Are certain OC threads getting out of hand?

Are certain OC threads getting out of hand?

Postby RushDelivery on Thu Oct 30, 2008 11:08 pm

There's been a recent flood of threads and posts in the Open Court which directly or indirectly mock religion and the religious. The problem IMO doesn't seem to be getting better as more threads and related posts have continued to appear, and I think people from both sides of the debate are growing a bit hot-headed. I think it might be very beneficial to lock all religious threads for a brief period of time to allow everyone to cool down before posters get offended or something is said that goes too far.

BTW, I am not suggesting this because I was offended, I have not been offended, but I am fearful these posts are on the verge of getting out of hand and will or already have incited some negative feelings between posters.

If there are others who agree feel free to list your support. If you disagree also feel free to say why you think we should allow these discussions to continue. I'm fully aware I could just be overreacting and no one really cares about the recent discussions but I want to make sure we come to a consensus about whether we need to do anything or not.
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Re: Are certain OC threads getting out of hand?

Postby Satan on Thu Oct 30, 2008 11:24 pm

What I don't understand is why religion should be spared mockery when every other subject is fair game?

Hell, even the religions which are not commonly accepted here are openly mocked, oftentimes most vocally by the followers of more popular religions.

As long as we're not mocking individuals or making personal comments, I don't see the problem. But then, I don't get offended by criticism of my beliefs, I welcome them. Criticism helps us find the weaknesses in our thinking, expand our world views.

Perhaps those clinging to dogmatic beliefs would be opposed to any challenge to their accepted ideas.
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Re: Are certain OC threads getting out of hand?

Postby RushDelivery on Fri Oct 31, 2008 1:40 am

Satan wrote:What I don't understand is why religion should be spared mockery when every other subject is fair game?

Hell, even the religions which are not commonly accepted here are openly mocked, oftentimes most vocally by the followers of more popular religions.

Religion is not special in this regard, many of the political threads also get very close to people just mocking each other and in the past we have seen temporary bans of political topics when it got out of hand. My fear here is that the religious threads are no longer productive and have devolved into just a mass of posts or either sarcasm or flat out attacks on religion and those who follow religion. That accomplishes nothing but inciting anger IMO and I don't want to see posters turning against one another, that's not the point of this site at all.

You're correct in bringing up an important point, other religions shouldn't just be mocked for being different and if that happened in the past then it was wrong to do so. However, the difference is those such threads tend to die down before anything gets out of hand so in that regard they are self-regulating, but the recent religious threads have continued to creep up over the past few weeks and every time a new one appears it contains more negative comments than before. I am worried about the escalation of the criticism of religion and the religious, and this is why I started this thread to get a discussion going as to whether we should do anything or not to prevent further escalation.

Satan wrote:As long as we're not mocking individuals or making personal comments, I don't see the problem. But then, I don't get offended by criticism of my beliefs, I welcome them. Criticism helps us find the weaknesses in our thinking, expand our world views.

Yes I agree constructive criticism indeed makes us stronger, but criticism designed to mock or incite anger doesn't accomplish anything useful IMO. While overall most of the comments have not been directed at individuals, a few posts have been personal which only supports my fear that it's only a matter of time until the threads collapse into personal attacks and posters say things they shouldn't have said. At the very least a warning should be sent out IMO to all of those getting close to crossing the line between mocking a religion and attacking a poster.

Satan wrote:Perhaps those clinging to dogmatic beliefs would be opposed to any challenge to their accepted ideas.

It's one thing to discuss the various religious beliefs (or any other subject) in a respectful manner as has been done successfully in the past, it's another to use sarcasm and borderline mockery regarding religious beliefs (or any other subject) as the way of promoting useful discussion. Again, my point isn't that religion is special, but that right now the discussions and posts in these threads simply are not encouraging productive and healthy discussions on the issues and are instead potentially inciting anger that could escalate. If I had noticed any other subject reaching this level of unproductive posts then I would have posted a thread concerning that subject.

BTW I am not singling you out Satan, I am talking about everyone's responses in the religious threads so please don't take anything I've said personally much like I have not taken anything you have said personally.

So I will ask again, what does everyone feel is the appropriate response? Should nothing be done at all, should we just issue warnings, should we temporary close religious threads and let everyone cool down? I'm personally not offended so I admit I could just be overreacting, but I just want to see the opinions of others on this issue including the mods.
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Re: Are certain OC threads getting out of hand?

Postby L4L on Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:14 am

I've voiced my concerns to staff over this very issue and others have done the same before me. Some kind of action will most likely be taken soon.
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Re: Are certain OC threads getting out of hand?

Postby Satan on Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:17 am

RushDelivery wrote:Yes I agree constructive criticism indeed makes us stronger, but criticism designed to mock or incite anger doesn't accomplish anything useful IMO.


I beg to differ. Some of the criticisms I have remembered best and that inspired me to change the most in my life were mocking or anger inciting. Also, who says we need to accomplish anything useful here? A discussion can be entertainment and nothing more.

RushDelivery wrote:While overall most of the comments have not been directed at individuals, a few posts have been personal which only supports my fear that it's only a matter of time until the threads collapse into personal attacks and posters say things they shouldn't have said. At the very least a warning should be sent out IMO to all of those getting close to crossing the line between mocking a religion and attacking a poster.


I agree that personal attacks detract from the value of any thread. I personally stop reading threads that devolve into two people bickering with personal attacks, part of the reason I stopped spending much time in Lakers Discussion here.

