Wed. 11/16 vs. Knicks - Results Inside - Postgame comments

Postby Lakerfan36 on Thu Nov 17, 2005 2:09 am

KB8@CL wrote:Well its nice that Kobe catched some fire in the second half but it pisses me off when he keeps shooting when its not falling. Its pathetic to see him brick shot after shot. 15-36 is not exactly what I want to see.


First half he was cold but then we went 10-17 in the second half. If kobes missing his shots early in the game i still think he should keep on shooting. He'll eventually catch fire like he did tonight.
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Postby KB24 on Thu Nov 17, 2005 2:13 am

Questionmark wrote:^

I agree. If his shot isn't falling, it's time to try other things to get some points on the board. The funny thing is, how many shots does it take before a player realizes their shot isn't falling? =)

He did have quite a few FTs tonight, so I guess that's better than nothing

Well I guess after 10 years of NBA experience a player should know his status after 2 shots. I mean I usually always know if I´m hot or not. Kobe should know it too. Lets say a limit of 5. After 5 shots you must know it. I just don´t want Kobe to flush down the toilet if his shot isn´t falling. He should then try to draw fouls, drive and MOST IMPORTANT set up his teammates. We are screaming why others are passive or whatever but if Kobe takes 36 shots you can only become passive. I don´t know if the teammates are happy with that. Really I´m a huge Kobe and Laker fan but I would be pissed off he he bricks shot after shot and knowing that Kwame had troubles with Gilbert for 20 shots he will also grow frustrated with 30+ shots. I mean Kwame has done nothing so far but 4 shots are just not enaugh for any starter. Kwame needs to do more but Kobe has to also play more within the offense.
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Postby bouncyman on Thu Nov 17, 2005 3:12 am

KB8@CL wrote:Well its nice that Kobe catched some fire in the second half but it pisses me off when he keeps shooting when its not falling. Its pathetic to see him brick shot after shot. 15-36 is not exactly what I want to see. I would rather see a 11-20 shooting or something like that specially against the Knicks without any Kobe stopper. He has to play smarter. Its irresponsible to kill the flow and the momentum of the game just to get his touch back.

Its a VERY important win but this was neither a Kobe MVP performence nor a playoff team performence. AT least the defense worked in the second half and the back-court defense was great.
I just don´t understand why Kobe keeps shooting when he EXACTLY knows he will miss it? Its just stabborn and not smart. Kobe wants to show he is trying but we already know he is. In the first 3-4 games he was the best player in the league and in the last 4 he is more AI than MJ.
I know he can do better, thats why I´m angry. If I knew he can´t do better I would have been happy. Kobe is the best player in the league and the best one in creating shots for himself and he is one of the best all-rounder. If your jumper doesn´t work, you have to find ways to still be efficient on the floor.


Not sure if it's an intentional, but this portion of the post put a smile on my face. It seems like a parody almost...Kobe can't just stop shooting jumpers just because he's missing. If he stopped shooting jumpers in the second quarter because he was cold, he wouldn't have been able to score the 42 points that he scored, and we needed everyone of those. While I would have liked to see him shoot less and pass more, I'd gladly take 3 assits and 0 turnovers over 6 assists and 3 turn overs.
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Postby Lakers Dynasty 2000 on Thu Nov 17, 2005 3:18 am

hZm wrote:
Lakers Dynasty 2000 wrote:
Lakerfan36 wrote:I was at the game. i believe i saw LD2K and HzM in the beginning of the game on the big screen. Im 99% sure it was them. Ld2k was wearing his laker gear and hat and hzm was wearing a black shirt with glasses. :jam2: :jam2: :jam2:

OMG... you saw us hahahaha! We were sitting up in the premier section... good stuff. :man10:


HAHAHA! Dude you saw that? I was about to get up and pull my wallet out to show something to LD2K and as I look up I see us on the big screen. I sit back down and we try to like play it off and not look into the camera. We had good seats the first half... but for the 2nd half we moved down to the 3rd row. I didnt need any glasses to see that.

Ill post some cheap pics I took with my cell later on.

:man10:

Good stuff man; it was fun.

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Postby KB24 on Thu Nov 17, 2005 3:42 am

bouncyman wrote:
KB8@CL wrote:Well its nice that Kobe catched some fire in the second half but it pisses me off when he keeps shooting when its not falling. Its pathetic to see him brick shot after shot. 15-36 is not exactly what I want to see. I would rather see a 11-20 shooting or something like that specially against the Knicks without any Kobe stopper. He has to play smarter. Its irresponsible to kill the flow and the momentum of the game just to get his touch back.

