The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby Iceberg Slim on Wed May 29, 2013 10:30 am

This post is taken directly from blog my site which is posted above my sig. I couldn't help but think that at a time when he's about to potentially win his 5th ring, no one is really talking about him for the right reasons. It's sad, but its the way it is. It's long overdue that I pay some homage to the greatest PF of all-time...


In a modern day culture scene where a Kardashian is trending for being a preggo fatty with a possible gay lover (sorry Kanye), Bieber wants Nazi victim love from Anne Frank, and Lohan is loved for a being a perennial life loser, I feel confident in saying that Americans like dysfunction.

Which brings me to the iPhone-like functionality of Tim Duncan – a genetic hybrid of a 7’0 Bill Russell, the kid who cried for a getting a 2200 on the new SAT, who acts like a moving wax statue…of himself. He’s a 14-time all-star, 4-time champion, 3-time Finals MVP, 2-time regular season MVP, who is simply put, the GREATEST POWER FORWARD OF ALL-TIME. And he’s making more headlines now than maybe ever before because he’s going through a divorce with his college sweetheart/wife Amy Duncan. NBA Finals? That might pale in comparison to his remarkably messy divorce scandal. A scandal that includes Duncan hiring a private eye to track his wife’s whereabouts where she allegedly cheated on him with her personal trainer. And true to form, it’s still as boring as badminton in the Olympics, just like his legendary game. If he had swag like the guys America loves to hate (Tiger, Mayweather, Kobe) ESPN would create its own ticker on the bottom screen for him. But you don’t care that much. And that’s probably how he prefers it.

But this blog post isn’t about his life, his wife, or his personal business. I’ll let TMZ and Bossip do what they’re known for. This post is about a guy who for all intents and purposes, might be the Tom Brady of the NBA. A guy who, while America cries a river over all the showboating, tattoos, and hip hop culture of the league, embodies the quintessential virtues of “American Values” - humility, a blue collar work ethic, and quiet consistency. Still, fans might choose Karl Malone or Charles Barkley above him for top billing, none of which makes any basketball sense considering they have zero combined rings.

So with the assumption that Tim Duncan and the aging Spurs (who get 10 days of rest until the Finals) meets the biggest media superstar/villian in Lebron James and the Miami Heat in the Finals, remember this…

People don’t remember winners. They only remember the winners who seem cool. Then they remember tragic losers. And that’s no fault of Tim Duncan. That’s the fault of our esteemed “american values”.
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby LTLakerFan on Wed May 29, 2013 12:59 pm

Epic Post Slim. What a great read. Of late I have really come to appreciate Tim and the Spurs themselves. Manu is the White Kobe in a lot of regards and freaking Tony Parker and all the plug in "Role" players over the years!! If they meet the Heat and stay healthy I think Spurs hoist #5. That would be freaking AWESOME.
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby Jazzygirl205 on Wed May 29, 2013 1:05 pm

People don't like the Spurs because in this basketball era all we care about is glitz and flash. If we're not getting high flying basketball tricks between the legs, or someone throwing down a dunk from a lob then people are uninterested. I like good old compatible basketball no matter who's playing. I prefer to watch two teams battle like their life depends on it, I don't care about superstars battling especially when one team is winning by like 15 it's pointless.
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby gcclaker on Wed May 29, 2013 1:14 pm

Quiet consistency...that sums it up. Unassuming brilliance. There was an SI story about Duncan a couple of years ago that was a good read. It was vanilla but interesting nonetheless. I wouldn't want to be the one selling him a car.
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby Weezy on Wed May 29, 2013 2:08 pm

