can improve at only 22. We may have gotten a steal.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby Center Court on Mon Oct 07, 2013 6:22 pm

he's easily earned himself a spot on this roster.

I think we made 5 terrific pickups this offseason and did it under $6MM for all. Young, Wes, X, Shawne, and Jordy are going to be really good rotation players.

I don't know if Wes is going to be anything more than he's been but Henry is clearly looking like a big steal.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby Ras Algethi on Mon Oct 07, 2013 7:27 pm

I'm loving what Im' seeing from Henry thus far.

I only see two things thats really keeping him from being a really good player. One, his lack of court vision, play making. He gets the ball, he scores. Which is great but the ability to find your teammates is also crucial. Secondly, he's very left hand dominant. His off hand is weak and he rarely uses it.

He has a lot of potential though.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby last stand on Mon Oct 07, 2013 7:36 pm

Ras Algethi wrote:I'm loving what Im' seeing from Henry thus far.

I only see two things thats really keeping him from being a really good player. One, his lack of court vision, play making. He gets the ball, he scores. Which is great but the ability to find your teammates is also crucial. Secondly, he's very left hand dominant. His off hand is weak and he rarely uses it.

He has a lot of potential though.


Nick young has a similar issue. If he didn't have tunnel vision he'd be on another level than he is. Guys who can put up 17-20 points at will in every which way are rarer

Guys that can do that and are relegated to role player status are done so usually for one reason. They can't create for others
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby LTLakerFan on Mon Oct 07, 2013 8:54 pm

dwighthowardsdad wrote:This kid has potential. As many others have noted, he is working his way onto a roster spot. He can flat out score, has a nice set shot, and is a good finisher around the rim; he's able to absorb and finish through contact with his thick frame. He does get out of control at times which leads to turnovers but he can improve at only 22. We may have gotten a steal.


Yeah yeah yeah. And I agree with you 100%.

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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby Snakell Beast on Tue Oct 08, 2013 8:46 am

It seems, to me, that after a few years of struggling to find himself...the light has gone on for this 22 year old. Remember that some players struggle mightily before they reach a certain epiphany and then they explode. Also remember that a player has to be confronted with losing everything before they can realize what they have and where they are. It's two preseason games, and his ability to "explode" might mean 10-14 ppg on around 45% shooting with maybe 5 boards a game, but that is certainly a lot better than anything we have had around Kobe, especially in an athletic and hungry 22 year old frame, in a long time.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby therealdeal on Tue Oct 08, 2013 9:27 am

I just think this offense lends itself to what he needs to do: he can't handle the rock great, he's athletic, but won't blow you away, and simple pick and rolls mean easy to find passing lanes and driving lanes.

It makes the game simple for scorers who need to get into the lane to be really effective. Once he's on the team, he won't get to monopolize the ball as much, so will he remain effective? It's hard to tell at this point. I love his hard work defensively and his attitude is a huge plus. I think he'll be a valuable asset, but there's a lot that needs to be determined first.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby lakerfan2 on Tue Oct 08, 2013 12:24 pm

Is it me, or is he a little out of control when driving to the basket.

He finishes very well, but it seems he doesn't have the best handles, and he only goes right.

Love his game though.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby LakerFan1235 on Tue Oct 08, 2013 7:06 pm

You mean he only goes left? ^
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby therealdeal on Wed Oct 09, 2013 8:41 am

He still looked alright, but this is the type of game I was waiting for before I really wanted to just hand the kid a spot. He's not going to give us 15-20 points a night. I like his defense though and I think before the pre-season is over he'll have a spot on our roster.

I wouldn't be surprised if he is the reason why the team is considering taking 15 into the season.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby revgen on Wed Oct 09, 2013 9:21 am

His man defense needs work. He's a pretty good ballhawk and rotates decently, but he needs to position himself better, especially in the post.
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Re: Xavier Henry Discussion

Postby therealdeal on Wed Oct 09, 2013 9:31 am

Well he's too small for the post anyway and that's the problem we're going to have with this defense. We switch everything and rely on help defense to bother the shot. Well if the other team moves to the post, then we need to double so that Henry isn't left on island.

Defensively I like how he moves his feet on the perimeter. I don't think we'll see him locking down anyone, but he'll make them work hard for their baskets.
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