AI Or CP3

Who Do You Pick?

AI
25
78%
CP3
7
21%
 
Total votes : 32

AI Or CP3

Postby LooN3y on Wed Jun 18, 2014 8:17 pm

Which would you choose?

Ironically CP3 said he looked up to AI, even though he's a traditional PG, doesn't have as much heart, and flops like a fish.



Build your team, Take the last shot/ make the last play (or last couple of shots/plays). Just generally.


CP3 is always getting labeled as going down as one of the best PGs to ever play. i feel like AI gets overlooked all the time. He was 2001 basketball.
LooN3y

 
Posts: 878
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 9:33 pm

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby Barnstable on Wed Jun 18, 2014 8:32 pm

AI all day. The guy had the most heart and determination I've ever seen in a PG. It just didn't matter how small he was, he was going to score on you, and it really didn't matter what you did to try to stop him. In terms of offensive dominance from the PG position, he was almost the equivalent of Shaq back in those days. You weren't going to stop him, you just had to hope he missed more than he made and thank god he wasn't the defender he could have been if he was more interested in defense.
"league getting mitch-slapped"
User avatar
Barnstable
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 14313
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2006 1:01 pm
Location: Queens NY

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby Weezy on Wed Jun 18, 2014 9:35 pm

Well, both have their faults, but in his prime AI was one of the most unstoppable scorers I've ever seen. He did lead a team of mostly role players to the Finals, and then take one game from the most dominant Laker team I have personally ever watched. That game 1 performance was incredible, he was unstoppable. It's rare that I am willing to go back and watch a Laker loss, or a great performance against us in the playoffs, but that game I can watch and be in awe and feel respect for the dude. I don't respect Paul, his flopping, his "don't tough me"attitude or really anything about him other than his passing ability.
User avatar
Weezy
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 50881
Joined: Sat Jun 03, 2006 11:14 am
Location: Anaheim, CA

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby Doc Brown on Wed Jun 18, 2014 9:47 pm

Iverson.

CP3 gets the excuse of not having teammates to get him past the 2nd round.

Look at the squad Iverson took to the FINALS. I don't even think he had a legit #2 option. And as Weezy said, he stole a game from one of the best teams the league has seen.
Rule of Thumb at ClubLakers - Never encourage people to check your post history.
User avatar
Doc Brown

 
Posts: 19457
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2010 10:11 am
Location: Ohio

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby Rooscooter on Wed Jun 18, 2014 11:42 pm

Hmmm... Let me think this one over.......

















AI
"If the past sits in judgment on the present, the future will be lost." Winston Churchill

“The prospect of domination of the nation's scholars by Federal employment, project allocations, and the power of money is ever present - and is gravely to be regarded." Dwight Eisenhower

"Socialism in general has a record of failure so blatant that only an intellectual could ignore or evade it" Thomas Sowell
User avatar
Rooscooter

 
Posts: 23048
Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2011 4:25 pm
Location: Chandler AZ and Andalué

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby V.V.V.V.V. on Thu Jun 19, 2014 1:34 am

AI. He had the heart of a lion.
Vi Veri Vniversum Vivus Vici
V.V.V.V.V.

 
Posts: 3144
Joined: Sun May 07, 2006 11:59 pm
Location: Hollywood

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby Magic Skywalker on Thu Jun 19, 2014 2:53 am

Allen Iverson is The Answer to this question :man1:
@MagicSkywalker Basketamericano
User avatar
Magic Skywalker

 
Posts: 1228
Joined: Tue Jun 01, 2010 7:08 pm

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby LooN3y on Thu Jun 19, 2014 6:12 am

lol

no way CP3 takes that 76ers team to the finals, let alone out of the first round, scratch that make the playoffs.


Image

Image
LooN3y

 
Posts: 878
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 9:33 pm

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby trodgers on Thu Jun 19, 2014 6:15 am

People who say that LBJ had no help need to look at Iverson and see what a beast without help is. Iverson never came out of games. The fewest minutes he ever averaged per game in a playoffs was 39.5 - his last year in the playoffs. The most was 47.6. In 71 career playoff games, he averaged 45.1 minutes per game. Let that sink in.

Vs. the Lakers in that 2001 championship:
48 points, 5 assists, 5 boards, 5 steals (52 minutes)
23 points, 3 assists, 4 boards, 1 steal (47 minutes)
35 points, 4 assists, 12 boards, 0 steals (47 minutes)
35 points, 4 assists, 4 rebounds, 1 steal (46 minutes)
37 points, 2 assists, 3 rebounds, 2 steals (45 minutes)
5 games, 35.6 points, 3.6 assists, 5.6 boards, 1.8 steals (47+ minutes)
blog.travisjrodgers.com
Its like Dr. Buss is guarding the Celtic rim this second half. Nothings dropping
User avatar
trodgers
Site Manager
 
Posts: 46640
Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2004 6:31 pm
Location: Orlando

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby John3:16 on Thu Jun 19, 2014 6:40 am

AI, and it's not even close.
Image
User avatar
John3:16
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 31874
Joined: Wed Dec 29, 2004 12:23 am
Location: Anywhere but LD after a loss.

