Andrew Bynum Discussion: Out for the season, 2x knee surgery

therealdeal wrote:rev...

It's a needle with fluid being injected into your knee. It's not ibuprofen or a specific training regimen. It's non invasive because he doesn't require anesthetics and a surgeon, but that doesn't mean it's anything like what Nash does. He still needs a needle full of fluid to lubricate his knees. If this was normal, we'd be hearing about it all over the NBA. This is not normal and it's not good.

This is a bandaid procedure that hides the problem: his knees aren't lubricated. Someone who is on dialysis is hiding their failed kidneys with a "non invasive" procedure, but that's different from the diabetic who changes their eating habits and lifestyle to stay healthy.

KB24 wrote:BTW we aren't just talking about an injection...we are talking about

multiple surgeries on the same knee
multiple injections a year
all sort of protective gear for this entire career
all sort of rest during the summer
all sort of medical treatment and therapy during the season
getting his knee drained a lot of times

Bynum's knee needs constant monitoring 24/7. Sure, if he can play on it, its fine but the fact that every awkward move could ruin his career is always there sadly. Nash does have a bad back but nobody is losing any sleep over it.

I'm sure all NBA players are always hurt and need to get constant treatment to perform at a high level for 10+ years. Everybody has maintenance techniques and therapists.

therealdeal wrote:1. My fear of needles DOESN'T have any impact on this conversation. The fact of the matter is that one is a man sitting on the ground and one is a man getting a needle to the knee every few months. If you can't see the difference there, then I can't help you.

2. I'm not comparing Drew to a dialysis patient and you know that. I'm comparing his health situation to someone on dialysis. YOU compared Steve Nash's treatment of his back to Drew's treatment of his knees. THAT is over the top since they are EXTREMELY different. Nash doesn't need regular injections to keep his back healthy and he hasn't had multiple surgeries there either. The idea that the two are the same is ludicrous.

What I was saying isn't that hard to grasp: a dialysis patient is reliant on daily care to stay healthy enough to function, care that must be provided from outside help. This is true no matter the situation because their kidneys cannot support their body. Someone who is diabetic, or pre-diabetic, can survive by monitoring their own health and is not necessarily DEPENDENT on outside assistance to stay healthy. They may need it from time to time, but for the most part they can remain healthy by monitoring their blood sugar levels.

The comparison is that Drew NEEDS those injections to stay healthy enough to function in the NBA. Steve Nash DOES NOT need those injections, he needs to monitor his health. I am not saying Drew is reliant on this procedure for his general health, that's stupid. I am saying his reliance on lubricant injections to maintain a high level of performance is a bandaid that is not good for him.

therealdeal wrote:1. You're trying to change the situation by putting the onus on me, it's transparent and it's a poor counter to my argument. A needle in the knee is no where near doing core strength exercises and the mere idea that it is the same is preposterous and I expect better from a smart person like you.

2. I did not say it was a life and death situation. I said the situation of DEPENDANCY is the same and that's not a stretch. Bynum is DEPENDANT on these shots in order to perform. Cortizone is actually an awful comparison; the only similarity being a needle involved. Cortizone is not a treatment, it's pain killer. A workout regimen can be considered a treatment. The shots that Bynum recieves can be considered a treatment. A Cortizone shot does nothing to treat, it only masks pain which in many cases results in further injury.

You keep bringing up my supposed fear of needles, a fear that you fabricated, and it's hilarious. You're doing it because you know the argument you're making sounds ridiculous. If you didn't love Bynum so much, you'd be able to seperate yourself from this and realize that the comparison you're making is just awful.

therealdeal wrote:1. No I didn't. It was a poorly worded sentence, but I have no fear of needles. Not to mention my fear of needles isn't the discussion it's your poorly argued point that injections in Bynum's knee are the same as Nash stretching on the sideline. Please. It's ludicrous and beneath you. You're letting your love for Bynum completely cloud your common sense.

2. Because there is no such thing as a player being dependent on Cortizone to play regularly. That doesn't make any sense medically. If you think that makes sense, I suggest reading up on exactly what Cortizone does and how it affects your body and health.