I get the message, and it's true to an extent, but I think the real reason people don't talk about Tim is because he doesn't put up big numbers. He hasn't averaged 20 points or more the last 6 seasons, the 7th he averaged exactly 20, and the year before that he averaged 18, and his career averages are 20 points, 11 boards, 2 blocks. People (and ESPN) like players that put up gaudy numbers with flashy games, I think if he'd had a few seasons of 25-28 ppg and those 12 boards, like Shaq, he'd have gotten a little more attention. The Spurs also haven't been to the Finals since 2007, and while they have remained good, they have failed to get to the Finals or win a title for quite some time now, AND the last time they did Tony Parker won Finals MVP not Timmy. I agree that he's the best PF ever, but he's just not flashy as this blog states, his defensive impact doesn't pop off the stat sheet and rock solid consistent play does show there, but again, the numbers aren't huge like the LeBron's, Kobe's, and Durant's of the NBA, and he doesn't "dunk g00d" like Blake Griffin. :man11:

If the Spurs do win the title this season though, Tim moves up a notch bigtime, in how he's remembered and talked about. He'd tie Kobe in rings, and might be talked about as the best player of his generation having those 5 rings (in 5 tries, no Finals blemishes ala MJ), 3 Finals MVP's (possibly 4), and 2 regular season MVP's, to Kobe's 5, 2, and 1. So I really say it's on him in the end to get it done to make people talk about him again. Like Tom Brady, Duncan hasn't won in a long time now, and if he does, maybe people will start talking about him for the right reasons again.
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby Battle Tested20 on Wed May 29, 2013 5:10 pm

Well said and well written Slim. I couldn't agree more with you about Duncan and how American is really dis-functional if you really think about it. Is Duncan the perfect person? No, but he's the kind of athlete that parents wants their kids to grow up to be: humble, coachable, and put their teammates before themselves.

I think often how much we as Lakers fans get upset at how Lebron gets all this attention and so-called accolades from ESPN as one of the best player in the last decade and Kobe seems to be this forgotten dynamic, once in a generation type competitor. Then you look at Duncan and he doesn't even get half or probably even a quarter of the attention he deserves based on all the success he's had in his career. It JUST ISN'T RIGHT sometimes. It's because of this that I myself find myself rooting for Duncan and the Spurs to win it all this year. In due time, Duncan before its all said and done will get his well deserved attention but it shouldn't take this long or happen this infrequently.

I'll have to bookmark your blog and keep tabs on it. Nice work again Slim!
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby Kasumi on Wed May 29, 2013 6:48 pm

Thank you Ice, well said and well spoken. This is an athlete that took a major paycut so that the team could get talent around him. This is the guy who, when Tony Parker's asking price was above what Peter Holt wanted to pay, walked into management's office and said, "Give him whatever he wants, I'll pay the difference out of my own pocket. Tony is staying here." This is the athlete that has embraced his coach and is willing to be yelled at during practice right along everyone else. This is the guy who graduated from college to fulfill a promise he made to his mom.

He's as fierce a competitor as anyone in the NBA today, but he's not a glitz and glamour guy. He's just a winner.
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby Avenged24 on Wed May 29, 2013 9:30 pm

Very well written. The problem with Tim in the sense that he is not talked about as much is the fact that he's not hated. Simply put. People love to talk about the players they hate. Kobe, Lebron, Wade, Dwight, Melo, Rose and even Durant now. Notice anything? They are all star players.

The way Tim has carried himself throughout his career, and the fact this he is part of a well ran, classy organization helps him in that department (or hurts depending on how you view it). All that aside, Tim still gets his respect. He is a consensus top 10 player of all-time (from what I can tell most have him at 7-9), and is regarded as the best PF of all-time.

Sorry for derailing this Duncan appreciation thread but isn't it hypocritical how people say Kobe was lucked into his rings due to coming straight to a contender with Shaq, and then gifted Pau but then those same people disregard it when it comes to Duncan. And why? Well because he is simply more liked. This is the guy who played with The Admiral, Manu, and 1x Finals MVP in Parker.
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby 432J on Wed May 29, 2013 10:22 pm

excellent post

i've been a fan of tim duncan for years now and the reason being that he plays the game the way it should be played. it's that simple. he isn't flashy, doesn't play in a big market, he doesn't find himself in the news all the time, he isn't dating a bigtime actress or model or whatever, and he definitely isn't marketable yet he's the most successful player of this generation along with kobe.

