Source: Rockets Not Interested In Danny Granger (Pg. 3)

I agree with Texas... I'd rather have Pau. Not sure what West can give us at this point, and Granger is not as good as everyone's rating him here. Bottom line, Pau will be the best player involved any deal with West & Granger - and we'll be losing him in it. Don't do it Mitch.

FabFourLakers wrote:Even if it was Granger for Pau straight up, its a fair trade IMO.

thkthebest wrote:Sure, we'd do the trade, but why in the world would the Pacers do it?

Because Mitch said so .. the opponent GM has no choice

Wow, West/Granger for Pau/Ebanks works so well for both sides too, as George can slide down to 3 and Pau upgrades their rebounding and length.. but it couldn't happen until Dec 15th at the earliest due to Ebanks' re-upping..

But...Pau/Glock works right now, doesn't it? Would they even consider that?

wcsoldier81 wrote:

thkthebest wrote:Sure, we'd do the trade, but why in the world would the Pacers do it?

Because Mitch said so .. the opponent GM has no choice

purp n gold wrote: Granger is not as good as everyone's rating him here.

Nobody is saying Granger is great. He's a 3rd option IMO, and would fit perfectly here. Granger gives us decent athletic ability to run the floor with Nash, and will knock down those open 3's with ease.

Not a star player, but a great complimentary piece.

Frank Dux wrote:

purp n gold wrote: Granger is not as good as everyone's rating him here.

Nobody is saying Granger is great. He's a 3rd option IMO, and would fit perfectly here. Granger gives us decent athletic ability to run the floor with Nash, and will knock down those open 3's with ease.

Not a star player, but a great complimentary piece.

People are rating him to be as good as or worth Gasol. That is overrating Granger.

Granger: average rebounder, suspect defender and a volume scorer... in other words a chucker. Not clutch either.

Pau will be a better 3rd option than Granger ever will be. Pau's hot or cold depending on how he being used in the offense. Everyone here knows that. Pau ABUSED Chandler (supposed best defensive big) in the post during the gold medal game this summer.

If Mr. Potato Head is any smart, part of his summer is being spent on finding ways to get Gasol involved in the offense.

Doc Brown wrote:^^^Please explain how we would be worse, if we brought in Granger/West and lost Pau.

He was saying how Pau for Granger alone would make us worse.

purp n gold wrote:

Frank Dux wrote:

purp n gold wrote: Granger is not as good as everyone's rating him here.

Nobody is saying Granger is great. He's a 3rd option IMO, and would fit perfectly here. Granger gives us decent athletic ability to run the floor with Nash, and will knock down those open 3's with ease.

Not a star player, but a great complimentary piece.

People are rating him to be as good as or worth Gasol. That is overrating Granger.

Granger: average rebounder, suspect defender and a volume scorer... in other words a chucker. Not clutch either.

Pau will be a better 3rd option than Granger ever will be. Pau's hot or cold depending on how he being used in the offense. Everyone here knows that. Pau ABUSED Chandler (supposed best defensive big) in the post during the gold medal game this summer.

If Mr. Potato Head is any smart, part of his summer is being spent on finding ways to get Gasol involved in the offense.

For me this move would be about floor balance and opening the paint for Howard. Right now we have Pau and MWP in the starting lineup...... neither of them are effective offensively from farther out than about 12 feet on a consistent basis.

Replacing Pau with West and Granger puts a GREAT pick and roll player at the PF in West..... he was amazing with Paul in NO.... Nash is even better than Paul at running the P&R and West can hit consistently out to 18'. Granger is a knockdown 3 point shooter and can create and get to the hoop. He's one of the better 2 way SF's in the league. His defense and grit against LeBron was a surprise for most but I've watched him give Pierce fits as well. He's very underrated on the defensive end.

