Bynum Discussion

Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby recoveringusername on Wed Aug 15, 2012 9:27 pm

nameant wrote:Wow...that was kinda sad. It's funny to watch franchises overreact. All respect to Andrew, he's an all-star player, but he's not good enough to be the face of a franchise or actually bring that franchise any sort of success. This guy acts like they just traded for the best player in the world. Philly definitely improved but a contender? Not quite.

EDIT: Also...the hyping up of Jason Richardson?? Dood is a journeyman.


Some fan bases aren't as blessed as the Lakers fans. Who has been the sixers best player since Iverson? Iggy, Brand? Of course they are excited knowing they got one of the best big men in the game. Who in the east can stop Bynum? lol
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby JSM on Wed Aug 15, 2012 9:33 pm

The Rock wrote:He did say Eastern Conference has a lot of decent centers LOL

Hibbert, Nene, Okafor, Horford, Chandler, Lopez, Noah, Camby, Bosh, Amare, KG (some aren't C but will see some minutes there)
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby JSM on Wed Aug 15, 2012 9:34 pm

gcclaker wrote:SI just reported that Philly is looking to move Brown and Hawes either near the end of training camp in October or prior to the trade deadline in February. It would be wiser for them to lose Brown instead of Hawes who can at least produce on offense as a backup. I don't see Bynum playing over 35 minutes a game. It would be a strain on those knees of his.

Plus Hawes was one of the players Drew mentioned during his presser of a guy he is looking forward to playing with.
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby Texas Lakers Fan on Wed Aug 15, 2012 9:38 pm

nameant wrote:Wow...that was kinda sad. It's funny to watch franchises overreact. All respect to Andrew, he's an all-star player, but he's not good enough to be the face of a franchise or actually bring that franchise any sort of success. This guy acts like they just traded for the best player in the world. Philly definitely improved but a contender? Not quite.

EDIT: Also...the hyping up of Jason Richardson?? Dood is a journeyman.

Why can't Drew be a franchise player? Why can't he lead Philly back to the promised land? We've ever seen Drew as the man on the team. No one can say with any certainty if Drew can be a franchise player or not. We'll find out, but to say he definitely can't be a franchise player is absurd.
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby dmaul on Wed Aug 15, 2012 10:41 pm

Historically, when a significant player is traded from the Lakers they are sad and disappointed. Obviously, tells us they loved it here, maybe liked where they live, the organization, etc. etc. When I see Bynum all smiles part of me thinks this is a guy who would be all smiles anywhere in the league because there's a bank in every city like he said. He just has to put in his few hours playing basketball and gets to spend the rest of his time having fun. I do give him credit for being a professional in the sense of not pouting, not threatening to not show up or threatening to retire like some players do. He's been a real pro dealing with all the trade rumors and frankly this must be a relief for him to finally be in a place that will embrace him and want him long term (at least for now).

And then I think it's too bad he didn't have the desire and motivation to give a good effort every game, to concentrate on rebounds and defense and not care about touches. To play so hard and want it so bad that he would be hurt if his name was ever mentionned in a trade rumor because he gave it his all for his team and would feel betrayed and disrespected if the franchise dared to question his loyalty and committment to winning and being a good teammate. But these qualities are not in his DNA. He's a borderline all-star player who does just enough.
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby KB24 on Thu Aug 16, 2012 2:29 am

You have to understand this is the first time in a decade that Philly has a top 2 player at one position...not every franchise has 24 HOF players like the Lakers.

Think about that...in 70 years we have 24 HOFs and quite a few in the pipeline.
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby Murdock on Thu Aug 16, 2012 2:36 am

Am I the only one who thought that the press was kind of weird? Well you can't blame them they don't have that much of experience as Mitch has :D anyway it felt weird, they didn't even thank Andre for his time there and such ...

Also looking at Phillies roster, they had pretty decent and YOUNG team ... if they can develop I can see them as no. 2 in the east in two years time IMO ... very nice young team on paper
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby nameant on Thu Aug 16, 2012 6:39 am

Texas Lakers Fan wrote:
nameant wrote:Wow...that was kinda sad. It's funny to watch franchises overreact. All respect to Andrew, he's an all-star player, but he's not good enough to be the face of a franchise or actually bring that franchise any sort of success. This guy acts like they just traded for the best player in the world. Philly definitely improved but a contender? Not quite.

EDIT: Also...the hyping up of Jason Richardson?? Dood is a journeyman.

Why can't Drew be a franchise player? Why can't he lead Philly back to the promised land? We've ever seen Drew as the man on the team. No one can say with any certainty if Drew can be a franchise player or not. We'll find out, but to say he definitely can't be a franchise player is absurd.