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby Lets Go Lakers on Thu Jun 19, 2014 7:36 am

I wonder how people would feel if CP3 had been a Laker instead of a Clipper.

But anyways, Iverson is without a doubt one of the greatest little men in history. He was a warrior and had a relentless motor. And he was one of the greatest scorers ever, despite being about 5'11", which is simply unreal. But I do think people overrate him a tad in terms of his impact on making his team better. People always point to that 2001 season when they overachieved and made the Finals. And it's already been mentioned several times in this thread. But besides that one season, his teams toiled at or around the .500 mark in a weak Eastern Conference.

And staying on this same topic, the level of competition that CP3 had to face in the incredibly tough WC can't be ignored. I mean outside of this year, when they really had a team that was talented as anyone else, he really didn't have THAT good of a team to really challenge the likes of San Antonio, Lakers or OKC. I mean did anyone really expect CP3's Hornets to beat the Kobe/Gasol Lakers at their peak? He had his standout season in 2007-08 when they were right there with the Lakers in 2008 for the best record in the WC but still, Kobe/Gasol/Odom prime? Not gonna happen. But outside of that, they were always seeded from 5-8. Who really expects a 5-8 seed to beat a 1-2 seed?

But anyways, I would take CP3. The guy impacts your team in more ways. He will make others better. Iverson was a single minded scorer. One of the best ever but that's what he was. CP3 is also a superior defender. And basketball is played on two ends: offense and defense. I've already mentioned many times why I like CP3 so much so I won't go into them. And I don't expect anyone to agree with me so no big deal.
User avatar
Lets Go Lakers

 
Posts: 2877
Joined: Tue Jan 26, 2010 3:25 pm

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby LooN3y on Thu Jun 19, 2014 8:00 am

AI would literally break CP3's ankles, run circles around him, and get called for a foul after Paul starts floppity flop flop


:man10:
LooN3y

 
Posts: 878
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 9:33 pm

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby therealdeal on Thu Jun 19, 2014 9:41 am

Allen Iverson by a large... large... large margin.
Stu : "Yeah, that's an old fashioned whoopin'."
therealdeal
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 40356
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2008 3:03 pm

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby thkthebest on Thu Jun 19, 2014 10:17 am

Iverson did have help. People need to stop looking for "big" names, and look at that team as a whole. Their defense was insanely good. They grabbed A LOT of offensive rebounds (nearly 1/3 of all available offensive rebounds).

How about Iverson's performance against the #20 ranked defense/#1 ranked offense. In those 4 wins against the Bucks, these are Iverson's stats:

16 points on 5/26 shooting
28 points on 10/32 shooting
15 points on 5/27 shooting
44 points on 17/33 shooting

So much for carrying that team, right? He literally made only 5 baskets in two of those wins. He averaged less than 4 points per quarter on those two wins. On 3 of those 4 wins, he shot atrociously. Despite his terrible shooting, they won because their defense was so damn good that they were able to hold the #1 ranked offense to poor performances.

In that 2001 playoff run, Iverson shot 38.9%.

Iverson was clearly the best player on that team. There's no denying that, but they also relied heavily on their defense, which does not get enough credit.
thkthebest

 
Posts: 3954
Joined: Mon Jul 23, 2007 12:59 pm

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby Lets Go Lakers on Thu Jun 19, 2014 10:49 am

thkthebest wrote:Iverson did have help. People need to stop looking for "big" names, and look at that team as a whole. Their defense was insanely good. They grabbed A LOT of offensive rebounds (nearly 1/3 of all available offensive rebounds).

How about Iverson's performance against the #20 ranked defense/#1 ranked offense. In those 4 wins against the Bucks, these are Iverson's stats:

16 points on 5/26 shooting
28 points on 10/32 shooting
15 points on 5/27 shooting
44 points on 17/33 shooting

So much for carrying that team, right? He literally made only 5 baskets in two of those wins. He averaged less than 4 points per quarter on those two wins. On 3 of those 4 wins, he shot atrociously. Despite his terrible shooting, they won because their defense was so damn good that they were able to hold the #1 ranked offense to poor performances.

In that 2001 playoff run, Iverson shot 38.9%.

Iverson was clearly the best player on that team. There's no denying that, but they also relied heavily on their defense, which does not get enough credit.