the spurs are the classiest organization in north american pro sports. it starts from the top in peter holt and rc buford and runs all the way down to the core on-court product that they've had in place for over a decade now. no big egos, flashiness, or prima donas on that team. just a group of guys with excellent chemistry and a single goal in mind. yes they're boring to watch but they play a team sport the way it should be played. like a team
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby Iceberg Slim on Wed May 29, 2013 11:39 pm

but I think the real reason people don't talk about Tim is because he doesn't put up big numbers. He hasn't averaged 20 points or more the last 6 seasons...


Neither did Alonzo Mourning when he played with the Hornets and Heat. Their numbers look almost identical. Difference was Zo had enough personalty for 3 people. He was a high energy, trash talking, shot blocking, goon. And didn't win a ring until 2006, which was his twilight. He was often talked about. And it primarily had to do with his incredible personality, imo.

Is Duncan the perfect person? No, but he's the kind of athlete that parents wants their kids to grow up to be: humble, coachable, and put their teammates before themselves.


This is what boggles me about basketball fans. The addage is true, negativity spreads faster. "Fans" of the game moan about Amare Stoudemire types, Melo's, and the JR Smith's (the Knicks are in trouble, btw) but can't acknowledge a 4-year Wake Forest grad as the quintessential embodiment of the "role model". Which brought me to my point in the last paragraph. Most people are victims of the cool factor, even if they hate a guy. They are blinded so much, many of them don't realize the good that's staring them in the face. Why? His energy isn't really attractive. And in a world of shiny toys and loud colors, substance comes second.

This is the guy who, when Tony Parker's asking price was above what Peter Holt wanted to pay, walked into management's office and said, "Give him whatever he wants, I'll pay the difference out of my own pocket. Tony is staying here."


He really did this? :man4: Hey...if you can find a link to a story that speaks on this, please provide it. That's one of the most selfless acts within the sports realm I've ever heard of.

Like Tom Brady, Duncan hasn't won in a long time now, and if he does, maybe people will start talking about him for the right reasons again.


Hopefully so. History will do him justice, I believe. But the current eyes and ears who appreciate him now are only basketball fanatics and lovers of the game. His resume alone stands up to almost anyone.

Hey, here's a question for everyone: In terms of championships, status, accomplishments, and hardware should Tim Duncan be ranked above Kobe Bryant in a top 10 of all-time list?
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby FabFourLakers on Thu May 30, 2013 12:08 am

Iceberg Slim wrote:
but I think the real reason people don't talk about Tim is because he doesn't put up big numbers. He hasn't averaged 20 points or more the last 6 seasons...


Neither did Alonzo Mourning when he played with the Hornets and Heat. Their numbers look almost identical. Difference was Zo had enough personalty for 3 people. He was a high energy, trash talking, shot blocking, goon. And didn't win a ring until 2006, which was his twilight. He was often talked about. And it primarily had to do with his incredible personality, imo.

Is Duncan the perfect person? No, but he's the kind of athlete that parents wants their kids to grow up to be: humble, coachable, and put their teammates before themselves.


This is what boggles me about basketball fans. The addage is true, negativity spreads faster. "Fans" of the game moan about Amare Stoudemire types, Melo's, and the JR Smith's (the Knicks are in trouble, btw) but can't acknowledge a 4-year Wake Forest grad as the quintessential embodiment of the "role model". Which brought me to my point in the last paragraph. Most people are victims of the cool factor, even if they hate a guy. They are blinded so much, many of them don't realize the good that's staring them in the face. Why? His energy isn't really attractive. And in a world of shiny toys and loud colors, substance comes second.

This is the guy who, when Tony Parker's asking price was above what Peter Holt wanted to pay, walked into management's office and said, "Give him whatever he wants, I'll pay the difference out of my own pocket. Tony is staying here."