Finally... I'd bet Pau is gone next summer regardless of what we do this year.... he is our only tradable asset to get something to go with Howard when all of the old guys retire..... He will be a huge expiring contract and never more valuable.... Granger and West would be a great trade for us and give Indiana the most formidable front line in the East....

David west couldn't post up Shane and y'all want him? Yell™

ben_ready wrote:David west couldn't post up Shane and y'all want him? Yell™

With Dwight you don't necessarily need another post player.

After watching last season, I am begging for more perimeter players...

1. i think the current lineup deserves a shot before we start fantasizing about trades.
2. i think it's entirely possible that granger's game would suffer with a demotion on the totem pole (much like artest's has), and i'm pretty sure that pau is better at every facet of the game when compared with david west. the only one i'm not positive about is midrange shooting, but that's close enough to not really worry about. if you're going to replace pau with a pf, it needs to be a true stretch-4 (3 pt range) for you to see the real benefit on offense.

^^Pau isn't a pick and roll PF.... no matter how much people say he is..... West was one of the best in the league playing with Paul.....

Granger's game complements the other players very well..... he would give us another "end of the game" option that we sorely need with Howard's free throw shooting as well.... Moving MWP to the bench strengthens that unit and puts another vet on the floor when the starters are resting.

The larger thought that somehow Pau will return to his 2010 form because of Nash is misplaced IMHO...... his issues haven't been getting the ball in a position to score...... it's been aggressiveness when he has the ball in those positions..... he's a gifted scorer with a "pass first" mentality..... and shrinks in pressure situations... I don't see Nash and Howard being on the floor changing that...

Rooscooter, I respectfully disagree with just about every point you've made regarding this deal. Why isn't Pau capable of being PnR PF? Asking Pau to return to his 2010 form is not nearly as far-fetched as asking David West to return to 2008.

I already voiced my opinions on Granger.

The larger thought that somehow Pau will return to his 2010 form because of Nash is misplaced IMHO...... his issues haven't been getting the ball in a position to score......

And that's just not true... Pau's issues last year had A LOT to do with positioning. Pau was always the "roll man" in any feeble attempt we made at the pick n roll. Blake/Sessions/Fisher have little to no ability in turning the corner and using Pau's screen. And when said guards couldn't get dribble penetration, Pau is stuck getting a weird pass 10-15ft away from the basket - forced to take a bad jumper or drive to the lane with all help defenders present. Nash will certainly change this. Search the "Steve Nash Effect" on youtube.

Pau is the best player in the trade. A West/Granger for Pau deal is "trading down" and I doubt Mitch & Jim do such a thing. Not to mention piss off a certain player named Kobe...

I don't buy that Pau is our only tradeable asset either. Mitch traded Luke Walton for Sessions for crying out loud... don't underestimate the man.

^well we'll agree to disagree....

Pau began last year missing 4 crucial free throws against Chicago.... and finished the year passing out of 8 footers over guards to turn the ball over to Westbrook and Durant on consecutive possessions ..... His problem has nothing to do with positioning or where he's getting the ball.... He doesn't want the ball when it's "winning time".... I can't put it any clearer than that.... Nash may make his field goal % go up.... he may get more points.... but he isn't going to change the fact that Pau won't take the big shot.... Say what you will about Granger but he elevates his game when the bright lights are on.....

Pau will be gone by this time next year because of his contract..... I'd love this kind of return on his contact...

You know, the more I think about this trade, the more I'm leaning in favor of it.

I think Roo made a great point about West playing better with CP3. Seems like his scoring average went down in Indy without a good distributor (and also playing less minutes).

And yes, 2008 West was pretty dominant, but '10-'11 West was still pretty good, too. That's good enough for us. With Nash on board, AND playing more minutes, he can probably get back into his 2011 ways. My only gripe is he doesn't rebound enough or pass as well as Gasol.

I haven't seen West play much, but if he can drill that 18-footer with consistency and remain athletic enough to stay in front of his man on defense, I don't think Kobe would miss Gasol too much.

