ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby Kobe8Fan on Wed Sep 26, 2012 10:02 am



Skip, what are you on? Dirk is not a top 10 player today? Melo is ahead of Dirk? I agree with Stephen A.'s reply to that. And Drew is better than Dirk?! Get outta here with that BS.
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby nameant on Wed Sep 26, 2012 10:21 am

Melo ahead of Dirk is laughable. And I wouldn't put Drew ahead of Dirk...not just yet.
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby Texas Lakers Fan on Wed Sep 26, 2012 10:47 am

nameant wrote:Melo ahead of Dirk is laughable. And I wouldn't put Drew ahead of Dirk...not just yet.

Drew is definitely better because he plays both sides of the ball and rebounds the ball. Dirk is a great scorer, but he doesn't do much else.


Kobe8Fan wrote:

Skip, what are you on? Dirk is not a top 10 player today? Melo is ahead of Dirk? I agree with Stephen A.'s reply to that. And Drew is better than Dirk?! Get outta here with that BS.

How is it BS? Did you watch Dirk at all last season? He's clearly not the same player. He's a horrible defender while Drew is a very good rebounder and doesn't rebound the ball well at all while Drew is one of the best in the game. It's funny how a couple of months most here would agree Drew is without question the better player, but now that he's gone everyone's answers are different. Offensively Dirk is still better, but not by much. Dirk is mainly a jump shooter with no low post game. Drew is one of the best low post players in the league.
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby wcsoldier81 on Wed Sep 26, 2012 11:27 am

Pau top 15 after the great postseason he had ? should be 20-25 ...

Rondo should be top 10 ... he's the 2nd best PG in the league
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby thkthebest on Wed Sep 26, 2012 11:27 am

What the... Dirk Nowitzki is a good defender. He's always been underrated throughout his entire career, and a lot of what he does doesn't show up on the box score.

Dirk isn't KG on defense, but I don't know how you can say that he's not a good defender when you watch him play. Dirk plays good defense by proper positioning and rotating. His man defense is good as suggested by opponent PER. He's always talking to his teammates, and as a result, the Mavericks have generally been one of the league's best defensive teams. Without Dirk, both their offense and defense plummets. His +/- numbers are only rivaled by the likes of LeBron, Chris Paul, and Garnett.

DIrk is a poor offensive rebounder, not a poor defensive rebounder. The Mavericks are 6th in DRB%. He has a 20.0 DRB% compared to Gasol's 21.8 DRB%. That's also by design. People underestimate the impact that Dirk has just by being able to space the floor and draw attention away from the paint as opposed to clogging the paint and trying to get more rebounds. His offensive game also can also help the defense. Despite being the team's #1 option for years now, Dirk averages around 1.9 turnovers per game and limits transition opportunities.

Dirk should have definitely been in the top 10. The same goes for Kevin Garnett. I will never understand how Garnett didn't even make the top 20.
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby revgen on Wed Sep 26, 2012 11:35 am

Kobe8Fan wrote:Skip, what are you on? Dirk is not a top 10 player today? Melo is ahead of Dirk? I agree with Stephen A.'s reply to that. And Drew is better than Dirk?! Get outta here with that BS.


Dirk shouldn't be in the top ten. His performance last season doesn't warrant it. Top Ten players aren't suspended by their coach for a week for being out of shape. I wouldn't put Bynum ahead of Dirk yet since Drew has yet to bear the burden of being the #1 guy yet.
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby Finwë on Wed Sep 26, 2012 10:07 pm

Rondo should be higher. One of the best playoff performers in the L.
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby bruddahmanmatt on Wed Sep 26, 2012 11:05 pm

Texas Lakers Fan wrote:How is it BS? Did you watch Dirk at all last season? He's clearly not the same player. He's a horrible defender while Drew is a very good rebounder and doesn't rebound the ball well at all while Drew is one of the best in the game. It's funny how a couple of months most here would agree Drew is without question the better player, but now that he's gone everyone's answers are different. Offensively Dirk is still better, but not by much. Dirk is mainly a jump shooter with no low post game. Drew is one of the best low post players in the league.


:man10:
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby Frank Dux on Thu Sep 27, 2012 12:08 am

Texas Lakers Fan wrote:Drew is definitely better because he plays both sides of the ball and rebounds the ball. Dirk is a great scorer, but he doesn't do much else.