Its a VERY important win but this was neither a Kobe MVP performence nor a playoff team performence. AT least the defense worked in the second half and the back-court defense was great.
I just don´t understand why Kobe keeps shooting when he EXACTLY knows he will miss it? Its just stabborn and not smart. Kobe wants to show he is trying but we already know he is. In the first 3-4 games he was the best player in the league and in the last 4 he is more AI than MJ.
I know he can do better, thats why I´m angry. If I knew he can´t do better I would have been happy. Kobe is the best player in the league and the best one in creating shots for himself and he is one of the best all-rounder. If your jumper doesn´t work, you have to find ways to still be efficient on the floor.


Not sure if it's an intentional, but this portion of the post put a smile on my face. It seems like a parody almost...Kobe can't just stop shooting jumpers just because he's missing. If he stopped shooting jumpers in the second quarter because he was cold, he wouldn't have been able to score the 42 points that he scored, and we needed everyone of those. While I would have liked to see him shoot less and pass more, I'd gladly take 3 assits and 0 turnovers over 6 assists and 3 turn overs.

This time it worked with the win but other times it wont. Kobe kept shooting and thats not smart. period
I don´t care if it worked or not, the point is the principle. We need Kobe points but at the end I would care less whether Kobe scores 80 or Lamar 60 or Kwame 45. I want to win and that means smart basketball, specially in the triangle. I´m a KObe fan and have ALWAYS been but sometimes he pisses me off. His biggest strength is also his biggest weakness.
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Postby DMK on Thu Nov 17, 2005 3:44 am

Lakers Dynasty 2000 wrote:
hZm wrote:
Lakers Dynasty 2000 wrote:
Lakerfan36 wrote:I was at the game. i believe i saw LD2K and HzM in the beginning of the game on the big screen. Im 99% sure it was them. Ld2k was wearing his laker gear and hat and hzm was wearing a black shirt with glasses. :jam2: :jam2: :jam2:

OMG... you saw us hahahaha! We were sitting up in the premier section... good stuff. :man10:


HAHAHA! Dude you saw that? I was about to get up and pull my wallet out to show something to LD2K and as I look up I see us on the big screen. I sit back down and we try to like play it off and not look into the camera. We had good seats the first half... but for the 2nd half we moved down to the 3rd row. I didnt need any glasses to see that.

Ill post some cheap pics I took with my cell later on.

:man10:

Good stuff man; it was fun.

The third row owned.


I bet... sounds like u fellas had a good time... i mean, how oculd you not have?... lakers WON! chea chea chea! :mhihi:
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Postby trips on Thu Nov 17, 2005 4:34 am

Seems like members here are just content with getting a win and totally blow off everything else. Remember people, we won against the knicks, yeah that's right a struggling team much like our own.

Now I love the lakers and Kobe but the last couple of games it seems that Kobe has dominated the ball and taken it away from LO.
What happened to letting the team figure out the offense and staying within team play? 36 shot attempts? Especially after 3 very poor shooting nights?

Sure we won but we need to look at the bigger picture.
Kobe won't be able to deliver us from a defeat every night, plus if he tries this hard every night he'll get burned out by the time we make the post season. This team needs to play within the offense and have players like smush, LO, Mihm, and Kwame get acustomed to contributing every night.

I rather we lose this game and later on become a better team, then have us go into the second half of the season still not knowing the offense and being lost all the time.

This is the same type of attitude that killed this team last season...
Yeah! we got a win!
who cares that we didn't play defense, who cares that we shot 24 three pointers, and who cares that we were behind all game long and managed to squeeze out a win simply by chance.

Sound familiar?

I'm glad we won but don't burn us just cause we want to see better execution....

Don't insult us cause we we're dissapointed with tonight's lack of defense...

And don't alienate us just cause we believe this team can do better and we want to see this team improve.
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Postby keyindabox on Thu Nov 17, 2005 6:20 am

DMK wrote:lmao...

We played like crap and was lucky to win...we played a crap team

we won.

get over it... a W is a W


Uhhhh we're a crap team? You know why you won right?