He really did this? :man4: Hey...if you can find a link to a story that speaks on this, please provide it. That's one of the most selfless acts within the sports realm I've ever heard of.

Like Tom Brady, Duncan hasn't won in a long time now, and if he does, maybe people will start talking about him for the right reasons again.


Hopefully so. History will do him justice, I believe. But the current eyes and ears who appreciate him now are only basketball fanatics and lovers of the game. His resume alone stands up to almost anyone.

Hey, here's a question for everyone: In terms of championships, status, accomplishments, and hardware should Tim Duncan be ranked above Kobe Bryant in a top 10 of all-time list?


Unfortunately (and I love Kobe), he probably already stands above Kobe simply because he boasts 3 finals MVP's to Kobe's 2, and he has 2 MVP awards to Kobe's 1. While he hasn't equaled Kobe in championships, he has been "the man" on 3 of the 4 championships he has won (dictated by number of finals MVP's in my eyes)...even though I believe that Kobe was probably the better PLAYER in every championship he's won from 00-02 and 09-10. I think you have to consider Duncan esp if he wins it all this year and gets finals MVP...that'll give him 5 titles, 4 finals MVP awards, 2 MVP awards, and a career of 20-11-2. That's just an AMAZING resume and unless Kobe can get #6 next year, Duncan will probably be ahead of Kobe in terms of championships, status, accomplishments, and hardware.
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby Weezy on Thu May 30, 2013 12:49 am

I don't really remember Alonzo Mourning being that talked about or celebrated that much back when he was at his peak in the late 90's. That's just me though, I remember he was a popular player, but I don't remember people celebrating him more than they do Duncan because he hadn't won any titles, and Duncan is often referred to as the greatest PF ever. I see your point though, and I do agree with it, he does not get celebrated enough because he isn't flashy as a player or person, I was just pointing out some more specific reasons why I feel that is.

Duncan vs Kobe, no I do not rank Duncan above Kobe right now, because I believe Kobe has had to carry more of a load for longer. Tony Parker has been the main guy or at least an equal partner in SA for a while now, Duncan has been rock solid, but Parker has been right there to carry the team with him, and often more than him for a while now. Kobe has not had a player on his team better than him for a decade. Plus I would say Kobe's prime was to me better, and went on for longer than Duncan's.

As far as accomplishments go they are close, Kobe has the 5 titles to Duncan's 4, but Duncan has the 3 Finals MVP's to Kobe's 2. I would think, like I said in my post above, that if Tim wins his 5th title this season and the Finals MVP, that if you're just going on accomplishments that probably has to push him past Kobe on the top 10 list though. If Tony Parker were to win his 2nd Finals MVP instead though, maybe Duncan stays where he is, close to Kobe, maybe equal to Kobe this generation, however you see it. It really depends on how you want to rank things, on pure accomplishments, on who you think the better player is, who's more talented, etc.. If you give me a choice with who I want to start a franchise with in their primes I take Kobe, but that's just me, and it's entirely possible I'm being a homer.
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby Forward Three on Thu May 30, 2013 2:24 am

Very thoughtful post. Timely too. I have been meditating on the American(seemingly American, certainly seems strongest here) obsession with superhero movies lately and how specifically it seems like almost ever modern superhero is kind of a total [Swearing is not permitted at Clublakers. You must edit this post prior to submitting.], but because they are really 'good/cool' we love them for it and root for them regardless. Where a Luke Skywalker type hero, once upon a time, had to have a humble beginning and go on a journey of discovery and learning and grow as a person/character, the modern hero is just someone who has to 'win', that is their only objective. To win and look cool while doing it. Going to rant a little here and veer off topic a bit but I do think there are connections in terms of society and culture even if the topics are a bit different.

The NBA has been seeing absolutely insane levels of popularity in the past half a decade or so, of all the major sports it has embraced social media the best, it has embraced big market tie-ins and advertising in the most unique ways(For the most part) it is very much an embodiment of sort of 'where we are at' with regards to what we want from entertainment and spectacle, and I think it is not an unfair or completely outlandish comparison to make to draw a connection to the recent trend in hollywood superhero movies. I mean, NBA ads even splice in whatever big movie is about to come out into the action to make the two seem one and the same.

