James Harden: $80m Extension With Rockets

Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby The Rock on Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:28 pm

That Kevin Martin $13 mil expiring and Toronto pick are gonna be very useful for OKC at the trade deadline. It will be interesting how OKC deals with that
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby Vasashi17 on Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:33 pm

^^ I don't think they will unless its for low salary type players (which are either rookies still on their rookie contracts or no so good NBA players). I think they simply let Kmart expire and go add to their roster through the draft. That's been Presti's specialty and plus the owner doesn't want to pay taxes.

What they could do is use one of their 1st round picks to deal away a bad contract (Perk?)...now that would be interesting. I guess it remains to be seen just how much their owner is willing to spend. At times like this, you just appreciate Buss that much more.
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby Alleyhoops on Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:36 pm

Perhaps the comradery between Westbrook, Durant and Harden was not what some thought it to be. Players say the right things to the media and portray themselves on the court in the best light possible. I think at times Westbrook's game has a tendency to alienate teammates. Whether or not there were personality issues with Harden and his OKC teammates is speculative, but he and his representation certainly seemed unmotivated to keep him in OKC. But maybe this was determined to be a prime opportunity for him to get a big payday -- somewhere. Or quite possibly a combination of the above.
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby JSM on Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:37 pm

Saw this as I was flipping through ESPN...talk about coming out of nowhere. Either Houston had put in an offer when they saw OKC struggling to come to terms with Harden throughout this summer or OKC put this together QUICK -- in a matter of hours, quick.

Really good deal for Houston. As this off-season proved, they can't land any of the marquee players they want. They were very aggressive and ended up getting stuck with Lin and Asik. I think Asik can be a very solid starting C in this league and the verdict is still out on Lin. He has a long way to go though now that teams know how to play against him.

Martin could score, but Harden is leaps and bounds a better player. He's more durable, has a more well-rounded game, and is certainly more athletic. Here's the biggest difference: Martin is not a franchise player and we don't know if Harden can be on or not because he was behind Durant and Westbrick. But there's the chance that he could be one. Obviously he isn't ready to be a franchise player on a good team or else he would have leap frogged Westprick, but Houston isn't a good team and is a good place to start.

Definitely a step in the wrong direction for OKC. It was a financial move that they had to make because Harden wasn't taking their offer and Marin will expire. But they take a step back for the next year to two and it doesn't seem like the players are fans of the trade. Should be interesting.
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby Basketball Fan on Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:45 pm

You didn't really need to watch it on ESPN but it did come out of nowhere it was mentioned by the announcers during the ND/Oklahoma game.


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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby The Rock on Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:47 pm

Vasashi17 wrote:^^ I don't think they will unless its for low salary type players (which are either rookies still on their rookie contracts or no so good NBA players). I think they simply let Kmart expire and go add to their roster through the draft. That's been Presti's specialty and plus the owner doesn't want to pay taxes.

What they could do is use one of their 1st round picks to deal away a bad contract (Perk?)...now that would be interesting. I guess it remains to be seen just how much their owner is willing to spend. At times like this, you just appreciate Buss that much more.


They can still improve roster for this year without adding future salary...here are some unrestricted free agents for 2013 that might be on the market at the deadline

- Al Jefferson
- Paul Millsap
-Josh Smith
- Emeka Okafor
- Iguodala
- Shawn Marion
- Chris Kaman
- Anthony Morrow
- Devin Harris


they can bag one or two of these guys for Martin's expiring and that Toronto pick (top 3 protected) if those teams are out of the playoff race deadline. Its a win win


But it really depends on how well they start this year. If they dont seem like a good team they might lean towards making a deal if they're doing just fine they may just decide to let K-Mart expire and use those picks
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby Snake Eyes on Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:53 pm

Weezy wrote:
Snake Eyes wrote:Kevin Martin and James Harden are not that different statistically. The only major difference is at the three point line.

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Statistics tell very little of the story here. Martin is always injured, and has never played in a significant game I can remember. Harden was a huge piece of OKC, he had a bad Finals, but before that he was clutch all playoffs, if take Harden over Martin every time. Seems like kind of a weak trade for OKC to me, unless Lamb is betted than anticipated.