Kobe with a 40+ point performance and of course he was KOBE in the 2nd half, especially the 4th quarter. And if you really think the Knicks are crap, I guess you didnt watch the game. Our young guns were doing very well, at times crapping on you.
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Postby shakin on Thu Nov 17, 2005 6:45 am

Did any of you Kobe haters ever watch Michael Jordan play? I mean, come on. The guy took more bad shots than anybody in the history of the game. He had more 13-30 nights than I can remember. He had so many nights like this one it's beyond me. The main thing is that his team was close and MJ was there when it mattered. Yeah, Kobe has to take a lot of shots, expend a lot of energy, etc, but that's the Lakers. When he's 15-26 against the Clippers friday everything will even out.

damNzzi~ wrote:
hype wrote:
damNzzi~ wrote:
DMK wrote:lakers win...

Kobe MVP...

Im happy!


With 41,6 % shooting in this game.

Hardly MVP type numbers.... :freak2:


whats wrong with you :man3:


Nothing , man. I just get really upset that Kobe's "hot shooting" 2:nd half eclipses his BAD BAD BAD 1:st half performance. Kobe could play so much more efficient/better that it makes me sad watching him jack up 36 friggin shots...

Ah well , let it rest now.

PS. If Lakers would had lost , and Kobe wudnt had that "hot shooting" 2:nd half people would be agreeing with me wholeheartedly. Momentum people....momentum.... :boxing1:
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Postby Startrex on Thu Nov 17, 2005 8:19 am

KB8@CL wrote:Well its nice that Kobe catched some fire in the second half but it pisses me off when he keeps shooting when its not falling. Its pathetic to see him brick shot after shot. 15-36 is not exactly what I want to see. I would rather see a 11-20 shooting or something like that specially against the Knicks without any Kobe stopper. He has to play smarter. Its irresponsible to kill the flow and the momentum of the game just to get his touch back.

Its a VERY important win but this was neither a Kobe MVP performence nor a playoff team performence. AT least the defense worked in the second half and the back-court defense was great.
I just don´t understand why Kobe keeps shooting when he EXACTLY knows he will miss it? Its just stabborn and not smart. Kobe wants to show he is trying but we already know he is. In the first 3-4 games he was the best player in the league and in the last 4 he is more AI than MJ.
I know he can do better, thats why I´m angry. If I knew he can´t do better I would have been happy. Kobe is the best player in the league and the best one in creating shots for himself and he is one of the best all-rounder. If your jumper doesn´t work, you have to find ways to still be efficient on the floor.

These days it feels like you take away his jumper and he kills the team. he has SO many ways to be effective, just needs to use them. Maybe its an order by Jax the way Kobe plays, nobody knows it.

The triangle has been anything but a high efficient offense. Our terrible spacing makes it barely possible to drive. Our bigs are also asked to do a better job. Mihm had 3 good games in a raw. props for that. And Bynum with 2 blocks AGAIN in 6 minutes. WOW and Lamar needs to show some efficiency. WTF with those amount of 3s?


I share your pain K. Just like many here, I am a die hard fan of Kobe. And I am not happy with him taking so many shots while he was not hot. He needs to trust his teammates more when he does not shoot well. IWhile I understand that he often is looking for and-1 plays when he drives to the basket, he needs to trust Mihm or other guys down under more. Mihm was wide open when he tried to beat 3 men yesterday. He got fouled but Mihm could have been the one making the and-1 easily. Did PJ ask him to shoot more for the time being? I am still puzzled by lack of disciplined reminders from Phil.

At this pace... shooting below 44% and tons of shots to reach 40+ points won't be impressive enough to convinve voters for an MVP season (although AI did get an MVP vote with less than 40% shooting). Kobe needs to realize when he is hot and not. There are always two open men when three players are surrounding him under the basket.
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Postby shakin on Thu Nov 17, 2005 8:50 am

So you'd rather he stopped shooting when he was 3-11 or whatever? Hmm... well that would have been nice, wouldn't it? Where exactly are we going to get any offense then?

Sure, he was cold and having problems, but our offense isn't there yet so we have to rely on Kobe a little too much. There are flashes of the triangle flowing together, but right now it's still too early. When push comes to shove, we need Kobe.

You'd rather Kobe be cold and then just not shoot huh? Well, it would have been interesting to see how the Lakers would have gotten out of that jam, wouldn't it. Sure, he needs to make better decisions sometimes but without him, we don't win that game. Without him stepping up, we don't coast to a victory at all. For now, we are going to have to rely on Kobe heavily until we're a team that understands the offense completely and everybody knows their spots.
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Postby strikemode14 on Thu Nov 17, 2005 9:52 am

IS it me or anyone else concern that Kobe had to put up 42 and Starbury had only 4 points and we only won like by 5. :man3: For that matter we gave up 92 points without Starbury being a big factor. That's not good. Plus we were letting Frye and Lee look like all-stars out there. Lee is an okay player but, not 21 point good. :disagree:
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Postby Lakers4Eva on Thu Nov 17, 2005 9:58 am

trpldblr_8 wrote:Seems like members here are just content with getting a win and totally blow off everything else. Remember people, we won against the knicks, yeah that's right a struggling team much like our own.