If Drew could be a franchise player, why would we have traded him? It doesn't take a player 7 years before you know whether or not he has IT. Usually you know within a year or 2 whether a player can be a franchise player. Drew is a fantastic #2 but he's never going to be THAT GUY that carries a franchise. There are some things you just know from watching basketball for a long time. Read between the lines in Kareem's comments, he knows it as well. If the Lakers thought Drew could be a franchise player, they wouldn't have traded him. Dwight on the other hand, MAY lead this franchise as the man in the future. Big difference.
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby bruddahmanmatt on Thu Aug 16, 2012 8:34 am

nameant wrote:
Texas Lakers Fan wrote:
nameant wrote:Wow...that was kinda sad. It's funny to watch franchises overreact. All respect to Andrew, he's an all-star player, but he's not good enough to be the face of a franchise or actually bring that franchise any sort of success. This guy acts like they just traded for the best player in the world. Philly definitely improved but a contender? Not quite.

EDIT: Also...the hyping up of Jason Richardson?? Dood is a journeyman.

Why can't Drew be a franchise player? Why can't he lead Philly back to the promised land? We've ever seen Drew as the man on the team. No one can say with any certainty if Drew can be a franchise player or not. We'll find out, but to say he definitely can't be a franchise player is absurd.


If Drew could be a franchise player, why would we have traded him? It doesn't take a player 7 years before you know whether or not he has IT. Usually you know within a year or 2 whether a player can be a franchise player. Drew is a fantastic #2 but he's never going to be THAT GUY that carries a franchise. There are some things you just know from watching basketball for a long time. Read between the lines in Kareem's comments, he knows it as well. If the Lakers thought Drew could be a franchise player, they wouldn't have traded him. Dwight on the other hand, MAY lead this franchise as the man in the future. Big difference.


Clearly Philadelphia believes otherwise. I think part of the problem is that you're ignoring a few details about Andrew's situation. I believe Drew was incapable of being a franchise player here in LA with Kobe still on the roster. Bynum IMO needed room to grow and he needed a team of his own that's built around him being the #1 option. From what I've read, almost everyone here is saying they believe Drew will flourish with his own team. Most folks seem to agree that it wasn't about Drew being incapable of carrying a team, it was about Drew being unmotivated and disinterested here in LA because an aging star is still the center of attention and the focal point of the offense.
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby nameant on Thu Aug 16, 2012 8:49 am

I understand why they believe otherwise. He's a huge upgrade for them. And I agree he had a problem with being unmotivated and disinterested sometimes as the #2 guy, but that's his problem. That is what separates the top tier from the second tier. Yes Nash is older, but we have 3 superstars on this team now, 3 future HOFers. Do you believe any of them will be less motivated playing with each other? Plenty of teams have/have had 2+ franchise players at the same time and have flourished. The Heat just won it all with 2 franchise players, the Celtics had 3 of them that contributed at an equal level during their run, the old Lakers had Kobe and Shaq, Showtime had Magic, Worthy, & Kareem, the Bulls had Jordan and Pippen, and the list goes on.

As Drew became more established he seemed to zone out more when things weren't going his way. That was the one thing I didn't like about him. Dominating didn't seem to come natural to him even though he has the talent. The kind of players that aren't happy being on a contender and winning b/c they aren't the #1 guy aren't usually capable of being the #1 guy, or at least have a different focus other than winning. I have no doubt Drew will put up 20 and 10 for years to come with Philly, but do I believe those numbers will amount to anything and Philly will be legitimate title contenders with Drew as their franchise guy? Definitely not. I wouldn't mind being wrong b/c Philly would make Miami's run tougher, but I just can't see it. If Drew was capable of that, why would we have traded him in the 1st place? We upgraded to get THAT GUY, that franchise capable player.
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby Delicious on Thu Aug 16, 2012 9:12 am

I believe that Andrew has the ability to lead a franchise however his talents surpassed the role he was playing for the Lakers. When he tried to do more he was punished for it. We know shooting three's and wanting to shoot jumpers is not what is expected from your big man but I think we should have at least have let Drew explore his offensive abilities. Like Phil would allow Kobe to do, the makeup of the team and his personal injuries stunted his growth and it appears to me that is what lead him to feel disinterested. Playing with stars when you're becoming a star can be good or bad for you. Howard has tried on his own and failed
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby KB24 on Thu Aug 16, 2012 10:00 am

JSM wrote:
The Rock wrote:He did say Eastern Conference has a lot of decent centers LOL