My solution would be for mods to delete posts with personal attacks and warn the posters. I also suggest posters take advantage of the foes feature to block comments from those they consistently feel they would be better of skipping.


RushDelivery wrote:It's one thing to discuss the various religious beliefs (or any other subject) in a respectful manner as has been done successfully in the past, it's another to use sarcasm and borderline mockery regarding religious beliefs (or any other subject) as the way of promoting useful discussion.


Again, I would state that useful discussion is not the only purpose of forum posts. We have posts for laughs, for venting, for analysis, for opinion gathering, honest debate, sharing of information, etc. If someone feels they have nothing to gain from a thread, they might consider simply moving on... It seems some feel that the entire world should mirror their ideas.

RushDelivery wrote:Again, my point isn't that religion is special, but that right now the discussions and posts in these threads simply are not encouraging productive and healthy discussions on the issues and are instead potentially inciting anger that could escalate.


If posts on a basketball message board are inciting folks to anger, I would likely suggest therapy. Wars, global poverty, disease, these are things which should incite anger, not the words of some anonymous posters on the 'net.

Honestly Rush, could you see yourself getting genuinely angry or upset about something someone who's opinion you don't care about said?


RushDelivery wrote:BTW I am not singling you out Satan, I am talking about everyone's responses in the religious threads so please don't take anything I've said personally much like I have not taken anything you have said personally.


I know ya too well for that brother. If you were singling me out you would PM me.
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Re: Are certain OC threads getting out of hand?

Postby RushDelivery on Fri Oct 31, 2008 3:02 am

L4L - Thanks for the quick response. Hopefully you and the others mods sort this out before anything gets out of hand.

Satan - I agree about the personal attacks, they can be removed from the threads. I also realize a post doesn't have to be useful per say, I probably used the wrong word choice but I was trying to say that a thread that's only full of negativity usually isn't one that adds to the overall enjoyment of this site. I think that resolves your correct statement that threads can be just for fun and enjoyment, but that still doesn't mean there can be threads that exist purely to promote negative and destructive statements.

While I myself didn't get angry or offended by the threads in question, I think others posters could easily get offended. I understand this is an online forum and in an ideal world no one would get upset over someone else's opinion, but the world unfortunately doesn't work like that and people can and do take offense to certain comments. As such, a little effort to reduce such negative threads isn't too much ask and helps reduce any such conflicts regardless of how silly they may seem given we are talking on a web forum.
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Re: Are certain OC threads getting out of hand?

Postby Moises on Sat Nov 01, 2008 9:39 pm

It's at the point where I see a thread that has nothing to do with religion, has 4 pages of replies filled with religion talk. Every f'n thread in Open Court turns into Religious Court. And its always the same jokers that take it there. Just create a topic for all the religion talk and move that garbage in there. :man10:
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Re: Are certain OC threads getting out of hand?

Postby JSM on Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:34 pm

This situation is not being ignored. Some preventative measures will be taken later tonight. Stay tuned.
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Re: Are certain OC threads getting out of hand?

Postby Satan on Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:36 pm

In regards to any part I have played in this, I've already gone and added several folks to my foes list.
Peter - "But then Jesus, what religion should our family be?"
Jesus - "Six of one, they're all complete crap."
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Re: Are certain OC threads getting out of hand?

Postby RushDelivery on Mon Nov 03, 2008 8:26 pm

JSM - I thank you for your response. I think it was the right decision to let everyone cool off and move on from many of these arguments.

Satan - That's what the foe list is for, to prevent heated arguments from spilling over and affecting others trying to just enjoy this site. Don't dwell on any part you may or may not have played in this, many were at fault from both sides as JSM said in his announcement and we all need to just move on and forget about what happened.
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Re: Are certain OC threads getting out of hand?

Postby strikemode14 on Tue Nov 04, 2008 6:11 am

Sorry for not adressing this topic sooner. I attend to regulate OC alot more stricter before they get out of hand. The bickering, baiting and flaming is going to stop.
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Re: Are certain OC threads getting out of hand?

Postby Sirron on Tue Nov 04, 2008 8:43 pm

I decided to use the foe feature for the most offensive poster, and it makes life rather pleasant.

Now if you will all be so kind and never quote him again, I'll never have to see another one of his/her ridiculous posts lol.

Glad to see this is being addressed in some way. Myself among many others were considering just exiting permanently due to one specific member and the baggage he/she brings. Must be immeasurable buckets of joy he brings to those around him.

Anyways, regards to management for taking an active role in the issue before it was too late.
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Re: Are certain OC threads getting out of hand?

Postby Savory Griddles on Thu Nov 06, 2008 8:24 am

sirronstuff wrote:I decided to use the foe feature for the most offensive poster, and it makes life rather pleasant.

Now if you will all be so kind and never quote him again, I'll never have to see another one of his/her ridiculous posts lol.

Glad to see this is being addressed in some way. Myself among many others were considering just exiting permanently due to one specific member and the baggage he/she brings. Must be immeasurable buckets of joy he brings to those around him.

Anyways, regards to management for taking an active role in the issue before it was too late.



Foe list is nice and all, but the really outlandish things said by members tend to be the ones that get quoted. Therefore the foe list only works so well.
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Re: Are certain OC threads getting out of hand?

Postby Sirron on Sat Nov 08, 2008 11:07 pm

true
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