As for Granger, well, he is a much better upgrade than Ebanks, right?

Rooscooter wrote:^^Pau isn't a pick and roll PF.... no matter how much people say he is..... West was one of the best in the league playing with Paul.....

why not? also, bolded. pau has played with derek fisher for much of his laker career.

Granger's game complements the other players very well..... he would give us another "end of the game" option that we sorely need with Howard's free throw shooting as well.... Moving MWP to the bench strengthens that unit and puts another vet on the floor when the starters are resting.

just saying, granger's a volume shooter. sometimes those guys are terrible when they're not the focal point of an offense. stephen jackson has been like that throughout his career, imo.

The larger thought that somehow Pau will return to his 2010 form because of Nash is misplaced IMHO...... his issues haven't been getting the ball in a position to score...... it's been aggressiveness when he has the ball in those positions..... he's a gifted scorer with a "pass first" mentality..... and shrinks in pressure situations... I don't see Nash and Howard being on the floor changing that...

eh, he needs another chance. one thing the talking heads are right about is that nash's arrival (and maybe howard's) may finally be the thing to help balance out kobe's acidity. i think that occasionally has grated on pau and taken away from his confidence. if the culture is a little more egalitarian (as he enjoys on the spanish national team), maybe he'll feel more comfortable being assertive when the moment calls.

i also like that pau can play 12 good minutes at center a game, btw. his replacement probably won't have that flexibility.

i just think it's worth a full year with this roster before any more splashy moves are made. if pau is terrible again in the playoffs, he's an expiring contract next year. if metta can't hit the broad side of a barn for most of the year again, he can be amnestied. for now, in theory, this team looks pretty good and pretty balanced.

abeer3 wrote:1. i think the current lineup deserves a shot before we start fantasizing about trades.
2. i think it's entirely possible that granger's game would suffer with a demotion on the totem pole (much like artest's has), and i'm pretty sure that pau is better at every facet of the game when compared with david west. the only one i'm not positive about is midrange shooting, but that's close enough to not really worry about. if you're going to replace pau with a pf, it needs to be a true stretch-4 (3 pt range) for you to see the real benefit on offense.

+1

Good to see the "anything to get rid of the Euro" crew is still alive and kicking.

abeer3 wrote:
i also like that pau can play 12 good minutes at center a game, btw. his replacement probably won't have that flexibility.

i just think it's worth a full year with this roster before any more splashy moves are made. if pau is terrible again in the playoffs, he's an expiring contract next year. if metta can't hit the broad side of a barn for most of the year again, he can be amnestied. for now, in theory, this team looks pretty good and pretty balanced.

Pau's versatility as a back-up center is a valid point that would result in some issues for us unless we could find a decent one in the deal somehow....

The balance of our starters is a bigger issue IMO with Howard than it was with Bynum. Howard has never played with a clogged lane and a "walk it up team". He needs a more open lane to work in and having a PF that will operate between 0 and 12 feet doesn't really help him IMO. MWP is a SF that cannot either create off the dribble or shoot from outside at a level to make the defense respect him. This allows teams to sag off of him onto Howard as well.... A shooter is needed in the starting lineup IMO.... and the best one we have will be passing most of the time in Nash....

My feelings are that Pau is gone next summer no matter what.... his contract and level of play are no longer in sync and he will never be worth more than next offseason because he will be a huge expiring. Getting someone like Granger is a good return.... West will expire next summer giving us some relief as well.

Pau's inabilities to step up don't' seem rooted in whom he is playing with IMHO... He's a joy to watch from a fundamental standpoint but when we really need him to pick up Kobe or the rest of the team he's been conspicuously absent..... and for 20 Million I'd trade him for youth (Granger) and diversity.

I guess Pau sliding to the center when Howard is out doesn't mean nothing to y'all, think this over please, versatility matters and Pau has been working on that 3 (not bynum like either). Yell™