It seems like the same problematic relationship with 'cool' is everywhere you look. Everything has become a simulacrum of the 'source material' everything is a reboot and a remix and major blockbusters like Star Trek Into Darkness exist pretty much solely to throw crap on the screen that you're supposed to recognize and feel good for having made the connection. Obviously NBA players aren't 'reboots' necessarily but sports have a long history of endless, tortured, beat-the-dead-horse comparisons of players for ages and we always want to believe such and such is 'the next' so and so, so there is something to be said about that as well.

But I think, perhaps the gnarliest thing about all of this stuff is that we've become so steeped in it, so saturated by it that "Well what did you expect?" is literally seen as a legitimate argument. "It's just entertainment", and "It's supposed to be stupid"...etc. all of these rationalizations exist to allow ridiculous movies to be made and made successful regardless of how dumb or pointless they might seem. The NBA isn't quite 'there' yet, but it's not hard to feel sometimes when you watch these games that it is. That the players don't really care, that hte refs are actively meddling to make things interesting, that the outcomes are irrelevant, that it's all 'just a game'.

Tough pill to swallow. When we all grew up(I'd assume, most of us at least) believing in the social and for lack of a better word spiritual values of sports and the community and 'character building' and the expression and all of the distinctly human and great things, the aspiration and the hopefulness, the greatness. The Tim Duncans and Kobe Bryants. It's not hard to feel like we've made a sharp turn somewhere away from caring about any of that and towards treating the whole thing like a big dumb money grab spectacle that exists for no other reason than 'ooo shiny'.

But... it's late and I'm being a cynical bastard. Great post Iceberg.
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby wcsoldier81 on Thu May 30, 2013 2:57 am

Well Duncan kind of chose to not be a superstar with the way he conducts himself through the years ( plus the fact his game is not flashy) ... It's a very respectable choice , nothing wrong with that , I'm sure he couldn't care less about being in the spotlight and getting more props from popular America .

The NBA always has promoted flashy players with huge egoes and individual performances over team players and teams performances in general .

The Spurs and Duncan get a ton of respect from people who know B-Ball , who cares if they were never talked about enough from the masses
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby Kasumi on Thu May 30, 2013 6:22 am

Iceberg Slim wrote:He really did this? Hey...if you can find a link to a story that speaks on this, please provide it. That's one of the most selfless acts within the sports realm I've ever heard of.

Yes, he did. I'll have to dig a bit and see if I can find an article, but it's from 2004 so it will be difficult. I had actually sat next to Peter Holt during a summer league game and, while arguing the importance of re-signing Horry, received the impression he didn't intend on signing Tony to an extension. That was confirmed at the start of the season, they wanted to let Tony play out the year to where he would be a restricted free agent in 2005.

Pop spoke openly to the media about what a stupid idea that was, and he never speaks badly about his own management team. Because of pressure, they started negotiations but were something like 6% off between the demands when they reached a stalemate. It was signed in the final hour at TP's asking price thanks to TD, though they didn't hold Timmy to actually paying the difference. It demonstrated how important Tony was to Tim, and Tim was everything to the Spurs.
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby Iceberg Slim on Thu May 30, 2013 7:24 am

The funny thing about my post on this subject is, all my favorite athletes are the cool villians of the world - Mayweather, Kobe, Tiger, Ray Lewis. My fanship of sports was rooted in the ways, guises, and words of a Mr. Muhammad Ali as a child. I was a fan of him before I was a fan of Michael Jordan, even though I was born in the year Jordan entered the league. His charisma jumped off the television screen and captivated me long before his ring intelligence and footwork did.