Hibbert, Nene, Okafor, Horford, Chandler, Lopez, Noah, Camby, Bosh, Amare, KG (some aren't C but will see some minutes there)

thats cold :man9:
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby bruddahmanmatt on Thu Aug 16, 2012 10:28 am

nameant wrote:I understand why they believe otherwise. He's a huge upgrade for them. And I agree he had a problem with being unmotivated and disinterested sometimes as the #2 guy, but that's his problem. That is what separates the top tier from the second tier. Yes Nash is older, but we have 3 superstars on this team now, 3 future HOFers. Do you believe any of them will be less motivated playing with each other? Plenty of teams have/have had 2+ franchise players at the same time and have flourished. The Heat just won it all with 2 franchise players, the Celtics had 3 of them that contributed at an equal level during their run, the old Lakers had Kobe and Shaq, Showtime had Magic, Worthy, & Kareem, the Bulls had Jordan and Pippen, and the list goes on.


Actually, most folks would disagree with you here. Guys who are unsatisfied with being the #2 guy and hunger for that #1 option role often make the best leaders provided they're actually good enough to fill that #1 spot. Now if you have a player who isn't as good as he thinks he is, then yes, I'd agree with you. However Andrew is incredibly talented and a force on the floor when he's eager and motivated. Right now it's a bit of a toss up with him as he's had his ups and his downs over the years, but most folks are betting on him being motivated in his new surroundings.

With regards to Nash, he's an aging superstar hunting for a chip, and thus while he's not being relegated to role player status, history will tell us that players in his position are often more willing to defer a bit more than a player in his prime with two rings looking to forge his own legacy elsewhere. Comparing Drew's situation with Steve's is apples to oranges as they both have completely different goals at this point in their respective careers. It's why Boston's Big Three worked in '08 as all three of those guys were into the twilight years of their careers and hunting for their first chip. Conversely it's why Shaq and Kobe couldn't be held together beyond '04. Had one of those guys been ok with being a #2, they'd have dominated the league for a decade. Instead we all know how that turned out.

nameant wrote:As Drew became more established he seemed to zone out more when things weren't going his way. That was the one thing I didn't like about him. Dominating didn't seem to come natural to him even though he has the talent. The kind of players that aren't happy being on a contender and winning b/c they aren't the #1 guy aren't usually capable of being the #1 guy, or at least have a different focus other than winning. I have no doubt Drew will put up 20 and 10 for years to come with Philly, but do I believe those numbers will amount to anything and Philly will be legitimate title contenders with Drew as their franchise guy? Definitely not. I wouldn't mind being wrong b/c Philly would make Miami's run tougher, but I just can't see it. If Drew was capable of that, why would we have traded him in the 1st place? We upgraded to get THAT GUY, that franchise capable player.


I agree, but that has more to do with the reasons I described above i.e. said players aren't as good as they think they are. With regards to having that sort of #1 option mindset however, you just described what goes on in the heads of players like Michael, Shaq and Kobe who combined for half of the chips over the last two decades.

As for why we traded Drew if he's capable of being "that guy", because sometimes a player simply isn't able or willing to be as good as he can be if his surroundings aren't tailored to his needs and wants. Most of us believe that Drew does have franchise player potential, but that he simply didn't have enough room here in LA to turn that potential into production. FWIW, I think Drew has more #1 option potential than Dwight as he's seemingly always had more fire and passion for the game (when motivated) than Howard, I just happen to think that Howard is a better fit for our needs. At this point it simply depends on whether or not Bynum can keep himself motivated and focused for a full 82 game season + playoffs.
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby bystander on Fri Aug 17, 2012 9:21 pm

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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby KB24 on Fri Aug 17, 2012 10:46 pm

Looks like fat Albert lol.

Doesn't seem to be in great shape...fat face.
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby jimbo327 on Sat Aug 18, 2012 12:25 am

ugly jersey
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby Texas Lakers Fan on Sun Aug 19, 2012 10:09 am

Just doesn't look right. :freak2:
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby MadMax on Sun Aug 19, 2012 10:19 am

That's a lot of grey hair for a young fella
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby KB24 on Sun Aug 19, 2012 10:50 am

jimbo327 wrote:ugly jersey

yes, has a Clipper touch to it.
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby Scnottaken on Sun Aug 19, 2012 4:28 pm

bruddahmanmatt wrote:
nameant wrote:I understand why they believe otherwise. He's a huge upgrade for them. And I agree he had a problem with being unmotivated and disinterested sometimes as the #2 guy, but that's his problem. That is what separates the top tier from the second tier. Yes Nash is older, but we have 3 superstars on this team now, 3 future HOFers. Do you believe any of them will be less motivated playing with each other? Plenty of teams have/have had 2+ franchise players at the same time and have flourished. The Heat just won it all with 2 franchise players, the Celtics had 3 of them that contributed at an equal level during their run, the old Lakers had Kobe and Shaq, Showtime had Magic, Worthy, & Kareem, the Bulls had Jordan and Pippen, and the list goes on.