Thats the key factor right there that people seem to be missing.
Of course Im happy with the win but a good team would of killed us last night, becasue they didnt play well, thats all im saying.
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Postby singap0reanb0i on Thu Nov 17, 2005 10:19 am

Lakers4Eva wrote:
trpldblr_8 wrote:Seems like members here are just content with getting a win and totally blow off everything else. Remember people, we won against the knicks, yeah that's right a struggling team much like our own.

Thats the key factor right there that people seem to be missing.
Of course Im happy with the win but a good team would of killed us last night, becasue they didnt play well, thats all im saying.


yeah i know what u say.. if u look at the stats its like kobes doing way too much and the rest are doing too little..

btw.. anyone have the emoticon of kobe shaking his finger
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Postby KB24 on Thu Nov 17, 2005 11:09 am

shakin wrote:So you'd rather he stopped shooting when he was 3-11 or whatever? Hmm... well that would have been nice, wouldn't it? Where exactly are we going to get any offense then?

Sure, he was cold and having problems, but our offense isn't there yet so we have to rely on Kobe a little too much. There are flashes of the triangle flowing together, but right now it's still too early. When push comes to shove, we need Kobe.

You'd rather Kobe be cold and then just not shoot huh? Well, it would have been interesting to see how the Lakers would have gotten out of that jam, wouldn't it. Sure, he needs to make better decisions sometimes but without him, we don't win that game. Without him stepping up, we don't coast to a victory at all. For now, we are going to have to rely on Kobe heavily until we're a team that understands the offense completely and everybody knows their spots.

to stay active on offense and to take 36 shots are 2 different stories homie. Why do people not realize what I´m talking about? Its about principle. Take away the FTs and you see Kobe needed 36 shots to score 30 points. Thats utterly ridiculous. I bet Odom, Mihm, Kwame can do that too. Imagine a team has around 70 possessions on offense Kobe has 36 shots + FTs and his assists. That means at least 40+ of 70 possessions are going untill Kobe either shoots or passes for the shot. That makes him predictable, the Lakers less active and the opponents learn to shut him down more and more. Kobe was talking about how he wants to stay in the flow of the offense but sometimes he just can´t. I like it when he is active takes it to the hole, even if he does it 50 times but I don´t like it if he takes 30+ 20footers.
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Postby shakin on Thu Nov 17, 2005 12:24 pm

KB8@CL wrote:
shakin wrote:So you'd rather he stopped shooting when he was 3-11 or whatever? Hmm... well that would have been nice, wouldn't it? Where exactly are we going to get any offense then?

Sure, he was cold and having problems, but our offense isn't there yet so we have to rely on Kobe a little too much. There are flashes of the triangle flowing together, but right now it's still too early. When push comes to shove, we need Kobe.

You'd rather Kobe be cold and then just not shoot huh? Well, it would have been interesting to see how the Lakers would have gotten out of that jam, wouldn't it. Sure, he needs to make better decisions sometimes but without him, we don't win that game. Without him stepping up, we don't coast to a victory at all. For now, we are going to have to rely on Kobe heavily until we're a team that understands the offense completely and everybody knows their spots.

to stay active on offense and to take 36 shots are 2 different stories homie. Why do people not realize what I´m talking about? Its about principle. Take away the FTs and you see Kobe needed 36 shots to score 30 points. Thats utterly ridiculous. I bet Odom, Mihm, Kwame can do that too. Imagine a team has around 70 possessions on offense Kobe has 36 shots + FTs and his assists. That means at least 40+ of 70 possessions are going untill Kobe either shoots or passes for the shot. That makes him predictable, the Lakers less active and the opponents learn to shut him down more and more. Kobe was talking about how he wants to stay in the flow of the offense but sometimes he just can´t. I like it when he is active takes it to the hole, even if he does it 50 times but I don´t like it if he takes 30+ 20footers.