Yes you keep bringing that up. I never said that I was afraid of needles and it is completely irrelevant even if I was. You're stooping VERY low for this argument and you're better than that.

"While that cortisone was in there, I was great," Putz said. "But cortisone is nothing but a Band-Aid anyway. It masks the problem. That's all it really is. With me there was really nothing structurally wrong, so I don't know if anything really got worse.

therealdeal wrote:
This is a bandaid procedure that hides the problem

therealdeal wrote:I'm pretty much done with this. I'll make my closing statements and be on my way.

1. The end result of missing zero games means nothing to me. Do the ends justify the means in every case? I'd argue in most cases no they don't. One man gets rich through hard work and sacrifice. Another wins the lottery. Which one made it there in the most ideal way? If Bynum needs injections every few months to maintain this level of play, that's a far cry from a man who needs to stretch on the sidelines.

therealdeal wrote:You want my argument? Bynum's knees are done. Just like the kidneys of a dialysis patient they require constant medical attention just to function in the way he needs them to. He needs constant injections and a brace worn at all times just to have knees that work well enough to perform. Nash needs to stretch on the sidelines. If you can't see the difference, that's not my problem.

therealdeal wrote:2. You give me a link to an article titled "How the Mets' Season Broke Down and Fell Apart" and you expect that to SUPPORT your argument? All you did was support what I said! Cortizone shots do not do anything to help you perform, in most cases they harm you because you don't feel the pain that's a result of extreme damage to your body! Just because two things are band-aids doesn't mean they're the same type of bandage!

therealdeal wrote:Bynum's knee gets a lubricant injection. It helps his knee perform for a limited time. If he got a Cortizone shot instead he'd tear anything left in his decrepit knees and probably struggle to walk normally the rest of his life due to his size. Your argument is awful.

therealdeal wrote:No I don't know you. But I've been on this site for more than 4 years now and I've always respected you and your opinions. You've been a quality poster here the entire time I have and your posting style was one of my deciding factors in signing up here. But your defense of Bynum is ridiculous and it's been hard for me to read because it holds no objectivity whatsoever.

therealdeal wrote:Fine, I don't know you. I'll be done responding to posts like this from now on and I suppose I'll take my Bynum thoughts elsewhere.

Sixers' Andrew Bynum to begin practicing Oct. 24

When 76ers coach Doug Collins and his team centerpiece, Andrew Bynum, had a recent conversation, the center told Collins that if they were in the regular season, he would be able to play right now.

But the reality is that they are not in the regular season and Bynum is scheduled to have further injections in both knees Monday to help lubricate the joints and better prepare them for the regular season.

Bynum will receive an injection of Synvisc-One. Used for the treatment of osteoarthritis, it is a natural substance that lubricates and cushions the joints. It is believed to provide up to six months of protection. According to his agent, Bynum will receive another injection at the all-star break.

The treatment is not related to the platelet therapy that Bynum underwent last month in Germany.

"Andrew's doing well," Collins said Monday before the Sixers improved their preseason record to 2-1 with a 107-75 victory over Boston at the Wells Fargo Center. "He's progressing and on track to where I think he hoped he would be at this time. Obviously, the next step for him is getting running and weight-bearing."

The plan for Bynum's return to the court is for three days of practice beginning Oct. 24. Collins plans on a break for the Sixers on Oct. 27 and then practice the next three days before the team opens the season at home against Denver on Oct. 31.

Bynum was acquired in a four-team trade on Aug. 10. Last season, he averaged career highs in points (18.7) and rebounds (11.8). He also blocked 1.98 shots per game and was named second-team all-NBA.

Bynum's conditioning will be a concern. While he is able to do some cardiovascular work on what Collins has described as an "antigravity machine," there is nothing Bynum can do to prepare him for games.

"A lot of that is going to be how he responds to increased activity," Collins said when asked if Bynum would be ready for the start of the season. "I know how important the home opener is, but we're not going to do anything silly and have another setback where it costs you and now you have to miss those kinds of games."