Actually, most folks would disagree with you here. Guys who are unsatisfied with being the #2 guy and hunger for that #1 option role often make the best leaders provided they're actually good enough to fill that #1 spot. Now if you have a player who isn't as good as he thinks he is, then yes, I'd agree with you. However Andrew is incredibly talented and a force on the floor when he's eager and motivated. Right now it's a bit of a toss up with him as he's had his ups and his downs over the years, but most folks are betting on him being motivated in his new surroundings.

With regards to Nash, he's an aging superstar hunting for a chip, and thus while he's not being relegated to role player status, history will tell us that players in his position are often more willing to defer a bit more than a player in his prime with two rings looking to forge his own legacy elsewhere. Comparing Drew's situation with Steve's is apples to oranges as they both have completely different goals at this point in their respective careers. It's why Boston's Big Three worked in '08 as all three of those guys were into the twilight years of their careers and hunting for their first chip. Conversely it's why Shaq and Kobe couldn't be held together beyond '04. Had one of those guys been ok with being a #2, they'd have dominated the league for a decade. Instead we all know how that turned out.

I think what Nameant is saying is Bynum didn't try when he wasn't the focal point. I guess many here would rather have off-court acting out vs. on-court acting out. Howard vs. Bynum.
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby V.V.V.V.V. on Sun Aug 19, 2012 5:28 pm

After posting for months that Dwight is not a franchise player, and that he's a natural #2, I can't say that he's the franchise player we've been looking for. Dwight fits well as the #2 option on a championship team, so he's perfect for the current LA roster. Maybe after he wins a few rings and Kobe retires, he'll be ready for the #1 position on a championship team, but right now he's not ready. He can lead a decent team to the playoffs, but he had his hat handed to him by GASOL in 09. This doesn't mean that he can't be the FACE of the franchise, which is what the Lakers brass wants from him, now and after Kobe's gone. That's different from being THE MAN on the court. And Dwight seems to be ok with that, since he said in the press conference that he thinks the team wants him to anchor the defense down low, not be the leading scorer.

As for Drew, he wanted a shot at being the #1, and now there he is. Be careful what you wish for, Drew. Now you have to perform well every night, and take responsibility for the wins and the losses. Time to grow up.
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby Center Court on Sun Aug 19, 2012 11:34 pm

Drew can't lead a franchise. He can play at the role of one on the floor, maybe. But, he is not a franchise cornerstone.

Kobe
Shaq
Duncan
LeBron
KG
KD

those guys were/are legit players who can carry a franchise.

Clearly Drew is no where near any of those guys. Doesn't walk, talk, dress, play, dedicate, care, want, lead, or commit to being that guy like those guys do/did.
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby bystander on Mon Aug 20, 2012 6:48 am

dress


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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby KB24 on Mon Aug 20, 2012 7:13 am

V.V.V.V.V. wrote:After posting for months that Dwight is not a franchise player, and that he's a natural #2, I can't say that he's the franchise player we've been looking for. Dwight fits well as the #2 option on a championship team, so he's perfect for the current LA roster. Maybe after he wins a few rings and Kobe retires, he'll be ready for the #1 position on a championship team, but right now he's not ready. He can lead a decent team to the playoffs, but he had his hat handed to him by GASOL in 09. This doesn't mean that he can't be the FACE of the franchise, which is what the Lakers brass wants from him, now and after Kobe's gone. That's different from being THE MAN on the court. And Dwight seems to be ok with that, since he said in the press conference that he thinks the team wants him to anchor the defense down low, not be the leading scorer.

As for Drew, he wanted a shot at being the #1, and now there he is. Be careful what you wish for, Drew. Now you have to perform well every night, and take responsibility for the wins and the losses. Time to grow up.

He brought the Magic to the finals, that's a big deal for a scrub team. Also Howard was 23 in 2009...it happens. He didn't play terrible in that series, the Lakers were just the much more talented team.

Dwight is a top 5 NBA player and a top 5 player is always a franchise player and someone to build around. I really don't see your logic there.
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Re: Andrew Bynum Discussion

Postby therealdeal on Mon Aug 20, 2012 9:42 am

I don't see the logic there either. Dwight is easily a cornerstone type of player. Any time you're the best at your position, it's difficult not to be that player.

And your example of taking scrubs to the Finals doesn't make sense either. LeBron, before Miami, didn't do anything better than Dwight did in Orlando. Would you not consider him a franchise player?
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