I had to re-check the part in red just to make sure it wasn't a typo and it wasn't. Yeah, he was an amazing scoring but that's pretty much all he did. A single minded, volume scorer. But in all fairness to him, he did have monster games against Toronto the series before with 52 and 54 point explosions. But he also shot 10/32 in the game 7 against Toronto. Although he did have 16 assists in that game.

The guy was an amazing scorer but like I said in my previous post, I think people overrate him a tad in terms of his contribution to team success based on that playoff run in 2001. He was "bad" Kobe for most of his career in that he was a single minded scorer but people didn't complain because he was never in the same level as Kobe in terms of making everyone around him better (mostly due to his short size). Just the fact that he was scoring this well at his height was amazing enough and people let him slide.
User avatar
Lets Go Lakers

 
Posts: 2877
Joined: Tue Jan 26, 2010 3:25 pm

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby gcclaker on Thu Jun 19, 2014 11:10 am

A better comparison would have been Isiah Thomas or Chris Paul. Paul may have the better overall game in the eyes of purists BUT Iverson was fearless and was relentless. He was the scoring point guard that is the norm nowadays. Yes, those Sixer teams did have a very good defense, then again I don't recall that crew having a second or third threat who can score to take some of the pressure of Iverson. When the game is in the balance or the team needs a jolt, I'd take The Answer.
No siggie...
User avatar
gcclaker
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 15201
Joined: Fri May 05, 2006 9:35 am
Location: Laker Cyber Space

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby Barnstable on Thu Jun 19, 2014 11:23 am

thkthebest wrote:Iverson did have help. People need to stop looking for "big" names, and look at that team as a whole. Their defense was insanely good. They grabbed A LOT of offensive rebounds (nearly 1/3 of all available offensive rebounds).

How about Iverson's performance against the #20 ranked defense/#1 ranked offense. In those 4 wins against the Bucks, these are Iverson's stats:

16 points on 5/26 shooting
28 points on 10/32 shooting
15 points on 5/27 shooting
44 points on 17/33 shooting

So much for carrying that team, right? He literally made only 5 baskets in two of those wins. He averaged less than 4 points per quarter on those two wins. On 3 of those 4 wins, he shot atrociously. Despite his terrible shooting, they won because their defense was so damn good that they were able to hold the #1 ranked offense to poor performances.

In that 2001 playoff run, Iverson shot 38.9%.

Iverson was clearly the best player on that team. There's no denying that, but they also relied heavily on their defense, which does not get enough credit.


I thought I remembered a reason for those low numbers, so I looked it up.

Those numbers aren't telling the whole story. AI was injured (tail bone) in the previous series to the point where he didn't think he could play at all, and Larry Brown wanted him to rest game 3 of that Bucks series because they could see how much it was hurting him. AI even considered sitting out saying he was hurting his team because he couldn't play like normal with the injury. That's how bad it was.

That was another thing about AI. He was tough as s*** when he was young. He got knocked around and thrown around like a rag doll from contact, and he still hit the continuation and rarely went out or missed games from injury. He played through it.
"league getting mitch-slapped"
User avatar
Barnstable
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 14313
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2006 1:01 pm
Location: Queens NY

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby pound4pound1 on Thu Jun 19, 2014 11:27 am

i'd like to get past the 2nd round...so AI for me
.
Jerry Buss wrote:One of the biggest reasons I bought the Lakers was to beat the Celtics …..you just got it into your soul that you couldn't stand the Celtics anymore
User avatar
pound4pound1

 
Posts: 6347
Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:47 am
Location: 818 LAKER NATION

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby Rooscooter on Thu Jun 19, 2014 1:01 pm

Funny how a certain Clipper fan believes that the overwhelming consensus of the fans in this thread is just a biased favorite team thing..... then again by his very presence and comments it's personified.

As for the CP3 to Zeke comparison. No... not close there either. Maybe to a Tiny or Gus Williams but I'd put Kevin Johnson's best years above anything that CP3 has done so far.
"If the past sits in judgment on the present, the future will be lost." Winston Churchill

“The prospect of domination of the nation's scholars by Federal employment, project allocations, and the power of money is ever present - and is gravely to be regarded." Dwight Eisenhower

"Socialism in general has a record of failure so blatant that only an intellectual could ignore or evade it" Thomas Sowell
User avatar
Rooscooter

 
Posts: 23048
Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2011 4:25 pm
Location: Chandler AZ and Andalué

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby CGrand81 on Thu Jun 19, 2014 1:08 pm

Wow, didn't think I'd be in the minority here but CP3 easily for me. I love Iverson, watching his highlight reels, entertaining has hell but a volume under 6 foot shooter; I'm passing on that. The guys a career 42.5% FG shooter, 40% in the playoffs. Stats don't tell the whole story but they can tell a lot. Even in his glory days 00-03 he shot lower than that. Cannot believe the poll but to each their own.