Boston coach Doc Rivers, close friends with Collins, said that working a big player back into the lineup and getting players accustomed to him is easier than it is with smaller players.

"It is easier with a big [man], I would say that - he's going to be big when he plays," Rivers said. "He's still going to be seven feet today and tomorrow. I think it's a lot tougher when you have guards and you are trying to integrate them into your system."

Hawes leads way. Spencer Hawes came off the bench for 17 points and eight rebounds to lead five Sixers in double figures against Boston.

Thaddeus Young scored 15 points and Nick Young added 14 off the bench.

The Sixers were without Kwame Brown, who missed the game with a strained calf. Kevin Garnett did not play for Boston.

Rivers endorses Collins. Collins and Rivers have had their names tossed around as potential Olympic coaches. Rivers thinks that Collins would be good for the job.

"Doug, he'd be great," Rivers said of Collins, a member of the 1972 U.S. Olympic team. "When you think about the history . . . I just think that the best guy that will help us win is the right way to go."

PHILADELPHIA — Evan Turner called the preseason “the pre-Bynum era.” Nick Young said Thursday that he can’t wait until the Andrew Bynum era arrives.

“When Bynum comes back, double-team city,” a smiling Young said. “We’re going to be flying with them 3s. ‘I’m open. I’m open.’ Andrew’s going to be the focal point. That’s going to take a lot of pressure off me.”

Bynum, who is sitting out the preseason to rehabilitate his knees, eventually is expected to draw plenty of attention from opposing defenses that should result in open shots for his teammates. Once he returns, the Sixers plan to continue getting out on the fastbreak as much as possible.

Doug Collins harkens back to the Lakers’ “Showtime” days of the 1980s with Magic Johnson, James Worthy and big man Kareem Abdul-Jabbar for an example of how it could work.

“They pushed that ball,” Collins said. “But when they got in the halfcourt, the ball went through Kareem.

“From our standpoint, we don’t want to, just because Andrew comes back, be a halfcourt team. We want to continue to push that ball. Then when the game gets slowed down, we want to play through him in the post. We think you can incorporate both.”

Veteran Jason Richardson believes that’s realistic.

“I think we’ve just got to find a happy medium between the two — of pushing the ball and fast-breaking, and getting him the ball in the half-court game,” Richardson said. “We definitely want him to get his touches. He’s going to be the No. 1 option.”

Collins is looking for the Sixers to average eight made 3-pointers a game in the regular season and wants them to look for 3s in transition and the half-court offense. They're at 8.5 in the four preseason games on 47.2 percent shooting without Bynum, which is an indication of their upgraded perimeter personnel.

A year ago, the Sixers averaged 5.3 3-pointers and 36.2 percent en route to a 35-31 record.

“We have a lot of weapons,” Nick Young said.

The Sixers, who hope Bynum will practice for the first time Wednesday, play their final three preseason games in the next four days, starting Friday night against the Nets in Brooklyn.

Reserve center Kwame Brown (strained calf) will miss his third straight contest, but Collins hopes Brown will be able to return Sunday (in Boston) and Monday (in Syracuse vs. the Knicks). The regular-season opener is Wednesday against the Nuggets.

revgen wrote:LOL at Collins comparing the 76ers to Showtime.

I know he's trying to motivate his team, but it's still hilarious.

KB24 wrote:Bynum in a fast break offense could be a pretty ugly experience...not sure he has the legs, speed and conditioning to run the floor up and down.

He was pretty much always behind the play running back.

lakerswiz wrote:I would watch out for that 76'ers team in the East. Well coached and they're very excited.

revgen wrote:

lakerswiz wrote:I would watch out for that 76'ers team in the East. Well coached and they're very excited.

I see them as a solid play-off team. Same as last season. The only difference is that they are younger and hence have more upside. Philly is hoping that Turner and Holliday grow into all-star caliber players along with Bynum to create a "big 3". I think they are a bit too optimistic, but it'll be interesting to see what happens.