Call me when Drew leads a group of role players to a championship.
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby Texas Lakers Fan on Thu Sep 27, 2012 11:16 am

bruddahmanmatt wrote:
Texas Lakers Fan wrote:How is it BS? Did you watch Dirk at all last season? He's clearly not the same player. He's a horrible defender while Drew is a very good rebounder and doesn't rebound the ball well at all while Drew is one of the best in the game. It's funny how a couple of months most here would agree Drew is without question the better player, but now that he's gone everyone's answers are different. Offensively Dirk is still better, but not by much. Dirk is mainly a jump shooter with no low post game. Drew is one of the best low post players in the league.


:man10:

Do you watch Dirk at all? He has no low post game. He's basically just a jump shooter. There's. reason he only shoots 45 percent from the field.
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby Texas Lakers Fan on Thu Sep 27, 2012 11:16 am

Frank Dux wrote:
Texas Lakers Fan wrote:Drew is definitely better because he plays both sides of the ball and rebounds the ball. Dirk is a great scorer, but he doesn't do much else.


Call me when Drew leads a group of role players to a championship.

When has Drew ever been given the chance to lead a team? This is his first opportunity. Also we're not talking about 2011 we're talking about 2012 and last season Drew was clearly better.
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby abeer3 on Thu Sep 27, 2012 12:18 pm

Texas Lakers Fan wrote:
bruddahmanmatt wrote:
Texas Lakers Fan wrote:How is it BS? Did you watch Dirk at all last season? He's clearly not the same player. He's a horrible defender while Drew is a very good rebounder and doesn't rebound the ball well at all while Drew is one of the best in the game. It's funny how a couple of months most here would agree Drew is without question the better player, but now that he's gone everyone's answers are different. Offensively Dirk is still better, but not by much. Dirk is mainly a jump shooter with no low post game. Drew is one of the best low post players in the league.


:man10:

Do you watch Dirk at all? He has no low post game. He's basically just a jump shooter. There's. reason he only shoots 45 percent from the field.


:man10:
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby Frank Dux on Thu Sep 27, 2012 1:07 pm

Texas Lakers Fan wrote:
bruddahmanmatt wrote:
Texas Lakers Fan wrote:How is it BS? Did you watch Dirk at all last season? He's clearly not the same player. He's a horrible defender while Drew is a very good rebounder and doesn't rebound the ball well at all while Drew is one of the best in the game. It's funny how a couple of months most here would agree Drew is without question the better player, but now that he's gone everyone's answers are different. Offensively Dirk is still better, but not by much. Dirk is mainly a jump shooter with no low post game. Drew is one of the best low post players in the league.


:man10:

Do you watch Dirk at all? He has no low post game. He's basically just a jump shooter. There's. reason he only shoots 45 percent from the field.


Now I know you're just trolling. Using raw FG% to support your agenda? Nobody uses raw FG% anymore, it's a pretty lousy way to evaluate a player, especially a player like Dirk who is a great 3 point shooter, and free throw shooter. Dirk's offensive efficiency has always been off the charts, his career true shooting % is .581, which is tremendous. Even last season, which everyone considers pretty sub par by Dirk's standard he still put up a TS% of .564%, which is among the elite.

Dirk is by no means a poor low post player, in fact, i'm sure he would be among the best in the league if he played down there more. His use of his pivot foot is fantastic, and his footwork has always been superb. However, he's such a skilled scorer, that he doesn't need to play down there all the time, and his range is so valuable to his team, because he pulls the opposing defensive anchor out of the paint, opening up the lane for his teammates. Dirk will absolutely kill you from the mid post with his signature one legged fadeaway, and i've seen him destroy his man from the top of the key off the dribble. Dirk can score from just about anywhere on the court.
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby Doc Brown on Thu Sep 27, 2012 1:59 pm

Dirk doesn't have a post game.......

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Where the eff did you think Kobe got his one leg fadeaway in the post that can't be blocked, that a certain German has been owning the league with since he got here. It's the one move that nobody can stop in the post, yet he doesn't have a post game.
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby S.R.05 on Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:25 pm

just because dirk doesnt back down defenders and try to get a layup doesnt mean he doesnt have a post game

hes got some of the best footwork in the nba and gets tons of his midrange opportunities based on setting himself up in the post
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby purp n gold on Thu Sep 27, 2012 3:07 pm

Dirk is muuuuuuuuuch more than a jump shooter and his post game, although not conventional, is excellent.