Speaking of playoff exits, he was 1 and done 4 times, didn't even make the playoffs 9 times, exited the 2nd round 3 times, and then his farthest run obviously against us. That year in the playoffs he shot 38% throughout the playoffs, volume chunker. Can't blame get though given that team around him.

Give me CP3 all day everyday.
User avatar
CGrand81

 
Posts: 744
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2008 12:04 pm
Location: San Marcos -TXST

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby Frank Dux on Thu Jun 19, 2014 1:08 pm

Both are faulty players. CP3 is an advanced stat geek's wet dream, and Iverson was one of the most determined players i've ever seen. Personally I would take Iverson. He was willing to go against anyone, hell remember him licking his chops against the GOAT, and crossing him up? CP3 is a ball pounder, you can run your team through him, but that's also his fault. His teammates end up expecting him to bail them out. His lack of post-season success is inexcusable given the rosters he's had. Tyson/West was one of the best frontcourts in the league at the time, and his Clippers roster is the deepest in the league. I question Chris Paul's heart and integrity. He's a guy who would rather cheat and draw a dishonest foul than taking it to the hole and ripping the opponents heart out. AI might not have been the sharpest tool in the shed, but he would give it 100%, and would go down fighting.
User avatar
Frank Dux

 
Posts: 4202
Joined: Sun Dec 13, 2009 11:24 pm

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby trodgers on Thu Jun 19, 2014 1:37 pm

I grew up in PA, and I lived there until 2003. I know how good Iverson was.

Their best players were:
Iverson
Mutombo
Aaron McKie
Eric Snow
Tyrone Hill
Jumaine Jones
Too MacCulloch
Raja Bell
Rodney Burord
Kevin Ollie
George Lynch
Matt Geiger

Chris Paul has had some good teams.
David West, Tyson Chandler, Peja were on that team. None of them were over 30. West was an All-Star (and would be the next season, too).

In LA, Paul had lots:
2012: Bledsoe, Butler, Evans, Griffin, Jordan, and Young.
Griffin was an all-star that year and the next and next year. He was also all-nba 2nd team. Butler and Williams had both been all-stars within the three years prior and neither were over the hill.


2014:
Jordan, Griffn were back; Crawford was in there, Collison, Barnes, Dudley, Redick, and Big Baby.
Griffin was an all-star that year and the next and next year. He was also all-nba 2nd team.
Crawford was 6th man of the year
blog.travisjrodgers.com
Its like Dr. Buss is guarding the Celtic rim this second half. Nothings dropping
User avatar
trodgers
Site Manager
 
Posts: 46640
Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2004 6:31 pm
Location: Orlando

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby TIME on Thu Jun 19, 2014 1:39 pm

Hmmm the classic Chucker vs. Flopper debate.

Easy, the Flopper always loses.
I'm lost in the fog of denial!
User avatar
TIME
CL Global Moderator
 
Posts: 9446
Joined: Thu Jun 09, 2005 11:06 am

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby Rooscooter on Thu Jun 19, 2014 1:48 pm

CGrand81 wrote:Wow, didn't think I'd be in the minority here but CP3 easily for me. I love Iverson, watching his highlight reels, entertaining has hell but a volume under 6 foot shooter; I'm passing on that. The guys a career 42.5% FG shooter, 40% in the playoffs. Stats don't tell the whole story but they can tell a lot. Even in his glory days 00-03 he shot lower than that. Cannot believe the poll but to each their own.

Speaking of playoff exits, he was 1 and done 4 times, didn't even make the playoffs 9 times, exited the 2nd round 3 times, and then his farthest run obviously against us. That year in the playoffs he shot 38% throughout the playoffs, volume chunker. Can't blame get though given that team around him.

Give me CP3 all day everyday.


You will be banned for this..... didn't you read the by-laws?

Zero tolerance for this with us "Laker Fans"....
"If the past sits in judgment on the present, the future will be lost." Winston Churchill

“The prospect of domination of the nation's scholars by Federal employment, project allocations, and the power of money is ever present - and is gravely to be regarded." Dwight Eisenhower

"Socialism in general has a record of failure so blatant that only an intellectual could ignore or evade it" Thomas Sowell
User avatar
Rooscooter

 
Posts: 23048
Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2011 4:25 pm
Location: Chandler AZ and Andalué

Re: AI Or CP3

Postby V.V.V.V.V. on Thu Jun 19, 2014 2:59 pm

AI was definitely a volume shooter. To a fault.

But he was a fierce competitor, and I would choose his will to win over CP3's will to appeal to the refs.
Vi Veri Vniversum Vivus Vici
V.V.V.V.V.

 
Posts: 3144
Joined: Sun May 07, 2006 11:59 pm
Location: Hollywood

Next

Return to NBA Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Yahoo [Bot] and 9 guests

cron
Advertise Here | Privacy Policy | ©2008 Sculu Sports. Come Strong.