You're talking one game, not every game. You're talking Kobe with an ailing hand. You're talking Kobe within an offense that's not tight or together yet. I agree he needs to take better shots, work the offense more, but unfortunately we can't afford to do that all game. We need offense from some place and he has to do it. He had a bad shooting night for a variety of reasons and he started taking it to the hole in the second half and that opened up his game. I think that was the true error... he didn't realize to take the ball in hard early enough and get himself going that way.

For now, we're going to have to patient until everybody find their roles and we can have a good flowing offense. Until then, Kobe is going to have to force things a little bit and we're going to take our lumps a little bit. I still see Kwame wondering where to go, I still Mihm not knowing where to go. Lamar is still hesitant and uncomfortable in his role.
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Postby KB24 on Thu Nov 17, 2005 12:32 pm

ya patience is a virtue. Specially our team has a lot of work to do. We are young and we must grow. it will certainly take more than couple of weeks. i would be glad if we could go back to contention in 2007/2008
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Postby shakin on Thu Nov 17, 2005 12:46 pm

With the current team, obviously a low-end playoff spot would be a great start. I'm curious what this off-season brings and how our season ends. Already it looks like Kwame is quite a project--one that may lead us to nowhere.

We're really a dominant big man from being very competitive. Will we get one this summer? Probably not....
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Postby slimjim on Thu Nov 17, 2005 3:23 pm

he in injuried but still jacking up 30+ shots.... :disagree: :disagree:

he won the game for us last night but... if we were against a good team and him jacking up 30+ on a injuried finger :disagree: :disagree:
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Postby Lakerfan36 on Thu Nov 17, 2005 6:11 pm

keyindabox wrote:
Uhhhh we're a crap team?


sorry key, but the knicks are worse then crap
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Postby shakin on Thu Nov 17, 2005 9:14 pm

It's tough and all situational. We still need Kobe because the rest of our offense isn't there yet. I wish it was the case, but we have to heavily rely on Kobe. It sickens me to think we need him shooting that many shots with an injured hand, but we don't have a lot of options.

He needs to attack because his jumper will not be consistent with that finger hurting... that's my only problems and he seemed to figure it out in the 2nd half. That also helped him get in the groove.

slimjim wrote:he in injuried but still jacking up 30+ shots.... :disagree: :disagree:

he won the game for us last night but... if we were against a good team and him jacking up 30+ on a injuried finger :disagree: :disagree:
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Postby halekulani on Fri Nov 18, 2005 1:51 am

shakin wrote:Did any of you Kobe haters ever watch Michael Jordan play? I mean, come on. The guy took more bad shots than anybody in the history of the game. He had more 13-30 nights than I can remember. He had so many nights like this one it's beyond me. The main thing is that his team was close and MJ was there when it mattered. Yeah, Kobe has to take a lot of shots, expend a lot of energy, etc, but that's the Lakers. When he's 15-26 against the Clippers friday everything will even out.


....

i hope you realized michael jordan averaged nearly 50% shooting each season, something kobe hasn't come close to yet.
'87-'93
.515
.457
.482
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yeah....kobe hasn't even come close. kobe hasn't even broken 48% with shaq.

jordan is on another level buddy.
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Postby KB24 on Fri Nov 18, 2005 1:54 am

halekulani wrote:
shakin wrote:Did any of you Kobe haters ever watch Michael Jordan play? I mean, come on. The guy took more bad shots than anybody in the history of the game. He had more 13-30 nights than I can remember. He had so many nights like this one it's beyond me. The main thing is that his team was close and MJ was there when it mattered. Yeah, Kobe has to take a lot of shots, expend a lot of energy, etc, but that's the Lakers. When he's 15-26 against the Clippers friday everything will even out.


....

i hope you realized michael jordan averaged nearly 50% shooting each season, something kobe hasn't come close to yet.
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yeah....kobe hasn't even come close. kobe hasn't even broken 48% with shaq.

jordan is on another level buddy.

Kobe is not MJ. Nobody is.
MJ was not just slightly better, you could put him in any era and he would have outshined everybody.
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Postby shakin on Fri Nov 18, 2005 6:49 am

That's not the point. The whole LEAGUE shot better then. Look at what Stockton, Drexler, etc were shooting. The point is, you have to take the bad shots with the good shots and MJ had plenty of those horrible nights and horrible quarters. When you have a team that lacks offensive punch, you get some of that. Look at AI. The guy, in the past, has had nobody and has to put bad shot after bad shot up because that's the best they can get. With Webber and some good young talent he's going to flourish and not have to take on the whole load.
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Postby kwamejoke on Fri Nov 18, 2005 9:20 am

MJ's shot selection is better than kobe.
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