When you have a height of 7'0", a wingspan of 7'4" and the ability to shoot the lights out, you have the luxury of posting up at the elbow of the key... or even beyond the free throw line.

TexasLakersFan, I get that you're trying to say Dirk sucks. And I agree he sucks, but only because he's been in celebration mode since he won the title. As far as his game goes I think you're way off base though.
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby Kit on Thu Sep 27, 2012 4:10 pm

Texas Lakers Fan wrote:
bruddahmanmatt wrote:
Texas Lakers Fan wrote:How is it BS? Did you watch Dirk at all last season? He's clearly not the same player. He's a horrible defender while Drew is a very good rebounder and doesn't rebound the ball well at all while Drew is one of the best in the game. It's funny how a couple of months most here would agree Drew is without question the better player, but now that he's gone everyone's answers are different. Offensively Dirk is still better, but not by much. Dirk is mainly a jump shooter with no low post game. Drew is one of the best low post players in the league.


:man10:

Do you watch Dirk at all? He has no low post game. He's basically just a jump shooter. There's. reason he only shoots 45 percent from the field.


The question is.... do YOU watch Dirk at all?

Dirk should be ahead of Love IMO.
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby V.V.V.V.V. on Thu Sep 27, 2012 6:10 pm

Doc Brown wrote:Dirk doesn't have a post game.......

Image

Where the eff did you think Kobe got his one leg fadeaway in the post that can't be blocked, that a certain German has been owning the league with since he got here. It's the one move that nobody can stop in the post, yet he doesn't have a post game.

I don't know Doc, I thought they both used that as a midrange move. Is it a postup move?
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby Rooscooter on Thu Sep 27, 2012 7:52 pm

Soooooo..... let me get this right..... ESPN does a top 10 list..... and now other ESPN shows are using it to create buzz..... Hmmm.....

Anyone else see a coordinated effort..... this crap is so lame it could only be "scripted".....
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby Congo Cash on Fri Sep 28, 2012 1:03 am

Wow, calling Dirk "only a jumpshooter"... :man3:
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby Iceberg Slim on Thu Oct 04, 2012 11:57 pm

Shamless bump here...

Dirk was not top 10 as of last year. He played uninspired basketball in the 2011-2012 season. Non-existent for the most part.
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Re: ESPN First Take: Biggest Top Ten Snub In NBA Player Rankings

Postby strikemode14 on Mon Oct 08, 2012 5:50 am

Skip, what are you on? Dirk is not a top 10 player today? Melo is ahead of Dirk? I agree with Stephen A.'s reply to that. And Drew is better than Dirk?! Get outta here with that BS.



Dirk at his best is better then melo no doubt. However just going by last year how he was out of shape and in fact had to sit games due to that fact I could live with someone saying dirk is better...for now. Now if Dirk comes this year in shape and with passion I'll put him back ahead of melo easily.

As for Drew over dirk. That's a tough one. The reason being is Drew is the second best center in the league. He is one of the few guys you can throw it in the post, he back down his defender and can throw it in the hoop. He can also rebound/blk shots well. Only a handful of guys can do it. So talent wise I think dirk is better but if I am starting a team I might go with drew with the preference I am assuming he will be healthy the whole time I go with drew becuase he is a harder commodity. I can get perimeter scoring alot easier then post scoring.

Now skip said Drew was better then howard which I disagree. Talent wise he can do more stuff. He has better footwork, has a jumper, has an array of way to score in the post compared and he is a legit 7'0 with longer arms so when he wants to he can block. However with that said the problem with drew is his constinency. He can have games where he put up 30 rebs..then next game put up 3. He can have 20 pt games one night and have a 6 the next. He can be the most aggressive guy in the post one half..the next half he gets timid. In short you don't know what you will get. I know with Howard I am getting minimal 15 and 10 with 2 blks on a bad night. I am getting that. I also know if Kobe or pau are having bad nights will just feed howard and he will get it done becuase he has the experience of being the only superstar. In short we won't miss drew at all in anyway.
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