With that said, being a athlete (and a former power forward) really assisted me in how I view the game and the athletes playing it. Tim Duncan was the guy I had to emulate. If you were a young basketball player and the tallest kid at almost every level, how could you not? He was quintessentially the perfect PF. I wasn't in the KG mold. I didn't have hops lmao! I had a ground game with basketball I.Q. So I looked to Jamal Mashburn and Tim Duncan to show me the game from afar. And even though I wanted Kobe's swag, my talent level didn't warrant that showmanship. I had keep my levels in check. I had to channel Mr. Duncan :bow:
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby trodgers on Thu May 30, 2013 9:12 am

Iceberg Slim wrote:This post is taken directly from blog my site which is posted above my sig. I couldn't help but think that at a time when he's about to potentially win his 5th ring, no one is really talking about him for the right reasons. It's sad, but its the way it is. It's long overdue that I pay some homage to the greatest PF of all-time...

I like the start.

In a modern day culture scene where a Kardashian is trending for being a preggo fatty with a possible gay lover (sorry Kanye), Bieber wants Nazi victim love from Anne Frank, and Lohan is loved for a being a perennial life loser, I feel confident in saying that Americans like dysfunction.

I don't like this paragraph. Kardashian looks great. I don't understand some of the other references.

Which brings me to the iPhone-like functionality of Tim Duncan – a genetic hybrid of a 7’0 Bill Russell, the kid who cried for a getting a 2200 on the new SAT, who acts like a moving wax statue…of himself. He’s a 14-time all-star, 4-time champion, 3-time Finals MVP, 2-time regular season MVP, who is simply put, the GREATEST POWER FORWARD OF ALL-TIME. And he’s making more headlines now than maybe ever before because he’s going through a divorce with his college sweetheart/wife Amy Duncan. NBA Finals? That might pale in comparison to his remarkably messy divorce scandal. A scandal that includes Duncan hiring a private eye to track his wife’s whereabouts where she allegedly cheated on him with her personal trainer. And true to form, it’s still as boring as badminton in the Olympics, just like his legendary game. If he had swag like the guys America loves to hate (Tiger, Mayweather, Kobe) ESPN would create its own ticker on the bottom screen for him. But you don’t care that much. And that’s probably how he prefers it.

This is probably right. His numbers don't blow you away either, but he's always there, always working. I don't know of anyone who has bad things to say about Duncan (except his wife, perhaps). And we should celebrate him more for the kind of player he is.

I think you're right on the rest. Great post. :jam2:
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby Iceberg Slim on Thu May 30, 2013 10:17 am

I don't like this paragraph. Kardashian looks great. I don't understand some of the other references.


I'm not inclined to disagree with you just stating the headlines which are everywhere, like this...


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Kinda surprised you didn't hear about the Bieber/Anne Frank comments. Trust me, I'm no Beliber lol. But I caught wind of this terribly insensitive and narcissistic comment he made about a month ago. While visiting Amsterdam and the Anne Frank House Bieber wrote in the guestbook...

"Truly inspiring to be able to come here. Anne was a great girl. Hopefully she would have been a belieber,"


Weird statement which really denotes where his mindset is...on himself. But he's rich and he's 19. My automatic question was, "How old is he?"

And Lohan...well, I think you know of all of that.
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby Rooscooter on Thu May 30, 2013 12:42 pm

Good read Ice. I agree with it for the most part with the exception of your reasons for deeming him the greatest PF of all time. I've never been able to bridge the gap between team performance and individual greatness. Malone played in the finals twice and lost to Jordan led Chicago teams. Duncan's SA teams wouldn't have faired any better in those series.

There are many forgotten "greats" that belong much much higher on those lists of "top players" and they don't get that recognition because of the emphasis put on winning championships. If you have to have one championship to be the best at a position it then narrows your player choices to just 17 teams.... and only 9 since 1980.
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby Juronimo on Thu May 30, 2013 1:05 pm

Rooscooter wrote:Good read Ice. I agree with it for the most part with the exception of your reasons for deeming him the greatest PF of all time. I've never been able to bridge the gap between team performance and individual greatness. Malone played in the finals twice and lost to Jordan led Chicago teams. Duncan's SA teams wouldn't have faired any better in those series.