Oh, I totally get that. I haven't seen a whole heck of a lot of Kevin Martin, but being a big KD fan, I try and watch OKC as much as possible. Harden is the superior player. So, you will get no argument from me; I agree. Image
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby Tobias Funke on Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:55 pm

So Vash, you're saying this all went down because OKC didn't want to offer a 5th year? Im not the go-to guy for info on contracts to say the least.
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby The Rock on Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:56 pm

Yikes

https://twitter.com/johnschuhmann/status/262417055209361408

38% of Harden's shots were in the restricted area last year. Martin? 14%.
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby Basketball Fan on Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:02 pm

Durant was at the ND/Oklahoma game I wonder if that's how he found out about the Harden trade that would be kind of hilarious if so

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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby Vasashi17 on Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:04 pm

Tobias Funke wrote:So Vash, you're saying this all went down because OKC didn't want to offer a 5th year? Im not the go-to guy for info on contracts to say the least.


That's what my understanding is. OKC offered Durant a max deal at 5 years and therefore designated him as the only player that they can use that rule for. Westbrook too got a 5 year deal, but not at the max.

Harden wanted the max and OKC was not ready to give him the max for 4 years (let alone 5 which they didn't have the ability to do anyways).

Houston with this trade pretty much said that they are ready to do just that. So I'm expecting a 5 year deal at the max for Harden by this coming Wednesday. It should total around 75M and that alone blows out the OKC offer of 54M over 4 years. Personally I don't think Harden is a max type player, but I can understand why Houston did it...he's 23 and still has to reach his prime...this offseason revealed to Houston that FAs are just not looking to sign with them, so they're going to have to get really aggressive in bringing them over. They gave pretty ridiculous contracts to Lin and Asik which is why NY and Chicago didn't match and they are once again prepared to do the same with Harden.
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby JSM on Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:08 pm

Jonathan Feigen ‏@Jonathan_Feigen

Hearing a lot about Lin, Asik contracts. Keep in mind, Rockets still have room for another max FA next summer, even after Harden gets max.
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby Battle Tested20 on Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:09 pm

Snake Eyes wrote:Kevin Martin and James Harden are not that different statistically. The only major difference is at the three point line.

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And more importantly Harden can create his own shot, whereas Martin can't really do that effectively and is more of a spot up or coming off a screen type of player now.
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby JSM on Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:11 pm

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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby dj vitus on Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:13 pm

The Rock wrote:Lin and Harden? not bad

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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby dj vitus on Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:13 pm

DAM BEAT ME TO IT :man6:
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby Tobias Funke on Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:17 pm

So OKC could have offered him a 5 year deal at lets say $68M? Interesting.
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby JSM on Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:18 pm

BBALLBREAKDOWN ‏@bballSource

According to @mySynergySports, Kevin Martin is in the 16th percentile for defense (terrible). Harden is 61st percentile, which is good

Good news for the Black Mamba. :man9:
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby The Rock on Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:23 pm

If the Rockets offer Harden a 5th year, the difference between that and the OKC offer is apparently 20 mil according to Stein

https://twitter.com/ESPNSteinLine/status/262423276880556032
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby Vasashi17 on Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:27 pm

Tobias Funke wrote:So OKC could have offered him a 5 year deal at lets say $68M? Interesting.

Yessir

IMHO, Harden and his agent were playing hardball...Presti and the owner got fed up and sent him on his way. They sent him out now, as opposed to next summer cause they probably felt his value could go down. Plus being an RFA, they're at other teams mercy and Morey just showed the league how much of a prick he is in give toxic contracts to RFAs like Lin and Asik. They wanted Harden, but not at the max and if they waited, that's exactly what would happen.
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby hollywood swinger on Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:47 pm

Harden = big time momentum shifting player. he actually can defend as well. kevin martin ? people are trying to justify kevin martin as equal to harden? :man10:
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby Vasashi17 on Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:54 pm

OKC's offer 54.4M over 4 years
Houston can offer max for 5 years, which is about 75-80M and Texas has no state tax.

Got 25M problems and the tax ain't one...
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby hollywood swinger on Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:56 pm

big chemistry blow to okc. checkout Lakers trading their 6th man of the year in the off season.
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby Lakerjones on Sat Oct 27, 2012 11:10 pm

Wow, I definitely did not see this one coming. OKC took some steps backward for sure. Certainly they just made our lives easier this season.
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Re: ROCKETS to acquire James Harden!

Postby therealdeal on Sat Oct 27, 2012 11:24 pm

Just seriously imagine the psychological damage this is going to cost right at the start of the season. Wow. That team built themselves on the "family" ideal. Perkins talked all of that mess during the summer. All of them said fairly similar things.

This is going to hit them pretty badly. I think they'll bounce back and they're certainly WCF worthy. But damn... remember what happened when we traded LO. The team was never the same after that.
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