There are many forgotten "greats" that belong much much higher on those lists of "top players" and they don't get that recognition because of the emphasis put on winning championships. If you have to have one championship to be the best at a position it then narrows your player choices to just 17 teams.... and only 9 since 1980.


I remember a 39 year old Karl Malone on a bad wheel checking Duncan in 2004. I don't think you can convincingly say Duncan was better looking at the numbers. Duncan was just in a better situation to win championships due to being on better teams.

I'd say it's close between the 2 and KG should be considered too even though he plays for our rivals. KG was stuck on bad teams all of those years in Minny but he was one hell of a player during that time. Once he got on a good team he won.

To me it's pretty close between Duncan and Malone with KG in the mix as well.
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby davriver290 on Thu May 30, 2013 1:18 pm

I... Love... Duncan... Nothing but class and silence. I don't ever hear him being talked about in the media.
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby gcclaker on Thu May 30, 2013 1:26 pm

Fundamentals and executing them to their optimum looks boring but winning with them however can't be constituted as such. Personally, I equate Duncan's solid consistency and no frills game with another great post player...Kareem Abdul-Jabbar. It still sticks with me how the TNT crew once described his effectiveness by singing the classic Roberta Flack song "Killing Me Softly"...so appropriate.
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby John3:16 on Thu May 30, 2013 1:45 pm

Devils Advocate: When was the last time Duncan dropped 40 on a team, carrying his team to victory? Or took over the 4th quarter?

Just playing devils advocate. I love Duncan and hate KG, but I think they are in the same mold of "truly great players who do not put up great stats". Not bad stats, but not mind blowing either.

SA has a ways to go to another ring. I hate Miami, but think they are destined. C'mon Duncan, prove me wrong!!!
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby Weezy on Thu May 30, 2013 1:57 pm

The Malone question of where does he rank is a big one to me. If you value titles above all Duncan is the top guy at PF, but if numbers matter a lot too I don't see another PF above Malone there. Malone blows Duncan away in scoring in his best seasons, and the rebounds are even. Defense, I can't really recall how well Malone played in that area, but I do remember him being a tough player and holding his own with how big he was. As far as averages go Malone barely ever averaged 1 block or over in a season, Duncan averages over 2 blocks for his career. So factoring in circumstance being why Malone never got a ring and Duncan did get his 4 you might have a hard time calling either one of them the greatest ever over the other. You always have that same argument or question you hear a lot with players that never won, put Malone on the Spurs for these years Duncan has been, does he have titles? Probably so, but you can't go on what if, only what is, so it's tough.
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Re: The Problem with America and Tim Duncan

Postby Rooscooter on Thu May 30, 2013 2:03 pm

Weezy wrote:The Malone question of where does he rank is a big one to me. If you value titles above all Duncan is the top guy at PF, but if numbers matter a lot too I don't see another PF above Malone there. Malone blows Duncan away in scoring in his best seasons, and the rebounds are even. Defense, I can't really recall how well Malone played in that area, but I do remember him being a tough player and holding his own with how big he was. As far as averages go Malone barely ever averaged 1 block or over in a season, Duncan averages over 2 blocks for his career. So factoring in circumstance being why Malone never got a ring and Duncan did get his 4 you might have a hard time calling either one of them the greatest ever over the other. You always have that same argument or question you hear a lot with players that never won, put Malone on the Spurs for these years Duncan has been, does he have titles? Probably so, but you can't go on what if, only what is, so it's tough.



While Duncan is a good passer Malone was a fantastic passer. Assist numbers aside the types of passes and how he did it were amazing for a man his size playing in the paint.

Malone's defense was underrated IMO. He was a very good post defender and very smart on that end of the floor. Duncan is known to turn it on defensively and is very good but a little like Kobe he uses that end to rest at times as well.
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